"BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to
millions of homes, including vulnerable households.

In a climbdown by the telecoms giant, the rollout of its so-called
Digital Voice programme has been postponed, with insiders saying it may
not be completed until the end of 2027. "

On Wed, 3 Apr 2024 07:50:09 +0100
JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> wrote:

> "BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to
> millions of homes, including vulnerable households.
>
> In a climbdown by the telecoms giant, the rollout of its so-called
> Digital Voice programme has been postponed, with insiders saying it
> may not be completed until the end of 2027. "

Citation?

Ah, here:
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-13264829/BT-pauses-digital-phone-line-rollout-including-thousands-vulnerable-households.html

--
Davey.

Davey <davey@example.invalid> wrote:
> On Wed, 3 Apr 2024 07:50:09 +0100
> JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> wrote:
>
>> "BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to
>> millions of homes, including vulnerable households.
>>
>> In a climbdown by the telecoms giant, the rollout of its so-called
>> Digital Voice programme has been postponed, with insiders saying it
>> may not be completed until the end of 2027. "
>
> Citation?
>
> Ah, here:
> https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-13264829/BT-pauses-digital-phone-line-rollout-including-thousands-vulnerable-households.html
>

It’s all a bit of a misrepresentation of what is really happening. BT/OR
has launched a product that is effectively an analogue to digital adapter
within the network for certain customers only. To qualify you have to have
an existing POTS line and no broadband service. You can’t order new lines
with this product.

On 03.04.2024 um 08:17 Uhr Tweed wrote:

> It’s all a bit of a misrepresentation of what is really happening.
> BT/OR has launched a product that is effectively an analogue to
> digital adapter within the network for certain customers only. To
> qualify you have to have an existing POTS line and no broadband
> service. You can’t order new lines with this product.

Why do they provide that?
DSL or other access methods not available at certain places?

--
kind regards
Marco

Send spam to 1712125038muell@cartoonies.org

On 03.04.2024 um 07:50 Uhr JMB99 wrote:

> "BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to
> millions of homes, including vulnerable households.

What is the exact reason for that?

--
kind regards
Marco

Send spam to 1712123409muell@cartoonies.org

Marco Moock <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:
> On 03.04.2024 um 08:17 Uhr Tweed wrote:
>
>> It’s all a bit of a misrepresentation of what is really happening.
>> BT/OR has launched a product that is effectively an analogue to
>> digital adapter within the network for certain customers only. To
>> qualify you have to have an existing POTS line and no broadband
>> service. You can’t order new lines with this product.
>
> Why do they provide that?
> DSL or other access methods not available at certain places?
>

It’s a product aimed at the elderly with fall alarm systems that can only
use analogue phone lines. Some fall alarm providers have been asleep and
have failed to upgrade the alarms. To be fair, they may have customers who
are very reluctant to change what they already have. It is a product whose
customer base will literally die off in the next few years.

Marco Moock <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:
> On 03.04.2024 um 07:50 Uhr JMB99 wrote:
>
>> "BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to
>> millions of homes, including vulnerable households.
>
> What is the exact reason for that?
>

Fall alarms for the elderly will stop working. To be more exact, older
models that can only use analogue phone lines.

On Wed, 3 Apr 2024 09:15:53 -0000 (UTC), Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:

>Marco Moock <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:
>> On 03.04.2024 um 08:17 Uhr Tweed wrote:
>>
>>> It’s all a bit of a misrepresentation of what is really happening.
>>> BT/OR has launched a product that is effectively an analogue to
>>> digital adapter within the network for certain customers only. To
>>> qualify you have to have an existing POTS line and no broadband
>>> service. You can’t order new lines with this product.
>>
>> Why do they provide that?
>> DSL or other access methods not available at certain places?
>>
>
>It’s a product aimed at the elderly with fall alarm systems that can only
>use analogue phone lines. Some fall alarm providers have been asleep and
>have failed to upgrade the alarms. To be fair, they may have customers who
>are very reluctant to change what they already have. It is a product whose
>customer base will literally die off in the next few years.

BT should offer to sign these customers up to an equivalent digital replacement service. This would
also have the beneficial effect of hastening the end of recalcitrant telecare companies.

