https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-middle-east-67037895

10:05
Israeli PM statement in full

"Citizens of Israel. We are at war, not an operation, not an escalation, a
war.

"This morning Hamas launched a murderous surprise attack against the state
of Israel and its citizens. We've been at it since early morning.

"I convened the heads of the security system, first of all I instructed to
cleanse the settlements of the terrorists who had infiltrated - this
operation is being carried out during these hours.

"At the same time, I ordered an extensive reserve mobilization and a
retaliatory war with a strength and scope that the enemy had never known.

"The enemy will pay a price he has never known. In the meantime, I call on
all citizens of Israel to strictly obey the instructions of the army and
the instructions of the Home Command.

"We are in a war and we will win it."

10:51
An unprecedented and unexpected development

Jeremy Bowen

International editor

What’s been happening this morning is without precedent in the more than
15 years since Hamas took control of Gaza.

It comes after months of violence and rising tension between Israelis and
Palestinians, although most of that has been concentrated in the West
Bank, which is the territory Israel has occupied since 1967, that
stretches between Jerusalem and the border with Jordan.

Israel has said it’s been attacked, that effectively Hamas had declared
war on Israel, and I would expect that the plans that the Israelis are
putting together now will result in a very vigorous response – they’ve
said that’s what’s going to happen.

I think there’s a strong chance that will include perhaps putting troops
into Gaza.

This situation will move fast and it’s likely to escalate. One big
question is what happens now - not just in and around Gaza - but what
happens in Jerusalem and the West Bank, where there has been repeated and
deepening violence between Palestinian armed groups and Israeli security
forces and settlers for months.

An already volatile situation is certain to be exacerbated by these events.

So I think right now for Israelis and Palestinians, this is a thoroughly
unexpected and highly worrying and concerning morning.

10:59
Breaking More than 500 injured - Israel health ministry

Israel's health ministry says at least 545 people have been injured in the
Palestinian attacks, according to the Reuters news agency.

At least 22 Israelis have died in the unprecedented attacks, according to
emergency services.

11:23
What do we know about reports of hostages?

Graeme Baker

Live reporter

The Israeli television channel Reshet 13 reports that Palestinian
militants are holding Israelis captive in the southern town of Ofakim,
according to the Reuters news agency.

This is one of the first reports we have from Israeli media on the
situation, after widespread claims on social media that Palestinian
militants have taken captives.

Unverified videos on social media appear to show Palestinians taking
civilians captive and moving them by motorbike into Gaza.

The Israeli authorities have said they will not comment on this and BBC
News has so far been unable to verify the reports.

However, a Hamas spokesman told Al Jazeera that "they are not hostages -
they are prisoners of war".

11:44
Iran backs Palestinian attack

We've just received reports saying the advisor to Iran's Supreme leader
Ali Khamenei supports the Palestinian attack on Israel.

"We congratulate the Palestinian fighters," Rahim Safavi is quoted as
saying by the ISNA news agency.

"We will stand by the Palestinian fighters until the liberation of
Palestine and Jerusalem”, he says.

On Sat, 07 Oct 2023 11:03:57 GMT
TWP <ngspammersad@yahoo.com> wrote:

> An unprecedented and unexpected development

Not expected today, but not exactly unexpected.

One only has to ask 'what would I do if my home and homeland was taken from me by an enemy who wants to destroy me' to know what the outcome would ultimately be.

When it's a matter of reclaiming what is yours or surrendering to your enemy, when it's a choice of living on your knees or dying on your feet; what would you do ?

At least we can enjoy a festival of hypocrisy as those who say Ukrainians are right to fight to secure their homeland, who back billions of tax payer dollars being gifted to help them do so, who proclaim Russia's land-grab is wrong, insist Israel's is right, and Palestinians just have to suck it up.

Stupid move by Hamas (although very successful in the short range).

They have lost all the moral credit they may have had, with this
totally unjustified and unprovoked massive attack on civilians.

Israel needs to bomb the living hell out of these animals, as
it did in Lebanon in 2006. Nothing else works.

On Sat, 07 Oct 2023 12:27:53 +0000, Loose Cannon wrote:

> Stupid move by Hamas (although very successful in the short range).
>
> They have lost all the moral credit they may have had, with this totally
> unjustified and unprovoked massive attack on civilians.
>
> Israel needs to bomb the living hell out of these animals, as it did in
> Lebanon in 2006. Nothing else works.

I wonder if Israel will just take over the whole lot.

In article <JtdUM.17919$6sw7.14349@fx15.ams1>,
TWP <ngspammersad@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Sat, 07 Oct 2023 12:27:53 +0000, Loose Cannon wrote:

>> Stupid move by Hamas (although very successful in the short range).
>>
>> They have lost all the moral credit they may have had, with this totally
>> unjustified and unprovoked massive attack on civilians.
>>
>> Israel needs to bomb the living hell out of these animals, as it did in
>> Lebanon in 2006. Nothing else works.

