I am updating my address details for my driving licence and form V5C.
According to the DVLA website, You need to 'Update your Direct Debit
.... If you pay for your vehicle tax by Direct Debit, you need to tell
DVLA when you change address'. Is this bollox? If I change my address,
why would the bank dishonour existing direct debits? I don't think the
address even appears on a direct debit mandate.

On 08/03/2024 03:05 pm, Scott wrote:

> I am updating my address details for my driving licence and form V5C.
> According to the DVLA website, You need to 'Update your Direct Debit
> ... If you pay for your vehicle tax by Direct Debit, you need to tell
> DVLA when you change address'. Is this bollox? If I change my address,
> why would the bank dishonour existing direct debits? I don't think the
> address even appears on a direct debit mandate.

The most obvious relevant part is:

"...you need to tell DVLA when you change address...".

And that is true without reference to direct debits. It's required so
that the police (or other authorised public bodies) know where to send
fixed penalty notices, summonses, etc. and know where to contact you if
a police officer needs to speak to you.

I understand that it is an offence not to advise the DVLA of a change of
address (and it used to be the same when county-level local authorities
issued driving licences prior to 1975).

On Fri, 8 Mar 2024 16:03:39 +0000, JNugent <jnugent97@mail.com> wrote:

>On 08/03/2024 03:05 pm, Scott wrote:
>
>> I am updating my address details for my driving licence and form V5C.
>> According to the DVLA website, You need to 'Update your Direct Debit
>> ... If you pay for your vehicle tax by Direct Debit, you need to tell
>> DVLA when you change address'. Is this bollox? If I change my address,
>> why would the bank dishonour existing direct debits? I don't think the
>> address even appears on a direct debit mandate.
>
>The most obvious relevant part is:
>
>"...you need to tell DVLA when you change address...".
>
>And that is true without reference to direct debits. It's required so
>that the police (or other authorised public bodies) know where to send
>fixed penalty notices, summonses, etc. and know where to contact you if
>a police officer needs to speak to you.
>
>I understand that it is an offence not to advise the DVLA of a change of
>address (and it used to be the same when county-level local authorities
>issued driving licences prior to 1975).

I fully understand this, and the reasoning, but this was not my
question. The DVLA website presents this as a five step process:
(1) Update your driving licence
(2) Update your vehicle's log book (V5C)
(3) Update your Direct Debit
(4) [...]
(5) [...]

My point is that having completed steps 1 and 2, why is step 3
necessary? See: https://www.gov.uk/tell-dvla-changed-address

On 08/03/2024 15:05, Scott wrote:
> I am updating my address details for my driving licence and form V5C.
> According to the DVLA website, You need to 'Update your Direct Debit
> ... If you pay for your vehicle tax by Direct Debit, you need to tell
> DVLA when you change address'. Is this bollox? If I change my address,
> why would the bank dishonour existing direct debits? I don't think the
> address even appears on a direct debit mandate.

Depending how far you moved, you may have changed your bank branch and
the sort code will then also change.

--
Colin Bignell

On Fri, 8 Mar 2024 17:02:37 +0000, Colin Bignell
<cpb@bignellREMOVETHIS.me.uk> wrote:

>On 08/03/2024 15:05, Scott wrote:
>> I am updating my address details for my driving licence and form V5C.
>> According to the DVLA website, You need to 'Update your Direct Debit
>> ... If you pay for your vehicle tax by Direct Debit, you need to tell
>> DVLA when you change address'. Is this bollox? If I change my address,
>> why would the bank dishonour existing direct debits? I don't think the
>> address even appears on a direct debit mandate.
>
>Depending how far you moved, you may have changed your bank branch and
>the sort code will then also change.

So 'need' is bollox (as I suspected).

Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> I fully understand this, and the reasoning, but this was not my
> question. The DVLA website presents this as a five step process:
> (1) Update your driving licence
> (2) Update your vehicle's log book (V5C)
> (3) Update your Direct Debit
> (4) [...]
> (5) [...]
>
> My point is that having completed steps 1 and 2, why is step 3
> necessary? See: https://www.gov.uk/tell-dvla-changed-address

https://www.directdebit.co.uk/using-direct-debit/setting-up-a-direct-debit/
"Step 1 – Set up a Direct Debit Instruction

Whether the organisation asks you to do this online, over the phone, or by
post, the information you’ll need to provide is the same:

Your name and address
The name and address of your bank or building society
Your bank or building society account number
The branch sort code of your bank or building society (see your debit card or banking app)
The name(s) on the account.

