ABOUT BLOODY TIME TOO!

=====================Drivers who leave their engines running when parked risk a £40 fine from next year.

Signs are now going up across the city ready for enforcement to start on Tuesday, 2 January.

Brighton and Hove councillors agreed to start issuing the fines last June to help tackle air pollution.

Drivers can be fined if their idling cars are in a parking bay, taxi rank and other parts of the road, but the new rule doesn’t apply to sitting in traffic.

The fine is reduced to £20 if paid within 10 days.

Councillor Tim Rowkins, chair of the City Environment, South Downs and The Sea Committee said: “Improving the city’s air quality is extremely important, especially for those who suffer from long term respiratory conditions like asthma and lung disease.

“Enforcing engine idling is something we hope will deter motorists from releasing harmful emissions unnecessarily. We’re asking those parked up to switch off their engines and reduce air pollution.”

If an environmental enforcement officer witnesses a car idling, they’ll speak to the driver to let them know they’re committing an offence.

They’ll take the drivers details, including their registration number, and issue them with a fixed penalty notice.

If the driver refuses to give their details or drives off, the council will contact Sussex Police to collect the details and the FPN will be sent in the post.

An idling engine can produce up to twice as many exhaust emissions as an engine in motion. Exhaust emissions contain a range of air pollutants such as carbon monoxide, nitrogen dioxide, and particulate matter.

https://www.brightonandhovenews.org/2023/12/22/drivers-to-be-hit-with-40-fines-for-idling-engines/

On 24/12/2023 04:38 pm, Simon Mason wrote:

> ABOUT BLOODY TIME TOO!
>
> ======================
> Drivers who leave their engines running when parked risk a £40 fine from next year.
> Signs are now going up across the city ready for enforcement to start on Tuesday, 2 January.
> Brighton and Hove councillors agreed to start issuing the fines last June to help tackle air pollution.
> Drivers can be fined if their idling cars are in a parking bay, taxi rank and other parts of the road, but the new rule doesn’t apply to sitting in traffic.
> The fine is reduced to £20 if paid within 10 days.
> Councillor Tim Rowkins, chair of the City Environment, South Downs and The Sea Committee said: “Improving the city’s air quality is extremely important, especially for those who suffer from long term respiratory conditions like asthma and lung disease.
> “Enforcing engine idling is something we hope will deter motorists from releasing harmful emissions unnecessarily. We’re asking those parked up to switch off their engines and reduce air pollution.”
> If an environmental enforcement officer witnesses a car idling, they’ll speak to the driver to let them know they’re committing an offence.
> They’ll take the drivers details, including their registration number, and issue them with a fixed penalty notice.
> If the driver refuses to give their details or drives off, the council will contact Sussex Police to collect the details and the FPN will be sent in the post.
> An idling engine can produce up to twice as many exhaust emissions as an engine in motion. Exhaust emissions contain a range of air pollutants such as carbon monoxide, nitrogen dioxide, and particulate matter.
> https://www.brightonandhovenews.org/2023/12/22/drivers-to-be-hit-with-40-fines-for-idling-engines/

Even in the depths of winter when drivers and other occupants need the
use of the vehicle's heating system?

Even in the height of summer when drivers and other occupants need the
use of the vehicle's air-conditioning system?

Has anyone on B&H Council got an ounce of common sense?

[That latter was rhetorical.]

Who, how and where was the chav on the chav-bike involved in this?

On Sunday, December 24, 2023 at 4:38:26 PM UTC, Simon Mason wrote:
> ABOUT BLOODY TIME TOO!
>
> ======================
David
5 days ago

Good point. It’s obviously going to take some intelligent enforcement.

I do regularly see vehicles with engines running and drivers having their lunch or having an extended chat on the phone, so I would like to see that change.
AND

martin J
4 days ago

PUBLIC HEALTH
Highway Code Rule 123: drivers must not leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while the vehicle is stationary on a public road.

See the RAC website under “Advice” on “why idling is so bad for the environment”

On 27/12/2023 09:39 am, Simon Mason wrote:
> On Sunday, December 24, 2023 at 4:38:26 PM UTC, Simon Mason wrote:
>> ABOUT BLOODY TIME TOO!
>>
>> ======================
> David
> 5 days ago
>
> Good point. It’s obviously going to take some intelligent enforcement.
>
> I do regularly see vehicles with engines running and drivers having their lunch or having an extended chat on the phone, so I would like to see that change.
> AND
>
> martin J
> 4 days ago
>
> PUBLIC HEALTH
> Highway Code Rule 123: drivers must not leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while the vehicle is stationary on a public road.
>
> See the RAC website under “Advice” on “why idling is so bad for the environment”

Note the operative word "unnecessarily".

It is perfectly legal to keep the engine running to keep the heater (in
winter) or air-conditioning (in summer) running for the comfort of the
vehicle's occupants.

