On Thu, 11 Jan 2024 03:22:19 -0800 (PST), Paul Reynolds
<paulreynoldsrpm@gmail.com> wrote:

>batter advances out of his ground and misses the ball, the keeper fumbles the ball and drops ball into the knee roll of his pad, with the batter out of their ground the keeper breaks the wicket with his knee/pad retaining the ball.
>what's the umpires decision?

Not out.
From hand to shoulder of the arm holding the ball counts as breaking
the wicket fairly.
Others might disagree.

max.it

On 14/01/2024 19:03, max.it wrote:
> On Thu, 11 Jan 2024 03:22:19 -0800 (PST), Paul Reynolds
> <paulreynoldsrpm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> batter advances out of his ground and misses the ball, the keeper fumbles the ball and drops ball into the knee roll of his pad, with the batter out of their ground the keeper breaks the wicket with his knee/pad retaining the ball.
>> what's the umpires decision?
>
> Not out.
> From hand to shoulder of the arm holding the ball counts as breaking
> the wicket fairly.
> Others might disagree.

One other point is that the ball must be held in the hand or hands, so
if he caught it, say, in the crook of his elbow, that wouldn't be out
either.

--
David North

On Monday, January 15, 2024 at 7:04:08 AM UTC+10, David North wrote:
> One other point is that the ball must be held in the hand or hands, so
> if he caught it, say, in the crook of his elbow, that wouldn't be out
> either.

What if the ball is "held" in the elbow and the ball touches the stumps during the stumping? Rather than, say, the outside part of the elbow holding the ball hitting the stumps.

39.2 Ball rebounding from wicket-keeper’s person
If the wicket is put down by the ball, it shall be regarded as having been put down by the wicket-keeper if the ball:
rebounds on to the stumps from any part of the wicket-keeper’s person or equipment

ISTM that if a keeper can stand there, eyes closed, and have a ball bounce off them to complete a stumping, then a ball controlled in the elbow to perform the stumping should be ok.

On Monday, January 15, 2024 at 5:03:43 AM UTC+10, max.it wrote:
> From hand to shoulder of the arm holding the ball counts as breaking

assuming holding the ball means "whilst being held in the hand".
If it's held in the elbow it looks like the ball itself has to touch the stumps/bail.

ISTM that if you balance the ball on your hand, then with full control, lower your hand onto the stumps, you can't run someone out.
You have to be "holding" the ball.
Fair enough, too. The Laws have to be easy to judge.

On Mon, 15 Jan 2024 03:36:38 -0800 (PST), jack fredricks
<jzfredricks@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Monday, January 15, 2024 at 5:03:43?AM UTC+10, max.it wrote:
>> From hand to shoulder of the arm holding the ball counts as breaking
>
>assuming holding the ball means "whilst being held in the hand".

That's what the law says.

>If it's held in the elbow it looks like the ball itself has to touch the stumps/bail.

Yeah, it happens all the time, almost every game, ubiquitous.
>
>ISTM that if you balance the ball on your hand, then with full control, lower your hand onto the stumps, you can't run someone out.
>You have to be "holding" the ball.

I love balancing the ball on my hand with full control, sometimes I
balance it on the end of my dick too.
ISTM that you are an arsehole

>Fair enough, too. The Laws have to be easy to judge.

max.it

On Monday 15 January 2024 at 11:26:02 UTC, jack fredricks wrote:
> On Monday, January 15, 2024 at 7:04:08 AM UTC+10, David North wrote:
> > One other point is that the ball must be held in the hand or hands, so
> > if he caught it, say, in the crook of his elbow, that wouldn't be out
> > either.
> What if the ball is "held" in the elbow and the ball touches the stumps during the stumping? Rather than, say, the outside part of the elbow holding the ball hitting the stumps.

As long as it's the contact between ball and wicket that puts the wicket down (or puts it down further if it's already been put down, e.g. by removing the second bail if the arm has already removed one bail).

On Monday 15 January 2024 at 13:12:34 UTC, max.it wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Jan 2024 03:36:38 -0800 (PST), jack fredricks
> <jzfre...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >On Monday, January 15, 2024 at 5:03:43?AM UTC+10, max.it wrote:
> >> From hand to shoulder of the arm holding the ball counts as breaking
> >
> >assuming holding the ball means "whilst being held in the hand".
> That's what the law says.
> >If it's held in the elbow it looks like the ball itself has to touch the stumps/bail.
> Yeah, it happens all the time, almost every game, ubiquitous.

Yes, we are getting a bit far-fetched.

On Tuesday, January 16, 2024 at 12:02:45 AM UTC+10, David North wrote:
> Yes, we are getting a bit far-fetched.

Discussing mundane law application is boring. Edge case stuff is always more fun.