Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol

`````````````````````````````````````

Wagner group leader Yevgeny Prigozhin is killed in plane crash: Jet
carrying warlord 'falls from the sky' north of Moscow two months after
failed coup

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12437935/Private-plane-believed-transporting-Wagner-chief-Yevgeny-Prigozhin-crashes-Russia.html
--
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for
light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:

> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>

You're too suspicious Jesse. I'm sure Putin had nothing to do with it!
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From: TWP <ngspammersad@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Putrid finally off'ed drunk Wagner rival ?
Newsgroups: uk.current-events.terrorism
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On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:

> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>

You're too suspicious Jesse. I'm sure Putin had nothing to do with it!

On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 18:05:04 +0000, TWP wrote:

> On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:
>
>> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>>
>>
> You're too suspicious Jesse. I'm sure Putin had nothing to do with it!

He was on the flight maifest along with his deputy making a total of ten
passengers but only eight bodies are reported to have been found.

In article <kTrFM.492810$tTKa.250260@fx10.ams1>,
TWP <ngspammersad@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:

>> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol

> You're too suspicious Jesse. I'm sure Putin had nothing to do with it!

WTF? He couldn't find a high enough window to fall from?

On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 18:11:21 +0000, TWP wrote:

> On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 18:05:04 +0000, TWP wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:
>>
>>> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>>>
>>>
>> You're too suspicious Jesse. I'm sure Putin had nothing to do with it!
>
> He was on the flight maifest along with his deputy making a total of ten
> passengers but only eight bodies are reported to have been found.

He's going to go spare if he does get upgraded to 'alive'. Absolutely
batshit postal.

TWP wrote:
> On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:
>
>> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>>
>
> You're too suspicious Jesse. I'm sure Putin had nothing to do with it!
>

Well, Putins involvement is 1 possibility ,,, Just so happens 99 out of
the other 100 possibilities involve him too, so theres that ,,,

I'm thinking the whole little rebellion thing was a KGB setup from the
start, crafted to milk a little patriotism out of the abused [and very
drunk] Russian population.
He had to have known that, in any scenario, this would leave him in a
precarious position, as people wondered why the despot let the other
despot live after such a mutiny.

Now we'll see what the [drunk] mercenaries do without a [drunk] leader,
or if they even go rogue and rebel [for real this time] against their
sickly [and drunk] overlord in Moscow.

--
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for
light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

In message <IorFM.730559$AsA.504340@fx18.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> writes
>Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>
>
>`````````````````````````````````````
>
>
>Wagner group leader Yevgeny Prigozhin is killed in plane crash: Jet
>carrying warlord 'falls from the sky' north of Moscow two months after
>failed coup
>
>https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12437935/Private-plane-believed
>-transporting-Wagner-chief-Yevgeny-Prigozhin-crashes-Russia.html

Hope he had good travel insurance.

Brian
--
Brian Howie

On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:

> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>
>
> `````````````````````````````````````
>
>
> Wagner group leader Yevgeny Prigozhin is killed in plane crash: Jet
> carrying warlord 'falls from the sky' north of Moscow two months after
> failed coup
>
> https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12437935/Private-plane-believed-
transporting-Wagner-chief-Yevgeny-Prigozhin-crashes-Russia.html

"Video shows plane crash in Kuzhenkino"
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-europe-66597449

JeSSe wrote:

> Now we'll see what the [drunk] mercenaries do without a [drunk] leader,
> or if they even go rogue and rebel [for real this time] against their
> sickly [and drunk] overlord in Moscow.
>

DING

'Prigozhin BETTER be alive': Wagner fighters threaten to march on Moscow
after Russia claimed mercenary was on-board doomed plane 'brought down
by bombs smuggled in wine crate - as rumours spread he 'faked his death'
and fled in a SECOND plane

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12438731/Was-Prigozhins-jet-brought-bomb-smuggled-inside-case-WINE-brought-board-moments-takeoff-Mystery-Wagner-chiefs-plane-crash-deepens-bizarre-theories-claiming-warlord-faked-death-spread.html
--
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for
light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 15:19:08 -0400, JeSSe wrote:

> TWP wrote:
>> On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:
>>
>>> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>>>
>>>
>> You're too suspicious Jesse. I'm sure Putin had nothing to do with it!