And who is/are the only judge/s of what is comfortable?

That's right: the vehicle's occupants.

No-one else. Certainly not a passing chav-cyclist.

[See what I did there? That's right: I got the thread back on-topic.]

On Wednesday, December 27, 2023 at 9:39:44 AM UTC, Simon Mason wrote:
> On Sunday, December 24, 2023 at 4:38:26 PM UTC, Simon Mason wrote:
> > ABOUT BLOODY TIME TOO!
Ubiquitous
5 days ago

Yeah, pretty imbecilic of the council to think that you could do the tiniest thing for other road users. Instead of whinging about the fine, why not turn off your engine? Is that really too much to ask?

On 27/12/2023 04:29 pm, Simon Mason, apparently talking to himself
again, said:

> On Wednesday, December 27, 2023 at 9:39:44 AM UTC, Simon Mason, , apparently talking to himself again, said:
>> On Sunday, December 24, 2023 at 4:38:26 PM UTC, Simon Mason, apparently talking to himself again, said:

>>> ABOUT BLOODY TIME TOO!

> Ubiquitous
> 5 days ago

> Yeah, pretty imbecilic of the council to think that you could do the tiniest thing for other road users. Instead of whinging about the fine, why not turn off your engine? Is that really too much to ask?

Yes, in many circumstances (see other posts nearby on the subjecyf cold
and hot weather - and also think about a vehicle which the driver only
*just* managed to get started because of a nearly-discharged battery),
it certainly IS too much to ask.

Only an eco-loony or a chav-on-a-bike could "think" otherwise.

Laura K
4 days ago

Aside from being bad for the environment, idling cars are an absolute nightmare for residents who live near taxi ranks and train stations. Will be great to see this enforced, not least to annoy the selfish commentators on here who think it’s acceptable.

On 27/12/2023 05:32 pm, Simon Mason wrote:

> Laura K
> 4 days ago

> Aside from being bad for the environment, idling cars are an absolute nightmare for residents who live near taxi ranks and train stations. Will be great to see this enforced, not least to annoy the selfish commentators on here who think it’s acceptable.

LOL!

For anyone living near a "train station" (you must mean a railway
station, this being the eastern side of the Atlantic) or an on-highway
taxi-rank, the odd idling engine in very cold or very hot weather is the
LEAST of their worries.

Each to their own, but I would not dream of buying a house that near to
a *railway* station.

And for the avoidance of doubt, there is no traffic law which obliges
drivers to switch off their vehicle's engine while stationary. Not a
single one.

The law simply provides that the engine must be stopped if idling is not
"necessary".

But as we have seen, there are PLENTY of circumstances where it IS
necessary.

If that were not the case, the law would have been worded differently.

But some idiots are so devoid of the ability to put themselves in the
shoes of others that they can't appreciate that. Apparently, even some
highly-qualified lawyers such as yourself, M'Lud.

If you leave your car idling, you can be charged a £20 fixed penalty notice (FPN) by local authorities, for emission offences and stationary idling under The Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) (Fixed Penalty) (England) Regulations 2002. There is also the potential for the fine to increase to £801.

It is also important to note that fines would be imposed only if a motorist refuses to turn off their engine when asked by an authorised person to do so.

Even if you are trying to defrost your windscreen, idling rules would still apply to you. If you leave your engine running and get out to scrape your windscreen, you can still be penalised for leaving your engine running.

It is always advisable to never leave your car idling in any situation, as it could result in your car being stolen away, which would affect your car insurance claim.

https://www.warrantydirect.co.uk/blog/engine-idling.html

On 27/12/2023 09:36 pm, Simon Mason wrote:

> If you leave your car idling, you can be charged a £20 fixed penalty notice (FPN) by local authorities, for emission offences and stationary idling under The Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) (Fixed Penalty) (England) Regulations 2002. There is also the potential for the fine to increase to £801.

TRANSLATION AND CORRECTION:

If you leave your car idling *unnecessarily*, you can be charged a £20
fixed penalty notice (FPN) by local authorities, for emission offences
and stationary idling under The Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) (Fixed
Penalty) (England) Regulations 2002.

> It is also important to note that fines would be imposed only if a motorist refuses to turn off their engine when asked by an authorised person to do so.

TRANSLATION AND CORRECTION:

It is also important to note that fines would be imposed only if a
motorist refuses to turn off their engine when asked by an authorised
person to do so *AND* if the engine is being run for an *unnecessary*
purpose. But obviously, keeping the vehicle occupants warm in winter or
cool in summer or for charging the battery of a vehicle whose battery is
not in an optimum state of charge are NOT unnecessary purposes.

> Even if you are trying to defrost your windscreen, idling rules would still apply to you. If you leave your engine running and get out to scrape your windscreen, you can still be penalised for leaving your engine running.

