Running two computers at once.

It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
up.

To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
what am I to do?

I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
both so easily .

micky wrote:
> Running two computers at once.
>
> It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
> desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
> up.
>
> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
> need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
> computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
> because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
> USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
> but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
> what am I to do?
>
> I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
> both so easily .

The KVM switches I used to use were pretty unreliable. I eventually
replaced them with a TV that had 3 HDMI inputs, and which I still use.
The PC boxes sit underneath, HDMI cables lead from them into the TV, a
remote control switches through HDMI 1, 2 ,3.

Ed

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 14:10:35 -0500, micky
<NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

>Running two computers at once.
>
>It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
>up.
>
>To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
>need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
>computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
>because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
>USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
>but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both?

Well, I think I answered my own first question by looking at the Q&A in
Amazon. The 4-port I was looking at by MT-VIKI apparently carries both
mouse and keyboard on their special HDMI to HDMI/USB cable. Is that
going to require any feature in my laptop or desktop which they don't
have, since both are old? Or can just about anything receive a merged
mouse/keyboard USB signal?

But people have complained about flashing on the screen when changing
pcs and there is even a user video about it. (One reason Amazon is
popular. It's a 3rd party and it lets people criticize the product.)

BTW, a few months ago, Amazon went from showing the Q&A to making you
ask a question first, even when there are only a few questions already.

It took me longer than it should have but putting in one letter, like an
a, will give you a look at every question that includes the letter or
maybe the word a.

> So
>what am I to do?
>
>I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
>both so easily .

I don't really have room for a 3rd monitor but the current one and a
laptop fit fine.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 14:57:53 -0500, micky
<NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

>
>BTW, a few months ago, Amazon went from showing the Q&A to making you
>ask a question first, even when there are only a few questions already.
>
>It took me longer than it should have but putting in one letter, like an
>a, will give you a look at every question that includes the letter or
>maybe the word a.

This doesnt' work as well as it seemed to the first time.

Also amazon has started this annoying summary of rreviews using "AI". I
will ignore that and read what people say in their own words.

Mickey,

> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to
> PC, I need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more
> than 2 computers all have HDMI outputs.

I also use a KVM, and the last one I bought is now ... just over a year old
and has SVGA input and USB keyboard and mouse. Than again, its an 8-port
one and not really ment for the home market.

The one before that was a D-Link 4-port DKVM-4U (which uses standard SVGA
and USB cables).

https://me.dlink.com/en/consumer/products/accessories/kvm-switches/dkvm-4u

I'm not sure if you can still get it though. New I mean. You might try
Amazon and its ilk for a second-hand one.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser

micky wrote:
> Running two computers at once.
>
> It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
> desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
> up.
>
> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
> need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
> computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
> because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
> USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
> but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
> what am I to do?
>
> I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
> both so easily .
>

I have several old (probably 15 years old) KVM switches in a cupboard
somewhere. You would be welcome to them. Where are you? I'm near
Thetford in Norfolk.

--
Graham J

On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 14:10:35 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

>Running two computers at once.
>
>It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
>up.
>
>To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
>need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
>computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
>because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
>USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
>but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
>what am I to do?
>
>I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
>both so easily .

If either of your PCs can support Remote Desktop (RDP), I would 100% recommend
that approach over a KVM. I had two KVM switches a long time ago, but they've
both gone to Goodwill. Good riddance.

With a KVM, you normally have to switch to the PC that you want to use, but with
RDP you simply click in a window, or if the 2nd PC is running full screen, just
click anywhere in that screen. It's so much faster, easier, and convenient.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 15:36:29 -0600, Char
Jackson <none@none.invalid> wrote:

>On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 14:10:35 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
>
>>Running two computers at once.
>>
>>It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>>desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
>>up.
>>
>>To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
>>need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
>>computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
>>because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
>>USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
>>but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
>>what am I to do?
>>
>>I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
>>both so easily .
>
>If either of your PCs can support Remote Desktop (RDP), I would 100% recommend
>that approach over a KVM. I had two KVM switches a long time ago, but they've
>both gone to Goodwill. Good riddance.
>
>With a KVM, you normally have to switch to the PC that you want to use, but with
>RDP you simply click in a window, or if the 2nd PC is running full screen, just
>click anywhere in that screen. It's so much faster, easier, and convenient.

