My samsung tv has started to send out little chirps every second or so at
rf.. You can hear them on most am radios up to about 30 mhz and on the audio
feed if you turn the volume up. Does not seem to affect the working of the
set, but as its only less than 3 years old it sounds like some screening or
decoupling is a bit dodgy. Iyt is not there if you unplug hdmi cables
though, ast either end, so I'm guessing these are acting like an aerial as
it polls for what is on the other end. I think its a worsening of the issue
I mentioned some time ago of ticks on the audio. I feel a contact clean of
plugs and sockets is in my future!

Brian

--

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"Brian Gaff" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:u4q3up$3v6dq$1@dont-email.me...
> My samsung tv has started to send out little chirps every second or so at
> rf.. You can hear them on most am radios up to about 30 mhz and on the
> audio feed if you turn the volume up. Does not seem to affect the working
> of the set, but as its only less than 3 years old it sounds like some
> screening or decoupling is a bit dodgy. Iyt is not there if you unplug
> hdmi cables though, ast either end, so I'm guessing these are acting like
> an aerial as it polls for what is on the other end. I think its a
> worsening of the issue I mentioned some time ago of ticks on the audio. I
> feel a contact clean of plugs and sockets is in my future!

That reminds me of something I haven't encountered for ages. No, no white
dogshit (!) but the "galloping horses" sound picked up on a car radio as a
mobile phone polls the base stations or as a base station rings a phone.
Same cars, same phones, but in the last few years I've never heard galloping
horses whereas it was almost guaranteed, especially when ringing or during a
call, before then. Is it the changeover from 2G to 3G, 4G or 5G for phone
calls?

NY wrote:

> the "galloping horses" sound picked up on a car radio as a mobile phone
> polls the base stations or as a base station rings a phone. Same cars,
> same phones, but in the last few years I've never heard galloping horses
> whereas it was almost guaranteed, especially when ringing or during a
> call, before then. Is it the changeover from 2G to 3G, 4G or 5G for
> phone calls?

Yes, that was 2G, the "buzzing"came from the time division multiplexing

On 26/05/2023 13:14, Andy Burns wrote:
> NY wrote:
>
>> the "galloping horses" sound picked up on a car radio as a mobile
>> phone polls the base stations or as a base station rings a phone.
>> Same cars, same phones, but in the last few years I've never heard
>> galloping horses whereas it was almost guaranteed, especially when
>> ringing or during a call, before then. Is it the changeover from 2G
>> to 3G, 4G or 5G for phone calls?
>
> Yes, that was 2G, the "buzzing"came from the time division multiplexing
 Vodafone switched off 3G in my town a couple of months ago.

For a laugh I switched 4G off on the VF SIM in my phone, and for the
first time in years heard the horses coming from my PC speakers :-)

On 26/05/2023 13:29, Mark Carver wrote:
> On 26/05/2023 13:14, Andy Burns wrote:
>> NY wrote:
>>
>>> the "galloping horses" sound picked up on a car radio as a mobile
>>> phone polls the base stations or as a base station rings a phone.
>>> Same cars, same phones, but in the last few years I've never heard
>>> galloping horses whereas it was almost guaranteed, especially when
>>> ringing or during a call, before then. Is it the changeover from 2G
>>> to 3G, 4G or 5G for phone calls?
>>
>> Yes, that was 2G, the "buzzing"came from the time division multiplexing
>  Vodafone switched off 3G in my town a couple of months ago.
>
> For a laugh I switched 4G off on the VF SIM in my phone, and for the
> first time in years heard the horses coming from my PC speakers :-)

Do the various generations of mobile phone use substantially the same
encoding of the signal, but on various different frequency bands? Or is
there something about the way that 2G was encoded which made it
especially likely to cause interference into *baseband* devices (ie not
into the RF stage of a radio). I've had interference into a
CD player and amplifier, which has no radio reception capability, and it
was common in my car radio *even when it was turned off*.

