I happened to be out driving and put the radio on to catch the end of Rach #4. I sat in the car and waited to find out who was playing it, since I thought the performance was excellent. Turned out to be Andsnes/Pappano.

I always liked #4 despite its rather corny 3 Blind Mice theme. Like I always liked Prokofiev's 9th Piano Sonata which is generally overlooked in favour of its predecessors.

Michelangeli is generally thought to own this (by music critics at least), but good though that is, there's plenty of room for others to make their mark in this. Not least the composer himself.

On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 12:26:20 PM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
>
> Michelangeli is generally thought to
> own this (by music critics at least),

His lease has expired.

dk

On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 4:01:39 PM UTC-7, Dan Koren wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 12:26:20 PM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
> >
> > Michelangeli is generally thought to
> > own this (by music critics at least),
>
> His lease has expired.

In fact, all of ABM's
leases have expired.

dk

On 2023-06-21 02:34:10 +0000, Dan Koren said:

> On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 4:01:39 PM UTC-7, Dan Koren wrote:
>> On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 12:26:20 PM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:> >> >
>> Michelangeli is generally thought to> > own this (by music critics at
>> least),
>>
>> His lease has expired.
> In fact, all of ABM'sleases have expired.

So has ABM.

-Owen

On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 04:56:06 UTC+1, Owen Hartnett wrote:
> > In fact, all of ABM's leases have expired.
> So has ABM.
> > -Owen

I see ABM as a great pianist in repertoire he was great in. Like Sviatoslav Richter.

A "great" pianist doesn't have to be good at everything to deserve that status. In fact ABM and Richter were quite picky about their repertoire.

> A "great" pianist doesn't have to be good at everything to deserve that status. In fact ABM and Richter were quite picky about their repertoire.

Hmmm. Richter picky? His repertoire was limitless. With all the consequences. He played the worst Gershwin I've ever heard, and quite a few other worsts. He was a great pianist, nonetheless. ABM, on the other hand, was picky and never played subpar.

In spite of their greatness, I never revisit their recordings.

Henk

On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 09:17:01 UTC+1, HT wrote:
> > A "great" pianist doesn't have to be good at everything to deserve that status. In fact ABM and Richter were quite picky about their repertoire.
> Hmmm. Richter picky? His repertoire was limitless. With all the consequences. He played the worst Gershwin I've ever heard, and quite a few other worsts. He was a great pianist, nonetheless. ABM, on the other hand, was picky and never played subpar. > In spite of their greatness, I never revisit their recordings.
> > Henk

Indeed - I hesitated about calling Richter "picky"... What I had in mind were things like never recording the integral of all 12 of Debussy's Preludes Book 1, where other pianists did. I value his Prokofiev, his Debussy, his Schubert amongst others. But for me, he had no real affinity for Bach or Scriabin to name just two.

I suppose you could call Horowitz "picky". Unfortunately what he failed to record was one composer he was superbly good at - Debussy.

On Wednesday, June 21, 2023 at 4:17:01 AM UTC-4, HT wrote:
> > A "great" pianist doesn't have to be good at everything to deserve that status. In fact ABM and Richter were quite picky about their repertoire.
> Hmmm. Richter picky? His repertoire was limitless. With all the consequences. He played the worst Gershwin I've ever heard, and quite a few other worsts. He was a great pianist, nonetheless. ABM, on the other hand, was picky and never played subpar.
>
> In spite of their greatness, I never revisit their recordings.
>
> Henk

Apropos to the subject:

https://images.app.goo.gl/kZpMuSySAQw9gM5V8

On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 10:31:54 UTC+1, JohnGavin wrote:
> Apropos to the subject:
>
> https://images.app.goo.gl/kZpMuSySAQw9gM5V8

Thanks, John. Some lovely photos and a wonderful one of Richter and ABM. Such different personalities.

On Wednesday, June 21, 2023 at 5:49:23 AM UTC-4, Andy Evans wrote:
> On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 10:31:54 UTC+1, JohnGavin wrote:
> > Apropos to the subject:
> >
> > https://images.app.goo.gl/kZpMuSySAQw9gM5V8
> Thanks, John. Some lovely photos and a wonderful one of Richter and ABM. Such different personalities.