>>
>>
> Well, Putins involvement is 1 possibility ,,, Just so happens 99 out of
> the other 100 possibilities involve him too, so theres that ,,,
>
> I'm thinking the whole little rebellion thing was a KGB setup from the
> start, crafted to milk a little patriotism out of the abused [and very
> drunk] Russian population.
> He had to have known that, in any scenario, this would leave him in a
> precarious position, as people wondered why the despot let the other
> despot live after such a mutiny.
>
> Now we'll see what the [drunk] mercenaries do without a [drunk] leader,
> or if they even go rogue and rebel [for real this time] against their
> sickly [and drunk] overlord in Moscow.

He does seem to have acted expecting support that never arrived. Once he
withdrew he was doomed. He was maybe doomed anyway. Stalin always feared
popular military leaders didn't he. I expect his reasons for doing so
would be familiar to Putin.

TWP wrote:
> On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 15:19:08 -0400, JeSSe wrote:
>
>> TWP wrote:
>>> On Wed, 23 Aug 2023 13:32:23 -0400, JeSSe wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yevgeny Prigozhin "feared" dead, lol
>>>>
>>>>
>>> You're too suspicious Jesse. I'm sure Putin had nothing to do with it!
>>>
>>>
>> Well, Putins involvement is 1 possibility ,,, Just so happens 99 out of
>> the other 100 possibilities involve him too, so theres that ,,,
>>
>> I'm thinking the whole little rebellion thing was a KGB setup from the
>> start, crafted to milk a little patriotism out of the abused [and very
>> drunk] Russian population.
>> He had to have known that, in any scenario, this would leave him in a
>> precarious position, as people wondered why the despot let the other
>> despot live after such a mutiny.
>>
>> Now we'll see what the [drunk] mercenaries do without a [drunk] leader,
>> or if they even go rogue and rebel [for real this time] against their
>> sickly [and drunk] overlord in Moscow.
>
> He does seem to have acted expecting support that never arrived. Once he
> withdrew he was doomed. He was maybe doomed anyway. Stalin always feared
> popular military leaders didn't he. I expect his reasons for doing so
> would be familiar to Putin.
>

Not sure how "popular" he is/was in Russia, I think its safe to say he
was feared more than admired.
He was a chubby, bald, drunk old man leading groups on convicts in war
crimes, I don't think even the average Russian is impressed much by that.

Wagner was conceived and operated to give Putin an unconventional option
for out of country adventures that he could deny being in control of,
and to some extent it appears he was not in total control. King makers
always risk losing control, especially one with a depraved private army.

Closest historical parallel as I have pointed out before was the Nazi
Dirlewanger Brigade,which was also led by a depraved old drunk and was
also composed largely of convicts. Big difference is is that he remained
steadfastly loyal to Hitler, though he did have quite a bit of autonomy
in the field ,, And also Dirlewanger was a highly accomplished and
decorated WW1 combat vet, whereas I highly doubt that a murky character
like Prigozhin has ever shown any bravery in the field or spark of any
tactical genius.

Come to think of it, early SA leader Ernst Röhm was put down and purged
because Hitler felt that he was getting out of control with his private
army, and had issued bellicose threats against anyone who interfered
with his control.
He was actual friends with Hitler and one of the very few who called him
Adolf, but that didn't stop a bullet from going through his head when he
bit the hand that fed.

--
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for
light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

In article <DLLFM.542016$qnnb.203292@fx11.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> wrote:

[...]

> Come to think of it, early SA leader Ernst Röhm was put down and purged
> because Hitler felt that he was getting out of control with his private
> army, and had issued bellicose threats against anyone who interfered
> with his control.
> He was actual friends with Hitler and one of the very few who called him
> Adolf, but that didn't stop a bullet from going through his head when he
> bit the hand that fed.

