England’s Ashes preparations have been rocked after spinner Jack Leach was ruled out of the series with a back stress fracture.

Leach claimed four scalps during England’s 10-wicket victory over Ireland at Lord’s this week, but developed low back symptoms during the match.

A subsequent scan on Sunday revealed a stress fracture in the lumbar region of the spine, which will rule him out of all five Ashes Tests.

“Spinner Jack Leach has been ruled out of the LV Insurance men’s Ashes series with a low back (lumbar) stress fracture,” an England statement said.

Read more at https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2023/06/04/jack-leach-ruled-out-of-the-ashes-with-stress-fracture/

RH

“England will announce a replacement for the Ashes series in due course.”

On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 5:47:17 PM UTC+1, Robert Henderson wrote:
> England’s Ashes preparations have been rocked after spinner Jack Leach was ruled out of the series with a back stress fracture.
>
> Leach claimed four scalps during England’s 10-wicket victory over Ireland at Lord’s this week, but developed low back symptoms during the match.
>
> A subsequent scan on Sunday revealed a stress fracture in the lumbar region of the spine, which will rule him out of all five Ashes Tests.
>
> “Spinner Jack Leach has been ruled out of the LV Insurance men’s Ashes series with a low back (lumbar) stress fracture,” an England statement said.
>
> Read more at https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2023/06/04/jack-leach-ruled-out-of-the-ashes-with-stress-fracture/
>
> RH
>
> “England will announce a replacement for the Ashes series in due course.”

English spinners who could plausibly replace Leach

Liam Livingston Lancs
Liam Dawson Hants
Liam Patterson-White
Danny Brigs Warks
Dominic Bess Yorks

I would go for Livingston.
RH

On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 6:11:14 PM UTC+1, Robert Henderson wrote:
> On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 5:47:17 PM UTC+1, Robert Henderson wrote:
> > England’s Ashes preparations have been rocked after spinner Jack Leach was ruled out of the series with a back stress fracture.
> >
> > Leach claimed four scalps during England’s 10-wicket victory over Ireland at Lord’s this week, but developed low back symptoms during the match.
> >
> > A subsequent scan on Sunday revealed a stress fracture in the lumbar region of the spine, which will rule him out of all five Ashes Tests.
> >
> > “Spinner Jack Leach has been ruled out of the LV Insurance men’s Ashes series with a low back (lumbar) stress fracture,” an England statement said.
> >
> > Read more at https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2023/06/04/jack-leach-ruled-out-of-the-ashes-with-stress-fracture/
> >
> > RH
> >
> > “England will announce a replacement for the Ashes series in due course.”
> English spinners who could plausibly replace Leach
>
> Liam Livingston Lancs
> Liam Dawson Hants
> Liam Patterson-White
> Danny Brigs Warks
> Dominic Bess Yorks
>
> I would go for Livingston.
> RH

i dont think LLs bolwing is test standard. its only ok in t20s. but he would be the bazball choice.

actually I wonder if they are begging moeen to help out. hes not like for like but he would
improve the balance of the side if stokes cant bowl.

in home tests ali has 1764 runs at 33 and 104 wkts at 33. but he has officially retired
from test cricket so i doubt he would want to involve himself in a 5 test ashes series.
plus i think his record against oz is poor. I'd probably choose dawson as Bess or
Ahmed would be a bigger risk. The other option is just to choose another
seamer, particularly 1 who can bat like woakes, and just fill in with root etc. But
the irish liked joes bowling yesterday. Perhaps Stokes could bowl offspin
instead ;)

mike

On Sunday, 4 June 2023 at 18:36:21 UTC+1, mike wrote:

> > Liam Livingston Lancs
> > Liam Dawson Hants
> > Liam Patterson-White
> > Danny Brigs Warks
> > Dominic Bess Yorks

> in home tests ali has 1764 runs at 33 and 104 wkts at 33. but he has officially retired
> from test cricket so i doubt he would want to involve himself in a 5 test ashes series.
> plus i think his record against oz is poor. I'd probably choose dawson as Bess or
> Ahmed would be a bigger risk. The other option is just to choose another
> seamer, particularly 1 who can bat like woakes, and just fill in with root etc. But
> the irish liked joes bowling yesterday. Perhaps Stokes could bowl offspin
> instead ;)

Dawson for me from the Aryan Master-Race list - but none of them set the pulse racing, do they, let's face it. Root's alright when it's turning - but holding an end down? No thanks. If you wanted a really maverick option at #7 or #8 then Jacks but he's as much bit-part as Root.