You folks have given me a lot to think about. I had planned to cut out
thinking when I retired. This is like joining a gym after years of
lethargy. I will look into RDP and, David,synergy.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 21:20:25 +0000, Graham J
<nobody@nowhere.co.uk> wrote:

>micky wrote:
>> Running two computers at once.
>>
>> It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>> desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
>> up.
>>
>> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
>> need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
>> computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
>> because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
>> USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
>> but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
>> what am I to do?
>>
>> I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
>> both so easily .
>>
>
>I have several old (probably 15 years old) KVM switches in a cupboard
>somewhere. You would be welcome to them. Where are you? I'm near
>Thetford in Norfolk.

I'm in Baltimore but I was in Norfolk about 2 months ago. I went to the
zoo. Before that I went to Jamestown and the American Revolution
Museum and the Yorktown Battlefield, and then I didn't even know abou
tit but I was driving by the Virginia War Museum and I stopped there
too. Had a very good time. Busy 3 days.

After the zoo I drove around Norfolk for 40 minutes and took the Bay
Bridge Tunnel to go home. That was one of the attractions.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 17 Nov 2023 00:05 +0000 (GMT Standard
Time), john@jeasonNoSpam.cix.co.uk (John K.Eason) wrote:

>In article <gqpclitogptioe2gqkoalipqmhr2t5b1nr@4ax.com>, NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com
>(micky) wrote:
>
>> *From:* micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com>
>> *Date:* Thu, 16 Nov 2023 14:10:35 -0500
>>
>> Running two computers at once.
>>
>> It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>> desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should
>> set up.
>>
>> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to
>> PC, I need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more
>> than 2 computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get
>> HDMI just because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop
>> inputs are all USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an
>> HDMI to USB cable, but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the
>> keyboard, not both?
>> So what am I to do?
>>
>> I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look
>> at both so easily .
>
>I have two PCs in front of me with separate monitors using a single keyboard and
>mouse. Assuming yours are all running Windows and are on a network, you can install
>Mouse without Borders on all of them and seamlessly move the mouse from screen to
>screen with the keyboard following.

Wow.

>You can also copy and paste files and text
>between PCs with Ctrl-C > Ctrl-V.

That would be good. Right now I'm sending myself emails to transfer
information.

>It was written by Microsoft employees as a 'Garage' project and I've been using
>it daily for years.
>https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/download/details.aspx?id=35460 has the download
>page and instructions on using it down the page. It has a few quirks if you're
>using specialised software with it but overall it's been rock-solid.

Probably not using specialized software.

More to think about. This sounds very good.

Char,

> With a KVM, you normally have to switch to the PC that you
> want to use, but with RDP you simply click in a window

I'm not all that sure what you think switching using the mouse is less work
than doing the same using the keyboard.

My old D-link did it with a scroll-lock double-tap and than 1...4 for the
selection. My current one makes it a more complex : on the numberpad
press-and-hold numlock, press-and-release the minus sign, release numlock,
and than press 1...7 for the selection.

Yep, that really feels like a /lot/ of work. :-)

Though to be honest, I can't seem to get my muscle-memory to remember the
"release minus before NumLock" order consistently. :-\

Regards,
Rudy Wieser

On 11/16/2023 2:10 PM, micky wrote:
> Running two computers at once.
>
> It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
> desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
> up.
>
> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
> need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
> computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
> because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
> USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
> but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
> what am I to do?
>
> I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
> both so easily .
>

There are the following graphics converters.
This is not an exhaustive list. I own three out of this
set, and multiple of some of them. Having multiple even
came in handy (accidental foresight).

