Apple throwing the higher end processors at laptops and only the M3 at
the iMac is a bit off putting.

My theory is that Apple not only make more margin on laptops, esp.
higher spec., but that iMac users tend to keep their Macs for a longer
period so Apple don't get that sweet, sweet turnover margin from iMac-ers.

This was nudged at in the iMac portion of the presentation where John
Ternus states to the effect: "Those of you with intel based iMacs will
see a [insert reality distortion field terms here] improvement..."

IOW, you iMac users are just not keeping up! Get a move on!

So we're presented with the base chip and a contained memory range.

Written on an 11 year old iMac ...

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

Am 31.10.23 um 15:06 schrieb Alan Browne:
>
> Apple throwing the higher end processors at laptops and only the M3 at
> the iMac is a bit off putting.
>
> My theory is that Apple not only make more margin on laptops, esp.
> higher spec., but that iMac users tend to keep their Macs for a longer
> period so Apple don't get that sweet, sweet turnover margin from iMac-ers.
>
> This was nudged at in the iMac portion of the presentation where John
> Ternus states to the effect: "Those of you with intel based iMacs will
> see a [insert reality distortion field terms here] improvement..."
>
> IOW, you iMac users are just not keeping up! Get a move on!
>
> So we're presented with the base chip and a contained memory range.
>
> Written on an 11 year old iMac ...

If you can handle your daily work with such an old machine why do you
care at all?

--
Alea icacta est

On 2023-10-31 11:38, Jörg Lorenz wrote:
> Am 31.10.23 um 15:06 schrieb Alan Browne:
>>
>> Apple throwing the higher end processors at laptops and only the M3 at
>> the iMac is a bit off putting.
>>
>> My theory is that Apple not only make more margin on laptops, esp.
>> higher spec., but that iMac users tend to keep their Macs for a longer
>> period so Apple don't get that sweet, sweet turnover margin from
>> iMac-ers.
>>
>> This was nudged at in the iMac portion of the presentation where John
>> Ternus states to the effect: "Those of you with intel based iMacs will
>> see a [insert reality distortion field terms here] improvement..."
>>
>> IOW, you iMac users are just not keeping up!  Get a move on!
>>
>> So we're presented with the base chip and a contained memory range.
>>
>> Written on an 11 year old iMac ...
>
> If you can handle your daily work with such an old machine why do you
> care at all?

I also edit and render video - which at 720 is passably fast, 1080 is a
slog, and anything higher is terribly slow or not even feasible.

I've wanted to update since the M1 came out, but also would never buy a
first flight processor. (My SO has it on her Macbook Air and it is fine
for her use which at most goes to photo edits and doc edits).

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On Oct 31, 2023 at 10:05:42 AM PDT, "Alan Browne" <bitbucket@blackhole.com>
wrote:

> On 2023-10-31 11:38, Jörg Lorenz wrote:
>> Am 31.10.23 um 15:06 schrieb Alan Browne:
>>>
>>> Apple throwing the higher end processors at laptops and only the M3 at
>>> the iMac is a bit off putting.
>>>
>>> My theory is that Apple not only make more margin on laptops, esp.
>>> higher spec., but that iMac users tend to keep their Macs for a longer
>>> period so Apple don't get that sweet, sweet turnover margin from
>>> iMac-ers.
>>>
>>> This was nudged at in the iMac portion of the presentation where John
>>> Ternus states to the effect: "Those of you with intel based iMacs will
>>> see a [insert reality distortion field terms here] improvement..."
>>>
>>> IOW, you iMac users are just not keeping up! Get a move on!
>>>
>>> So we're presented with the base chip and a contained memory range.
>>>
>>> Written on an 11 year old iMac ...
>>
>> If you can handle your daily work with such an old machine why do you
>> care at all?
>
> I also edit and render video - which at 720 is passably fast, 1080 is a
> slog, and anything higher is terribly slow or not even feasible.
>
> I've wanted to update since the M1 came out, but also would never buy a
> first flight processor. (My SO has it on her Macbook Air and it is fine
> for her use which at most goes to photo edits and doc edits).

Are the programs you use for this kind of processing silicon ready. If so, I
would think that reduced even with reduced RAM you'll have significantly more
efficient processing.

Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> writes:

> Apple throwing the higher end processors at laptops and only the M3 at
> the iMac is a bit off putting.
>
> My theory is that Apple not only make more margin on laptops,
> esp. higher spec., but that iMac users tend to keep their Macs for a
> longer period so Apple don't get that sweet, sweet turnover margin
> from iMac-ers.
>
> This was nudged at in the iMac portion of the presentation where John
> Ternus states to the effect: "Those of you with intel based iMacs will
> see a [insert reality distortion field terms here] improvement..."
>
> IOW, you iMac users are just not keeping up! Get a move on!
>
> So we're presented with the base chip and a contained memory range.
>
> Written on an 11 year old iMac ...

