EISNER will be moving again soon---as in this week, if all goes well.

In fact, the system is being replaced. VSI has hosted the physical
system for the past few years, but Process Software will be taking over
hosting, and the machine is being replaced by a vtAlpha system, thanks
to AVT and Vere Technologies, who generously donated a license for the
system.

With Rob's help, we transferred the contents of all of the disks
yesterday, and I now have virtual EISNER up and running in-house. We
still have some networking work to do before we can switch the systems,
and I'll need to re-transfer the user disks next week to pick up files
created or modified since yesterday.

Whichever day this happens, I plan to shut down access to EISNER while
we move the data and change the DNS entries. Hopefully, access to the
system will only be down for a few hours, whichever day that is.

More info later this week!

Hunter

In article <uril3c$2m8au$1@dont-email.me>,
Hunter Goatley <goathunter@goatley.com> wrote:
>EISNER will be moving again soon---as in this week, if all goes well.
>
>In fact, the system is being replaced. VSI has hosted the physical
>system for the past few years, but Process Software will be taking over
>hosting, and the machine is being replaced by a vtAlpha system, thanks
>to AVT and Vere Technologies, who generously donated a license for the
>system.
>
>With Rob's help, we transferred the contents of all of the disks
>yesterday, and I now have virtual EISNER up and running in-house. We
>still have some networking work to do before we can switch the systems,
>and I'll need to re-transfer the user disks next week to pick up files
>created or modified since yesterday.
>
>Whichever day this happens, I plan to shut down access to EISNER while
>we move the data and change the DNS entries. Hopefully, access to the
>system will only be down for a few hours, whichever day that is.
>
>More info later this week!

Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

- Dan C.
Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

- Dan C.
Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

- Dan C.
Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

- Dan C.
Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

- Dan C.
Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

- Dan C.
Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

- Dan C.
Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

- Dan C.

In article <uriuf2$iv6$1@reader1.panix.com>,
Dan Cross <cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net> wrote:
>In article <uril3c$2m8au$1@dont-email.me>,
>Hunter Goatley <goathunter@goatley.com> wrote:
>>EISNER will be moving again soon---as in this week, if all goes well.
>>
>>In fact, the system is being replaced. VSI has hosted the physical
>>system for the past few years, but Process Software will be taking over
>>hosting, and the machine is being replaced by a vtAlpha system, thanks
>>to AVT and Vere Technologies, who generously donated a license for the
>>system.
>>
>>With Rob's help, we transferred the contents of all of the disks
>>yesterday, and I now have virtual EISNER up and running in-house. We
>>still have some networking work to do before we can switch the systems,
>>and I'll need to re-transfer the user disks next week to pick up files
>>created or modified since yesterday.
>>
>>Whichever day this happens, I plan to shut down access to EISNER while
>>we move the data and change the DNS entries. Hopefully, access to the
>>system will only be down for a few hours, whichever day that is.
>>
>>More info later this week!
>
>Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> - Dan C.
>Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> - Dan C.
>Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> - Dan C.
>Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> - Dan C.
>Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> - Dan C.
>Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> - Dan C.
>Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> - Dan C.
>Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> - Dan C.
>

(Oops. Dunno what happened here.... I assume I hit the
wrong button. :-/)

- Dan C.

On 2/26/2024 4:05 PM, Dan Cross wrote:
> In article <uril3c$2m8au$1@dont-email.me>,
> Hunter Goatley <goathunter@goatley.com> wrote:
>> EISNER will be moving again soon---as in this week, if all goes well.
>>
>> In fact, the system is being replaced. VSI has hosted the physical
>> system for the past few years, but Process Software will be taking over
>> hosting, and the machine is being replaced by a vtAlpha system, thanks
>> to AVT and Vere Technologies, who generously donated a license for the
>> system.
>>
>> With Rob's help, we transferred the contents of all of the disks
>> yesterday, and I now have virtual EISNER up and running in-house. We
>> still have some networking work to do before we can switch the systems,
>> and I'll need to re-transfer the user disks next week to pick up files
>> created or modified since yesterday.
>>
>> Whichever day this happens, I plan to shut down access to EISNER while
>> we move the data and change the DNS entries. Hopefully, access to the
>> system will only be down for a few hours, whichever day that is.
>
> Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?