Codger <codger524@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 3 Apr 2024 09:15:53 -0000 (UTC), Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Marco Moock <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:
>>> On 03.04.2024 um 08:17 Uhr Tweed wrote:
>>>
>>>> It’s all a bit of a misrepresentation of what is really happening.
>>>> BT/OR has launched a product that is effectively an analogue to
>>>> digital adapter within the network for certain customers only. To
>>>> qualify you have to have an existing POTS line and no broadband
>>>> service. You can’t order new lines with this product.
>>>
>>> Why do they provide that?
>>> DSL or other access methods not available at certain places?
>>>
>>
>> It’s a product aimed at the elderly with fall alarm systems that can only
>> use analogue phone lines. Some fall alarm providers have been asleep and
>> have failed to upgrade the alarms. To be fair, they may have customers who
>> are very reluctant to change what they already have. It is a product whose
>> customer base will literally die off in the next few years.
>
> BT should offer to sign these customers up to an equivalent digital
> replacement service. This would
> also have the beneficial effect of hastening the end of recalcitrant telecare companies.
>

Don’t underestimate the difficulty of dealing with the customer base.

On 03/04/2024 10:18, Tweed wrote:
> Marco Moock <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:
>> On 03.04.2024 um 07:50 Uhr JMB99 wrote:
>>
>>> "BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to
>>> millions of homes, including vulnerable households.
>>
>> What is the exact reason for that?
>>
>
> Fall alarms for the elderly will stop working. To be more exact, older
> models that can only use analogue phone lines.
>
Yes, I was surprised that my mother's fall alarm company have said
nothing. Recently I noticed on their website a 2/4G version of a fall
alarm. I phoned assuming an upgrade on request, but no, I have to cancel
the current annual contract for the PSTN version, and start a new
contract for the 'GSM' version.

Anyway, owing to some recent 'events', it seems I will just be
cancelling the present service very soon..... :-(

On 03/04/2024 07:50, JMB99 wrote:
> "BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to millions of
> homes, including vulnerable households.
>
> In a climbdown by the telecoms giant, the rollout of its so-called Digital Voice
> programme has been postponed, with insiders saying it may not be completed until
> the end of 2027. "

That is not the only reason I suspect, after a few days my digital line ceased
to function.

I was unable make outgoing calls.

Incoming calls made the phone ring but there is no caller ID and neither party
can hear each other if the call is answered.

Using a BT/EE router.

Right now I think they have tried to resolve the issue by rebooting the DSL side
at some point every night.

Time and date Message
29/03/2024, 04:04:43 DSL connection lost
29/03/2024, 04:05:15 DSL connection established
30/03/2024, 04:11:28 DSL connection lost
30/03/2024, 04:11:59 DSL connection established
31/03/2024, 04:08:59 DSL connection lost
31/03/2024, 04:09:31 DSL connection established
01/04/2024, 03:11:38 DSL connection lost
01/04/2024, 03:12:09 DSL connection established
02/04/2024, 04:33:44 DSL connection lost
02/04/2024, 04:34:15 DSL connection established
03/04/2024, 04:44:53 DSL connection lost
03/04/2024, 04:45:52 DSL connection established
04/04/2024, 05:50:20 DSL connection lost
04/04/2024, 05:50:51 DSL connection established

Mote the difference in time here:

Network uptime: 11 Hrs 16 Mins
System uptime:6 Days, 12 Hrs 3 Mins

Time will tell, not a nice solution IMHO more a fudge.
--
Regards

RayG

RayG <rgsub1@btinternet.com> wrote:
> On 03/04/2024 07:50, JMB99 wrote:
> > "BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to millions of
> > homes, including vulnerable households.
> >
> > In a climbdown by the telecoms giant, the rollout of its so-called Digital Voice
> > programme has been postponed, with insiders saying it may not be completed until
> > the end of 2027. "
>
> That is not the only reason I suspect, after a few days my digital line ceased
> to function.
>
> I was unable make outgoing calls.
>
> Incoming calls made the phone ring but there is no caller ID and neither party
> can hear each other if the call is answered.
>
> Using a BT/EE router.
>
> Right now I think they have tried to resolve the issue by rebooting the DSL side
> at some point every night.

That sounds like they've stuffed up the config on the router - most likely
firewall config but possibly other SIP config too. When the DSL comes up
the router likely asks a BT server (via TR104) for the SIP config, so maybe
they are resetting the DSL link so a new SIP config is deployed and the VOIP
part of the router is restarted.

I would try power cycling your router, if you haven't already. It's
possible something on the firewall side has got stuck. Maybe they deployed
some bad config and are desperately trying to remedy the situation from
their end.

> Time will tell, not a nice solution IMHO more a fudge.

They are supposed to do all this remotely so it's a plug and play solution -
sounds like that leaves something to be desired...

Theo

RayG wrote:

> Mote the difference in time here:
>
> Network uptime: 11 Hrs 16 Mins
> System uptime:6 Days, 12 Hrs 3 Mins

My system uptime and WAN/VDSL interface uptimes are both 6 days, as I
did a firmware upgrade last week, normally they'd be several months.