I got an email from Vodafone this week, We are turning off all 3G networks
to use the bandwidth for 4 and 5 G on 1st June.
I am reliably informed that all other operators are doing the same.
Do we know if an old fashioned phone will still work, which ran on the old
GSM standard known more recently as 2G? It was these which made the
galloping ghost sounds as they talked to towers. Most modern phones seem to
just emit a high pitched whine if you get them near some audio equipment, so
one supposes its always checking for the best tower to use.
Brian

--

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"NY" <me@privacy.invalid> wrote in message
news:u4q4q3$3v9qi$1@dont-email.me...
> "Brian Gaff" <brian1gaff@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:u4q3up$3v6dq$1@dont-email.me...
>> My samsung tv has started to send out little chirps every second or so at
>> rf.. You can hear them on most am radios up to about 30 mhz and on the
>> audio feed if you turn the volume up. Does not seem to affect the working
>> of the set, but as its only less than 3 years old it sounds like some
>> screening or decoupling is a bit dodgy. Iyt is not there if you unplug
>> hdmi cables though, ast either end, so I'm guessing these are acting like
>> an aerial as it polls for what is on the other end. I think its a
>> worsening of the issue I mentioned some time ago of ticks on the audio. I
>> feel a contact clean of plugs and sockets is in my future!
>
>
> That reminds me of something I haven't encountered for ages. No, no white
> dogshit (!) but the "galloping horses" sound picked up on a car radio as a
> mobile phone polls the base stations or as a base station rings a phone.
> Same cars, same phones, but in the last few years I've never heard
> galloping horses whereas it was almost guaranteed, especially when ringing
> or during a call, before then. Is it the changeover from 2G to 3G, 4G or
> 5G for phone calls?

Maybe they have to keep all the gsm links running as a fall back then.
Brian

--

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This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
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briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"NY" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:C-qdnTfVK-kHIOz5nZ2dnZfqn_udnZ2d@brightview.co.uk...
> On 26/05/2023 13:29, Mark Carver wrote:
>> On 26/05/2023 13:14, Andy Burns wrote:
>>> NY wrote:
>>>
>>>> the "galloping horses" sound picked up on a car radio as a mobile phone
>>>> polls the base stations or as a base station rings a phone. Same cars,
>>>> same phones, but in the last few years I've never heard galloping
>>>> horses whereas it was almost guaranteed, especially when ringing or
>>>> during a call, before then. Is it the changeover from 2G to 3G, 4G or
>>>> 5G for phone calls?
>>>
>>> Yes, that was 2G, the "buzzing"came from the time division multiplexing
>> Vodafone switched off 3G in my town a couple of months ago.
>>
>> For a laugh I switched 4G off on the VF SIM in my phone, and for the
>> first time in years heard the horses coming from my PC speakers :-)
>
> Do the various generations of mobile phone use substantially the same
> encoding of the signal, but on various different frequency bands? Or is
> there something about the way that 2G was encoded which made it especially
> likely to cause interference into *baseband* devices (ie not into the RF
> stage of a radio). I've had interference into a
> CD player and amplifier, which has no radio reception capability, and it
> was common in my car radio *even when it was turned off*.

On Sat 27/05/2023 09:21, NY wrote:
> On 26/05/2023 13:29, Mark Carver wrote:
>> On 26/05/2023 13:14, Andy Burns wrote:
>>> NY wrote:
>>>
>>>> the "galloping horses" sound picked up on a car radio as a mobile
>>>> phone polls the base stations or as a base station rings a phone.
>>>> Same cars, same phones, but in the last few years I've never heard
>>>> galloping horses whereas it was almost guaranteed, especially when
>>>> ringing or during a call, before then. Is it the changeover from 2G
>>>> to 3G, 4G or 5G for phone calls?
>>>
>>> Yes, that was 2G, the "buzzing"came from the time division multiplexing
>>   Vodafone switched off 3G in my town a couple of months ago.
>>
>> For a laugh I switched 4G off on the VF SIM in my phone, and for the
>> first time in years heard the horses coming from my PC speakers :-)
>
> Do the various generations of mobile phone use substantially the same
> encoding of the signal, but on various different frequency bands? Or is
> there something about the way that 2G was encoded which made it
> especially likely to cause interference into *baseband* devices (ie not
> into the RF stage of a radio). I've had interference into a
> CD player and amplifier, which has no radio reception capability, and it
> was common in my car radio *even when it was turned off*.