HDMI to VGA (active, cheap)
DP to VGA (active, cheap)

DP++ to HDMI (passive, cheap)
DP to HDMi (active, cheap) [For the Optiplex 780, which isn't DP++ capable]

DVI to HDMI (could be passive)
DL-DVI to HDMI (active, likely $$)
(Anything DVI-I or DVI-D is pretty obscure now. Modern vid cards no longer have DVI-I.)

There are converters for just about anything. But you must
acquire a set, before they go out of production. The last
HDMI to VGA I bought, I had to go upmarket a bit and get
one with an analog audio output (stereo), in order to get
an adapter. Startech was almost wiped out by COVID. And
my local computer store, just doesn't have the stock any more.

Conversion at high resolution, can have more issues. I don't
have any 4K stuff here to experiment with.

*******

I would run a KVM on two computers, and leave the third
computer separate. I refuse to believe the three machines
need "equal access". For example, one machine here functions
as a NAS, and it hardly needs a screen when it is doing that.
I could sit that in the kitchen, and hardly ever look at it.

I could see if one machine was running Linux, another Windows,
the third machine was your file server, you might use a dual-port
KVM. KVM pricing is not "rational", and you will pay too much
in any case.

Switching could be done with a button or knob on top of the KVM.
Intercepting key presses is for the birds. Not all computers
seem to be compatible, and you have to be a Level 39 Wizard
to solve all the KVM problems. KVM setup is hardly ever a
joyful experience. It's expensive, and craptastic.

That's why the answer you got, with a monitor having three
HDMI inputs, that exemplifies the "easy" part of the problem,
the routing of graphics to a monitor. But some of the other
conversions (PS/2 interfaces to USB outputs or something),
that stuff can be pretty rough.

I don't own a KVM here. And I don't plan on fattening any
KVM company profits either. I have two monitors, two keyboards,
two mice here. For two machines. I put a PC in the kitchen
if I need a third.

Paul

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 17 Nov 2023 09:38:10 +0100,
"R.Wieser" <address@is.invalid> wrote:

>Char,
>
>> With a KVM, you normally have to switch to the PC that you
>> want to use, but with RDP you simply click in a window
>
>I'm not all that sure what you think switching using the mouse is less work
>than doing the same using the keyboard.
>
>My old D-link did it with a scroll-lock double-tap and than 1...4 for the
>selection. My current one makes it a more complex : on the numberpad
>press-and-hold numlock, press-and-release the minus sign, release numlock,
>and than press 1...7 for the selection.
>
>Yep, that really feels like a /lot/ of work. :-)

It *sounds* like a lot of work.

>
>Though to be honest, I can't seem to get my muscle-memory to remember the
>"release minus before NumLock" order consistently. :-\
>
>Regards,
>Rudy Wieser
>

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 19:03:27 -0500, micky
<NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:

>In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 15:36:29 -0600, Char
>Jackson <none@none.invalid> wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 14:10:35 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Running two computers at once.
>>>
>>>It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>>>desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
>>>up.
>>>
>>>To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
>>>need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
>>>computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
>>>because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
>>>USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
>>>but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
>>>what am I to do?
>>>
>>>I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
>>>both so easily .
>>
>>If either of your PCs can support Remote Desktop (RDP), I would 100% recommend

Google says I need wint 10 1703 or later.

Winver for the desktop runing win10 Pro says
ver 20H2 (OS build 19042,844). Does that mean it's version 844?
I never know what version I have!

Winver for the desktop runing win10 Home says
ver 22H2 (OS build 19045,3693). Does that mean it's version 3693?

So one computer would be enough.

