Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in jail.

But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen at some point?

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnj1i$3reeb$1@dont-email.me:

> Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in jail.
>
> But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen at some
> point?
>

No

It will happen to us all, at some point.

On 16/02/2024 12:44, wessie wrote:
> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnj1i$3reeb$1@dont-email.me:
>
>> Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in jail.
>>
>> But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen at some
>> point?
>>
>
> No
>
> It will happen to us all, at some point.
>
True, but you know I meant sooner rather than later, while he was
interned. :-)

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnm33$3ru52$1@dont-email.me:

> On 16/02/2024 12:44, wessie wrote:
>> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnj1i$3reeb$1@dont-email.me:
>>
>>> Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in jail.
>>>
>>> But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen at some
>>> point?
>>>
>>
>> No
>>
>> It will happen to us all, at some point.
>>
> True, but you know I meant sooner rather than later, while he was
> interned. :-)
>

No, again

He survived an assassination attempt and was treated in Germany. His card
was marked whether he had remained in Germany as a policitcal refugee or
returned to Russia. It's more of a susprise he has remained alive for 2
years since returning to Russia. There again, Putin has been trying to
convince his subjects that his actions are those of a just leader.
Navalny's death will be determined as natural causes and he will continue
to be portrayed as a criminal in the Kremlin's propaganda.

On 16/02/2024 13:39, wessie wrote:
> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnm33$3ru52$1@dont-email.me:
>
>> On 16/02/2024 12:44, wessie wrote:
>>> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnj1i$3reeb$1@dont-email.me:
>>>
>>>> Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in jail.
>>>>
>>>> But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen at some
>>>> point?
>>>>
>>>
>>> No
>>>
>>> It will happen to us all, at some point.
>>>
>> True, but you know I meant sooner rather than later, while he was
>> interned. :-)
>>
>
> No, again
>
> He survived an assassination attempt and was treated in Germany. His card
> was marked whether he had remained in Germany as a policitcal refugee or
> returned to Russia. It's more of a susprise he has remained alive for 2
> years since returning to Russia. There again, Putin has been trying to
> convince his subjects that his actions are those of a just leader.
> Navalny's death will be determined as natural causes and he will continue
> to be portrayed as a criminal in the Kremlin's propaganda.

Not sure how that was different to what I was implying, you just used
more words to say what we already knew.

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnt0h$3t50a$1@dont-email.me:

> On 16/02/2024 13:39, wessie wrote:
>> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnm33$3ru52$1@dont-email.me:
>>
>>> On 16/02/2024 12:44, wessie wrote:
>>>> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnj1i$3reeb$1@dont-email.me:
>>>>
>>>>> Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in jail.
>>>>>
>>>>> But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen at
>>>>> some point?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> No
>>>>
>>>> It will happen to us all, at some point.
>>>>
>>> True, but you know I meant sooner rather than later, while he was
>>> interned. :-)
>>>
>>
>> No, again
>>
>> He survived an assassination attempt and was treated in Germany. His
>> card was marked whether he had remained in Germany as a policitcal
>> refugee or returned to Russia. It's more of a susprise he has
>> remained alive for 2 years since returning to Russia. There again,
>> Putin has been trying to convince his subjects that his actions are
>> those of a just leader. Navalny's death will be determined as natural
>> causes and he will continue to be portrayed as a criminal in the
>> Kremlin's propaganda.
>
> Not sure how that was different to what I was implying, you just used
> more words to say what we already knew.
>
>

less ambiguous, you mean?

YTC#1 wrote:

> On 16/02/2024 13:39, wessie wrote:
> >YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnm33$3ru52$1@dont-email.me:
> >
> > > On 16/02/2024 12:44, wessie wrote:
> >>>YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnj1i$3reeb$1@dont-email.me:
> > > >
> > > > > Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in
> > > > > jail.
> > > > >
> > > > > But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen
> > > > > at some point?
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > No
> > > >
> > > > It will happen to us all, at some point.
> > > >
> > > True, but you know I meant sooner rather than later, while he was
> > > interned. :-)
> > >
> >
> > No, again
> >
> > He survived an assassination attempt and was treated in Germany.
> > His card was marked whether he had remained in Germany as a
> > policitcal refugee or returned to Russia. It's more of a susprise
> > he has remained alive for 2 years since returning to Russia. There
> > again, Putin has been trying to convince his subjects that his
> > actions are those of a just leader. Navalny's death will be
> > determined as natural causes and he will continue to be portrayed
> > as a criminal in the Kremlin's propaganda.
>
> Not sure how that was different to what I was implying, you just used
> more words to say what we already knew.