So stay in the car and wait for the demisters to work.

> It is always advisable to never leave your car idling in any situation, as it could result in your car being stolen away, which would affect your car insurance claim.

> https://www.warrantydirect.co.uk/blog/engine-idling.html

Odd turn of phrase: "stolen away".

Drivers that leave their engines running while parked could face tougher penalties under new proposals announced today. Transport Secretary Chris Grayling intends to launch a public consultation, looking at increasing fines for idling drivers. Vehicle idling is a major factor in poor air quality, particularly in areas with large numbers of waiting vehicles - such as outside schools, at taxi ranks and bus stations.

Councils already have the power to fine drivers, but the Department for Transport is looking at toughening up those powers to try and put a stop to unnecessary air pollution.

Chris Grayling, Transport Secretary, said:

We are determined to crack down on drivers who pollute our communities by leaving their engines running, particularly outside school gates where our children are breathing in this toxic air.

Putting a stop to idling is an easy way to drive down dangerously high levels of pollution, reducing its impact on the environment and our health.

Poor air quality is the biggest environmental risk to public health in the UK. Every minute, an idling car produces enough exhaust emissions to fill 150 balloons with harmful chemicals, including cyanide, NOx and PM2.5. The microscopic pollutants can result in a range of health problems - from heart and lung disease to strokes and cancer and have been shown to be particularly damaging to children.

These plans – which would represent the biggest change to the rules since 2002 - will also provide guidance to local authorities on their anti-idling powers, enabling them to enforce the law more effectively.

The consultation, expected to launch this summer, will also explore how to deal with repeat offenders who keep their engines running following several warnings. These proposals are the latest move in the government’s drive to improve air quality, which include grants to encourage the purchase of cleaner vehicles, the commitment to end the sale of new conventional diesel and petrol cars and vans by 2040 as part of our Road to Zero strategy, and the doubling of investment in cycling and walking since 2010.

On 28/12/2023 08:14 am, Simon Mason wrote:

> Drivers that leave their engines running while parked could face tougher penalties under new proposals announced today. Transport Secretary Chris Grayling intends to launch a public consultation, looking at increasing fines for idling drivers. Vehicle idling is a major factor in poor air quality, particularly in areas with large numbers of waiting vehicles - such as outside schools, at taxi ranks and bus stations.
>
> Councils already have the power to fine drivers, but the Department for Transport is looking at toughening up those powers to try and put a stop to unnecessary air pollution.
>
> Chris Grayling, Transport Secretary, said:
>
> We are determined to crack down on drivers who pollute our communities by leaving their engines running, particularly outside school gates where our children are breathing in this toxic air.
>
> Putting a stop to idling is an easy way to drive down dangerously high levels of pollution, reducing its impact on the environment and our health.
>
> Poor air quality is the biggest environmental risk to public health in the UK. Every minute, an idling car produces enough exhaust emissions to fill 150 balloons with harmful chemicals, including cyanide, NOx and PM2.5. The microscopic pollutants can result in a range of health problems - from heart and lung disease to strokes and cancer and have been shown to be particularly damaging to children.
>
> These plans – which would represent the biggest change to the rules since 2002 - will also provide guidance to local authorities on their anti-idling powers, enabling them to enforce the law more effectively.
>
> The consultation, expected to launch this summer, will also explore how to deal with repeat offenders who keep their engines running following several warnings. These proposals are the latest move in the government’s drive to improve air quality, which include grants to encourage the purchase of cleaner vehicles, the commitment to end the sale of new conventional diesel and petrol cars and vans by 2040 as part of our Road to Zero strategy, and the doubling of investment in cycling and walking since 2010.

No mention or involvement of chav-bikes or the chavs who ride them.

And it's the umpteenth time that May Sun has posted the same tripe.

Drivers face a £40 fine for leaving their car engine running while they are in a parking bay after councillors backed new rules.

Councillors were told that fines would not be dished out to vehicles stopped in traffic, with the rule change intended to target drivers idling elsewhere, including in taxi ranks.

Brighton and Hove City Council’s City Environment, South Downs and the Sea Committee was asked to back a £20 fine for idling.

But at a meeting Green councillor Kerry Pickett asked for the penalty charge to be £40 – in line with similar councils – and reduced to £20 if paid within 10 days.

Labour councillor Mitchie Alexander backed Councillor Pickett’s suggestion.

Labour councillor Tim Rowkins, who chairs the committee, said: “The choice for the fine to be initially set at £20 was based on us having the information that that was the maximum.

“Had we known that £40 was the maximum, then that’s what would have been proposed.”

The committee unanimously agreed to the increase.

Signs are already in place at level crossings, taxi ranks and in the centre of Brighton and Hove as well as in Rottingdean and Portslade, councillors were told. More signs will alert drivers to turn off their engines when stationary.