> I wonder if Israel will just take over the whole lot.

That's probably impossible.

The security services are probably watching out for attacks in sympathy.
Don't look like a suicide bomber if you pass any armed police. Probably
good advice most of the time.

On Sat, 07 Oct 2023 12:53:41 +0100, The Happy Hippy wrote:

> At least we can enjoy a festival of hypocrisy as those who say
> Ukrainians are right to fight to secure their homeland, who back
> billions of tax payer dollars being gifted to help them do so, who
> proclaim Russia's land-grab is wrong, insist Israel's is right, and
> Palestinians just have to suck it up.

I suppose - along with everything else that makes it different! - in
Ukraine's case Russia broke the peace. In the Israel v Hamas war it was
Hamas that broke the peace making Israel the one that's defending itself.

Loose Cannon wrote:
> Stupid move by Hamas (although very successful in the short range).
>
> They have lost all the moral credit they may have had, with this
> totally unjustified and unprovoked massive attack on civilians.
>
> Israel needs to bomb the living hell out of these animals, as
> it did in Lebanon in 2006. Nothing else works.
>
I wonder how many jews will remember that Xiden gifted the mullahs with
6B$ less than 1 month ago and routinely pays millions for hostages, and
that his soft policies and steady cash flow has encouraged bandits
around the globe to act out ?

Of course, they can't say much about it since we will be expected to
subsidize their war, just like we are with Ukraine.
Bombs are running low for Ukraine, they'll be running even lower now as
the joos present their list of the munitions, donations and services
they require.

Its a given that they will bomb the living hell out of them, I just wish
they were their own bombs [for once] instead of ours

--
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for
light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

On Sat, 07 Oct 2023 13:58:01 GMT
TWP <ngspammersad@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Sat, 07 Oct 2023 12:27:53 +0000, Loose Cannon wrote:
>
> > Stupid move by Hamas (although very successful in the short range).
> >
> > They have lost all the moral credit they may have had, with this
> > totally unjustified and unprovoked massive attack on civilians.

Others don't see it that way.

Israel's illegal occupations are against International Law, has only gone unpunished because America doesn't respect International Law, is beholden to the Israel Lobby, and efforts by the right to make boycotting of Israel and support for the Palestinian cause illegal.

Biden has already reaffirmed America's unconditional support of Israel and her illegal acts.

> > Israel needs to bomb the living hell out of these animals, as it
> > did in Lebanon in 2006. Nothing else works.

Yes, genocide is a workable final solution.

Israel's right-wing learned the wrong lessons from the holocaust.

As have America's right-wing.

> I wonder if Israel will just take over the whole lot.

That has always been the plan.

Netanyahu has already told everyone to leave Gaza, has promised to turn it to rubble. He and Israel's right-wing have long been waiting for this pretext to continue illegal expansion.

On Sun, 08 Oct 2023 02:03:39 GMT
TWP <ngspammersad@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Sat, 07 Oct 2023 12:53:41 +0100, The Happy Hippy wrote:
>
>
> > At least we can enjoy a festival of hypocrisy as those who say
> > Ukrainians are right to fight to secure their homeland, who back
> > billions of tax payer dollars being gifted to help them do so, who
> > proclaim Russia's land-grab is wrong, insist Israel's is right, and
> > Palestinians just have to suck it up.
>
>
> I suppose - along with everything else that makes it different! - in
> Ukraine's case Russia broke the peace. In the Israel v Hamas war it
> was Hamas that broke the peace making Israel the one that's defending
> itself.

As I said, a festival of hypocrisy. Israel is illegally occupying Palestinian land against International Law.

In article <QZoUM.12264$w4ec.2143@fx14.iad>, JeSSe <zo@so.org> wrote:

> Loose Cannon wrote:

>> Stupid move by Hamas (although very successful in the short range).
>>
>> They have lost all the moral credit they may have had, with this
>> totally unjustified and unprovoked massive attack on civilians.
>>
>> Israel needs to bomb the living hell out of these animals, as
>> it did in Lebanon in 2006. Nothing else works.

> I wonder how many jews will remember that Xiden gifted the mullahs with
> 6B$ less than 1 month ago and routinely pays millions for hostages, and
> that his soft policies and steady cash flow has encouraged bandits
> around the globe to act out ?
>
> Of course, they can't say much about it since we will be expected to
> subsidize their war, just like we are with Ukraine.
> Bombs are running low for Ukraine, they'll be running even lower now as
> the joos present their list of the munitions, donations and services
> they require.
>
> Its a given that they will bomb the living hell out of them, I just wish
> they were their own bombs [for once] instead of ours

Agreed.

I think there is a relatively cheap solution. Every 20 minutes or so,
fire a 155mm shell (a plain old one, they are rather cheap) randomly into
Gaza city. If the Hamas can fire thousands of rockets at civilians all
over Israel, then well, such a retaliation is more than fair, as even
the dumbest left wing monkey will have to admit.

