Living in Glasgow, I can receive Radio Caroline 648 kHz very weakly in
the open. This seems surprising as I believe it operates at only 4 kW.

648 kHz corresponds to 464 metres. Out of curiosity, and
hypothetically speaking, if I were to install an aerial 232 m long,
would I get great reception or would it just pick up a load more
electrical interference? Would it need to be horizontal or vertical,
or would this make no real difference?

On 28/12/2023 10:05, Scott wrote:
> Living in Glasgow, I can receive Radio Caroline 648 kHz very weakly in
> the open. This seems surprising as I believe it operates at only 4 kW.
>
> 648 kHz corresponds to 464 metres. Out of curiosity, and
> hypothetically speaking, if I were to install an aerial 232 m long,
> would I get great reception or would it just pick up a load more
> electrical interference? Would it need to be horizontal or vertical,
> or would this make no real difference?

These frequencies (MF) are normally vertically polarized and even when
transmitted with a more mixed polarization travelling any distance by
ground wave propagation seems to favour the vertical polarized part.

A bigger better, perhaps resonant aerial doesn't usually make a huge
difference with good modern receivers once you get much beyond the level
of a built in ferrite rod in a desk top receiver. The aerial picks up
noise that exceeds that added by the receiver and you don't end up with
a better signal to noise ratio.

The things that do make a difference are having the aerial away from
local sources of noise and interference and having a direction aerial
which is difficult to achieve on these frequencies, though phased arrays
are possible but very large. Probably the most practical directional
aerial is a Beverage. But a good one for 648kHz would still be very very
large.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beverage_antenna

--
Brian Gregory (in England).

On 28/12/2023 10:05, Scott wrote:
> Living in Glasgow, I can receive Radio Caroline 648 kHz very weakly in
> the open. This seems surprising as I believe it operates at only 4 kW.
>
> 648 kHz corresponds to 464 metres. Out of curiosity, and
> hypothetically speaking, if I were to install an aerial 232 m long,
> would I get great reception or would it just pick up a load more
> electrical interference? Would it need to be horizontal or vertical,
> or would this make no real difference?
>
They may be interested in your report of reception. I'm not sure which
stream they put on the transmitter, but they also have a couple of
streams on the internet as well as some DAB output, so if you just want
the music and chat, log on.

As has been pointed out, though, you'll do as well with a correctly
oriented ferrite rod as with a long wire. It may be an idea to move the
rod to minimise local interference from the switch mode supplies which
infest just about every home nowadays, rsther than try to maximise the
signal. Ferrite suppressors on any wall wart supplies you can get at
will also improve things.

https://www.radiocaroline.co.uk/#648_am.html

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Thursday 28 December 2023 at 10:05:08 UTC, Scott wrote:
> Living in Glasgow, I can receive Radio Caroline 648 kHz very weakly in
> the open. This seems surprising as I believe it operates at only 4 kW.
>
> 648 kHz corresponds to 464 metres. Out of curiosity, and
> hypothetically speaking, if I were to install an aerial 232 m long,
> would I get great reception or would it just pick up a load more
> electrical interference? Would it need to be horizontal or vertical,
> or would this make no real difference?

The best way is to make a tuned loop about a metre across. Google 'tuned loop antenna'. Amazingly effective indoors or out. Make it so you can turn it to null out interference.

Bill

In message <eba751bb-cff2-48bd-9c9c-38f9719d8977n@googlegroups.com> at
Sat, 30 Dec 2023 18:33:05, "wrightsaerials@aol.com"
<wrightsaerials@f2s.com> writes
>On Thursday 28 December 2023 at 10:05:08 UTC, Scott wrote:
>> Living in Glasgow, I can receive Radio Caroline 648 kHz very weakly in
>> the open. This seems surprising as I believe it operates at only 4 kW.
>>
>> 648 kHz corresponds to 464 metres. Out of curiosity, and
>> hypothetically speaking, if I were to install an aerial 232 m long,
>> would I get great reception or would it just pick up a load more
>> electrical interference? Would it need to be horizontal or vertical,
>> or would this make no real difference?
>
>The best way is to make a tuned loop about a metre across. Google
>'tuned loop antenna'. Amazingly effective indoors or out. Make it so
>you can turn it to null out interference.
>
>Bill

Used as far back as wartime, for DF purposes: vehicles with a turnable
loop. I think used for finding spies. I remember encountering - I think
must have been at work - a Rohde and Schwartz set, with a very
heavily-made turnable loop on top of it.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The way I see it, if you want the rainbow, you gotta put up with the rain
(Dolly Parton)

Op 28-12-2023 om 16:29 schreef John Williamson:
> On 28/12/2023 10:05, Scott wrote:
>> Living in Glasgow, I can receive Radio Caroline 648 kHz very weakly in
>> the open. This seems surprising as I believe it operates at only 4 kW.
>>
>> 648 kHz corresponds to 464 metres.  Out of curiosity, and
>> hypothetically speaking, if I were to install an aerial 232 m long,
>> would I get great reception or would it just pick up a load more
>> electrical interference? Would it need to be horizontal or vertical,
>> or would this make no real difference?
>>
> They may be interested in your report of reception. I'm not sure which
> stream they put on the transmitter, but they also have a couple of
> streams on the internet as well as some DAB output, so if you just want
> the music and chat, log on.

Try one of the links on the left of this page:
https://carolinestreams.weebly.com/

>
> As has been pointed out, though, you'll do as well with a correctly
> oriented ferrite rod as with a long wire. It may be an idea to move the
> rod to minimise local interference from the switch mode supplies which
> infest just about every home nowadays, rsther than try to maximise the
> signal. Ferrite suppressors on any wall wart supplies you can get at
> will also improve things.
>
> https://www.radiocaroline.co.uk/#648_am.html
>

Rink