He approved of the annexation of Crimea and on the political spectrum
was slightly to the right of Mussolini's right testicle.
He's a (dead) hero now though.

--

Geoff
NTV650

On 16/02/2024 16:32, wessie wrote:
> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnt0h$3t50a$1@dont-email.me:
>
>> On 16/02/2024 13:39, wessie wrote:
>>> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnm33$3ru52$1@dont-email.me:
>>>
>>>> On 16/02/2024 12:44, wessie wrote:
>>>>> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnj1i$3reeb$1@dont-email.me:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in jail.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen at
>>>>>> some point?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> No
>>>>>
>>>>> It will happen to us all, at some point.
>>>>>
>>>> True, but you know I meant sooner rather than later, while he was
>>>> interned. :-)
>>>>
>>>
>>> No, again
>>>
>>> He survived an assassination attempt and was treated in Germany. His
>>> card was marked whether he had remained in Germany as a policitcal
>>> refugee or returned to Russia. It's more of a susprise he has
>>> remained alive for 2 years since returning to Russia. There again,
>>> Putin has been trying to convince his subjects that his actions are
>>> those of a just leader. Navalny's death will be determined as natural
>>> causes and he will continue to be portrayed as a criminal in the
>>> Kremlin's propaganda.
>>
>> Not sure how that was different to what I was implying, you just used
>> more words to say what we already knew.
>>
>>
>
> less ambiguous, you mean?
Granted

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

On 16/02/2024 16:32, GeoffC wrote:
> YTC#1 wrote:
>
>> On 16/02/2024 13:39, wessie wrote:
>>> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnm33$3ru52$1@dont-email.me:
>>>
>>>> On 16/02/2024 12:44, wessie wrote:
>>>>> YTC#1 <ytc1@ytc1.co.uk> wrote in news:uqnj1i$3reeb$1@dont-email.me:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Some how he managed to fall out of an hotel window, will in
>>>>>> jail.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But on a serious note. Was anyone surprised this would happen
>>>>>> at some point?
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> No
>>>>>
>>>>> It will happen to us all, at some point.
>>>>>
>>>> True, but you know I meant sooner rather than later, while he was
>>>> interned. :-)
>>>>
>>>
>>> No, again
>>>
>>> He survived an assassination attempt and was treated in Germany.
>>> His card was marked whether he had remained in Germany as a
>>> policitcal refugee or returned to Russia. It's more of a susprise
>>> he has remained alive for 2 years since returning to Russia. There
>>> again, Putin has been trying to convince his subjects that his
>>> actions are those of a just leader. Navalny's death will be
>>> determined as natural causes and he will continue to be portrayed
>>> as a criminal in the Kremlin's propaganda.
>>
>> Not sure how that was different to what I was implying, you just used
>> more words to say what we already knew.
>
> He approved of the annexation of Crimea and on the political spectrum
> was slightly to the right of Mussolini's right testicle.

So, it is ok for political assassination if they are also bad guys?

> He's a (dead) hero now though.

To some, maybe.

>
>

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

YTC#1 wrote:

> On 16/02/2024 16:32, GeoffC wrote:
> > YTC#1 wrote:
> >
> >
> > He approved of the annexation of Crimea and on the political
> > spectrum was slightly to the right of Mussolini's right testicle.
>
> So, it is ok for political assassination if they are also bad guys?

Well, personally, I couldn't bring myself to kill anybody so it would
be a touch hypocritical to vote for/support/pay somebody else to do it
for me, so no, all assassinations are definitely not OK.
Unfortunately there are plenty of regimes around the world who don't
agree, US/Israeli middle Eastern policy seems to be almost exclusively
based upon plugging anybody who dares to stand in the way of their
"wider objectives". Then there is of course Bin Laden, Gaddafi, Allende
to name a few. Closer to home there was the 'shoot to kill' policy
although that was never proved of course. In short, most World Powers
do it, if anything the Russians are maybe a little more open and
transparent about it.
Getting back to my original point, the "My enemy's enemy must be my
friend" theory seems to be doing the rounds again and although Putin
may not be the cuddliest leader, in all probability Navalny would have
been even worse
>
> > He's a (dead) hero now though.
>
> To some, maybe.

