According to Bloomberg’s Mark Gurman, Apple is expected to roll out the
update that will enable sideloading for iPhone and iPad users in Europe “in
the coming weeks.” Interestingly, Gurman says that due to these changes,
the App Store will be split in two. There will be one version for EU
countries and another for the rest of the world.

The DMA requires Apple to allow developers to distribute their iOS apps
outside the App Store. Third-party apps will also be allowed to use
third-party payment platforms for in-app purchases. The company has been
secretly working to comply with the DMA since last year.

Apple’s VP of Software Craig Federighi acknowledged last year that the
company will have to comply with EU legislation. The deadline for companies
to comply with the DMA legislation is March 7.

https://9to5mac.com/2024/01/15/apple-sideloading-ios-eu-soon/

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 02:00:47 -0000 (UTC), badgolferman wrote:
> The DMA requires Apple to allow developers to distribute their iOS apps
> outside the App Store.

As much as Apple hates anything working outside the walled gulag, slowly
but surely Apple will be forced to allow its customers the common decency
to be able to do what everyone else has been doing for about thirty years.

On 2024-01-16 21:09, Patrick wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 02:00:47 -0000 (UTC), badgolferman wrote:
>> The DMA requires Apple to allow developers to distribute their iOS apps
>> outside the App Store.
>
> As much as Apple hates anything working outside the walled gulag, slowly
> but surely Apple will be forced to allow its customers the common decency
> to be able to do what everyone else has been doing for about thirty years.

Apple is a country club. Has everything outside the club, but to have
what's in the club, need an Apple device.

Clear to you now?

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 09:08:44 -0500, Alan Browne wrote:

> Apple is a country club. Has everything outside the club, but to have
> what's in the club, need an Apple device.

The problem with your assumption of Apple's iOS being an exclusive country
club is that you can't bring your own golf clubs or even your own shoes.

That country club has armed guards and a tall barbed wire Berlin Wall.

Everything you use there has to be purchased at the Apple golf club store.
Nothing works with anything else except what was bought inside that club.

In that way, iOS is much like East Berlin was, before the wall came down.
The good news is regulatory agencies are slowly tearing that wall down.

On 2024-01-17 09:22, Patrick wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 09:08:44 -0500, Alan Browne wrote:
>
>> Apple is a country club.  Has everything outside the club, but to have
>> what's in the club, need an Apple device.
>
> The problem with your assumption of Apple's iOS being an exclusive country
> club is that you can't bring your own golf clubs or even your own shoes.
>
> That country club has armed guards and a tall barbed wire Berlin Wall.
>
> Everything you use there has to be purchased at the Apple golf club store.
> Nothing works with anything else except what was bought inside that club.
>
> In that way, iOS is much like East Berlin was, before the wall came down.
> The good news is regulatory agencies are slowly tearing that wall down.

As to Mac I can download/buy my apps anywhere. And write my own.

As to an appliance like an iPhone I'm delighted that Apple take the
responsibility to host apps and filter them for malware.

You really need to take up a better hobby than niche searching for
reasons to hate Apple. Can't see that it's good for your mental health.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 09:40:37 -0500, Alan Browne wrote:
> As to Mac I can download/buy my apps anywhere.

There's no comparison between the Mac & PC when it comes to software and
hardware choices which is why Apple is like East Germany was in the 50s.

> And write my own.

if you have to write your own apps just to get build a tunnel under that
Berlin Wall just to obtain basic functionality the PC already has
available, then that's an escape-under-the-Berlin-wall problem that you can
solve, but most people can't write apps just to make the Mac do what the PC
already does.

> As to an appliance like an iPhone I'm delighted that Apple take the
> responsibility to host apps and filter them for malware.

The problem all iPhones suffer from is lack of any security - not malware.

> You really need to take up a better hobby than niche searching for
> reasons to hate Apple. Can't see that it's good for your mental health.

You're the one arguing that the barbed wire surrounding your East Berlin
paradise is a good thing. I'm with Reagan. "Tim Cook. Tear down that wall!"

The EU is forcing Apple to take the first step in tearing down that wall.

On 1/16/2024 6:00 PM, badgolferman wrote:
> According to Bloomberg’s Mark Gurman, Apple is expected to roll out the
> update that will enable sideloading for iPhone and iPad users in Europe “in
> the coming weeks.” Interestingly, Gurman says that due to these changes,
> the App Store will be split in two. There will be one version for EU
> countries and another for the rest of the world.
>
> The DMA requires Apple to allow developers to distribute their iOS apps
> outside the App Store. Third-party apps will also be allowed to use
> third-party payment platforms for in-app purchases. The company has been
> secretly working to comply with the DMA since last year.
>
> Apple’s VP of Software Craig Federighi acknowledged last year that the
> company will have to comply with EU legislation. The deadline for companies
> to comply with the DMA legislation is March 7.
>
> https://9to5mac.com/2024/01/15/apple-sideloading-ios-eu-soon/

I wonder how long it will take before someone figures out how to work
around this? If you have an iPhone bought outside of the EU and you take
it to the EU are you able to use the EU app store? If you buy an iPhone
in the EU and bring it to another country are you banned from using the
EU app store?