It was suggested that his homosexuality also played a role, but it was
probably a minor factor. But who knows. It apparently lead people to
suspect that Hitler was a homosexual.

IIRC he also never fell under Hitler's spell, to the degree of publicly
mocking him. Not a clever thing to do.

Loose Cannon wrote:
> In article <DLLFM.542016$qnnb.203292@fx11.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>> Come to think of it, early SA leader Ernst Röhm was put down and purged
>> because Hitler felt that he was getting out of control with his private
>> army, and had issued bellicose threats against anyone who interfered
>> with his control.
>> He was actual friends with Hitler and one of the very few who called him
>> Adolf, but that didn't stop a bullet from going through his head when he
>> bit the hand that fed.
>
> It was suggested that his homosexuality also played a role, but it was
> probably a minor factor. But who knows. It apparently lead people to
> suspect that Hitler was a homosexual.
>
> IIRC he also never fell under Hitler's spell, to the degree of publicly
> mocking him. Not a clever thing to do.
>

I think its pretty well documented that Roehm and the top echelons of
leadership within the SA were homos - Hitler was willing to overlook
their deviancies so long as they performed well in the streets and
followed orders ,, Which they did for quite many years until Roehms head
swelled and deemed himself an untouchable shot caller, which put him in
direct conflict with Hitler.

We know the story, in addition to that, some of the Nazis well heeled
backers and regular army aristocrats were repulsed by the uncouth street
ruffians, which was another compelling reason why Hitler calculated he
was better off without Roehm than with him.

So there are parallels with the Wagner situation but they only go so
far, many different dynamics and of course, Wagners are small time
wannabes compared to the early SA, they were the real deal until the
purge ,, Then the SS took over as Hitlers trusted guard.

--
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for
light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

In article <7KOFM.575090$TCKc.11919@fx13.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> wrote:

> Loose Cannon wrote:

[...]

>> It was suggested that his homosexuality also played a role, but it was
>> probably a minor factor. But who knows. It apparently lead people to
>> suspect that Hitler was a homosexual.
>>
>> IIRC he also never fell under Hitler's spell, to the degree of publicly
>> mocking him. Not a clever thing to do.

> I think its pretty well documented that Roehm and the top echelons of
> leadership within the SA were homos - Hitler was willing to overlook
> their deviancies so long as they performed well in the streets and
> followed orders ,, Which they did for quite many years until Roehms head
> swelled and deemed himself an untouchable shot caller, which put him in
> direct conflict with Hitler.
>
> We know the story, in addition to that, some of the Nazis well heeled
> backers and regular army aristocrats were repulsed by the uncouth street
> ruffians, which was another compelling reason why Hitler calculated he
> was better off without Roehm than with him.
>
> So there are parallels with the Wagner situation but they only go so
> far, many different dynamics and of course, Wagners are small time
> wannabes compared to the early SA, they were the real deal until the
> purge ,, Then the SS took over as Hitlers trusted guard.

Re "... were repulsed by the uncouth...", that was also the case with
Streicher. However Hitler protected him -- well, he obviously did not
pose any threat.

I'm not an expert on Hitler's inner circle, but it seems Goebbels was the
only one who remained 100% committed to him until the very end. Bormann
in a sense as well, but he did try to flee, and not commit suicide.

I wonder whether anyone will remain loyal to Putin, if and when the
Russians decide they've had enough.

Loose Cannon wrote:
> In article <7KOFM.575090$TCKc.11919@fx13.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> wrote:
>
>> Loose Cannon wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>>> It was suggested that his homosexuality also played a role, but it was
>>> probably a minor factor. But who knows. It apparently lead people to
>>> suspect that Hitler was a homosexual.
>>>
>>> IIRC he also never fell under Hitler's spell, to the degree of publicly
>>> mocking him. Not a clever thing to do.
>
>> I think its pretty well documented that Roehm and the top echelons of
>> leadership within the SA were homos - Hitler was willing to overlook
>> their deviancies so long as they performed well in the streets and
>> followed orders ,, Which they did for quite many years until Roehms head
>> swelled and deemed himself an untouchable shot caller, which put him in
>> direct conflict with Hitler.