2G uses TDMA - time division multiple access - where there are (IMSMC)
eight time slots per channel with one time slot on one channel being
defined as the control time slot for the whole site of that service
provider. Hence as there was a carrier pulsing on and off so the rising
edge cause RFI.

3G used a form of spread-spectrum operation.

4G use OFDMA - orthagonal frequency division multiple access - on
multiple carriers all operating very close to the noise floor so
requiring much less power but capable of much faster data throughput.

In article <u4skr7$cj0f$1@dont-email.me>,
Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:

> 2G uses TDMA -...

I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only. We only
got it in case we needed to call for an ambulance or taxi home if my better
half had a fit/fall. (She has epilepsy.) If so I'l need another cheap phone
that just costs when actually used. Then see if the old 'card' and account
can be moved over to the new phone.

That said, we've been 'confined to barracks' for a couple of years due to
a combination of 'medical' reasons, anyway. So maybe we should simply
inform our landline phone co when they switch off the old system that
we can't call via mobile for a 999, so would rely on the landline.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scots_Guide/intro/electron.htm
biog http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history/ups_and_downs.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

On Sun 28/05/2023 10:08, Jim Lesurf wrote:
> In article <u4skr7$cj0f$1@dont-email.me>,
> Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>> 2G uses TDMA -...
>
> I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only. We only
> got it in case we needed to call for an ambulance or taxi home if my better
> half had a fit/fall. (She has epilepsy.) If so I'l need another cheap phone
> that just costs when actually used. Then see if the old 'card' and account
> can be moved over to the new phone.
>
> That said, we've been 'confined to barracks' for a couple of years due to
> a combination of 'medical' reasons, anyway. So maybe we should simply
> inform our landline phone co when they switch off the old system that
> we can't call via mobile for a 999, so would rely on the landline.
>

Simple answer Jim, get a Doro 6820. This is a clam-shell design
specifically made for those with grey hair and does 2/3/4G. If you
prefer a 'candy bar' version then get the 5860 which is somewhat cheaper.
They all have alarm features, Bluetooth connection for the car, and (by
modern standards) a long battery life.
My wife has one and her late father had one as well and both worked
superbly, in fact my f-in-l's phone is sitting just behind me as I type
but not for sale.

On Sun, 28 May 23 09:08:01 UTC, Jim Lesurf <noise@audiomisc.co.uk>
wrote:

>I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only. We only
>got it in case we needed to call for an ambulance or taxi home if my better
>half had a fit/fall. (She has epilepsy.) If so I'l need another cheap phone
>that just costs when actually used. Then see if the old 'card' and account
>can be moved over to the new phone.

Beware of the 90 day or 180 day "use it or lose it" clause that most
PAYG accounts appear to have. This caught me out once when I checked
my spare emergency phone and found it didn't work. I'm surprised that
this is legal but they all seem to do it. Since then I've used
calendar reminders to ensure that I power it up at the required
intervals and make a one minute call to another phone to incur a small
payment so the system counts it as a live connection. Then I make sure
its battery is charged, switch it off, and put it away till next time.

If your old SIM card is really old it might be physically too large to
fit in a new phone, and might not have the press-out sections that
they generally have now. I think it's possible to get a modern
replacement card with the same number, but the old card would have to
be cancelled to transfer the number, so your phone could be unusable
while you wait for the replacement to arrive. (This wouldn't matter if
you don't need to keep the same number of course - just buy a new SIM
card for the new phone).