--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards

On 2024-01-17 15:03, Patrick wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 09:40:37 -0500, Alan Browne wrote:
>> As to Mac I can download/buy my apps anywhere.
>
> There's no comparison between the Mac & PC when it comes to software and
> hardware choices which is why Apple is like East Germany was in the 50s.
>
>> And write my own.
>
> if you have to write your own apps just to get build a tunnel under that
> Berlin Wall just to obtain basic functionality the PC already has
> available, then that's an escape-under-the-Berlin-wall problem that you can
> solve, but most people can't write apps just to make the Mac do what the PC
> already does.

I write my own apps for my own uses, numbskull. And guess what? They
are portable to Windows and Linux with cross or re-compile (I test the
Linux versions a lot, not so much Windows. Useless platform for me).

>> As to an appliance like an iPhone I'm delighted that Apple take the
>> responsibility to host apps and filter them for malware.
>
> The problem all iPhones suffer from is lack of any security - not malware.

ROFL. I hope you're happy in that wet sleeping bag of yours

>
>> You really need to take up a better hobby than niche searching for
>> reasons to hate Apple.  Can't see that it's good for your mental health.
>
> You're the one arguing that the barbed wire surrounding your East Berlin
> paradise is a good thing. I'm with Reagan. "Tim Cook. Tear down that wall!"
>
> The EU is forcing Apple to take the first step in tearing down that wall.

Not really. But, we'll see a shitload of malware on European iPhones in
the future.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2024-01-17 16:31, sms wrote:
> On 1/16/2024 6:00 PM, badgolferman wrote:
>> According to Bloomberg’s Mark Gurman, Apple is expected to roll out the
>> update that will enable sideloading for iPhone and iPad users in
>> Europe “in
>> the coming weeks.” Interestingly, Gurman says that due to these changes,
>> the App Store will be split in two. There will be one version for EU
>> countries and another for the rest of the world.
>>
>> The DMA requires Apple to allow developers to distribute their iOS apps
>> outside the App Store. Third-party apps will also be allowed to use
>> third-party payment platforms for in-app purchases. The company has been
>> secretly working to comply with the DMA since last year.
>>
>> Apple’s VP of Software Craig Federighi acknowledged last year that the
>> company will have to comply with EU legislation. The deadline for
>> companies
>> to comply with the DMA legislation is March 7.
>>
>> https://9to5mac.com/2024/01/15/apple-sideloading-ios-eu-soon/
>
> I wonder how long it will take before someone figures out how to work
> around this? If you have an iPhone bought outside of the EU and you take
> it to the EU are you able to use the EU app store? If you buy an iPhone
> in the EU and bring it to another country are you banned from using the
> EU app store?

Only idiots will sideload and increase their exposure to malware.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 16:45:55 -0500, Alan Browne wrote:
> I write my own apps for my own uses, numbskull.

Notice you first claimed that the only way to get the mac to work is to
write your own apps, and when called out on it, you resort to taunts.

I supply documented references.
You can only respond with taunts.

https://www.sapphire.net/insights/mac-vs-windows/
"Microsoft Windows offers you a greater degree of freedom in terms of
hardware and software customization, and it is available for more devices.
Apple's hardware offerings are not as robust or affordable as Windows PCs"

If you can't respond with cites, I will not respond to your taunts.

> And guess what? They
> are portable to Windows and Linux with cross or re-compile (I test the
> Linux versions a lot, not so much Windows. Useless platform for me).

The fact you write your own apps is meaningless in terms of the fact that
iOS has many times the security holes than Android due to iOS' poor design.

Kaspersky says the poor iOS design makes all the exploits on it even worse.
https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/iphone-illusion-of-security/49145/

>>> As to an appliance like an iPhone I'm delighted that Apple take the
>>> responsibility to host apps and filter them for malware.
>>
>> The problem all iPhones suffer from is lack of any security - not malware.
>
> ROFL. I hope you're happy in that wet sleeping bag of yours

How many more times the number of security holes do you think iOS has?