>>that approach over a KVM. I had two KVM switches a long time ago, but they've
>>both gone to Goodwill. Good riddance.
>>
>>With a KVM, you normally have to switch to the PC that you want to use, but with
>>RDP you simply click in a window, or if the 2nd PC is running full screen, just
>>click anywhere in that screen. It's so much faster, easier, and convenient.
>
>You folks have given me a lot to think about. I had planned to cut out
>thinking when I retired. This is like joining a gym after years of
>lethargy. I will look into RDP and, David,synergy.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 17 Nov 2023 10:23 +0000 (GMT Standard
Time), john@jeasonNoSpam.cix.co.uk (John K.Eason) wrote:

>In article <u9cdli58j408od3l0o5dfcf40h4tnpbrhc@4ax.com>, NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com
>(micky) wrote:
>
>> >I have two PCs in front of me with separate monitors using a
>> single keyboard and
>> >mouse. Assuming yours are all running Windows and are on a
>> network, you can install
>> >Mouse without Borders on all of them and seamlessly move the mouse
>> from screen to
>> >screen with the keyboard following.
>>
>> Wow.
>>
>> >You can also copy and paste files and text
>> >between PCs with Ctrl-C > Ctrl-V.
>>
>> That would be good. Right now I'm sending myself emails to transfer
>> information.
>>
>> >It was written by Microsoft employees as a 'Garage' project and
>> I've been using >it daily for years.
>> >https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/download/details.aspx?id=35460 has
>> the download >page and instructions on using it down the page. It has
>> a few quirks if you're using specialised software with it but overall
>> it's been rock-solid.
>>
>> Probably not using specialized software.
>>
>> More to think about. This sounds very good.

Well I installed it right after posting above. Right out of the box the
cursor went from one monitor to the next, but after the first minute, it
wouldn't do it!! Also while typing in one computer, all of a sudden the
cursor and effects of alt-tab would switch to the other one for no
apparent reason. I could get it back with ctrl-alt F3, but it was
frequent and a nuisance, and then I think I couldn't get it back at all
one time. I rebooted both computers and the switching problem was
still there.

One is WIN10 Pro and one is Home, FWIW

It also means that I have to be running the PC with the kb plugged in.
That wouldn't be a problem to change, but I would have to change it. It
would almost never be a problem, but I use the B computer to listen to
web radio even when I'm in other rooms or going to sleep. It would mean
I'd have to always leave the A computer running. I usually do that now
but it's not required.
>
>The link at the bottom of that page takes you to a comprehensive setup/faq/tips &
>tricks page with lots more information.

Thanks. I read that.
>
>The 'specialised software' I use is Blender which is a free 3D modelling program
>and probably uses its own system for controlling the cursor. It's not a big problem
>and every other program I've used has been fine.
>If you happen to have more than one PC which still has its own keyboards and mouse
>connected you can control the lot from whichever mouse/keyboard is nearest to you
>at the time.
>The only (user-induced) problem I have is that I tend to type without looking at
>the screen occasionally and then find that I'm typing on the "wrong" PC because
>that's where the mouse cursor is! :^)

I understand. I've done that already with 2 keyboards and 2 mice. Thank
goodness for ctrl-Z. And I often use alt-tab I on the wrong computer.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:21:03 -0500, Paul
<nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

>On 11/16/2023 2:10 PM, micky wrote:
>> Running two computers at once.
>>
>> It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>> desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
>> up.
>>
>> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
>> need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
>> computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
>> because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
>> USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
>> but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
>> what am I to do?
>>
>> I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
>> both so easily .
>>
>
>There are the following graphics converters.
>This is not an exhaustive list. I own three out of this
>set, and multiple of some of them. Having multiple even
>came in handy (accidental foresight).
>
>HDMI to VGA (active, cheap)
>DP to VGA (active, cheap)
>
>DP++ to HDMI (passive, cheap)
>DP to HDMi (active, cheap) [For the Optiplex 780, which isn't DP++ capable]
>
>DVI to HDMI (could be passive)
>DL-DVI to HDMI (active, likely $$)
>(Anything DVI-I or DVI-D is pretty obscure now. Modern vid cards no longer have DVI-I.)
>
>There are converters for just about anything. But you must
>acquire a set, before they go out of production. The last
>HDMI to VGA I bought, I had to go upmarket a bit and get
>one with an analog audio output (stereo), in order to get
>an adapter. Startech was almost wiped out by COVID. And
>my local computer store, just doesn't have the stock any more.
>
>Conversion at high resolution, can have more issues. I don't
>have any 4K stuff here to experiment with.
>
>*******
>
>I would run a KVM on two computers, and leave the third
>computer separate. I refuse to believe the three machines
>need "equal access".