I'm not really sure exactly what sort of emergency I had in mind when
I got my spare phone, but it's cheap enough to be prepared. One
scenario I have imagined was of me being carted off to hospital and
telling the ambulance people to grab my spare phone, so I've made sure
it's placed where it would be easy to describe. Also, I chose one of
the Doro phones for this because I wouldn't need to worry about
charging it for a week or two, and nobody would be likely to steal it.

Rod.

In article <th867iho9dn4u2ksfr5hp06rs3s0f6ue0j@4ax.com>,
Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On Sun, 28 May 23 09:08:01 UTC, Jim Lesurf <noise@audiomisc.co.uk>
> wrote:

> >I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only. We only
> >got it in case we needed to call for an ambulance or taxi home if my better
> >half had a fit/fall. (She has epilepsy.) If so I'l need another cheap phone
> >that just costs when actually used. Then see if the old 'card' and account
> >can be moved over to the new phone.

> Beware of the 90 day or 180 day "use it or lose it" clause that most
> PAYG accounts appear to have. This caught me out once when I checked
> my spare emergency phone and found it didn't work. I'm surprised that
> this is legal but they all seem to do it. Since then I've used
> calendar reminders to ensure that I power it up at the required
> intervals and make a one minute call to another phone to incur a small
> payment so the system counts it as a live connection. Then I make sure
> its battery is charged, switch it off, and put it away till next time.

> If your old SIM card is really old it might be physically too large to
> fit in a new phone, and might not have the press-out sections that
> they generally have now. I think it's possible to get a modern
> replacement card with the same number, but the old card would have to
> be cancelled to transfer the number, so your phone could be unusable
> while you wait for the replacement to arrive.

I did the changeover at a Vodafone shop. Only a few minutes delay

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On Sun, 28 May 23 09:08:01 UTC, Jim Lesurf <noise@audiomisc.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only. We only
>> got it in case we needed to call for an ambulance or taxi home if my better
>> half had a fit/fall. (She has epilepsy.) If so I'l need another cheap phone
>> that just costs when actually used. Then see if the old 'card' and account
>> can be moved over to the new phone.
>
> Beware of the 90 day or 180 day "use it or lose it" clause that most
> PAYG accounts appear to have. This caught me out once when I checked
> my spare emergency phone and found it didn't work. I'm surprised that
> this is legal but they all seem to do it. Since then I've used
> calendar reminders to ensure that I power it up at the required
> intervals and make a one minute call to another phone to incur a small
> payment so the system counts it as a live connection. Then I make sure
> its battery is charged, switch it off, and put it away till next time.
>
> If your old SIM card is really old it might be physically too large to
> fit in a new phone, and might not have the press-out sections that
> they generally have now. I think it's possible to get a modern
> replacement card with the same number, but the old card would have to
> be cancelled to transfer the number, so your phone could be unusable
> while you wait for the replacement to arrive. (This wouldn't matter if
> you don't need to keep the same number of course - just buy a new SIM
> card for the new phone).
>
> I'm not really sure exactly what sort of emergency I had in mind when
> I got my spare phone, but it's cheap enough to be prepared. One
> scenario I have imagined was of me being carted off to hospital and
> telling the ambulance people to grab my spare phone, so I've made sure
> it's placed where it would be easy to describe. Also, I chose one of
> the Doro phones for this because I wouldn't need to worry about
> charging it for a week or two, and nobody would be likely to steal it.
>
> Rod.
>

https://www.aa.net.uk/voice-and-mobile/sip2sim/

£2.40/month plus calls. Doesn’t have a use it or lose it clause. Uses o2
network.