The law allows council enforcement officers to issue a fixed penalty notice after approaching the driver of a stationary car with its engine running.

Councillors also agreed to halt community protection warnings and community protection notices for small and independent businesses blighted by graffiti.

Councillor Pickett asked whether the move would make any difference to graffiti levels in Brighton and Hove and abstained from voting for the change.

Councillor Rowkins said: “We’ve heard a lot of feedback from small business owners who feel they are the victim of a crime and secondly doubly punished by the threat of a fine from the council. This is in response to those concerns.

“The hope is this shift in approach won’t lead to a significant amount of graffiti left in place but we will continue monitoring throughout this period.”

The council’s graffiti reduction strategy is due to be reviewed later this year.

On 28/12/2023 04:18 pm, Simon Mason wrote:

> Drivers face a £40 fine for leaving their car engine running while they are in a parking bay after councillors backed new rules.
>
> Councillors were told that fines would not be dished out to vehicles stopped in traffic, with the rule change intended to target drivers idling elsewhere, including in taxi ranks.
>
> Brighton and Hove City Council’s City Environment, South Downs and the Sea Committee was asked to back a £20 fine for idling.
>
> But at a meeting Green councillor Kerry Pickett asked for the penalty charge to be £40 – in line with similar councils – and reduced to £20 if paid within 10 days.
>
>
> Labour councillor Mitchie Alexander backed Councillor Pickett’s suggestion.
>
> Labour councillor Tim Rowkins, who chairs the committee, said: “The choice for the fine to be initially set at £20 was based on us having the information that that was the maximum.
>
> “Had we known that £40 was the maximum, then that’s what would have been proposed.”
>
> The committee unanimously agreed to the increase.
>
> Signs are already in place at level crossings, taxi ranks and in the centre of Brighton and Hove as well as in Rottingdean and Portslade, councillors were told. More signs will alert drivers to turn off their engines when stationary.
>
> The law allows council enforcement officers to issue a fixed penalty notice after approaching the driver of a stationary car with its engine running.
>
> Councillors also agreed to halt community protection warnings and community protection notices for small and independent businesses blighted by graffiti.
>
> Councillor Pickett asked whether the move would make any difference to graffiti levels in Brighton and Hove and abstained from voting for the change.
>
> Councillor Rowkins said: “We’ve heard a lot of feedback from small business owners who feel they are the victim of a crime and secondly doubly punished by the threat of a fine from the council. This is in response to those concerns.
>
> “The hope is this shift in approach won’t lead to a significant amount of graffiti left in place but we will continue monitoring throughout this period.”
>
> The council’s graffiti reduction strategy is due to be reviewed later this year.

Off-topic.

No material relating to chavs and/or their chav-bikes.

The Royal College of Physicians estimate 40,000 deaths a year in the UK are linked to air pollution, with engine idling contributing to this.

The Government is working to address the issue as a whole, but what can you do to help the situation?

Cutting out engine idling will help for a start - not only will it improve air quality in congested areas but it is also a potentially fine-able offence.

We take a look at why idling is so bad for the environment and what is being done to discourage it.

Idling means leaving a vehicle's engine running while it is stationary.

While this is often because of everyday traffic, there are some instances – such as waiting for children outside schools and sitting in total gridlock – when idling is not necessary and should be avoided.

These fumes contain a number of harmful gasses including carbon dioxide, which is bad for the environment and contributes towards climate change, as well as a range of other harmful gasses including nitrogen dioxide, carbon monoxide and hydrocarbons which are linked to asthma and other lung diseases..

Diesel vehicles are thought to be one of the biggest contributors to the problem.
Some local authorities charge a £20 fixed penalty notice (FPN) for emission offences and stationary idling under The Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) (Fixed Penalty) (England) Regulations 2002. There’s potential for the fine to increase to £801.

However, it’s important to note that fines are imposed only if a motorist refuses to switch off their engine when asked to do so by an authorised person. According to RAC research, 44% of drivers support the measure.

Local authorities have the power to issue £20 fixed penalties for engine idling if a motorist refuses to switch off their engine, regardless of the location.

The penalty is given as a result of rule 123 of The Highway Code, stating that drivers must not leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while the vehicle is stationary on a public road.

RAC research found that 26% of those caught idling are spotted doing so outside schools. An RAC scheme inviting schools to buy School Clean Air Zone banners launched in 2019.