I've yet to see/hear any MSM in UK/US/NL that has even hinted he might
have had a darker side. Saint Aleksej is all I see/hear.
>
> >
> >

--

Geoff
NTV650

On Sat, 17 Feb 2024 10:58:24 -0000 (UTC), "GeoffC" <me@invalid.nl>
wrote:

>Closer to home there was the 'shoot to kill' policy
>although that was never proved of course.

That was where the IRA demanded to be treated as a proper army engaged
in warfare, but objected to being ambushed.

--
Colin Irvine
R1250RS

On 17/02/2024 12:48, Colin Irvine wrote:
>On Sat, 17 Feb 2024 10:58:24 -0000 (UTC), "GeoffC" <me@invalid.nl>
>wrote:
>
>>Closer to home there was the 'shoot to kill' policy
>>although that was never proved of course.
>
>That was where the IRA demanded to be treated as a proper army engaged
>in warfare, but objected to being ambushed.

Good point although at least one of the targets was from t'other side.
If it was all so justified and good why the need for all the denials/lies
and cover ups afterwards?
That's the trouble with nod and a wink
extra-judicial executions, once the mechanism exists it can be very easily
turned on other targets at will. Eg. I would imagine that if Mad Nad ever
got to be PM, they would be dropping like flies.

--
Geoff
NTV 650

On Sat, 17 Feb 2024 11:48:20 +0000, Colin Irvine
<look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote:

>On Sat, 17 Feb 2024 10:58:24 -0000 (UTC), "GeoffC" <me@invalid.nl>
>wrote:

>>Closer to home there was the 'shoot to kill' policy
>>although that was never proved of course.

>That was where the IRA demanded to be treated as a proper army engaged
>in warfare, but objected to being ambushed.

I'm surprised at you Colin! "The troubles" were much more complex
than that. Didn't expect a simple (istic) 2 line response from you,
of all people
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

On Sat, 17 Feb 2024 13:44:27 +0000, Champ <neal@champ.org.uk> wrote:

>On Sat, 17 Feb 2024 11:48:20 +0000, Colin Irvine
><look@colinandpat.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 17 Feb 2024 10:58:24 -0000 (UTC), "GeoffC" <me@invalid.nl>
>>wrote:
>
>>>Closer to home there was the 'shoot to kill' policy
>>>although that was never proved of course.
>
>>That was where the IRA demanded to be treated as a proper army engaged
>>in warfare, but objected to being ambushed.
>
>I'm surprised at you Colin! "The troubles" were much more complex
>than that. Didn't expect a simple (istic) 2 line response from you,
>of all people

Heh. Of course the troubles were more complex. I was merely pointing
out one particular contradiction that has always stood out for me.

--
Colin Irvine
R1250RS

On 16/02/2024 20:05 YTC#1 penned these words:
> Was anyone surprised this would happen at some point?

Hardly, he was a dead man walking once he was back in Putain's lair.
--
Ian

"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of
the last priest"

On 19/02/2024 08:29, Boots wrote:
> On 16/02/2024 20:05 YTC#1 penned these words:
>> Was anyone surprised this would happen at some point?
>
> Hardly, he was a dead man walking once he was back in Putain's lair.

Russian Limerick:

There once was a man named Navalny.
The end.

--
Bruce Horrocks
FJR1300AS

On 19/02/2024 18:07, Bruce Horrocks wrote:
> On 19/02/2024 08:29, Boots wrote:
>> On 16/02/2024 20:05 YTC#1 penned these words:
>>> Was anyone surprised this would happen at some point?
>>
>> Hardly, he was a dead man walking once he was back in Putain's lair.
>
> Russian Limerick:
>
> There once was a man named Navalny.
> The end.

Very good.
That is even shorter than Tom Paxton's 1970s song about a former US vice
president: "The Ballad of Spiro Agnew"!*

Chris
* Younger viewers may have to google both of those names.
--
The Deuchars BBB#40 COFF#14
Yamaha XV750SE & Suzuki GS550t
http://www.Deuchars.org.uk

GeoffC wrote:

> He approved of the annexation of Crimea and on the political spectrum
> was slightly to the right of Mussolini's right testicle.
> He's a (dead) hero now though.

I think your characterisation of AN is slightly lazy, and dated. He
also spoke out *against* the annexation of Crimea and the sham
referendum.

