https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM

Dan Koren schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 02:08:07 UTC+2:
> https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM

I think I like most the W. Hoffmann T161 by C. Bechstein (clicked immediately with me). Fazioli sounds steely, no?

Marc S schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 08:06:48 UTC+2:
> Dan Koren schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 02:08:07 UTC+2:
> > https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM
>
> I think I like most the W. Hoffmann T161 by C. Bechstein (clicked immediately with me). Fazioli sounds steely, no?

*Mind you; I am not experienced with this... just rechecked sth... the C. Bechstein Concert 8 "Intarsia" sounds steely (thought it was a Fazioli at first because of the logo in the background)... the Fazioli that comes afterwards sounds less steely. But I really seem to like the T161... it has a very beautiful sound...

Marc S schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 08:11:32 UTC+2:
> Marc S schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 08:06:48 UTC+2:
> > Dan Koren schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 02:08:07 UTC+2:
> > > https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM
> >
> > I think I like most the W. Hoffmann T161 by C. Bechstein (clicked immediately with me). Fazioli sounds steely, no?
> *Mind you; I am not experienced with this... just rechecked sth... the C. Bechstein Concert 8 "Intarsia" sounds steely (thought it was a Fazioli at first because of the logo in the background)... the Fazioli that comes afterwards sounds less steely. But I really seem to like the T161... it has a very beautiful sound...

the high tones sound a bit jarring on the Intarsia... not saying it sounds bad... but the sound of T161 is warmer... as is Fazioli... very difficult.... anyway interesting experience.

On Saturday, May 6, 2023 at 11:06:48 PM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> Dan Koren schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 02:08:07 UTC+2:
> > https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM
>
> I think I like most the W. Hoffmann T161 by C. Bechstein
> (clicked immediately with me). Fazioli sounds steely, no?

I liked the Bechstein the best. The Faziolis in this recording
sounded really ugly to my ears, very deifferent from Faziolis
I heard live.

dk

Op zondag 7 mei 2023 om 02:08:07 UTC+2 schreef Dan Koren:
> https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM

None. When I want a new piano, I'll first look for a Yamaha - and perhaps a Kawai. The ones I have heard sounded more 'natural' than any of the other top brands, especially the Faziolis.

Henk

On Sunday, May 7, 2023 at 2:45:20 AM UTC-7, HT wrote:
> Op zondag 7 mei 2023 om 02:08:07 UTC+2 schreef Dan Koren:
> > https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM
>
> None. When I want a new piano, I'll first look for a
> Yamaha - and perhaps a Kawai. The ones I have
> heard sounded more 'natural' than any of the
> other top brands, especially the Faziolis.
>

How about Bosies?

dk

Dan Koren schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 10:52:51 UTC+2:
> On Saturday, May 6, 2023 at 11:06:48 PM UTC-7, Marc S wrote:
> > Dan Koren schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 02:08:07 UTC+2:
> > > https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM
> >
> > I think I like most the W. Hoffmann T161 by C. Bechstein
> > (clicked immediately with me). Fazioli sounds steely, no?
> I liked the Bechstein the best. The Faziolis in this recording
> sounded really ugly to my ears, very deifferent from Faziolis
> I heard live.

Which Bechstein? There are two in the video and they sound completely different from each other - I assume you are talkign about the Intarsia?

I don't want to say that the Faziolis sounded ugly, but I was expecting more tbh... and the Intarsia didn't feel good on my ears... Would probably have to think about it more, and also hear them in real life or sth to decide.

>
> dk

Op zondag 7 mei 2023 om 12:57:03 UTC+2 schreef Dan Koren:
> On Sunday, May 7, 2023 at 2:45:20 AM UTC-7, HT wrote:
> > Op zondag 7 mei 2023 om 02:08:07 UTC+2 schreef Dan Koren:
> > > https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM
> >
> > None. When I want a new piano, I'll first look for a
> > Yamaha - and perhaps a Kawai. The ones I have
> > heard sounded more 'natural' than any of the
> > other top brands, especially the Faziolis.
> >
> How about Bosies?

A decade or so ago, I would have agreed. Since then, the Yamaha's improved drastically - the Kawais even more so (imo - of course).

Henk

HT schrieb am Sonntag, 7. Mai 2023 um 11:45:20 UTC+2:
> Op zondag 7 mei 2023 om 02:08:07 UTC+2 schreef Dan Koren:
> > https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM
>
> None. When I want a new piano, I'll first look for a Yamaha - and perhaps a Kawai. The ones I have heard sounded more 'natural' than any of the other top brands, especially the Faziolis.

I assume there is a difference between a Kawai and a Shigeru Kawai (Shigeru being more high-end?)? Anyway I remember liking the sound of the Shigeru Kawai I heard Pletnev playing Rachmaninov on (ADGO upload) when I heard it years ago - not so sure if I would think the same now...

>
> Henk

I'll have the Hoffmann Bechstein upright please.

Didn't like any of the Faziolis, however much gold they put on them......

On Sunday, May 7, 2023 at 11:48:42 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
> I'll have the Hoffmann Bechstein upright please.
>
> Didn't like any of the Faziolis,
> however much gold they put
> on them......

I suspect the Faziolis in this clip
sounded ugly partly because they
were built as luxury furniture and
housed in cases that do not have
appropriate acoustical properties,
and partly because they were not
properly tuned and regulated. They
did not sound anywhere close to
the Faziolis I tried or that I heard
in concerts. The guy playing them
was also not the greatest living
pianist either.

dk

On 2023-05-07 22:23:45 +0000, Dan Koren said:

> On Sunday, May 7, 2023 at 11:48:42 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
>> I'll have the Hoffmann Bechstein upright please.>> Didn't like any of
>> the Faziolis,> however much gold they put> on them......
>
> I suspect the Faziolis in this clipsounded ugly partly because theywere
> built as luxury furniture andhoused in cases that do not
> haveappropriate acoustical properties,and partly because they were
> notproperly tuned and regulated. Theydid not sound anywhere close tothe
> Faziolis I tried or that I heardin concerts. The guy playing themwas
> also not the greatest livingpianist either.
> dk

Where's the Stoneways and Bosies? And Yamahas and, even, Baldwins?