On 28/12/2023 09:33 pm, Simon Mason wrote:
>
> The Royal College of Physicians estimate 40,000 deaths a year in the UK are linked to air pollution, with engine idling contributing to this.
>
> The Government is working to address the issue as a whole, but what can you do to help the situation?
>
> Cutting out engine idling will help for a start - not only will it improve air quality in congested areas but it is also a potentially fine-able offence.
>
> We take a look at why idling is so bad for the environment and what is being done to discourage it.
>
> Idling means leaving a vehicle's engine running while it is stationary.
>
> While this is often because of everyday traffic, there are some instances – such as waiting for children outside schools and sitting in total gridlock – when idling is not necessary and should be avoided.
>
> These fumes contain a number of harmful gasses including carbon dioxide, which is bad for the environment and contributes towards climate change, as well as a range of other harmful gasses including nitrogen dioxide, carbon monoxide and hydrocarbons which are linked to asthma and other lung diseases.
>
> Diesel vehicles are thought to be one of the biggest contributors to the problem.
> Some local authorities charge a £20 fixed penalty notice (FPN) for emission offences and stationary idling under The Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) (Fixed Penalty) (England) Regulations 2002. There’s potential for the fine to increase to £801.
>
> However, it’s important to note that fines are imposed only if a motorist refuses to switch off their engine when asked to do so by an authorised person. According to RAC research, 44% of drivers support the measure.
>
> Local authorities have the power to issue £20 fixed penalties for engine idling if a motorist refuses to switch off their engine, regardless of the location.
>
> The penalty is given as a result of rule 123 of The Highway Code, stating that drivers must not leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while the vehicle is stationary on a public road.
>
> RAC research found that 26% of those caught idling are spotted doing so outside schools. An RAC scheme inviting schools to buy School Clean Air Zone banners launched in 2019.

No Chav-cyclists or their chav-bikes mentioned.

How many times are you going to repeat your trolling?

AS TEMPERATURES plummet across the UK, drivers have been warned that they may face a £40 penalty for idling their cars to defrost windscreens.

Andrew Marshall, from car finance group CarMoney, has pointed out that engine idling is illegal under Section 2 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 and that rule 123 of the Highway Code states: “You must not leave a vehicle’s engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on a public road.”

Motorists found in breach of the law could see themselves saddled with a fixed penalty notice of £20 or, if not paid within 28 days, a penalty of double that. Charges within London can be stricter still, with local by-laws stipulating that drivers caught idling their cars on a public highway can be issued with a Penalty Charge Notice of £40 to be paid within 14 days, rising to £80 if not settled within that two-week period.

Idling while stuck in traffic generally falls outside the definition of “unnecessary”, though, as the depths of winter approach, motorists found running their cars to defrost their windscreens and to warm up their interiors are considered to be in breach of the rules if they refuse to switch off their engines when instructed to do so by an officer of the law.

It is also illegal to leave a vehicle unattended with the engine running in a public place, so motorists leaving their cars to idle while they go back into their houses are falling foul of the Highway Code on two counts. They also run the risk of their cars being stolen by an unscrupulous passer-by.

While it should be said that these laws only apply on public roads — not, for example, when a car is parked in someone’s driveway — that doesn’t mean that idling a car to defrost the windscreen is the right thing to do.

Cars left idling, particularly in cold weather, emit higher levels of harmful fumes such as nitrogen oxides (NOx) and carbon monoxide than those that are driven immediately, and thereby brought up to temperature more quickly. Idling engines are a major contributor to local air pollution, which, according to the Royal College of Surgeons results in around 40,000 deaths in the UK annually.

The potential impact of poor air quality from idling engines on children’s health has led to calls from many groups for a ban on idling outside schools, though in theory the existing laws on idling in public also cover that. Advocacy groups say that more enforcement is needed.

“Now more than ever it is important to be aware of our impact on the environment,” Marshall said. “By minimising car idling on our daily commutes, school drop-offs and simply waiting in traffic, we can contribute less CO2 emissions.”

Rather than leaving their cars idling, drivers without garages who need to park their cars outdoors overnight in winter should invest in a can of de-icing spray and a window scraper. Alternatively, a jug or kettle filled with barely lukewarm water will suffice, though be warned: if the water is too hot the thermal shock may crack the windscreen.

It’s also important to clear the inside of the windows of condensation as it can impact visibility and make it dangerous to drive. Rule 229 of the Highway Code says “you MUST be able to see, so clear all snow and ice from all your windows.” Any rule that uses the word “MUST” indicates it is law. A cloth or sponge to clear the moisture is useful and the dehumidifying effect of running the car’s air conditioning while driving will help to clear additional excess moisture.