I was fortunate to have seen some great pianists live as a kid. Rubinstein, Horowitz twice (I thought he was far greater live than in his recordings), Arrau twice (I felt absolutely.nothing, but I admit it has to do with receptivity to him, which I still don’t possess). It was Michelangeli, however who sent me into a different consciousness entirely. If I had to travel home alone, I probably would have gotten run over by a car! The most memorable recital of my life.

On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 11:15:23 UTC+1, JohnGavin wrote:

> I was fortunate to have seen some great pianists live as a kid. Rubinstein, Horowitz twice (I thought he was far greater live than in his recordings), Arrau twice (I felt absolutely.nothing, but I admit it has to do with receptivity to him, which I still don’t possess). It was Michelangeli, however who sent me into a different consciousness entirely. If I had to travel home alone, I probably would have gotten run over by a car! The most memorable recital of my life.

I really should have gone to more concerts. I was a gigging musician and that was something I neglected, though I did pop into Ronnie Scotts a fair bit.

My most memorable concert was the string of concerts the Russians did when they first hit London. Rostropovich, Oistrakh, Richter and Rozhdestvensky were the stars. Richter's Debussy/Chopin recital had 6 encores - the audience mobbed the stage like he was a pop star. And the big names were all there - in one box in the Festival Hall I saw Shostakovich, Hindemith, Britten, Peter Pears and no doubt one or two others I didn't recognise. The Richter recitals, including the Prokofiev recital, are on BBC recordings. I was a teenager, and it was a big deal for me.

I wish I'd seen Horowitz and Rubinstein - two favourites. I did see Julius Katchen not long before he died, and in the small town we lived in - Bridgend, Glamorgan. God knows what someone of his stature was doing there.

Op woensdag 21 juni 2023 om 10:57:42 UTC+2 schreef Andy Evans:

> I suppose you could call Horowitz "picky". Unfortunately what he failed to record was one composer he was superbly good at - Debussy.

From his interviews with Dubal, I gather that Horowitz was a great marketer. For example, he loved a certain Medtner concerto (don't remember which one) but was afraid that no one would buy it. Consequently, he didn't record it.

Henk

On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 12:28:16 UTC+1, HT wrote:
> Op woensdag 21 juni 2023 om 10:57:42 UTC+2 schreef Andy Evans:
> > I suppose you could call Horowitz "picky". Unfortunately what he failed to record was one composer he was superbly good at - Debussy.
> From his interviews with Dubal, I gather that Horowitz was a great marketer. For example, he loved a certain Medtner concerto (don't remember which one) but was afraid that no one would buy it. Consequently, he didn't record it.
> > Henk

That's interesting. But was Debussy that un-marketable in his lifetime? Or Ravel?

He recorded plenty of Scriabin - surely further down the marketable ladder....

Op woensdag 21 juni 2023 om 14:19:43 UTC+2 schreef Andy Evans:

> That's interesting. But was Debussy that un-marketable in his lifetime? Or Ravel?
>
> He recorded plenty of Scriabin - surely further down the marketable ladder....

IIRC Ravel once told Horowitz that he made his music sound like Liszt. Horowitz agreed. That may have been the reason why he seldom (if ever?) recorded Ravel. I don't know why Horowitz stopped recording Debussy - and many other composers - but continued to play Scriabin.