There'll obviously be calls for Rehan Ahmed now but I'd imagine for all his brio he dishes up too many 4 balls and the Aussies will tuck in at the buffet (75-3-325-6 in the counties this season) . But as far as I'm aware Bazball doesn't mind conceding runs if it means wickets?

Richard

On Sunday, 4 June 2023 at 18:36:21 UTC+1, mike wrote:
> mike

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fxy_62xakAAL4W2?format=png&name=large

Interesting that the Parky brothers top the list here:

On Sun, 4 Jun 2023 10:36:20 -0700 (PDT), mike <dmike204@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:

>On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 6:11:14?PM UTC+1, Robert Henderson wrote:
>> On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 5:47:17?PM UTC+1, Robert Henderson wrote:
>> > England’s Ashes preparations have been rocked after spinner Jack Leach was ruled out of the series with a back stress fracture.
>> >
>> > Leach claimed four scalps during England’s 10-wicket victory over Ireland at Lord’s this week, but developed low back symptoms during the match.
>> >
>> > A subsequent scan on Sunday revealed a stress fracture in the lumbar region of the spine, which will rule him out of all five Ashes Tests.
>> >
>> > “Spinner Jack Leach has been ruled out of the LV Insurance men’s Ashes series with a low back (lumbar) stress fracture,” an England statement said.
>> >
>> > Read more at https://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2023/06/04/jack-leach-ruled-out-of-the-ashes-with-stress-fracture/
>> >
>> > RH
>> >
>> > “England will announce a replacement for the Ashes series in due course.”
>> English spinners who could plausibly replace Leach
>>
>> Liam Livingston Lancs
>> Liam Dawson Hants
>> Liam Patterson-White
>> Danny Brigs Warks
>> Dominic Bess Yorks
>>
>> I would go for Livingston.
>> RH
>
>i dont think LLs bolwing is test standard. its only ok in t20s. but he would be the bazball choice.
>
>actually I wonder if they are begging moeen to help out. hes not like for like but he would
>improve the balance of the side if stokes cant bowl.
>
>in home tests ali has 1764 runs at 33 and 104 wkts at 33. but he has officially retired
>from test cricket so i doubt he would want to involve himself in a 5 test ashes series.
>plus i think his record against oz is poor. I'd probably choose dawson as Bess or
>Ahmed would be a bigger risk. The other option is just to choose another
>seamer, particularly 1 who can bat like woakes, and just fill in with root etc. But
>the irish liked joes bowling yesterday. Perhaps Stokes could bowl offspin
>instead ;)
>
>mike

Tongue can bowl leg spin.

max.it

In message <4853ff31-61bb-4934-88cf-d9373eec2148n@googlegroups.com>,
Robert Henderson <anywhere156@gmail.com> writes
>English spinners who could plausibly replace Leach
>
>Liam Livingston Lancs
>Liam Dawson Hants
>Liam Patterson-White
>Danny Brigs Warks
>Dominic Bess Yorks

For some value of "plausible.
>
>I would go for Livingston.
>RH

At least he would add to the batting. The same could be said of Jacks. I
find it hard to envisage any of these names causing the Aussies too much
concern, though.

I suspect that Stokes and McCullum may try to persuade Moeen Ali to
reverse his decision to give up Test cricket. I think it's unlikely that
they'll succeed, though. Not that I'd expect Australia to be overly
concerned about him either, but he is at least a proven Test bowler.
--
John Hall "[It was] so steep that at intervals the street broke into steps,
like a person breaking into giggles or hiccups, and then resumed
its sober climb, until it had another fit of steps."
Ursula K Le Guin "The Beginning Place"

In message <641ad3cd-88b7-4fb3-ba04-bd4851489117n@googlegroups.com>,
Richard Dixon <richsdixon1975@gmail.com> writes
>On Sunday, 4 June 2023 at 18:36:21 UTC+1, mike wrote:
>> mike
>
>https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fxy_62xakAAL4W2?format=png&name=large
>
>Interesting that the Parky brothers top the list here:

I was surprised that Moriarty has the best average, though since he
hasn't played a Championship match for Surrey this season he would be a
real left-field selection.
--
John Hall "[It was] so steep that at intervals the street broke into steps,
like a person breaking into giggles or hiccups, and then resumed
its sober climb, until it had another fit of steps."
Ursula K Le Guin "The Beginning Place"

On Sun, 4 Jun 2023 20:20:20 +0100, John Hall <john_nospam@jhall.co.uk>
wrote:

>In message <4853ff31-61bb-4934-88cf-d9373eec2148n@googlegroups.com>,
>Robert Henderson <anywhere156@gmail.com> writes
>>English spinners who could plausibly replace Leach
>>

Season's f-c bowling record in 2023:
Liam Livingston Lancs 0-0
Liam Dawson Hants 9-216
Liam Patterson-White 1-228
Danny Brigs Warks 1-9
Dominic Bess Yorks 9-378
>
>For some value of "plausible.
>>

Given the village idiot's obsession with destroying English cricket,
presumably he saw Livingstone's 0 wickets and thought he'd be ideal -
except that he hasn't actually bowled at all. I would think an actual
average of 228 would be a better bet to weaken the bowling and is
certainly not a batter of any note.

Cheers,

Mike

On Sunday, June 4, 2023 at 9:37:53 PM UTC+1, Mike Holmans wrote:
> On Sun, 4 Jun 2023 20:20:20 +0100, John Hall <john_...@jhall.co.uk>
> wrote:
> >In message <4853ff31-61bb-4934...@googlegroups.com>,
> >Robert Henderson <anywh...@gmail.com> writes
> >>English spinners who could plausibly replace Leach
> >>
> Season's f-c bowling record in 2023:
>
> Liam Livingston Lancs 0-0
> Liam Dawson Hants 9-216
> Liam Patterson-White 1-228
> Danny Brigs Warks 1-9
> Dominic Bess Yorks 9-378
> >
> >For some value of "plausible.
> >>
> Given the village idiot's obsession with destroying English cricket,
> presumably he saw Livingstone's 0 wickets and thought he'd be ideal -
> except that he hasn't actually bowled at all. I would think an actual
> average of 228 would be a better bet to weaken the bowling and is
> certainly not a batter of any note.
>

i dont think the doc has played a single FC match so far this season,
so its not surprising hes 0-0. but then thats only 1 less than our 4,5,6 middle
order batters, so it shouldnt be a drawback in the bazball era ;)

on the bbc ali leads the field in the viewers poll but i think it very unlikely
he would want to restart his test career.

mike

On Monday, June 5, 2023 at 2:47:17 AM UTC+10, Robert Henderson wrote:
> England’s Ashes preparations have been rocked after spinner Jack Leach was ruled out of the series with a back stress fracture.

It's ok.

County Cricket produces loads of Test class spin bowlers.

It's basically a batting and pace bowling and spin bowling factory.
It really should focus more on medium pace trundlers. We're lacking in them.... /s

On Sunday, 4 June 2023 at 20:12:02 UTC+1, max.it wrote:

> Tongue can bowl leg spin.

------------
Moeen Ali seriously considering approach from England for Ashes return
GEORGE DOBELL - EXCLUSIVE: Moeen, the off-spinning allrounder, originally retired from Test cricket in September 2021, but Jack Leach's back injury has opened the door for a possible return
------------

I'm neither pro or anti this, but leaning towards pro largely as it'll boil someone on here's piss.

Richard

In message <7d29270f-8420-45b5-b4e1-a4d67e123ea1n@googlegroups.com>,
Richard Dixon <richsdixon1975@gmail.com> writes
>On Sunday, 4 June 2023 at 20:12:02 UTC+1, max.it wrote:
>
>> Tongue can bowl leg spin.
>
>------------
>Moeen Ali seriously considering approach from England for Ashes return
>GEORGE DOBELL - EXCLUSIVE: Moeen, the off-spinning allrounder,
>originally retired from Test cricket in September 2021, but Jack
>Leach's back injury has opened the door for a possible return
>------------
>
>I'm neither pro or anti this, but leaning towards pro largely as it'll
>boil someone on here's piss.
>
>Richard

The new England regime should suit Moeen a lot better than the old one
did, and hopefully that might be reflected in his performance.
--
John Hall "[It was] so steep that at intervals the street broke into steps,
like a person breaking into giggles or hiccups, and then resumed
its sober climb, until it had another fit of steps."
Ursula K Le Guin "The Beginning Place"

On Mon, 5 Jun 2023 13:19:10 -0700 (PDT), Richard Dixon
<richsdixon1975@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Sunday, 4 June 2023 at 20:12:02 UTC+1, max.it wrote:
>
>> Tongue can bowl leg spin.
>
>------------
>Moeen Ali seriously considering approach from England for Ashes return
>GEORGE DOBELL - EXCLUSIVE: Moeen, the off-spinning allrounder, originally retired from Test cricket in September 2021, but Jack Leach's back injury has opened the door for a possible return
>------------
>
>I'm neither pro or anti this, but leaning towards pro largely as it'll boil someone on here's piss.