>>
>> We know the story, in addition to that, some of the Nazis well heeled
>> backers and regular army aristocrats were repulsed by the uncouth street
>> ruffians, which was another compelling reason why Hitler calculated he
>> was better off without Roehm than with him.
>>
>> So there are parallels with the Wagner situation but they only go so
>> far, many different dynamics and of course, Wagners are small time
>> wannabes compared to the early SA, they were the real deal until the
>> purge ,, Then the SS took over as Hitlers trusted guard.
>
> Re "... were repulsed by the uncouth...", that was also the case with
> Streicher. However Hitler protected him -- well, he obviously did not
> pose any threat.
>
> I'm not an expert on Hitler's inner circle, but it seems Goebbels was the
> only one who remained 100% committed to him until the very end. Bormann
> in a sense as well, but he did try to flee, and not commit suicide.

Hitler had quite a loyally streak himself for people that were loyal to
him, Streicher had similar WW1 experiences to Hitlers [awarded the EK1 &
2] Was with him at the beer hall, he was highly nostalgic to Hitler and
that was probably the main reason Hitler kept up the relationship until
the end.
I personally don't think Streicher earned a noose, as distasteful and
vulgar though he may have been, he was a propagandist, not a shot caller
or even close.
I guess the reasoning was he inflamed passions and prejudices which led
to war crimes, though he himself had nothing to do with them. I think
the allies were also sore they couldn't stretch the neck of Goebbels and
used Streicher as somewhat of a stand-in, the only moderately high
ranking propagandist they had.
[They actually did have one of Goebbels secretaries on the dock at
Nuremberg, no one seemed to know what he was doing there and he was
found not guilty on all charges]

For that matter, I don't think Goebbels either deserved a noose if he
was taken alive ,, If telling lies to the population on behalf of the
government was a war crime punishable by death, there would be one
helluva lot of people across the globe put to death before, during and
after WW2.

Of course Nuremberg was set up like one gigantic victors justice RICO
act, guilt by association was enough for conviction.

> I wonder whether anyone will remain loyal to Putin, if and when the
> Russians decide they've had enough.

Seems unlikely, I think far more of his countrymen hate his guts than
would take a bullet for him, in direct contrast with Hitler.

--
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for
light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

In article <w5VFM.617230$SuUf.45929@fx14.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> wrote:

[...]

> Hitler had quite a loyally streak himself for people that were loyal to
> him, Streicher had similar WW1 experiences to Hitlers [awarded the EK1 &
> 2] Was with him at the beer hall, he was highly nostalgic to Hitler and
> that was probably the main reason Hitler kept up the relationship until
> the end.

Indeed. He even allowed two Jews who were very nice to him to leave
Germany with their possessions -- the officer who recommended him for
the Iron Cross, and the doctor who treated his mother kindly and
"charged reduced prices, sometimes taking no fee at all".

Paranoids seem to have this soft spot for the very few they believe
are *not* against them. I recall reading that Henry VIII had such a
soft spot for only one of his associates, who managed to survive after
being close to him for many years.

> I personally don't think Streicher earned a noose, as distasteful and
> vulgar though he may have been, he was a propagandist, not a shot caller
> or even close.

He was bad enough for Goebbels to refer to him as a "pig" in his diary.

> I guess the reasoning was he inflamed passions and prejudices which led
> to war crimes, though he himself had nothing to do with them.

IIRC he also explicitly called for the extermination of the Jews. I
guess this was the deciding factor.

William Joyce was not nearly as bad as Streicher, even if you throw
in the "treason" factor -- and he was also hanged.

> I think
> the allies were also sore they couldn't stretch the neck of Goebbels and
> used Streicher as somewhat of a stand-in, the only moderately high
> ranking propagandist they had.

Could be.

> [They actually did have one of Goebbels secretaries on the dock at
> Nuremberg, no one seemed to know what he was doing there and he was
> found not guilty on all charges]

Interesting, never hard of that.