On 28/05/2023 12:00, charles wrote:
> In article <th867iho9dn4u2ksfr5hp06rs3s0f6ue0j@4ax.com>,
> Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>> On Sun, 28 May 23 09:08:01 UTC, Jim Lesurf <noise@audiomisc.co.uk>
>> wrote:
>
>>> I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only. We only
>>> got it in case we needed to call for an ambulance or taxi home if my better
>>> half had a fit/fall. (She has epilepsy.) If so I'l need another cheap phone
>>> that just costs when actually used. Then see if the old 'card' and account
>>> can be moved over to the new phone.
>
>> Beware of the 90 day or 180 day "use it or lose it" clause that most
>> PAYG accounts appear to have. This caught me out once when I checked
>> my spare emergency phone and found it didn't work. I'm surprised that
>> this is legal but they all seem to do it. Since then I've used
>> calendar reminders to ensure that I power it up at the required
>> intervals and make a one minute call to another phone to incur a small
>> payment so the system counts it as a live connection. Then I make sure
>> its battery is charged, switch it off, and put it away till next time.
>
>> If your old SIM card is really old it might be physically too large to
>> fit in a new phone, and might not have the press-out sections that
>> they generally have now. I think it's possible to get a modern
>> replacement card with the same number, but the old card would have to
>> be cancelled to transfer the number, so your phone could be unusable
>> while you wait for the replacement to arrive.
>
> I did the changeover at a Vodafone shop. Only a few minutes delay

How long ago was that?

Almost 2 years ago I bought a Xiaomi Redmi Note 10 5G at a Vodafone shop
to replace my 8-years old Huawei. I'd had the old sim with Vodafone for
25 years, and the Xiaomi used only nano sims. I wanted to keep my old
number, so the assistant generated a new nano sim and put it in the
phone. He rang my number and the new phone rang, so everything seemed
fine. But it wasn't. The Xiaomi came with a new sim, and it was almost
impossible to dissociate that number from my Vodafone account. As soon
as I used the phone with my old sim (it is a dual-sim phone) I got a
snotty text from Vodafone that I was using data which had not been paid
for! It took several calls, helpline chats, three visits to the shop,
and a letter to the Vodafone CEO before my account was associated with
my old number. And I've got £4.19 credit I can't use from my old sim on
my current account because Vodafone only allow multiples of £10 to add
to the account!

--

Jeff

Brian Gaff wrote:

> I got an email from Vodafone this week, We are turning off all 3G networks
> to use the bandwidth for 4 and 5 G on 1st June.

They've started the switch-off process already, doing it town by town,
continuing throughout the remainder of the year, it won't all be gone
from June 1st

> I am reliably informed that all other operators are doing the same.

EE and Three will be shutting 3G during 2024, O2 hasn't named any dates
yet, what we do know is that 2G and 3G will all be gone in the UK by end
of 2033

> Do we know if an old fashioned phone will still work, which ran on the old
> GSM standard known more recently as 2G?

That'll be kept for years yet, too many devices such as smart meters
using 2G.

On Sun, 28 May 2023 11:15:17 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
<usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:

>https://www.aa.net.uk/voice-and-mobile/sip2sim/
>
>£2.40/month plus calls. Doesn’t have a use it or lose it clause. Uses o2
>network.

Interesting, and I've bookmarked it to read more carefully later, but
it's not PAYG. It's a regularly paid account, and as far as I know
none of those has a use it or lose it cause.

After a year at 2.40pm I'd have spent more than twice as much as the
amount of PAYG call time on my current emergency phone. This started
at 10ukp and has reduced by a few pence each time I test it, but other
than that it has cost me absolutely nothing for several years.

Rod.

On 28/05/2023 13:27, Andy Burns wrote:
> Brian Gaff wrote:
>>  Do we know if an old fashioned phone will still work, which ran on
>> the old
>> GSM standard known more recently as 2G?
>
> That'll be kept for years yet, too many devices such as smart meters
> using 2G.
>

I have an old transportable lorry drivers mobile phone brick, that is
2G. It still works except needs a new lead-acid battery (or a lithium swap)

I must get it on a number and start retro-posing in an 80s vibe thing.