Probably some software not available on x86-64 (or Itanium
since it is Alpha).

Notes maybe.

Arne

On 2024-02-26, Arne Vajhøj <arne@vajhoej.dk> wrote:
>
> Probably some software not available on x86-64 (or Itanium
> since it is Alpha).
>
> Notes maybe.
>

And BASIC.

And TECO (if anyone is still using it. :-) )

And all the various Alpha binaries that people either have or are part
of the various additional tools installed on Eisner.

Simon.

--
Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
Walking destinations on a map are further away than they appear.

On 2/26/2024 7:08 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>
>> Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>
> Probably some software not available on x86-64 (or Itanium
> since it is Alpha).
>
> Notes maybe.

Yes, NOTES is the primary reason. AFAIK, NOTES was never available for
I64 and isn't available for X86.

Hunter

On 2/27/2024 9:08 AM, Hunter Goatley wrote:
> On 2/26/2024 7:08 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> >
> >> Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
> >
> > Probably some software not available on x86-64 (or Itanium
> > since it is Alpha).
> >
> > Notes maybe.
>
> Yes, NOTES is the primary reason. AFAIK, NOTES was never available for I64 and isn't available for X86.

Notes is available on IA64; still under development on X86 -- hasn't risen to the top of anyone's priority list yet.

--
-- Rob

In article <urks9e$38i4d$1@dont-email.me>,
Robert A. Brooks <FIRST.LAST@vmssoftware.com> wrote:
>On 2/27/2024 9:08 AM, Hunter Goatley wrote:
>> On 2/26/2024 7:08 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>> >
>> >> Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>> >
>> > Probably some software not available on x86-64 (or Itanium
>> > since it is Alpha).
>> >
>> > Notes maybe.
>>
>> Yes, NOTES is the primary reason. AFAIK, NOTES was never available for I64 and isn't available for X86.
>
>Notes is available on IA64; still under development on X86 -- hasn't risen to the top of anyone's priority list yet.

Thanks for confirming. I'm happy to hear that it's at
least on the radar; Notes is very nice.

- Dan C.

On 2/27/2024 9:40 AM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
>
> Notes is available on IA64; still under development on X86 -- hasn't
> risen to the top of anyone's priority list yet.
>
Good to know! Thanks.

Hunter

On 2/27/2024 9:40 AM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
> On 2/27/2024 9:08 AM, Hunter Goatley wrote:
>> On 2/26/2024 7:08 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>>  >
>>  >> Purely out of curiosity, why not host it on x86?
>>  >
>>  > Probably some software not available on x86-64 (or Itanium
>>  > since it is Alpha).
>>  >
>>  > Notes maybe.
>>
>> Yes, NOTES is the primary reason. AFAIK, NOTES was never available for
>> I64 and isn't available for X86.
>
> Notes is available on IA64;

In final?

Freeware CD 7.0 has:
* 2.5 for VAX and Alpha
* 2.6 Field Test for Alpha and Itanium

> still under development on X86 -- hasn't
> risen to the top of anyone's priority list yet.

Probably never will.

I consider the VT version obsolete for 30 years and the
DECWindows/MSWindows version obsolete for 20 years.

Arne

On 2/27/2024 3:20 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> On 2/27/2024 9:40 AM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:

>> Notes is available on IA64;
>
> In final?

I suspect there is little difference between the IA64 FT version and
a final version.

> Freeware CD 7.0 has:
> * 2.5 for VAX and Alpha
> * 2.6 Field Test for Alpha and Itanium
>
>> still under development on X86 -- hasn't risen to the top of anyone's priority list yet.
>
> Probably never will.
>
> I consider the VT version obsolete for 30 years and the
> DECWindows/MSWindows version obsolete for 20 years.

We rely on Notes as part of the source management system, so yeah, it'll get done.