> For that matter, I don't think Goebbels either deserved a noose if he
> was taken alive ,, If telling lies to the population on behalf of the
> government was a war crime punishable by death, there would be one
> helluva lot of people across the globe put to death before, during and
> after WW2.

I don't know too much about him. Alas

"He was aware throughout that the Jews were being exterminated, and
completely supported this decision. He was one of the few top Nazi
officials to do so publicly."

What a show it would have been had Hitelr and Goebbels turned
themselves in and stood trial...

> Of course Nuremberg was set up like one gigantic victors justice RICO
> act, guilt by association was enough for conviction.

I actually never bothered to read too much about it. My interest is
limited to what happened during the war, at the operational level. For
that, a very informative source are documents and the trials of the
camp's staff and the Einsatzgruppen, many of them held by the Germans
themselves.

IIRC quite a few people were acquitted in Nuremberg. Speer was only
jailed. Many other Nazis had their sentences greatly reduced. Generally,
considering what transpired during the war, I don't think the Nazis were
treated that badly, post-war, with some of the sentences meted out (esp.
by the German legal system) being absurdly lenient. However, they are not
unique in that regard, we have our Lt. Calley.

Hell, even the Israelis gave Eichmann a chance to defend himself and
present his case (although the outcome was probably known in advance).

>> I wonder whether anyone will remain loyal to Putin, if and when the
>> Russians decide they've had enough.

> Seems unlikely, I think far more of his countrymen hate his guts than
> would take a bullet for him, in direct contrast with Hitler.

The sooner the better. Polonium-210 in his vodka, perhaps?

Loose Cannon <efbregg73@gmx-xx.comm> wrote:

> Paranoids seem to have this soft spot for the very few they believe
> are *not* against them. I recall reading that Henry VIII had such a
> soft spot for only one of his associates, who managed to survive after
> being close to him for many years.

I may have been a little too harsh on the fat crazy bastard, with the
"managed to survive", alas:

"Brandon was perhaps the only person in England who successfully
retained Henry VIII's affection for most of a period of forty years."

So I guess he didn't murder *all* his close associates :)

Loose Cannon wrote:
> In article <w5VFM.617230$SuUf.45929@fx14.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>> Hitler had quite a loyally streak himself for people that were loyal to
>> him, Streicher had similar WW1 experiences to Hitlers [awarded the EK1 &
>> 2] Was with him at the beer hall, he was highly nostalgic to Hitler and
>> that was probably the main reason Hitler kept up the relationship until
>> the end.
>
> Indeed. He even allowed two Jews who were very nice to him to leave
> Germany with their possessions -- the officer who recommended him for
> the Iron Cross, and the doctor who treated his mother kindly and
> "charged reduced prices, sometimes taking no fee at all".
>
> Paranoids seem to have this soft spot for the very few they believe
> are *not* against them. I recall reading that Henry VIII had such a
> soft spot for only one of his associates, who managed to survive after
> being close to him for many years.
>
>> I personally don't think Streicher earned a noose, as distasteful and
>> vulgar though he may have been, he was a propagandist, not a shot caller
>> or even close.
>
> He was bad enough for Goebbels to refer to him as a "pig" in his diary.

His base character is not disputed, he made a living off it
>
>> I guess the reasoning was he inflamed passions and prejudices which led
>> to war crimes, though he himself had nothing to do with them.
>
> IIRC he also explicitly called for the extermination of the Jews. I
> guess this was the deciding factor.

I'm sure there was no lack of material to charge him for incitement, I
don't think there were any incitement charges at Nuremberg but rather
crimes against peace, war crimes, and crimes against humanity - He was
pronounced guilty of the last and hanged.

>
> William Joyce was not nearly as bad as Streicher, even if you throw
> in the "treason" factor -- and he was also hanged.

Well, was referring specifically to Nuremberg, 100's if not 1,000's of
others were charged in other trials, including Lord Haw Haw.
>
>> I think
>> the allies were also sore they couldn't stretch the neck of Goebbels and
>> used Streicher as somewhat of a stand-in, the only moderately high
>> ranking propagandist they had.