--
Adrian C

On Sun, 28 May 23 09:08:01 UTC, Jim Lesurf
<noise@audiomisc.co.uk> wrote:

>In article <u4skr7$cj0f$1@dont-email.me>,
> Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>> 2G uses TDMA -...
>
>I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only.

My understanding is that only 3G is being turned off now or in
the near future. Phones which can use 2G, and which phones
can't, are good for a some years.
--
Roger

In article <th867iho9dn4u2ksfr5hp06rs3s0f6ue0j@4ax.com>, Roderick Stewart
<rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On Sun, 28 May 23 09:08:01 UTC, Jim Lesurf <noise@audiomisc.co.uk> wrote:

> >I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only. We
> >only got it in case we needed to call for an ambulance or taxi home if
> >my better half had a fit/fall. (She has epilepsy.) If so I'l need
> >another cheap phone that just costs when actually used. Then see if the
> >old 'card' and account can be moved over to the new phone.

> Beware of the 90 day or 180 day "use it or lose it" clause that most
> PAYG accounts appear to have. This caught me out once when I checked my
> spare emergency phone and found it didn't work. I'm surprised that this
> is legal but they all seem to do it.

We were caught by that in the past. But they restored the connection and
account when I contacted them.

> I'm not really sure exactly what sort of emergency I had in mind when I
> got my spare phone,

In our case the main reason is if my wife has a fit and hurts herself.
Meaning we need a 999. Lesser reason is to call a taxi home if she has a
fit or we need one for some other reason. That said, shops in town know us
so on a shopping trip they're happy to call for us if one is nearby.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scots_Guide/intro/electron.htm
biog http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history/ups_and_downs.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article <u4v86v$qt07$1@dont-email.me>, Woody
<harrogate3@ntlworld.com>
wrote:

> Simple answer Jim, get a Doro 6820. This is a clam-shell design
> specifically made for those with grey hair and does 2/3/4G. If you
> prefer a 'candy bar' version then get the 5860 which is somewhat cheaper.
> They all have alarm features, Bluetooth connection for the car, and (by
> modern standards) a long battery life.

Noted. Ta.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scots_Guide/intro/electron.htm
biog http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history/ups_and_downs.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

"Roger" <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:dj977iluuddn3vte7g14rrd1orqbb2a8ke@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 28 May 23 09:08:01 UTC, Jim Lesurf
> <noise@audiomisc.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>In article <u4skr7$cj0f$1@dont-email.me>,
>> Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>>
>>> 2G uses TDMA -...
>>
>>I'm now wondering if the ancient mobile phone we bought is 2G only.
>
> My understanding is that only 3G is being turned off now or in
> the near future. Phones which can use 2G, and which phones
> can't, are good for a some years.

That is a pain for devices which AFAIK are 3G-only. The early Kindles (the
Kindle Keyboard) came with free 3G for life, so you could download books
from your Kindle account web site, even when you were away from a wifi
network. If I still had one of those Kindles (*) I'd be a bit miffed if the
3G worked perfectly but there was no longer a 3G mobile network for it to
talk to.

Interesting to see how far behind the UK is in the roll-out of 5G. Where I
live, near a few small market towns but nowhere near a larger city, I've
never seen 5G. But when we were on a cruise of the Baltic, every port that
we stopped in had 5G. Also, their mobile reception (though not necessarily
5G) was receivable about 20 miles off the coast, whereas when we were
arriving back in the Channel, we passed about 5 miles off the coast of Dover
and yet no mobile signal was receivable. I wonder whether UK and French
masts close to the coast have to have deliberately reduced off-shore range
to avoid interfering with each other. If so, I wonder how Denmark and Sweden
manage when the sea between them is about the same separation - and in one
place as little as 2 miles.

()*) I traded it in for a newer one when the old one started to have
intermittent spontaneous-rebooting problems.