--
-- Rob

On 2/27/2024 5:21 PM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
> On 2/27/2024 3:20 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>> On 2/27/2024 9:40 AM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
>>> Notes is available on IA64;
>>
>> In final?
>
> I suspect there is little difference between the IA64 FT version and
> a final version.

I believe that.

No bug reports and FT becomes final.

>> Freeware CD 7.0 has:
>> * 2.5 for VAX and Alpha
>> * 2.6 Field Test for Alpha and Itanium
>>
>>> still under development on X86 -- hasn't risen to the top of anyone's
>>> priority list yet.
>>
>> Probably never will.
>>
>> I consider the VT version obsolete for 30 years and the
>> DECWindows/MSWindows version obsolete for 20 years.
>
> We rely on Notes as part of the source management system, so yeah, it'll
> get done.

Are you at liberty to elaborate on that?

Just curious. Notes is a conference system and it is not
obvious to me how it related to source control.

Arne

On Tue, 27 Feb 2024 18:54:22 -0500, Arne Vajhøj wrote:

> Notes is a conference system and it is not obvious to me
> how it related to source control.

Bug tracker? Patch submissions? Todo lists? General feature discussion?

I just hope they are using some non-crap source-management system ...

On 2/27/2024 6:54 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> On 2/27/2024 5:21 PM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
>> On 2/27/2024 3:20 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:

>>> I consider the VT version obsolete for 30 years and the
>>> DECWindows/MSWindows version obsolete for 20 years.
>>
>> We rely on Notes as part of the source management system, so yeah, it'll get
>> done.
>
> Are you at liberty to elaborate on that?
>
> Just curious. Notes is a conference system and it is not
> obvious to me how it related to source control.

We use CMS for source control. There is an Rdb-driven front end that provides
things that CMS does not, like the concept of sequential streams, and automatic
propagation through the streams. For the most part, this system works well for us.

Notes is used to contain detailed information regarding a source checking.

Depending upon the complexity of the change, the detail can be a few pages.

That, of course, is in addition to the verbose edit history that most of our
compilation units contain. When VSI started in 2014, it was very useful for me
to review stuff I'd written 10+ years before, to remind myself about how certain
areas of the code worked, and why things were done in non-obvious ways.

--

--- Rob

On 2/28/2024 11:05 PM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
> On 2/27/2024 6:54 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>> On 2/27/2024 5:21 PM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
>>> On 2/27/2024 3:20 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>
>>>> I consider the VT version obsolete for 30 years and the
>>>> DECWindows/MSWindows version obsolete for 20 years.
>>>
>>> We rely on Notes as part of the source management system, so yeah,
>>> it'll get done.
>>
>> Are you at liberty to elaborate on that?
>>
>> Just curious. Notes is a conference system and it is not
>> obvious to me how it related to source control.
>
> We use CMS for source control.  There is an Rdb-driven front end that
> provides
> things that CMS does not, like the concept of sequential streams, and
> automatic propagation through the streams.  For the most part, this
> system works well for us.

That is the VDE thing available here:

https://www.digiater.nl/openvms/freeware/v70/vde/
https://www.digiater.nl/openvms/freeware/v40/vde/

?

> Notes is used to contain detailed information regarding a source checking.
>
> Depending upon the complexity of the change, the detail can be a few pages.

So sort of like a NoSQL text database with revision information?

UI based or API based?

(yes - I am a nosy person)

Arne

On 2/26/2024 1:25 PM, Hunter Goatley wrote:
> EISNER will be moving again soon---as in this week, if all goes well.
>
> In fact, the system is being replaced. VSI has hosted the physical
> system for the past few years, but Process Software will be taking over
> hosting, and the machine is being replaced by a vtAlpha system, thanks
> to AVT and Vere Technologies, who generously donated a license for the
> system.

It took longer than I anticipated, but EISNER has been moved from
VSI to Process Software, thanks to the vtAlpha license provided by
AVT and Vere Technologies.

I think everything is working as expected, but if you see any
problems, just send email to GOATLEY on EISNER.

Hunter
------
Hunter Goatley, Process Software, https://www.process.com/
goathunter@goatley.com