>
> Could be.
>
>> [They actually did have one of Goebbels secretaries on the dock at
>> Nuremberg, no one seemed to know what he was doing there and he was
>> found not guilty on all charges]
>
> Interesting, never hard of that.

From wiki: Hans Fritzsche
Popular radio commentator; head of the news division of the Nazi
Propaganda Ministry.[avalon 5] Sentenced to 9 years of hard labor by a
denazification court in 1947. Released early in 1950.[16] Fritzsche had
made himself a career within German radio, because his voice was similar
to Goebbels'.[17] Died 27 September 1953.
>
>> For that matter, I don't think Goebbels either deserved a noose if he
>> was taken alive ,, If telling lies to the population on behalf of the
>> government was a war crime punishable by death, there would be one
>> helluva lot of people across the globe put to death before, during and
>> after WW2.
>
> I don't know too much about him. Alas

Can't say I do either, either legal principles apply to all all of the
time, or some some of the time
>
> "He was aware throughout that the Jews were being exterminated, and
> completely supported this decision. He was one of the few top Nazi
> officials to do so publicly."
>
> What a show it would have been had Hitelr and Goebbels turned
> themselves in and stood trial...
>
>> Of course Nuremberg was set up like one gigantic victors justice RICO
>> act, guilt by association was enough for conviction.
>
> I actually never bothered to read too much about it. My interest is
> limited to what happened during the war, at the operational level. For
> that, a very informative source are documents and the trials of the
> camp's staff and the Einsatzgruppen, many of them held by the Germans
> themselves.
>
> IIRC quite a few people were acquitted in Nuremberg. Speer was only
> jailed. Many other Nazis had their sentences greatly reduced. Generally,
> considering what transpired during the war, I don't think the Nazis were
> treated that badly, post-war, with some of the sentences meted out
True, they could have fared worse, thats for sure.
Was no doubt positively unhealthy and career ending to show any sympathy
for them in the wake of the large scale nightmare they had a large part
in causing, and victors justice [also practiced in Japan post WW2] was
to be expected.

As with most things, its easy to look back and ponder that this or that
could have been done better or differently, there was a demand for harsh
judgements [especially with Soviets on the judgement panel], and they
had to deliver [and yes, no doubt many if not most deserved a rope]
--
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for
light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

In article <i_4GM.619452$SuUf.24044@fx14.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> wrote:

[...]

> As with most things, its easy to look back and ponder that this or that
> could have been done better or differently, there was a demand for harsh
> judgements [especially with Soviets on the judgement panel], and they
> had to deliver [and yes, no doubt many if not most deserved a rope]

Certainly the Soviets (and the Poles, probably acting as proxy) were
harsher; after all, they suffered far more than any other nation.

Still, interestingly, while executing many of those who called the shots
in Auschwitz

"The Supreme National Tribunal sat in Cracow for a second important trial, known as the Auschwitz garrison trial.
Of the 40 people indicted, 23 (including the second Auschwitz commandant, Arthur Liebehenschel, political
department head Maximilian Grabner, and women’s camp director Maria Mandel) were sentenced to death, and 6 to life
imprisonment."

They were relatively lenient with the lower ranks:

"Other trials were held between 1946 and 1953 before regional, voivodship, and special courts in Katowice, Cracow,
Cieszyn, Gliwice, Racibórz, Sosnowiec, and Wadowice. The most common sentences for lower-ranking members of the
Auschwitz garrison were three years in prison (203 times, for 31.9% of all the sentences) and 4 years (111 times,
17.5%). Death and life sentences were relatively rare (41 times, 6.1%)."

Prof. Johann Paul Kremer, whose Auschwitz diary is often quoted, was sentenced to death
by the Poles, but eventually released in 1958. He later testified in the famous Frankfurt
trial, held by the Germans.

The German courts, BTW, meted out sentences based almost exclusively on whether
someone "just followed orders", or murdered/tortured out of sadism. The first
category of defendants usually received mild sentences, some of the latter were
sentenced to life.