The organisation will send the Instruction onto your bank or building
society, and start to collect payments on the date you agreed with them.
Most organisations offer a choice of dates so, if one doesn’t suit you, ask
if there’s another option."

Presumably the address forms part of the direct debit instruction.
Although it seems to appear on some direct debit forms and not others.

Theo

On 08 Mar 2024 17:35:34 +0000 (GMT), Theo
<theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

>Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>> I fully understand this, and the reasoning, but this was not my
>> question. The DVLA website presents this as a five step process:
>> (1) Update your driving licence
>> (2) Update your vehicle's log book (V5C)
>> (3) Update your Direct Debit
>> (4) [...]
>> (5) [...]
>>
>> My point is that having completed steps 1 and 2, why is step 3
>> necessary? See: https://www.gov.uk/tell-dvla-changed-address
>
>https://www.directdebit.co.uk/using-direct-debit/setting-up-a-direct-debit/
>"Step 1 – Set up a Direct Debit Instruction
>
>Whether the organisation asks you to do this online, over the phone, or by
>post, the information you’ll need to provide is the same:
>
> Your name and address
> The name and address of your bank or building society
> Your bank or building society account number
> The branch sort code of your bank or building society (see your debit card or banking app)
> The name(s) on the account.
>
>The organisation will send the Instruction onto your bank or building
>society, and start to collect payments on the date you agreed with them.
>Most organisations offer a choice of dates so, if one doesn’t suit you, ask
>if there’s another option."
>
>Presumably the address forms part of the direct debit instruction.
>Although it seems to appear on some direct debit forms and not others.
>
Are you saying that the existing direct debit for my existing account
for which I have notified the bank of the change of address is no
longer valid and a new direct debit mandate is needed? If you can
change banks and let the banks do the work, surely to goodness you can
change your address and let the bank do the work?

On 08/03/2024 17:02, Colin Bignell wrote:
> On 08/03/2024 15:05, Scott wrote:
>> I am updating my address details for my driving licence and form V5C.
>> According to the DVLA website, You need to 'Update your Direct Debit
>> ... If you pay for your vehicle tax by Direct Debit, you need to tell
>> DVLA when you change address'. Is this bollox? If I change my address,
>> why would the bank dishonour existing direct debits? I don't think the
>> address even appears on a direct debit mandate.
>
> Depending how far you moved, you may have changed your bank branch and
> the sort code will then also change.

But the bank should be dealing with that, by internal redirection or
update. The customer shouldn't be having to update details for
half-a-dozen or more direct debits. The banks even advertise that if you
move your account from one bank to another, they can automatically
transfer your direct debits and standing orders for you, without you
having to do anything - why on earth would they not be able to do the
same internally, between their own branches? Anyway, as most branches
close and people deal mainly online, branch sort codes are becoming
pretty meaningless (my branch and all those for miles around have long
gone) and there seems little reason anymore for the banks to have to
change the account/sort code when you move to another address.

On Fri, 08 Mar 2024 17:59:25 +0000, Scott
<newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:

> On 08 Mar 2024 17:35:34 +0000 (GMT), Theo
> <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>
> >Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> >> I fully understand this, and the reasoning, but this was not my
> >> question. The DVLA website presents this as a five step process:
> >> (1) Update your driving licence
> >> (2) Update your vehicle's log book (V5C)
> >> (3) Update your Direct Debit
> >> (4) [...]
> >> (5) [...]
> >>
> >> My point is that having completed steps 1 and 2, why is step 3
> >> necessary? See: https://www.gov.uk/tell-dvla-changed-address
> >
> >https://www.directdebit.co.uk/using-direct-debit/setting-up-a-direct-debit/
> >"Step 1 – Set up a Direct Debit Instruction
> >
> >Whether the organisation asks you to do this online, over the phone, or by
> >post, the information you’ll need to provide is the same:
> >
> > Your name and address
> > The name and address of your bank or building society
> > Your bank or building society account number
> > The branch sort code of your bank or building society (see your debit card or banking app)
> > The name(s) on the account.
> >
> >The organisation will send the Instruction onto your bank or building
> >society, and start to collect payments on the date you agreed with them.
> >Most organisations offer a choice of dates so, if one doesn’t suit you, ask
> >if there’s another option."
> >
> >Presumably the address forms part of the direct debit instruction.
> >Although it seems to appear on some direct debit forms and not others.
> >
> Are you saying that the existing direct debit for my existing account
> for which I have notified the bank of the change of address is no
> longer valid and a new direct debit mandate is needed? If you can
> change banks and let the banks do the work, surely to goodness you can
> change your address and let the bank do the work?