It's not that the 3rd box, which isn't even functional yet ;-), needs
equal access. It's that I don't feel I have room on the desk for two
keyboards. For the last 18 months I've had one flat and one tilted
behind it. I can't touch-type on the rear one. I have to hunt and
peck.

That's fine for 2 or 3 words, but if I have something long to write I've
tried reversing their positions, but then I get all mixed up and type in
the wrong computer.
And I have tried writing in one computer and emailing to the other,
but yesterday I needed data from the 2nd computer B and needed to write
in the first A, so I was going to have to send part from B to A and then
the whole thing from A to B and it was just ridiculous.
OTOH, see my latest answer, today's, to John.

I do have room for two mice, and I may keep both of them. In fact, the
FAQ for John's method says for win7 or 8 and above there can be a
problem if you don't have a 2nd mouse plugged in, so even if I use that
method, I might as well use a second mouse..

> For example, one machine here functions
>as a NAS, and it hardly needs a screen when it is doing that.

I don't know what a NAS is. If I have a third, it will definitely need
a monitor.

>I could sit that in the kitchen, and hardly ever look at it.
>
>I could see if one machine was running Linux,

That's one thing I've wanted to do on a spare computer.

> another Windows,
>the third machine was your file server, you might use a dual-port
>KVM. KVM pricing is not "rational", and you will pay too much
>in any case.
>
>Switching could be done with a button or knob on top of the KVM.

I like the remote button. The box itself will be 2 feet farther back.

>Intercepting key presses is for the birds. Not all computers
>seem to be compatible, and you have to be a Level 39 Wizard
>to solve all the KVM problems. KVM setup is hardly ever a
>joyful experience. It's expensive, and craptastic.

We shall see. This thread reminded me that I did have one before and it
worked well, maybe on win7?, but stopped using it when the HDD in the
spare PC crashed and I went back to using only one PC (and the laptop
onlly on trips, not when I got home like now.) It might have had round
PS2 plugs, so I can't use it now.

I know things will be different now.

>That's why the answer you got, with a monitor having three
>HDMI inputs, that exemplifies the "easy" part of the problem,
>the routing of graphics to a monitor. But some of the other
>conversions (PS/2 interfaces to USB outputs or something),
>that stuff can be pretty rough.
>
>I don't own a KVM here. And I don't plan on fattening any
>KVM company profits either.

Even now they are as little as $21 for 2-port, $27 for 4-port.

> I have two monitors, two keyboards,
>two mice here. For two machines. I put a PC in the kitchen
>if I need a third.
>
> Paul

On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 12:21:03 -0500, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

>I don't own a KVM here. And I don't plan on fattening any
>KVM company profits either.

Same here. I have plenty of firsthand experience with them, and I don't plan to
add any more.

>I have two monitors, two keyboards,
>two mice here. For two machines.

For two machines, I use one keyboard, one mouse, and two displays. I use the
laptop display for the laptop, and the 24" display (which is physically
connected to the laptop) for the desktop system. The desktop system has no
mouse, no keyboard, and no display directly connected, but it has Ethernet,
which is all I need for RDP.

On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 09:38:10 +0100, "R.Wieser" <address@is.invalid> wrote:

>Char,
>
>> With a KVM, you normally have to switch to the PC that you
>> want to use, but with RDP you simply click in a window
>
>I'm not all that sure what you think switching using the mouse is less work
>than doing the same using the keyboard.

Start with the simplest case of one PC and two simultaneously running
applications. To move from one application to the other, you can click in the
relevant window. There are other ways, but that's the example I'm using.