When he embarked on politics he was a Russian nationalist, and had
subsequently disowned that period of his politics (probably not
strongly enough for many).

A "nationalist" and a "right winger" are not necessarily the same.

However, where he did become a threat to Putin - and sealed his fate as
the "opponent" (Putin rarely used his name) - was as an anti corruption
campaigner - exposing the direct link to Putin and his allies of the
blatant robbery of state assets.

His return to Russia from exile would have been done fully aware of the
likely consequences. Whether I liked his nationalism or not - says a
great deal about him as man.

--
Simon

sweller <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
> GeoffC wrote:
>
>> He approved of the annexation of Crimea and on the political spectrum
>> was slightly to the right of Mussolini's right testicle.
>> He's a (dead) hero now though.
>
> I think your characterisation of AN is slightly lazy, and dated. He
> also spoke out *against* the annexation of Crimea and the sham
> referendum.
>
> When he embarked on politics he was a Russian nationalist, and had
> subsequently disowned that period of his politics (probably not
> strongly enough for many).
>
> A "nationalist" and a "right winger" are not necessarily the same.
>
> However, where he did become a threat to Putin - and sealed his fate as
> the "opponent" (Putin rarely used his name) - was as an anti corruption
> campaigner - exposing the direct link to Putin and his allies of the
> blatant robbery of state assets.
>
> His return to Russia from exile would have been done fully aware of the
> likely consequences. Whether I liked his nationalism or not - says a
> great deal about him as man.

I've learned more _useful_ information about AN here in this thread
than in all the news coverage I've seen or read to date (including
Sky News and all the usual online newpaper sites around the world).

I have immense respect for Navalny, coming back to Russia after the
poisoning, knowing full well what the eventual outcome would be. His
politics hardly enter into it.

--
FJR1300A, GL1000, KLR650A6F, EX250J9A, DR200SE, Vespa Ciao

On 21/02/2024 18:09, Mark Olson wrote:
> sweller <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
>> GeoffC wrote:
>>
>>> He approved of the annexation of Crimea and on the political spectrum
>>> was slightly to the right of Mussolini's right testicle.
>>> He's a (dead) hero now though.
>>
>> I think your characterisation of AN is slightly lazy, and dated. He
>> also spoke out *against* the annexation of Crimea and the sham
>> referendum.
>>
>> When he embarked on politics he was a Russian nationalist, and had
>> subsequently disowned that period of his politics (probably not
>> strongly enough for many).
>>
>> A "nationalist" and a "right winger" are not necessarily the same.
>>
>> However, where he did become a threat to Putin - and sealed his fate as
>> the "opponent" (Putin rarely used his name) - was as an anti corruption
>> campaigner - exposing the direct link to Putin and his allies of the
>> blatant robbery of state assets.
>>
>> His return to Russia from exile would have been done fully aware of the
>> likely consequences. Whether I liked his nationalism or not - says a
>> great deal about him as man.
>
> I've learned more _useful_ information about AN here in this thread

Often the way here. Which is why URKM (IMO) lives on.

> than in all the news coverage I've seen or read to date (including
> Sky News and all the usual online newpaper sites around the world).
>
> I have immense respect for Navalny, coming back to Russia after the
> poisoning, knowing full well what the eventual outcome would be. His
> politics hardly enter into it.

Yeah, still not sure of what his politics was (other than ant-Putin),
but respect is due as he knew they would do for him at some point.

I suspect that having survived the 1st attempt he knew he was a dead man
walking and may as well make a point.

>

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

On 21/02/2024 18:09, Mark Olson wrote:
> sweller <sweller@mztech.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
>> GeoffC wrote:
>>
>>> He approved of the annexation of Crimea and on the political spectrum
>>> was slightly to the right of Mussolini's right testicle.
>>> He's a (dead) hero now though.
>>
>> I think your characterisation of AN is slightly lazy, and dated. He
>> also spoke out *against* the annexation of Crimea and the sham
>> referendum.
>>
>> When he embarked on politics he was a Russian nationalist, and had
>> subsequently disowned that period of his politics (probably not
>> strongly enough for many).
>>
>> A "nationalist" and a "right winger" are not necessarily the same.
>>
>> However, where he did become a threat to Putin - and sealed his fate as
>> the "opponent" (Putin rarely used his name) - was as an anti corruption
>> campaigner - exposing the direct link to Putin and his allies of the
>> blatant robbery of state assets.
>>
>> His return to Russia from exile would have been done fully aware of the
>> likely consequences. Whether I liked his nationalism or not - says a
>> great deal about him as man.
>
> I've learned more _useful_ information about AN here in this thread
> than in all the news coverage I've seen or read to date (including
> Sky News and all the usual online newpaper sites around the world).
>
> I have immense respect for Navalny, coming back to Russia after the
> poisoning, knowing full well what the eventual outcome would be. His
> politics hardly enter into it.
>