I think the people like myself who think he's too callow should ask
themselves whether they would say the same if we were playing India.

If Ali or Rashid were to make themselves available, I wouldn't, but
the other white spinners available are definitely not going to cause
the Australian top order much trouble.

Apart from pissing off the obvious, Ahmed clearly has potential to be
much better than Dawson etc, so there's a rational argument for giving
him the spot and show what he can do. Tongue has just played his debut
Test and bowled very well indeed, which suggests that the support
network in the England squad works extremely well - and most other
people who've had debuts in the last year have not failed (Ahmed did
get a debut 5-fer).

Obviously his recent CC performances don't scream for his selection
but I've a feeling Stokes and McCullum will tell Luke Wright their
preference for him.

Cheers,

Mike

On Mon, 05 Jun 2023 22:59:07 +0100, Mike Holmans <spam@jackalope.uk>
wrote:

>On Mon, 5 Jun 2023 13:19:10 -0700 (PDT), Richard Dixon
><richsdixon1975@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sunday, 4 June 2023 at 20:12:02 UTC+1, max.it wrote:
>>
>>> Tongue can bowl leg spin.
>>
>>------------
>>Moeen Ali seriously considering approach from England for Ashes return
>>GEORGE DOBELL - EXCLUSIVE: Moeen, the off-spinning allrounder, originally retired from Test cricket in September 2021, but Jack Leach's back injury has opened the door for a possible return
>>------------
>>
>>I'm neither pro or anti this, but leaning towards pro largely as it'll boil someone on here's piss.
>
>I think the people like myself who think he's too callow should ask
>themselves whether they would say the same if we were playing India.
>
>If Ali or Rashid were to make themselves available, I wouldn't, but
>the other white spinners available are definitely not going to cause
>the Australian top order much trouble.
>
>Apart from pissing off the obvious, Ahmed clearly has potential to be
>much better than Dawson etc, so there's a rational argument for giving
>him the spot and show what he can do. Tongue has just played his debut
>Test and bowled very well indeed, which suggests that the support
>network in the England squad works extremely well - and most other
>people who've had debuts in the last year have not failed (Ahmed did
>get a debut 5-fer).
>
>Obviously his recent CC performances don't scream for his selection
>but I've a feeling Stokes and McCullum will tell Luke Wright their
>preference for him.
>
>Cheers,
>
>Mike

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/65816609

max.it

>> RH
>
> i dont think LLs bolwing is test standard. its only ok in t20s. but he would be the bazball choice.
>
> actually I wonder if they are begging moeen to help out. hes not like for like but he would
> improve the balance of the side if stokes cant bowl.
>
> in home tests ali has 1764 runs at 33 and 104 wkts at 33. but he has officially retired
> from test cricket so i doubt he would want to involve himself in a 5 test ashes series.
> plus i think his record against oz is poor. I'd probably choose dawson as Bess or
> Ahmed would be a bigger risk. The other option is just to choose another
> seamer, particularly 1 who can bat like woakes, and just fill in with root etc. But
> the irish liked joes bowling yesterday. Perhaps Stokes could bowl offspin
> instead ;)
>
> mike
I know you're joking, but Stokes is versatile. I remember when Tony
Greig started bowling medium pace off spin later on in his career, and
became a much more effective bowler.

On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 11:34:58 AM UTC+1, Steve Hague wrote:
> >> RH
> >
> > i dont think LLs bolwing is test standard. its only ok in t20s. but he would be the bazball choice.
> >
> > actually I wonder if they are begging moeen to help out. hes not like for like but he would
> > improve the balance of the side if stokes cant bowl.
> >
> > in home tests ali has 1764 runs at 33 and 104 wkts at 33. but he has officially retired
> > from test cricket so i doubt he would want to involve himself in a 5 test ashes series.
> > plus i think his record against oz is poor. I'd probably choose dawson as Bess or
> > Ahmed would be a bigger risk. The other option is just to choose another
> > seamer, particularly 1 who can bat like woakes, and just fill in with root etc. But
> > the irish liked joes bowling yesterday. Perhaps Stokes could bowl offspin
> > instead ;)
> >
> > mike
> I know you're joking, but Stokes is versatile. I remember when Tony
> Greig started bowling medium pace off spin later on in his career, and
> became a much more effective bowler.

I have seen Ollie Robinson bowling very impressive offbrakes for Sussex against Middlsex a couple of years ago. He started as a spinner in the age groups so it would not be something foreign to him. RH