From that simple example, I'll add a second PC, without a mouse, KB, or monitor
connected. The second PC has only power and Ethernet. Using RDP, in my example,
you can now switch between applications running on either system simply by
clicking anywhere in the relevant application window. Whether it's one system or
two (or more), you'd have to make that click anyway, so it's nothing additional.

To extend the example further, add a second display to the first PC. Now you can
move the RDP session onto the second display. From the user perspective, at that
point you have one PC and all of its running applications on one display, and
the second PC with all of its running apps on the second display. To switch from
one PC to the other, you click in the relevant window. No clunky keyboard
combinations required, or no reaching for a physical KVM switch.

That's why I say it's faster, easier, and more efficient. I can see both
displays at all times, and switching from one system to the other is exactly the
same as switching from one application to another. I don't think it can get any
easier than that.

If one were inclined to do so, you could add another PC, another display, and
another RDP session to run 3 systems seamlessly. Or you could share a display
among two or more systems, since each RDP session can not only be run full
screen but also can be run in a window.

>My old D-link did it with a scroll-lock double-tap and than 1...4 for the

I had a D-Link KVM that operated that way! Annoying. :-)

>selection. My current one makes it a more complex : on the numberpad
>press-and-hold numlock, press-and-release the minus sign, release numlock,
>and than press 1...7 for the selection.
>
>Yep, that really feels like a /lot/ of work. :-)
>
>Though to be honest, I can't seem to get my muscle-memory to remember the
>"release minus before NumLock" order consistently. :-\

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 21:19:15 +0100,
"R.Wieser" <address@is.invalid> wrote:

>Mickey,
>
>> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to
>> PC, I need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more
>> than 2 computers all have HDMI outputs.
>
>I also use a KVM, and the last one I bought is now ... just over a year old
>and has SVGA input and USB keyboard and mouse. Than again, its an 8-port
>one and not really ment for the home market.
>
>The one before that was a D-Link 4-port DKVM-4U (which uses standard SVGA
>and USB cables).
>
>https://me.dlink.com/en/consumer/products/accessories/kvm-switches/dkvm-4u
>
>I'm not sure if you can still get it though. New I mean. You might try
>Amazon and its ilk for a second-hand one.

It must be pretty good. Reconditioned, it's selling for 108 dollars or
more.

I'm going to try for something cheaper, but it's still a possibility.
Maybe my brother will buy it for me as a present!
>
>Regards,
>Rudy Wieser
>

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 15:36:29 -0600, Char
Jackson <none@none.invalid> wrote:

>On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 14:10:35 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
>
>>Running two computers at once.
>>
>>It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>>desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
>>up.
>>
>>To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
>>need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
>>computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
>>because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
>>USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
>>but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
>>what am I to do?
>>
>>I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
>>both so easily .
>
>If either of your PCs can support Remote Desktop (RDP), I would 100% recommend

from 11/2022 "You can't connect to computers running a home edition,
like Win10 Home." And one of mine is Home. Maybe eventually I'll
have all Pro, although this page doesn't mention win11. Thanks for the
suggestion.

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-server/remote/remote-desktop-services/clients/remote-desktop-allow-access

>that approach over a KVM. I had two KVM switches a long time ago, but they've
>both gone to Goodwill. Good riddance.
>
>With a KVM, you normally have to switch to the PC that you want to use, but with
>RDP you simply click in a window, or if the 2nd PC is running full screen, just
>click anywhere in that screen. It's so much faster, easier, and convenient.