Even Kaspersky says iOS only offers the mere "illusion of security".
https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/iphone-illusion-of-security/49145/
>>> You really need to take up a better hobby than niche searching for
>>> reasons to hate Apple.� Can't see that it's good for your mental health.
>>
>> You're the one arguing that the barbed wire surrounding your East Berlin
>> paradise is a good thing. I'm with Reagan. "Tim Cook. Tear down that wall!"
>>
>> The EU is forcing Apple to take the first step in tearing down that wall.
>
> Not really. But, we'll see a shitload of malware on European iPhones in
> the future.

While there is malware on both platforms, the amount is miniscule on both
given that both the main app stores are well vetted by Apple/Google.

https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/iphone-illusion-of-security/49145/
"Even Apple's marketplace can no longer be considered impregnable. Our
colleagues recently found a number of scam apps in the App Store which,
under certain conditions, phished personal data from the user. "

There will always be clickbait articles about an app that 5 people
downloaded which was malware - but you can't find any mainstream apps.

On either platform, malwqre isn't the problem.
Security is.

And iOS has had far more zero day holes than Android for years on end.
https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/2021-mobile-security-android-more-vulnerabilities-ios-more-zero-days/

Please respond with meaningful cites. Not taunts. TIA

On 2024-01-17 17:25, Patrick wrote:
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 16:45:55 -0500, Alan Browne wrote:
>> I write my own apps for my own uses, numbskull.
>
> Notice you first claimed that the only way to get the mac to work is to
> write your own apps, and when called out on it, you resort to taunts.
>

I never claimed it was the only way to get my Macs to work, I said it is
a nice thing that is sooooooooo easy to do for both work and home
projects.

Do read for comprehension next time. Take the time to do so.

> I supply documented references.

Go ahead.

> You can only respond with taunts.
>
> https://www.sapphire.net/insights/mac-vs-windows/
> "Microsoft Windows offers you a greater degree of freedom in terms of
> hardware and software customization, and it is available for more devices.
> Apple's hardware offerings are not as robust or affordable as Windows PCs"

Cheery picked as always, but I'll grant that Apple products are more
expensive. OTOH, I run them a long, long time - including the iMac here
that is from 2012 that is now in a secondary role (supporting my last
surviving WinXP ironically under a hypervisor - 2024 will see the end of
that...)

>
> If you can't respond with cites, I will not respond to your taunts.

If you think you're worth much more than my replies here, you have
delusions of adequacy you need to look into.

>
>> And guess what?  They are portable to Windows and Linux with cross or
>> re-compile (I test the Linux versions a lot, not so much Windows.
>> Useless platform for me).
>
> The fact you write your own apps is meaningless in terms of the fact that
> iOS has many times the security holes than Android due to iOS' poor design.

Not at all. Android security holes pop up all of the item.

>
> Kaspersky says the poor iOS design makes all the exploits on it even worse.
> https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/iphone-illusion-of-security/49145/

An advert from a malware protection co.? surely even you can do better.

>
>>>> As to an appliance like an iPhone I'm delighted that Apple take the
>>>> responsibility to host apps and filter them for malware.
>>>
>>> The problem all iPhones suffer from is lack of any security - not
>>> malware.
>>
>> ROFL.  I hope you're happy in that wet sleeping bag of yours
>
> How many more times the number of security holes do you think iOS has?
>
> Even Kaspersky says iOS only offers the mere "illusion of security".
> https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/iphone-illusion-of-security/49145/

Yes, adversarial advertising is so honest!

>
>>>> You really need to take up a better hobby than niche searching for
>>>> reasons to hate Apple.  Can't see that it's good for your mental
>>>> health.
>>>
>>> You're the one arguing that the barbed wire surrounding your East Berlin
>>> paradise is a good thing. I'm with Reagan. "Tim Cook. Tear down that
>>> wall!"
>>>
>>> The EU is forcing Apple to take the first step in tearing down that
>>> wall.
>>
>> Not really.  But, we'll see a shitload of malware on European iPhones
>> in the future.
>
> While there is malware on both platforms, the amount is miniscule on both
> given that both the main app stores are well vetted by Apple/Google.
>
> https://www.kaspersky.com/blog/iphone-illusion-of-security/49145/
> "Even Apple's marketplace can no longer be considered impregnable. Our
> colleagues recently found a number of scam apps in the App Store which,
> under certain conditions, phished personal data from the user. "
>
> There will always be clickbait articles about an app that 5 people
> downloaded which was malware - but you can't find any mainstream apps.
>
> On either platform, malwqre isn't the problem.
> Security is.
>
> And iOS has had far more zero day holes than Android for years on end.
> https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/security/2021-mobile-security-android-more-vulnerabilities-ios-more-zero-days/
>
> Please respond with meaningful cites. Not taunts. TIA

Not wasting my time on you - deal with your own problems (pro tip: you
have many).

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.