Do it for weeks and months, increase to a shell every 10/5/1 minutes if
Hamas continues. Add commando raids which randomly kill hundreds of
Gazans (again, if the Hamas can do it...).

Just, simple and cheap, no F-35 etc.

On Sun, 8 Oct 2023 14:13:11 +0000 (UTC)
Loose Cannon <efbregg73@gmx-xx.comm> wrote:

> I think there is a relatively cheap solution. Every 20 minutes or so,
> fire a 155mm shell (a plain old one, they are rather cheap) randomly
> into Gaza city.

Should work. It's only a war crime when we designate the ones who do hat as Bad Guys. Those we designate Good Guys are allowed to get away with anything, war crimes, even genocide.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-middle-east-67045650

<quote>

Footage shows the aftermath of Israeli air strikes on Gaza, where a mosque was completely destroyed.

</quote>

And plenty of other footage of civilians killed and civilian infrastructure destroyed if one avoids the pro Israel slaughter channels.

In article <20231008161900.0000634b@ntlworld.invalid>,
The Happy Hippy <the.happy.hippy.nntp@ntlworld.invalid> wrote:

> Loose Cannon <efbregg73@gmx-xx.comm> wrote:

>> I think there is a relatively cheap solution. Every 20 minutes or so,
>> fire a 155mm shell (a plain old one, they are rather cheap) randomly
>> into Gaza city.

> Should work.

Hopefully, yes.

> It's only a war crime when we designate the ones who do hat as Bad Guys.

The Bad Guys are the ones who started it.

> Footage shows the aftermath of Israeli air strikes on Gaza, where a mosque
> was completely destroyed.

Tough shit. Next time, don't start wars, crazy motherfuckers.

The Israelis left Gaza 20 years ago. Since then, the one and only goal
of Hamas is to destroy Israel. All its efforts, all its resources, are
channeled to obtain this goal. I can understand why Israel is unwilling
to leave the West Bank.

Even these nutters understood it this time:

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/hkuorkkbt

"Some of Israel's most vocal opponents in Congress issued strong
condemnations of the attack on Israel by Hamas and Islamic Jihad"

On Sun, 8 Oct 2023 15:42:13 +0000 (UTC)
Loose Cannon <efbregg73@gmx-xx.comm> wrote:

> The Bad Guys are the ones who started it.

I suspect we have different views on who the Bad Guys are.

Of course it's what any "it" is, the when and why, which matters.

I recall there was a time when Israel didn't exist. Then it did.

I don't recall Palestinians ever saying please illegally take our homes and lands. But that's what Israel has done.

> > Footage shows the aftermath of Israeli air strikes on Gaza, where a
> > mosque was completely destroyed.
>
> Tough shit.

You dismiss war crimes with "tough shit". No great surprise. It's a festival of hypocrisy as I previously said.

> Even these nutters understood it this time:

Ah yes, the usual 'everyone who doesn't agree with me is a nutter, mad, or mentally defective' nonsense, the arrogant 'I'm right and everyone else is wrong' supremacist viewpoint. "Typical American" as many would say.

In article <20231008211552.00005bf4@ntlworld.invalid>,
The Happy Hippy <the.happy.hippy.nntp@ntlworld.invalid> wrote:

[yawn]

On Sun, 8 Oct 2023 20:56:48 +0000 (UTC)
Loose Cannon <efbregg73@gmx-xx.comm> wrote:

> In article <20231008211552.00005bf4@ntlworld.invalid>,
> The Happy Hippy <the.happy.hippy.nntp@ntlworld.invalid> wrote:
>
> [yawn]

And another cut and run.

You are so predictable. I have lost count how many times you have done this.

Sorry if I'm not such a sucker for your trolling as others are. I'm sure you'll still get some perverse enjoyment trolling Jessie as he cheers your outrageous notions, exceeds them. And at some point you'll turn to trying to get him to agree with you as you always do, or have him wasting his time in some pointless debate.

Jessie is too fucking stupid to know when he's being trolled.

Not all of us are.

In article <20231008224409.00004e4c@ntlworld.invalid>,
The Happy Hippy <the.happy.hippy.nntp@ntlworld.invalid> wrote:

[flush]

A waste of time, you poor, old, crazy bugger.

Go find a 10 year old to insult. It won't be easy, the large
majority are smarter than you.

On Sun, 8 Oct 2023 22:09:48 +0000 (UTC)
Loose Cannon <efbregg73@gmx-xx.comm> wrote:

> In article <20231008224409.00004e4c@ntlworld.invalid>,
> The Happy Hippy <the.happy.hippy.nntp@ntlworld.invalid> wrote:
>
> [flush]
>
> A waste of time, you poor, old, crazy bugger.
>
> Go find a 10 year old to insult. It won't be easy, the large
> majority are smarter than you.

LOL. Just more of your demonising bullshit propaganda.

I know name-calling is a national sport of retards in the Shithole States of America but it just washes off me.