On 29/12/2023 06:39 am, Simon Mason wrote:

> AS TEMPERATURES plummet across the UK, drivers have been warned that they may face a £40 penalty for idling their cars to defrost windscreens.
> Andrew Marshall, from car finance group CarMoney, has pointed out that engine idling is illegal under Section 2 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 and that rule 123 of the Highway Code states: “You must not leave a vehicle’s engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on a public road.”
> Motorists found in breach of the law could see themselves saddled with a fixed penalty notice of £20 or, if not paid within 28 days, a penalty of double that. Charges within London can be stricter still, with local by-laws stipulating that drivers caught idling their cars on a public highway can be issued with a Penalty Charge Notice of £40 to be paid within 14 days, rising to £80 if not settled within that two-week period.
> Idling while stuck in traffic generally falls outside the definition of “unnecessary”, though, as the depths of winter approach, motorists found running their cars to defrost their windscreens and to warm up their interiors are considered to be in breach of the rules if they refuse to switch off their engines when instructed to do so by an officer of the law.
> It is also illegal to leave a vehicle unattended with the engine running in a public place, so motorists leaving their cars to idle while they go back into their houses are falling foul of the Highway Code on two counts. They also run the risk of their cars being stolen by an unscrupulous passer-by.
> While it should be said that these laws only apply on public roads — not, for example, when a car is parked in someone’s driveway — that doesn’t mean that idling a car to defrost the windscreen is the right thing to do.
> Cars left idling, particularly in cold weather, emit higher levels of harmful fumes such as nitrogen oxides (NOx) and carbon monoxide than those that are driven immediately, and thereby brought up to temperature more quickly. Idling engines are a major contributor to local air pollution, which, according to the Royal College of Surgeons results in around 40,000 deaths in the UK annually.
> The potential impact of poor air quality from idling engines on children’s health has led to calls from many groups for a ban on idling outside schools, though in theory the existing laws on idling in public also cover that. Advocacy groups say that more enforcement is needed.
> “Now more than ever it is important to be aware of our impact on the environment,” Marshall said. “By minimising car idling on our daily commutes, school drop-offs and simply waiting in traffic, we can contribute less CO2 emissions.”
> Rather than leaving their cars idling, drivers without garages who need to park their cars outdoors overnight in winter should invest in a can of de-icing spray and a window scraper. Alternatively, a jug or kettle filled with barely lukewarm water will suffice, though be warned: if the water is too hot the thermal shock may crack the windscreen.
> It’s also important to clear the inside of the windows of condensation as it can impact visibility and make it dangerous to drive. Rule 229 of the Highway Code says “you MUST be able to see, so clear all snow and ice from all your windows.” Any rule that uses the word “MUST” indicates it is law. A cloth or sponge to clear the moisture is useful and the dehumidifying effect of running the car’s air conditioning while driving will help to clear additional excess moisture.

No chav-cycling content.

FAIL.

Off-topic, trolling post by May Sun.

Also known as stationary idling, Section 42 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 prohibits leaving your engine on when it is not needed. This act enforces Rule 123 of the Highway Code, which states “you must not leave a vehicle’s engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on a public road”.

If you do leave your engine idle, you could face a fine upwards of £20, or £80 in areas of London – as per the Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) Regulations of 2002.

An idling engine can contribute massively to air pollution, potentially producing up to twice the emissions of a car in motion. Idling engines can churn out nitrogen oxide, sulphur dioxide and particulate matter. These chemicals can have a negative effect on people and the environment by contributing to poor air quality. Therefore, to reduce the impact of these pollutants, idling has been prohibited to limit emissions.
There aren’t many exceptions to engine idling. If you are stuck in a traffic jam, it would be expected that you would turn your engine off as you aren’t going anywhere.

It’s a common misconception that stopping and starting the engine uses up more fuel than leaving the car running. So, by switching off, you’re also cutting down on fuel costs.

On a warm day, keeping the air conditioning on by leaving the engine running may seem like a valid reason, but unfortunately, it is not.

One of the few valid reasons to leave your engine idling while you aren’t driving is if you need to defrost your windscreen on a cold morning.. However, you shouldn’t leave the car unattended while you do so.

On 29/12/2023 02:47 pm, Simon Mason wrote:

> Also known as stationary idling, Section 42 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 prohibits leaving your engine on when it is not needed.

"...when ... not *needed*...".

> This act enforces Rule 123 of the Highway Code, which states “you must not leave a vehicle’s engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on a public road”.

"...unnecessarily...".

> If you do leave your engine idle [unnecessarily - you forgot that bit, innit?], you could face a fine upwards of £20, or £80 in areas of London – as per the Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) Regulations of 2002.
>
> An idling engine can contribute massively to air pollution, potentially producing up to twice the emissions of a car in motion. Idling engines can churn out nitrogen oxide, sulphur dioxide and particulate matter. These chemicals can have a negative effect on people and the environment by contributing to poor air quality. Therefore, to reduce the impact of these pollutants, idling has been prohibited to limit emissions.

It hasn't been prohibited. Whoever wrote that sentence (I know it wasn't
you because it contains a four syllable word) is a blatant liar.

You should be ashamed of yourself for repeating the lies.

> There aren’t many exceptions to engine idling.

There are enough.

> If you are stuck in a traffic jam, it would be expected that you would turn your engine off as you aren’t going anywhere.

