"This [the early 1970s] was a very bitter time for John. Bitter, bitter, bitter. He was bitter about Paul McCartney. He ranted and raved about Paul. Ranted and raved about Klein. Ranted and raved about being a celebrity. He hated it.

"I liked John when he would get stoned on grass. He'd get real mellow and nice. On coke he would just get real aggressive. On heroin, very sad. I saw John and Yoko in their house shaking for five hours straight, in a cold sweat, getting off heroin."

-- Rubin, from Jon Weiner's book Come Together

I think John had been tricked and deceived into forfeiting his original destiny. To make matters worse, I think some close to him had been false friends. In that light, his response makes sense...

Yeah. I think the animosity towards Paul *and* the embracing of fringe self-styled revolutionaries like Rubin originated in Ono.

I think it all started before Yoko. She just made sure to ramp everything up...

pamina58 wrote:

> I think it all started before Yoko. She just made sure to ramp
> everything up...

Of course it started before Yoko! When John first met Yoko he
thought she was good looking and sexy, so clearly he was on
'something'! :-)

Good point!

I think John's bitterness had already taken hold when Cynthia got pregnant. I think he blamed her for keeping him from what could have been his rightful destiny.

On Tue, 05 Mar 2024 04:18:57 -0800, Norbert wrote:

> "This [the early 1970s] was a very bitter time for John. Bitter, bitter, bitter. He was bitter about Paul McCartney. He ranted and raved about Paul. Ranted and raved about Klein. Ranted and raved about being a celebrity. He hated it.
>
> "I liked John when he would get stoned on grass. He'd get real mellow and nice. On coke he would just get real aggressive. On heroin, very sad. I saw John and Yoko in their house shaking for five hours straight, in a cold sweat, getting off heroin."
>
> -- Rubin, from Jon Weiner's book Come Together

Weiner and Rubin may be shielding Bob Dylan who
bragged about pushing the Beatles to take drugs.

On Thu, 14 Mar 2024 18:11:08 -0700, Pluted Pup wrote:

> On Tue, 05 Mar 2024 04:18:57 -0800, Norbert wrote:
>
> > "This [the early 1970s] was a very bitter time for John. Bitter, bitter, bitter. He was bitter about Paul McCartney. He ranted and raved about Paul. Ranted and raved about Klein. Ranted and raved about being a celebrity. He hated it.
> >
> > "I liked John when he would get stoned on grass. He'd get real mellow and nice. On coke he would just get real aggressive. On heroin, very sad. I saw John and Yoko in their house shaking for five hours straight, in a cold sweat, getting off heroin."
> >
> > -- Rubin, from Jon Weiner's book Come Together
>
> Weiner and Rubin may be shielding Bob Dylan who
> bragged about pushing the Beatles to take drugs.

A drug pusher is someone who pushes a non-user to
take drugs, regardless of whether it is sold or given.

"Friends" persuading a non-user to take drugs is
the worst form of pusher.

On 15/03/2024 2:11 pm, Pluted Pup wrote:
> On Tue, 05 Mar 2024 04:18:57 -0800, Norbert wrote:
>
>> "This [the early 1970s] was a very bitter time for John. Bitter, bitter, bitter. He was bitter about Paul McCartney. He ranted and raved about Paul. Ranted and raved about Klein. Ranted and raved about being a celebrity. He hated it.
>>
>> "I liked John when he would get stoned on grass. He'd get real mellow and nice. On coke he would just get real aggressive. On heroin, very sad. I saw John and Yoko in their house shaking for five hours straight, in a cold sweat, getting off heroin."
>>
>> -- Rubin, from Jon Weiner's book Come Together
>
> Weiner and Rubin may be shielding Bob Dylan who
> bragged about pushing the Beatles to take drugs.
>
>

A pusher is somebody try to SELL drugs.

However keen Dylan may have been to introduce The Beatles to pot, he
wasn't a pusher.

And they weren't exactly inexperienced in other drugs even (or
especially) in Hamburg days.

geoff

I think Dylan has been protected from a lot of the damage he did to the Beatles, especially John, whom he goaded.

Good one!

Actually, Lennon's limo driver Les Anthony said Lennon was weirded out by Yoko at first.

He was fried on acid -- and mere hours away from wanting to hold a press conference to announce to the word that he was Jesus Christ -- when he summoned her to his home to consummate their relationship.

I don't know; John still f*cked around like a man possessed, didn't he?

Of course he may have felt some resentment, but he only had himself to blame for failing to use condoms.