On 3 Apr 2024 07:50, JMB99 wrote:
> "BT has been forced to pause the rollout of digital phone lines to
> millions of homes, including vulnerable households.
>
> In a climbdown by the telecoms giant, the rollout of its so-called
> Digital Voice programme has been postponed, with insiders saying it may
> not be completed until the end of 2027. "
>

A slight misrepresentation but mostly caused by lack of capability in
the current crop of journalists.

Local loop providers have been given new guidance to Ofcom (or, rather
a new position has been agreed to) to do more about vulnerable users.
So moving lots of people to non-POTS lines continues but not forcefully
and vulnerable users will need something (might be batteries for some,
might be the new analog to the home but not POTS, might be something
else)

So the switch off of copper is delayed

On 05/04/2024 11:14, Rupert Moss-Eccardt wrote:
> So the switch off of copper is delayed

Digital voice is not the same as switch off of copper. Many people will
continue to get copper delivery of broadband.

On 03/04/2024 10:15, Tweed wrote:
> It is a product whose
> customer base will literally die off in the next few years.

Do you think there is going to be a cure for being elderly?

Elderly people living on their own are always going to have falls even
with various aids to reduce the number of falls.

On 5 Apr 2024 11:36, David Woolley wrote:
> On 05/04/2024 11:14, Rupert Moss-Eccardt wrote:
>> So the switch off of copper is delayed
>
> Digital voice is not the same as switch off of copper. Many people will
> continue to get copper delivery of broadband.

Sorry I let brevity get to me. Non-digital E2E telephony.

JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> wrote:
> On 03/04/2024 10:15, Tweed wrote:
>> It is a product whose
>> customer base will literally die off in the next few years.
>
>
> Do you think there is going to be a cure for being elderly?
>
> Elderly people living on their own are always going to have falls even
> with various aids to reduce the number of falls.
>
>
Those that in the future who require fall alarms will get ones not
dependent on analogue POTS lines.

On 04/04/2024 17:28, Andy Burns wrote:
> RayG wrote:
>
>> Mote the difference in time here:
>>
>> Network uptime: 11 Hrs 16 Mins
>> System uptime:6 Days, 12 Hrs 3 Mins
>
> My system uptime and WAN/VDSL interface uptimes are both 6 days, as I did a
> firmware upgrade last week, normally they'd be several months.
>

What version of Firmware are you running?

You said you did the upgrade, where do you get that from?

I agree on the old BT smart hub 2 it was up for months but this new EE kit
leaves a LOT to be desired. You cannot see how items on your network connect and
the hub manager takes 5-10 seconds to change pages. The App on the phone gives
different info to that on the router itself, and its also to slow to be usable.

The hub had a complete Factory Reset recently and that had not resolved the
issue. Still waiting to see if the current FW version is any better.

App version: 1.13.1
Firmware version: r1.34.0-R-994210-PROD-83002r
--
Regards

RayG

On 04/04/2024 17:17, Theo wrote:

>> Time will tell, not a nice solution IMHO more a fudge.
>
> They are supposed to do all this remotely so it's a plug and play solution -
> sounds like that leaves something to be desired...

Hmm. 30 years ago I would have referred to that as "plug & pray"...

--

Jeff

RayG wrote:

> Andy Burns wrote:
>
>> My system uptime and WAN/VDSL interface uptimes are both 6 days, as I
>> did a firmware upgrade last week, normally they'd be several months.
>
> What version of Firmware are you running?
>
> You said you did the upgrade, where do you get that from?

I should have made clear, I'm using a Draytek router.

On 06/04/2024 20:27, Andy Burns wrote:
> RayG wrote:
>
>> Andy Burns wrote:
>>
>>> My system uptime and WAN/VDSL interface uptimes are both 6 days, as I did a
>>> firmware upgrade last week, normally they'd be several months.
>>
>> What version of Firmware are you running?
>>
>> You said you did the upgrade, where do you get that from?
>
> I should have made clear, I'm using a Draytek router.
>
>

Thanks for the clarification
--
Regards

RayG

On 08/04/2024 14:10, RayG wrote:
> On 06/04/2024 20:27, Andy Burns wrote:
>> RayG wrote:
>>
>>> Andy Burns wrote:
>>>
>>>> My system uptime and WAN/VDSL interface uptimes are both 6 days, as
>>>> I did a firmware upgrade last week, normally they'd be several months.
>>>
>>> What version of Firmware are you running?
>>>
>>> You said you did the upgrade, where do you get that from?
>>
>> I should have made clear, I'm using a Draytek router.
>>
>>
>
> Thanks for the clarification

Oddly it prompted me to do the same upgrade, which resulted into a
further problem investigation...but that's another story.

Draytek are quality routers, for sure.

--
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice, there is.
-- Yogi Berra