Henk

On Wednesday, June 21, 2023 at 8:19:43 AM UTC-4, Andy Evans wrote:
> On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 12:28:16 UTC+1, HT wrote:
> > Op woensdag 21 juni 2023 om 10:57:42 UTC+2 schreef Andy Evans:
> > > I suppose you could call Horowitz "picky". Unfortunately what he failed to record was one composer he was superbly good at - Debussy.
> > From his interviews with Dubal, I gather that Horowitz was a great marketer. For example, he loved a certain Medtner concerto (don't remember which one) but was afraid that no one would buy it. Consequently, he didn't record it.
> > > Henk
> That's interesting. But was Debussy that un-marketable in his lifetime? Or Ravel?
>

Just discovered this on YouTube. Ravel’s Scarbo.
I understand that he is trying to capture Scarbo’s impish, devilish character, but for my taste VH is too past his prime at this point.

https://youtu.be/7z-ub3VkjqE

On Wednesday, June 21, 2023 at 9:27:22 AM UTC-4, JohnGavin wrote:
> On Wednesday, June 21, 2023 at 8:19:43 AM UTC-4, Andy Evans wrote:
> > On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 12:28:16 UTC+1, HT wrote:
> > > Op woensdag 21 juni 2023 om 10:57:42 UTC+2 schreef Andy Evans:
> > > > I suppose you could call Horowitz "picky". Unfortunately what he failed to record was one composer he was superbly good at - Debussy.
> > > From his interviews with Dubal, I gather that Horowitz was a great marketer. For example, he loved a certain Medtner concerto (don't remember which one) but was afraid that no one would buy it. Consequently, he didn't record it.
> > > > Henk
> > That's interesting. But was Debussy that un-marketable in his lifetime? Or Ravel?
> >
> Just discovered this on YouTube. Ravel’s Scarbo.
> I understand that he is trying to capture Scarbo’s impish, devilish character, but for my taste VH is too past his prime at this point.
>
>
> https://youtu.be/7z-ub3VkjqE

Also, here is Horowitz’ complete Debussy all on one YouTube entry.

https://youtu.be/FgL6cwlXKVQ

IMO - the best Isle Joyeuse of all time.
For the Preludes I prefer Michelangeli.

On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 14:27:22 UTC+1, JohnGavin wrote:
> Just discovered this on YouTube. Ravel’s Scarbo.
> I understand that he is trying to capture Scarbo’s impish, devilish character, but for my taste VH is too past his prime at this point.
> > https://youtu.be/7z-ub3VkjqE

Wow - I didn't know that existed. Clearly well past his prime, but I really like it. The concept is there and shines through the pianism.

Oh for more Ravel and Debussy....... too late now.

On the subject of "what could have been" I really like Prokofiev as a pianist.

Op woensdag 21 juni 2023 om 16:06:31 UTC+2 schreef Andy Evans:
> On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 14:27:22 UTC+1, JohnGavin wrote:
> > Just discovered this on YouTube. Ravel’s Scarbo.
> > I understand that he is trying to capture Scarbo’s impish, devilish character, but for my taste VH is too past his prime at this point.
> > > https://youtu.be/7z-ub3VkjqE
> Wow - I didn't know that existed. Clearly well past his prime, but I really like it. The concept is there and shines through the pianism.
>
> Oh for more Ravel and Debussy....... too late now.
>
> On the subject of "what could have been" I really like Prokofiev as a pianist.

There were serious doubts in 2013 about the performer of Scarbo. Some professionals, including Denk, warned that it couldn't be Horowitz.

Henk

On 2023-06-21 15:27:01 +0000, HT said:

> Op woensdag 21 juni 2023 om 16:06:31 UTC+2 schreef Andy Evans:
>> On Wednesday, 21 June 2023 at 14:27:22 UTC+1, JohnGavin wrote:> > Just
>> discovered this on YouTube. Ravel’s Scarbo.> > I understand that he is
>> trying to capture Scarbo’s impish, devilish character, but for my taste
>> VH is too past his prime at this point.> > >
>> https://youtu.be/7z-ub3VkjqE
>> Wow - I didn't know that existed. Clearly well past his prime, but I
>> really like it. The concept is there and shines through the pianism.>>
>> Oh for more Ravel and Debussy....... too late now.>> On the subject of
>> "what could have been" I really like Prokofiev as a pianist.
>
> There were serious doubts in 2013 about the performer of Scarbo. Some
> professionals, including Denk, warned that it couldn't be Horowitz.
>
> Henk

The description under the video indicates the pianist is Alphonse Sauer.

-Owen