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Thu, 16 Nov 2023 15:59:04 -0500, "David W.
Hodgins" <dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:

>On Thu, 16 Nov 2023 14:10:35 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
>
>> Running two computers at once.
>>
>> It happened sort of by accident but now I'm runing my laptop and my
>> desktop all the time. And I have a spare computer I really should set
>> up.
>>
>> To use just one mouse and one keyboard and switch them from PC to PC, I
>> need a KVM switch, but it seems that those that supply more than 2
>> computers all have HDMI outputs. And maybe I should get HDMI just
>> because it's newer than USB. But my laptop and desktop inputs are all
>> USB. I gather someone like me is supposed to get an HDMI to USB cable,
>> but that seems to connect only the mouse OR the keyboard, not both? So
>> what am I to do?
>>
>> I don't want to use only one monitor. It's good to be able to look at
>> both so easily .
>
>Instead of a hardware approach, I use a software/network approach.
>https://symless.com/synergy

Reading about it, thinking about it. I don't spend $30 quickly. :-)
>
>Part of it is open source, so for linux user's it can be installed without
>having to buy it. It has to be configured by manually editing the text
>configuration files, or you can buy the commercial software that includes a
>graphical interface to simplify the configuration.
>
>I still need a local keyboard to login to each computer, but once logged in
>I use one keyboard/mouse for both systems, each of which has it's own monitor.
>As I use a wireless keyboard/mouse combo, I can just move the usb dongle
>temporarily when booting/logging into the the other two systems.
>
>I only use linux, so likely can't help with configuration for windows.

And yet you read this ng. (Unless you're reading t he hardware ng?)
That's big of you.

>It works well on my three linux systems. No flashing or other unwanted
>artifacts.
>
>Regards, Dave Hodgins

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Fri, 17 Nov 2023 23:03:57 -0500, "David W.
Hodgins" <dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:

>On Fri, 17 Nov 2023 22:22:22 -0500, micky <NONONOmisc07@fmguy.com> wrote:
>> And yet you read this ng. (Unless you're reading t he hardware ng?)
>> That's big of you.
>
>I'm subscribed to alt.comp.hardware. I'm not subscribed to any windows newsgroups.
>Windows XP was the last version of windows that I used. I prefer to control
>what's installed in my computer rather then some company that does what's best
>for them. I used to help people diagnose and fix malware infections. Got tired
>of seeing every version of windows be worse than the version before it.
>
>I dual booted windows and linux for a few months. Once I was comfortable with
>how linux works, I switched to it completely and deleted windows to free up
>the disk space.
>
>Regards, Dave Hodgins

I'm glad I included the hardware group. I looked at it and it seemed no
one had posted anything worthwhile in a long time, but I included it
anyhow.

On 11/17/2023 8:26 PM, micky wrote:

> It's not that the 3rd box, which isn't even functional yet ;-), needs
> equal access. It's that I don't feel I have room on the desk for two
> keyboards. For the last 18 months I've had one flat and one tilted
> behind it. I can't touch-type on the rear one. I have to hunt and
> peck.
>
> That's fine for 2 or 3 words, but if I have something long to write I've
> tried reversing their positions, but then I get all mixed up and type in
> the wrong computer.

With a little carpentry, you could probably make some better
work surfaces for yourself.

One of my keyboards is at table height. The second keyboard
happens to be one foot above the table.

Paul

micky,

> It must be pretty good. Reconditioned, it's selling for
> 108 dollars or more.

I think is is. I've been using one for a number of years, only to be
replaced when I wanted to be able to connect more than four 'puters.

Thats quite the price though. I bought it for E50,- (AFAIK) new. Without
cables thoug, but they are bog-standard.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser

Char,

>> I'm not all that sure what you think switching using the mouse
>> is less work than doing the same using the keyboard.
>
> Start with the simplest case of one PC and two simultaneously
> running applications.

[snip]

Yeah, I know how it works, you don't have to describe it to me.

You still forgot to bring anything forward about how switching by mouseclick
is simpler than doing the same by keyboard ...

>> My old D-link did it with a scroll-lock double-tap and than
>> 1...4 for the
>
> I had a D-Link KVM that operated that way! Annoying. :-)

:-) You could always have gone for an even older version, the ones with the
selection buttons on the KVMs front, or even yet older, with the rotary
switch. :-p

Regards,
Rudy Wieser.