It is certainly not "expected" and also not "necessary".
>
> It’s a common misconception that stopping and starting the engine uses up more fuel than leaving the car running. So, by switching off, you’re also cutting down on fuel costs.
> On a warm day, keeping the air conditioning on by leaving the engine running may seem like a valid reason, but unfortunately, it is not.

Oh, yes it is. Who claims that it isn't? The liar who claimed that
idling-at-stationary has been prohibited?
>
> One of the few valid reasons to leave your engine idling while you aren’t driving is if you need to defrost your windscreen on a cold morning. However, you shouldn’t leave the car unattended while you do so.

And?

What about chavs on bikes?

This is uk.rec.cycling, not uk.alt-untruths.

QUOTE: Do you sit in your car with the engine running while you wait to collect your children after school?

Or, if your windscreen is covered in a thick layer of ice, you might be tempted to start your car, and then head back into the warmth of your house for a few minutes while it defrosts.

Whatever the weather, aside from the obvious risk of inviting an opportunist car thief*, leaving your car while it’s running could actually be breaking the law.
Fines for idling

The problem isn’t just constrained to drivers idling to clear ice from their windscreens. Cars are often left idling for other reasons, such as waiting to pick someone up.

Leaving your car idling is looked upon dimly by the law. The Highway Code clearly states: "You must not leave a vehicle’s engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on a public road."

Drivers can face a fine of upwards of £20 for leaving the engine on while in a stationary car; this can go up to £80 in some areas of London..

In fact, some councils have been pushing for tougher rules regarding idling, including instant on-the-spot fines. This was echoed by the government in June 2019, when the Transport Secretary at the time, Chris Grayling, announced a consultation regarding tightening up the law in this area.

Notably, idling could be banned outside schools and hospitals, and other areas where people are especially sensitive to air pollution.
Are there exceptions?

There are some exceptions and qualifications to the law regarding idling.

The law only applies on public roads, meaning that you can legally leave the engine on if you’re on a private driveway or supermarket car park, for instance.
What’s so bad about idling?

Running engines emit fumes. And in some cases, cars can pump out almost twice the emissions while stationary as they do while in motion.

Emissions such as nitrogen oxide, sulphur dioxide and fine particulate matter are major contributors to poor air quality.

And exposure to these emissions can have serious negative effects on health.. It’s estimated that man-made air pollution causes between 28,000 and 36,000 deaths in the UK every year, contributing to asthma, lung cancer and heart disease.

Although it’s difficult to separate different types of pollutants for the purposes of these figures, traffic emissions are doubtless a huge factor. According to Transport for London, over half of the capital’s air pollution is caused by polluting vehicles.
Stuck in traffic

If you have a modern car, there’s a good chance it’s already fitted with a ‘stop-start’ system. As the engine cuts out when the car’s at a standstill, you need not worry about idling. Although manufacturers allow drivers to switch off these systems manually, it’s advisable not to.

It won’t run your battery flat either, even if you’re caught for a long time in stationary traffic. The system will automatically restart the engine before the battery runs out.

If you have an older car without this system, the RAC recommends that drivers switch off their engines if they think they’ll be waiting for two minutes or more.

It’s recommended that you don’t do this too often if you have an older vehicle, however, or a battery that’s five years old or more. Your car may struggle if you switch the engine off and on again too frequently, especially in cold weather. ENDS

https://www.ageas.co.uk/solved/your-car/car-idling-is-it-illegal-to-leave-my-engine-running-in-cold-weather/

On 29/12/2023 06:59 pm, Simon Mason wrote:
> QUOTE: Do you sit in your car with the engine running while you wait to collect your children after school?
>
> Or, if your windscreen is covered in a thick layer of ice, you might be tempted to start your car, and then head back into the warmth of your house for a few minutes while it defrosts.
>
> Whatever the weather, aside from the obvious risk of inviting an opportunist car thief*, leaving your car while it’s running could actually be breaking the law.

Not on my driveway.

> Fines for idling
> The problem isn’t just constrained to drivers idling to clear ice from their windscreens. Cars are often left idling for other reasons, such as waiting to pick someone up.
> Leaving your car idling is looked upon dimly by the law. The Highway Code clearly states: "You must not leave a vehicle’s engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on a public road."

Define "unnecessarily".