Do not rely on it.
Some years ago Santander persuaded a relative to switch from one
Santander account to another at the same branch. They then cancelled
all the Direct Debits and claimed that the promise about no-hassle
switching between banks did not apply to transfers within banks.

--
Regards

John

On Sat, 09 Mar 2024 14:47:20 +0000, John <john.geneal@googlemail.com>
wrote:

>On Fri, 08 Mar 2024 17:59:25 +0000, Scott
><newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 08 Mar 2024 17:35:34 +0000 (GMT), Theo
>> <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>>
>> >Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>> >> I fully understand this, and the reasoning, but this was not my
>> >> question. The DVLA website presents this as a five step process:
>> >> (1) Update your driving licence
>> >> (2) Update your vehicle's log book (V5C)
>> >> (3) Update your Direct Debit
>> >> (4) [...]
>> >> (5) [...]
>> >>
>> >> My point is that having completed steps 1 and 2, why is step 3
>> >> necessary? See: https://www.gov.uk/tell-dvla-changed-address
>> >
>> >https://www.directdebit.co.uk/using-direct-debit/setting-up-a-direct-debit/
>> >"Step 1 – Set up a Direct Debit Instruction
>> >
>> >Whether the organisation asks you to do this online, over the phone, or by
>> >post, the information you’ll need to provide is the same:
>> >
>> > Your name and address
>> > The name and address of your bank or building society
>> > Your bank or building society account number
>> > The branch sort code of your bank or building society (see your debit card or banking app)
>> > The name(s) on the account.
>> >
>> >The organisation will send the Instruction onto your bank or building
>> >society, and start to collect payments on the date you agreed with them.
>> >Most organisations offer a choice of dates so, if one doesn’t suit you, ask
>> >if there’s another option."
>> >
>> >Presumably the address forms part of the direct debit instruction.
>> >Although it seems to appear on some direct debit forms and not others.
>> >
>> Are you saying that the existing direct debit for my existing account
>> for which I have notified the bank of the change of address is no
>> longer valid and a new direct debit mandate is needed? If you can
>> change banks and let the banks do the work, surely to goodness you can
>> change your address and let the bank do the work?
>
>Do not rely on it.
>Some years ago Santander persuaded a relative to switch from one
>Santander account to another at the same branch. They then cancelled
>all the Direct Debits and claimed that the promise about no-hassle
>switching between banks did not apply to transfers within banks.
>
But I haven't switched my account, only changed my address. The sort
code and account number remain the same and no other DD appears to
have failed. Methinks the DVLA is getting confused.
>

John <john.geneal@googlemail.com> wrote:
> Do not rely on it.
> Some years ago Santander persuaded a relative to switch from one
> Santander account to another at the same branch. They then cancelled
> all the Direct Debits and claimed that the promise about no-hassle
> switching between banks did not apply to transfers within banks.

That's correct. The switching service is a specific thing with a specific
protocol for moving an account between banks with DDs kept in place, plus
a redirection for any payments which are sent to the old bank. The system
is operated by Pay UK with specific IT in place to operate it:
https://www.wearepay.uk/what-we-do/switching-services/current-account-switch-service/

That's not available when moving an account within a bank, because you
aren't switching. The bank may have a similar process, but they may not be
a mechanism for the bank to tell the DD payee that the account number has
changed, aside from cancelling the DD and letting the payee get in touch to
establish new ones. There is likely no specific IT in place designed
specifically for it.

Theo

Update: No other direct debit has encountered any difficulty following
my change of address. I think the DVLA were simply wrong in suggesting
a new direct debit is needed (unless of course the banking details
change, which here they did not).