I think Scott Ritter's article "The Tragic Death of a Traitor" gives a
very different perspective than the one portrayed by our main stream media.

https://www.scottritterextra.com/p/the-tragic-death-of-a-traitor

If your preferred learning style is visual, Brian Berletic's youtube
video "Wikileaks Reveals Alexei Navalny's US Funding as Washington
Exploits His Death" on "The New Atlas" channel contains more information.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0uRXkw3_0BE

dozynsleepy <dozynsleepy@gmail.com> wrote:
[snip]

[Re: Alex Navalny]

> I think Scott Ritter's article "The Tragic Death of a Traitor" gives a
> very different perspective than the one portrayed by our main stream media.

Well, I have to agree with you that his perspective is very different
from the so-called mainstream media (which isn't particularly objective
or complete on any given subject).

However- is this the same Scott Ritter, who according to Wikipedia,
tweeted in April 2022 that he believed the National Police of Ukraine
were responsible for the horrible massacre at Bucha?

Quoting from the Wikipedia article on Scott Ritter:

After several years of a lower public profile, Ritter once more came
to wide attention in 2022, in the context of Russia's invasion of
Ukraine. Ritter became very active on social media at this time,
posting a tweet in April 2022 claiming that the National Police
of Ukraine was responsible for the Bucha massacre and calling
U.S. President Joe Biden a "war criminal" for "seeking to shift
blame for the Bucha murders" to Russia

If that portion of the Wikipedia article is true, I'm not particularly
interested in what Mr. Ritter might have to say on _any_ subject.

For anyone interested in Ritter, there's a fair amount of background
in his Wikipedia article that should clarify pretty well where he
stands regarding Russia.

dozynsleepy <dozynsleepy@gmail.com> wrote in

> I think Scott Ritter's article "The Tragic Death of a Traitor" gives a
> very different perspective than the one portrayed by our main stream
> media.
>

his perspective is somewhat skewed by his adoration of Putin, a wish to
avenge a vendetta against Biden, who, as a senator, heavily criticised his
conduct as a weapons inspector in the 1990s and a resentment towards his
homeland that had the audacity to convict him of sex crimes involving a
minor in 2011.

you have such good taste in influencers

On 22/02/2024 23:01, Mark Olson wrote:
> dozynsleepy <dozynsleepy@gmail.com> wrote:
> [snip]
>
> [Re: Alex Navalny]
>
>> I think Scott Ritter's article "The Tragic Death of a Traitor" gives a
>> very different perspective than the one portrayed by our main stream media.
>
> Well, I have to agree with you that his perspective is very different
> from the so-called mainstream media (which isn't particularly objective
> or complete on any given subject).
>
> However- is this the same Scott Ritter, who according to Wikipedia,
> tweeted in April 2022 that he believed the National Police of Ukraine
> were responsible for the horrible massacre at Bucha?

One thing in the Ritter article is objectively true - Navalny did make a
video or two which were extremely ethnically bigoted.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-56181084

Mike Fleming <mike@tauzero.co.uk> wrote:
> On 22/02/2024 23:01, Mark Olson wrote:
>> dozynsleepy <dozynsleepy@gmail.com> wrote:
>> [snip]
>>
>> [Re: Alex Navalny]
>>
>>> I think Scott Ritter's article "The Tragic Death of a Traitor" gives a
>>> very different perspective than the one portrayed by our main stream media.
>>
>> Well, I have to agree with you that his perspective is very different
>> from the so-called mainstream media (which isn't particularly objective
>> or complete on any given subject).
>>
>> However- is this the same Scott Ritter, who according to Wikipedia,
>> tweeted in April 2022 that he believed the National Police of Ukraine
>> were responsible for the horrible massacre at Bucha?
>
> One thing in the Ritter article is objectively true - Navalny did make a
> video or two which were extremely ethnically bigoted.
>
> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-56181084

Stopped clock & all that.