<.....long wait...>

> Drivers can face a fine of upwards of £20 for leaving the engine on while in a stationary car; this can go up to £80 in some areas of London.
> In fact, some councils have been pushing for tougher rules regarding idling, including instant on-the-spot fines. This was echoed by the government in June 2019, when the Transport Secretary at the time, Chris Grayling, announced a consultation regarding tightening up the law in this area.
> Notably, idling could be banned outside schools and hospitals, and other areas where people are especially sensitive to air pollution.
> Are there exceptions?
> There are some exceptions and qualifications to the law regarding idling.
> The law only applies on public roads, meaning that you can legally leave the engine on if you’re on a private driveway or supermarket car park, for instance.
> What’s so bad about idling?
> Running engines emit fumes. And in some cases, cars can pump out almost twice the emissions while stationary as they do while in motion.
> Emissions such as nitrogen oxide, sulphur dioxide and fine particulate matter are major contributors to poor air quality.
> And exposure to these emissions can have serious negative effects on health. It’s estimated that man-made air pollution causes between 28,000 and 36,000 deaths in the UK every year, contributing to asthma, lung cancer and heart disease.
> Although it’s difficult to separate different types of pollutants for the purposes of these figures, traffic emissions are doubtless a huge factor. According to Transport for London, over half of the capital’s air pollution is caused by polluting vehicles.
> Stuck in traffic
> If you have a modern car, there’s a good chance it’s already fitted with a ‘stop-start’ system. As the engine cuts out when the car’s at a standstill, you need not worry about idling. Although manufacturers allow drivers to switch off these systems manually, it’s advisable not to.
> It won’t run your battery flat either, even if you’re caught for a long time in stationary traffic. The system will automatically restart the engine before the battery runs out.
> If you have an older car without this system, the RAC recommends that drivers switch off their engines if they think they’ll be waiting for two minutes or more.
> It’s recommended that you don’t do this too often if you have an older vehicle, however, or a battery that’s five years old or more. Your car may struggle if you switch the engine off and on again too frequently, especially in cold weather. ENDS

> https://www.ageas.co.uk/solved/your-car/car-idling-is-it-illegal-to-leave-my-engine-running-in-cold-weather/

Where's the bit about the chavs on their chav-bikes?

QUOTE:
Under Regulation 98 of The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, it is an offence to leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on the roadside.

Since 2002, under Regulation 12 of The Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) (Fixed Penalty) (England) Regulations 2002, Local Authorities have been given the powers to enforce the switching off of engines when vehicles are stationary on the roadside. This enables local authorities to issue a Fixed Penalty Notice of (FPN) £40 to a driver who is committing an offence by idling their vehicle’s engine.

Aside from enforcing idling by issuing FPNs, a council may choose to create a Traffic Management Order, under the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984, so that traffic enforcement officers within the local authority are able to issue Penalty Charge Notices (PCNs) of £80 for idling vehicles.

Local Authorities can find a useful toolkit with templates related to enforcement on the Resources page. Please note, all local authorities using these templates should consult with their relevant legal teams first. ENDS

https://idlingaction.london/idling-enforcement

On 29/12/2023 08:06 pm, Simon Mason wrote:

> QUOTE:
> Under Regulation 98 of The Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, it is an offence to leave a vehicle engine running *unnecessarily* while that vehicle is stationary on the roadside. [my emphasis]

Define "unnecessarily".
>
> Since 2002, under Regulation 12 of The Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) (Fixed Penalty) (England) Regulations 2002, Local Authorities have been given the powers to enforce the switching off of engines when vehicles are stationary on the roadside. This enables local authorities to issue a Fixed Penalty Notice of (FPN) £40 to a driver who is committing an offence by idling their vehicle’s engine... "unnecessarily"...
>
> Aside from enforcing idling by issuing FPNs, a council may choose to create a Traffic Management Order, under the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984, so that traffic enforcement officers within the local authority are able to issue Penalty Charge Notices (PCNs) of £80 for idling vehicles.
>
> Local Authorities can find a useful toolkit with templates related to enforcement on the Resources page. Please note, all local authorities using these templates should consult with their relevant legal teams first. ENDS
>
> https://idlingaction.london/idling-enforcement

Define "unnecessary" and its derivatives.

Sorry for the four syllable words.

Reducing Nitrogen dioxide and particulate emissions from road transport is one of the most effective ways to improve air quality in urban areas. Motorists who leave their engines running when parked cause unnecessary, harmful air pollution.

The Road Traffic Act 1988 and the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 deal with how vehicles can be used on a road.

Under this national legislation, you must not leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is stationary on a public road.

The Act and Regulations are enforced by the police. However, under the Road Traffic (Vehicle Emissions) (Fixed Penalty) (England) Regulations 2002, local authorities may enforce the “stationary idling offence” (which is a contravention of regulation 98 Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 as it relates to the prevention of exhaust emissions).

This means that in a designated air quality management area (Newcastle's city centre is one), local authority officers have a discretionary power to request a driver to switch of the engine of a vehicle which is unnecessarily left running, and would be in breach of the above regulations.

It is an offence to fail to comply with the request and a £20 penalty notice may be issued by the officer.

A person issued a penalty notice for engine idling (by the police or local authority) can either pay it, or elect for a magistrates' court to deal with the matter. The maximum fine for this offence in a magistrates' court is £1,000.