I don't have any info on the relative profit margins for Apple's various
products, so I can't speculate in that regard.

I do think it's possible that some of Apple's products are kept longer
by its customers. I'd think that those with batteries tend to get
replaced more frequently since battery replacements can be expensive and
involve some amount of hassle and perhaps even risk. It can seem like it
might just be better to get a new Mac with all the latest goodness.

I'd say that it's also possible that the typical iMac user is different
than the typical user of things like the Macbook Pro. Perhaps the users
of higher-end Macs tend to buy an MBP or maybe a Studio?

I don't remember how well the iMac Pro sold. However, I also don't
really remember hearing a lot about it - I heard more about the MBP for
professional use, and then a lot of argument about the Mac Pro and
whether it was worth the price or not. :-)

I would tend to think that, if a reasonable market existed for an iMac
with one of the upper-end CPUs, 48GB RAM, etc. that Apple would sell
them. I suppose they could just be nudging people towards a MBP or
Studio instead...

On 2023-10-31 22:40, gtr wrote:
> On Oct 31, 2023 at 10:05:42 AM PDT, "Alan Browne" <bitbucket@blackhole.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-10-31 11:38, Jörg Lorenz wrote:
>>> Am 31.10.23 um 15:06 schrieb Alan Browne:
>>>>
>>>> Apple throwing the higher end processors at laptops and only the M3 at
>>>> the iMac is a bit off putting.
>>>>
>>>> My theory is that Apple not only make more margin on laptops, esp.
>>>> higher spec., but that iMac users tend to keep their Macs for a longer
>>>> period so Apple don't get that sweet, sweet turnover margin from
>>>> iMac-ers.
>>>>
>>>> This was nudged at in the iMac portion of the presentation where John
>>>> Ternus states to the effect: "Those of you with intel based iMacs will
>>>> see a [insert reality distortion field terms here] improvement..."
>>>>
>>>> IOW, you iMac users are just not keeping up! Get a move on!
>>>>
>>>> So we're presented with the base chip and a contained memory range.
>>>>
>>>> Written on an 11 year old iMac ...
>>>
>>> If you can handle your daily work with such an old machine why do you
>>> care at all?
>>
>> I also edit and render video - which at 720 is passably fast, 1080 is a
>> slog, and anything higher is terribly slow or not even feasible.
>>
>> I've wanted to update since the M1 came out, but also would never buy a
>> first flight processor. (My SO has it on her Macbook Air and it is fine
>> for her use which at most goes to photo edits and doc edits).
>
> Are the programs you use for this kind of processing silicon ready. If so, I

If you mean Apple Silicon ready, yes (Final Cut Pro, Adobe Premiere
Pro). DaVinci Resolve uses Rosetta (as far as I can tell) but will
eventually be Apple Si compatible.

> would think that reduced even with reduced RAM you'll have significantly more
> efficient processing.

Compared to this iMac? Absolutely. I just wanted more cores than the
M3 and more display options would have been nice (if not really needed).

32 GB was my "wish" size. But the M3 iMac tops out at 24.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2023-11-01 07:10, Bud Frede wrote:
> Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> writes:
>
>> Apple throwing the higher end processors at laptops and only the M3 at
>> the iMac is a bit off putting.
>>
>> My theory is that Apple not only make more margin on laptops,
>> esp. higher spec., but that iMac users tend to keep their Macs for a
>> longer period so Apple don't get that sweet, sweet turnover margin
>> from iMac-ers.
>>
>> This was nudged at in the iMac portion of the presentation where John
>> Ternus states to the effect: "Those of you with intel based iMacs will
>> see a [insert reality distortion field terms here] improvement..."
>>
>> IOW, you iMac users are just not keeping up! Get a move on!
>>
>> So we're presented with the base chip and a contained memory range.
>>
>> Written on an 11 year old iMac ...
>
>
> I don't have any info on the relative profit margins for Apple's various
> products, so I can't speculate in that regard.

Apple margins are monstrous compared to industry peers. GM's north of
30%. This used to be very easy to suss out of the quarterly reports,
but they've "zoomed out" on a lot of detail so GM is across the co.
rather than particular product groupings.

> I do think it's possible that some of Apple's products are kept longer
> by its customers. I'd think that those with batteries tend to get
> replaced more frequently since battery replacements can be expensive and
> involve some amount of hassle and perhaps even risk. It can seem like it
> might just be better to get a new Mac with all the latest goodness.

Battery changes on Apple products range from almost trivial (most
laptops) to user doable with effort (other laptops, phones, iPads) to
better take it to a shop (Watch). I haven't found a shop that will do
AirPods yet - but there is evidence that it is doable. Not something I
would attempt. I repair a lot of things, but soldering at that level is
not for me.
A local shop does the Watch battery for CAD$99.

> I'd say that it's also possible that the typical iMac user is different
> than the typical user of things like the Macbook Pro. Perhaps the users
> of higher-end Macs tend to buy an MBP or maybe a Studio?