The Fazis all sounded alike once you got above $100K, where they seemed
to peak.

That's about where a decent Steinway D will buy you. The best piano
I've played on was a Steinway D. (Not that I've played on that many
expensive pianos.)

-Owen

On 2023-05-07 23:30:49 +0000, Owen Hartnett said:

> On 2023-05-07 22:23:45 +0000, Dan Koren said:
>
>> On Sunday, May 7, 2023 at 11:48:42 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
>>> I'll have the Hoffmann Bechstein upright please.>> Didn't like any of
>>> the Faziolis,> however much gold they put> on them......
>>
>> I suspect the Faziolis in this clipsounded ugly partly because theywere
>> built as luxury furniture andhoused in cases that do not
>> haveappropriate acoustical properties,and partly because they were
>> notproperly tuned and regulated. Theydid not sound anywhere close tothe
>> Faziolis I tried or that I heardin concerts. The guy playing themwas
>> also not the greatest livingpianist either.
>> dk
>
> Where's the Stoneways and Bosies? And Yamahas and, even, Baldwins?
>
> The Fazis all sounded alike once you got above $100K, where they seemed
> to peak.
>
> That's about where a decent Steinway D will buy you. The best piano
> I've played on was a Steinway D. (Not that I've played on that many
> expensive pianos.)
>

Here's the same guy playing a different array of pianos:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdRekUGLQvM

I'll take the Steinway D from this assortment. The Steinway "pictures"
one sounded terrible, as did a similar "special" Steinway I tried in
Boston when they were exhibiting it there.

-Owen

On Sunday, May 7, 2023 at 4:31:02 PM UTC-7, Owen Hartnett wrote:
> On 2023-05-07 22:23:45 +0000, Dan Koren said:
>
> > On Sunday, May 7, 2023 at 11:48:42 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:
> >> I'll have the Hoffmann Bechstein upright please.>> Didn't like any of
> >> the Faziolis,> however much gold they put> on them......
> >
> > I suspect the Faziolis in this clip
> > sounded ugly partly because they
> > were built as luxury furniture and
> > housed in cases that do not have
> > appropriate acoustical properties,
> > and partly because they were not
> > properly tuned and regulated. They
> > did not sound anywhere close tothe
> > Faziolis I tried or that I heardin concerts.
> > The guy playing them was also not the
> > greatest living pianist either.
>
> Where's the Stoneways and Bosies?
> And Yamahas and, even, Baldwins?

Ask the guy who made the video.

> The Fazis all sounded alike once you
> got above $100K, where they seemed
> to peak.

Above that price level one pays for the
furniture, not for the musical instrument.
Except of course for 9+ ft concert grands.

> That's about where a decent Steinway D
> will buy you. The best piano I've played
> on was a Steinway D. (Not that I've played
> on that many expensive pianos.)

Tastes differ, and music differs too. Some
pianos work better for some composers
than for others. The best piano I played
was a Bosie Imperial in Bosendorfer's
SF store, followed by a Yamaha CFX.

By and large I do not like Steinway's
typically nasal timbre and heavy
Renner actions.

dk

On 2023-05-07 23:53:13 +0000, Dan Koren said:

> On Sunday, May 7, 2023 at 4:31:02 PM UTC-7, Owen Hartnett wrote:
>> On 2023-05-07 22:23:45 +0000, Dan Koren said:>> > On Sunday, May 7,
>> 2023 at 11:48:42 AM UTC-7, Andy Evans wrote:> >> I'll have the Hoffmann
>> Bechstein upright please.>> Didn't like any of> >> the Faziolis,>
>> however much gold they put> on them......> >> > I suspect the Faziolis
>> in this clip
>>> sounded ugly partly because they
>>> were built as luxury furniture and> > housed in cases that do not have>
>>> > appropriate acoustical properties,
>>> and partly because they were not
>>> properly tuned and regulated. They
>>> did not sound anywhere close tothe> > Faziolis I tried or that I
>>> heardin concerts.> > The guy playing them was also not the> > greatest
>>> living pianist either.>
>> Where's the Stoneways and Bosies?> And Yamahas and, even, Baldwins?
> Ask the guy who made the video.
>> The Fazis all sounded alike once you> got above $100K, where they
>> seemed> to peak.
> Above that price level one pays for thefurniture, not for the musical
> instrument.Except of course for 9+ ft concert grands.
>> That's about where a decent Steinway D> will buy you. The best piano
>> I've played> on was a Steinway D. (Not that I've played> on that many
>> expensive pianos.)
> Tastes differ, and music differs too. Somepianos work better for some
> composersthan for others. The best piano I playedwas a Bosie Imperial
> in Bosendorfer'sSF store, followed by a Yamaha CFX.
> By and large I do not like Steinway'stypically nasal timbre and
> heavyRenner actions.

I tried a Bosie once in Harrod's, in London. Not the best place to try
it out, and not for long, because it was closing! I was quite
surprised to find that all retail in England shut down at 5PM on
Saturday night!

-Owen

On Saturday, May 6, 2023 at 5:08:07 PM UTC-7, Dan Koren wrote:
> https://youtu.be/wdRekUGLQvM

(2023 Y. upload):

"Finest Piano in The USA: Steinway B"