Just listened to the 2nd movement of Celibidache's SWR SO Brahms 2, hmmm... I don't think it comes close to his EMI; it's beautiful, and certainly very good, but not very special? Wil have to relisten to Bernstein's 2nd movement (Bernstein certainly would be my other fav pick). The thing about Celibidache's EMI Brahms for me is this, it works very different on me than other interpretations, Celibidache manages to highlight all the details (the way he interprets the score at least) while at the same time creating some sort of cloud of sound with them which then engulfs you. It is very different..

Dan Koren schrieb am Freitag, 29. Dezember 2023 um 06:44:25 UTC+1:
> On Tuesday, December 26, 2023 at 11:26:09 PM UTC-8, Marc S wrote:
> >
> > As long as you believe Celibidache's Mozart 40 and
> > Brahms Symphonies to be unsurpassed, we are good ;)
> Which recordings? There are at least 3 different versions
> of each, dating from the 1960s through the 1990s.
>
> Cheers!

I think I am enjoying Bernstein more than Celibidache in Brahms 2... getting tired of Celibidache again... not a good sign, might sort out...

The thing with Celibidache is this, he gives every instrument time to breathe, and the sounds unfold more, because they do so more slowly - not just because of the tempo, but because of how the instruments are played -, and these sounds (think french horn playing) also cover a large radius, while tending to be a little porous - as opposed to Klemperer who sort of edges things into the stone; and the sound generally being more sharper and distinct from each other, they don't "run into each other" as much - and these sounds are getting woven together, and he lets 1 thing flow seamlessly into the next. Sometimes it's like you are getting drowned in the sound, while interestingly still being able to see all the details.

The finale of Celibidache Brahms 2 (EMI) is really quite sth though... (didn't listen to Bernstein's 4th movement yet).

Marc S schrieb am Samstag, 30. Dezember 2023 um 17:57:53 UTC+1:
> Dan Koren schrieb am Freitag, 29. Dezember 2023 um 06:44:25 UTC+1:
> > On Tuesday, December 26, 2023 at 11:26:09 PM UTC-8, Marc S wrote:
> > >
> > > As long as you believe Celibidache's Mozart 40 and
> > > Brahms Symphonies to be unsurpassed, we are good ;)
> > Which recordings? There are at least 3 different versions
> > of each, dating from the 1960s through the 1990s.
> >
> > Cheers!
> I think I am enjoying Bernstein more than Celibidache in Brahms 2... getting tired of Celibidache again... not a good sign, might sort out...
>
> The thing with Celibidache is this, he gives every instrument time to breathe, and the sounds unfold more, because they do so more slowly - not just because of the tempo, but because of how the instruments are played -, and these sounds (think french horn playing) also cover a large radius, while tending to be a little porous - as opposed to Klemperer who sort of edges things into the stone; and the sound generally being more sharper and distinct from each other, they don't "run into each other" as much - and these sounds are getting woven together, and he lets 1 thing flow seamlessly into the next. Sometimes it's like you are getting drowned in the sound, while interestingly still being able to see all the details.
*diffuse instead of porous

>
> The finale of Celibidache Brahms 2 (EMI) is really quite sth though... (didn't listen to Bernstein's 4th movement yet).

Marc S schrieb am Samstag, 30. Dezember 2023 um 18:21:30 UTC+1:
> Marc S schrieb am Samstag, 30. Dezember 2023 um 17:57:53 UTC+1:
> > Dan Koren schrieb am Freitag, 29. Dezember 2023 um 06:44:25 UTC+1:
> > > On Tuesday, December 26, 2023 at 11:26:09 PM UTC-8, Marc S wrote:
> > > >
> > > > As long as you believe Celibidache's Mozart 40 and
> > > > Brahms Symphonies to be unsurpassed, we are good ;)
> > > Which recordings? There are at least 3 different versions
> > > of each, dating from the 1960s through the 1990s.
> > >
> > > Cheers!
> > I think I am enjoying Bernstein more than Celibidache in Brahms 2... getting tired of Celibidache again... not a good sign, might sort out...
> >
> > The thing with Celibidache is this, he gives every instrument time to breathe, and the sounds unfold more, because they do so more slowly - not just because of the tempo, but because of how the instruments are played -, and these sounds (think french horn playing) also cover a large radius, while tending to be a little porous - as opposed to Klemperer who sort of edges things into the stone; and the sound generally being more sharper and distinct from each other, they don't "run into each other" as much - and these sounds are getting woven together, and he lets 1 thing flow seamlessly into the next. Sometimes it's like you are getting drowned in the sound, while interestingly still being able to see all the details.
> *diffuse instead of porous
> >
> > The finale of Celibidache Brahms 2 (EMI) is really quite sth though... (didn't listen to Bernstein's 4th movement yet).

*the Brahms 1 opening is also crazy, it's like a wall of sound.