Depends on needs. Creatives who move around obviously need a laptop;
heavy video editing is best done on a devoted work station (Studio or a
high end Mac Mini or for the masochists, the Mac Pro). That said I like
iMacs that are well loaded - and the M3 is not "it". But - I'm at the
end of my patience and it is still head and shoulders better than this
i7 iMac.

> I don't remember how well the iMac Pro sold. However, I also don't
> really remember hearing a lot about it - I heard more about the MBP for
> professional use, and then a lot of argument about the Mac Pro and
> whether it was worth the price or not. :-)

A graphics co. who does work for us had a sole iMac Pro (the owner), the
other designers had high end iMacs or laptops.

>
> I would tend to think that, if a reasonable market existed for an iMac
> with one of the upper-end CPUs, 48GB RAM, etc. that Apple would sell
> them. I suppose they could just be nudging people towards a MBP or
> Studio instead...

Absolutely - no telling why they didn't roll out a Pro/Max for the iMac
at this time ... but there it is.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2023-11-01 11:10:31 +0000, Bud Frede said:

> Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> writes:
>
>> Apple throwing the higher end processors at laptops and only the M3 at
>> the iMac is a bit off putting.
>>
>> My theory is that Apple not only make more margin on laptops,
>> esp. higher spec., but that iMac users tend to keep their Macs for a
>> longer period so Apple don't get that sweet, sweet turnover margin
>> from iMac-ers.
>>
>> This was nudged at in the iMac portion of the presentation where John
>> Ternus states to the effect: "Those of you with intel based iMacs will
>> see a [insert reality distortion field terms here] improvement..."
>>
>> IOW, you iMac users are just not keeping up! Get a move on!
>>
>> So we're presented with the base chip and a contained memory range.
>>
>> Written on an 11 year old iMac ...
>
> I don't have any info on the relative profit margins for Apple's various
> products, so I can't speculate in that regard.
>
> I do think it's possible that some of Apple's products are kept longer
> by its customers. I'd think that those with batteries tend to get
> replaced more frequently since battery replacements can be expensive and
> involve some amount of hassle and perhaps even risk. It can seem like it
> might just be better to get a new Mac with all the latest goodness.
>
> I'd say that it's also possible that the typical iMac user is different
> than the typical user of things like the Macbook Pro. Perhaps the users
> of higher-end Macs tend to buy an MBP or maybe a Studio?
>
> I don't remember how well the iMac Pro sold. However, I also don't
> really remember hearing a lot about it - I heard more about the MBP for
> professional use, and then a lot of argument about the Mac Pro and
> whether it was worth the price or not. :-)
>
> I would tend to think that, if a reasonable market existed for an iMac
> with one of the upper-end CPUs, 48GB RAM, etc. that Apple would sell
> them. I suppose they could just be nudging people towards a MBP or
> Studio instead...

Part of the problem is that laptops have become the "must have" fashion
fad item over about the last 10 years, even when many people don't ever
move them from the one desk permanently plugged into the wall socket,
and often also plugged into a bigger display! That fad means laptops
are currently selling better than desktops to the more money than sense
brigade who insist on being "on trend" (they would be much better off
buying a cheaper or more powerful desktop computer instead).

Where my mother works, a few of years ago they replaced all the Windoze
desktop computer with Windoze laptops. Pointlessly expensive since most
of the computers don't get moved.

Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

[...]

> Part of the problem is that laptops have become the "must have" fashion
> fad item over about the last 10 years, even when many people don't ever
> move them from the one desk permanently plugged into the wall socket,
> and often also plugged into a bigger display! That fad means laptops
> are currently selling better than desktops to the more money than sense
> brigade who insist on being "on trend" (they would be much better off
> buying a cheaper or more powerful desktop computer instead).

[...]

OTOH laptops are very powerful now, portable, dockable for accessories
(inc. displays) and you don't need a UPS. Besides, they're ~shiny!~

--
^Ï^. Sn!pe, PA, FIBS - Professional Crastinator.
My pet rock Gordon just is.

No Google Groups articles seen unless poster is whitelisted.

On 2023-11-01 18:23, Your Name wrote:

>
> Part of the problem is that laptops have become the "must have" fashion
> fad item over about the last 10 years, even when many people don't ever

I don't have a laptop anymore - only had one when mobility was a
requirement, even if only a dozen times per year. (And where I used to
work - I traveled a lot).

It was never a "fashion thing".

> move them from the one desk permanently plugged into the wall socket,
> and often also plugged into a bigger display! That fad means laptops are
> currently selling better than desktops to the more money than sense
> brigade who insist on being "on trend" (they would be much better off
> buying a cheaper or more powerful desktop computer instead).

Those I know who have laptops are frequent travelers. Some have both a
desktop and a laptop and only use the latter when on the move. Often
they have a business laptop and a personal desktop.

An exception, is I have a company laptop at home that is a backup
operating post for my company.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.