On Saturday, June 6, 2020 at 11:41:59 AM UTC-4, cyril.r...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, 26 May 2020 00:18:15 UTC+3, Gerard Schildberger wrote:
> > On Sunday, June 1, 2003 at 3:12:55 PM UTC-5, Don Quixote wrote:
> > > George R. Gonzalez might have said:
> > >
> > > [CT rats game]
> > >
> > > >Anybody remember that game? Anybody have the source code to it?
> > >
> > > Yes, no.
> >
> > (Regarding the Rat's game ...)
> >
> >
> > Attributed to Lily Tomlin and/or Robert Reisner:
> >
> >
> > “The trouble with being in the rat race is that even if you win,
> > you're still a rat.”
> >
> > ________________________________________ Gerard Schildbergr
> hi,
>
> do you remember what was the behavior difference between the rat and the small one (bug?)?
>
> I try to write my own version of the game ...
We called them "anklebiters" at Burroughs. I do remember they were fast but I am forgetting their full behavior.

Didn't you notice that you are replying to a thread from two decades ago?

On 2023-05-03 13:12, George T Peppel wrote:
> On Saturday, June 6, 2020 at 11:41:59 AM UTC-4, cyril.r...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Tuesday, 26 May 2020 00:18:15 UTC+3, Gerard Schildberger wrote:
>>> On Sunday, June 1, 2003 at 3:12:55 PM UTC-5, Don Quixote wrote:
>>>> George R. Gonzalez might have said:
>>>>
>>>> [CT rats game]
>>>>
>>>>> Anybody remember that game? Anybody have the source code to it?
>>>>
>>>> Yes, no.
>>>
>>> (Regarding the Rat's game ...)
>>>
>>>
>>> Attributed to Lily Tomlin and/or Robert Reisner:
>>>
>>>
>>> “The trouble with being in the rat race is that even if you win,
>>> you're still a rat.”
>>>
>>> ________________________________________ Gerard Schildbergr
>> hi,
>>
>> do you remember what was the behavior difference between the rat and the small one (bug?)?
>>
>> I try to write my own version of the game ...
> We called them "anklebiters" at Burroughs. I do remember they were fast but I am forgetting their full behavior.

--
Cheers, Carlos.

2023-05-03, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> schrieb:
>
> Didn't you notice that you are replying to a thread from two decades ago?

In my opinion the error is Googlegroups allowing this.

[Schnipp]

--
"There's an eyeball in my Martini"

Jan v/d Broek balglaas@sdf.org
SDF Public Access UNIX System - https://sdf.org

On Wed, 3 May 2023 14:08:18 -0000 (UTC)
Jan van den Broek <balglaas@sdf.org> wrote:

> 2023-05-03, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> schrieb:
> >
> > Didn't you notice that you are replying to a thread from two decades ago?
>
> In my opinion the error is Googlegroups allowing this.
>
> [Schnipp]
>
But I'd welcome a rewrite of the game to.. well for me. MSDOS. I might
tackle it myself, if had more of a spec.

Ah
https://convergentaws.blogspot.com/2022/02/finding-and-implementing-rats-of-maze.html
has a lot of info. Maybe later.
--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

Jan van den Broek <balglaas@sdf.org> wrote:
> 2023-05-03, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> schrieb:
>>
>> Didn't you notice that you are replying to a thread from two decades ago?
>
> In my opinion the error is Googlegroups allowing this.
>
> [Schnipp]
>

Right, or at least it should give a warning “the message you’re replying to
is more than xxx days old, do you want to continue.” Google should hire us
old-timers to fix their code.

--
Pete

On 2023-05-03, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Jan van den Broek <balglaas@sdf.org> wrote:
>
>> 2023-05-03, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> schrieb:
>>
>>> Didn't you notice that you are replying to a thread from two decades ago?
>>
>> In my opinion the error is Googlegroups allowing this.
>>
>> [Schnipp]
>
> Right, or at least it should give a warning “the message you’re replying to
> is more than xxx days old, do you want to continue.” Google should hire us
> old-timers to fix their code.

Or not. Considering how far Google has insinuated its tentacles into
our lives, the last thing I'd want to do is help them in any way.

--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | You can't save the earth
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | unless you're willing to
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | make other people sacrifice.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Dogbert the green consultant

On Wed, 3 May 2023 13:34:38 -0700
Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Google should hire us old-timers to fix their code.

Google (also Amazon and Meta) have been pinging me about working for
them on and off for the last decade, apparently I'm talent they'd like to
acquire. I haven't been desperate enough yet.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/

In article <20230504055155.02ec7253374b61b7ab643d8e@eircom.net>, Ahem A
Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> on Thu, 4 May 2023 at 05:51:55 awoke
Nicholas from his slumbers and wrote
>On Wed, 3 May 2023 13:34:38 -0700
>Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Google should hire us old-timers to fix their code.
>
> Google (also Amazon and Meta) have been pinging me about working for
>them on and off for the last decade, apparently I'm talent they'd like to
>acquire. I haven't been desperate enough yet.
>
Or you are dealing with people with evil intentions.....

as you were.
--
0sterc@tcher -

"Où sont les neiges d'antan?"

On 03/05/2023 21:34, Peter Flass wrote:
> Right, or at least it should give a warning “the message you’re replying to
> is more than xxx days old, do you want to continue.” Google should hire us
> old-timers to fix their code.

I had a perfectly good job. I stopped when I decided I had enough money
to do the things I wanted, but might not have enough time.

I imagine that's true of a lot of people.

Andy

On 2023-05-11, Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On 03/05/2023 21:34, Peter Flass wrote:
>> Right, or at least it should give a warning “the message you’re replying to
>> is more than xxx days old, do you want to continue.” Google should hire us
>> old-timers to fix their code.
>
> I had a perfectly good job. I stopped when I decided I had enough money
> to do the things I wanted, but might not have enough time.
>
> I imagine that's true of a lot of people.
>
> Andy

A bit of a story from many, many years ago.

The machine was not working, so a learned man came from afar,
contemplated it for a while, then turned a screw, the machine started,
and the learned man presented his bill

"How can you justify charging so much for turning a screw?."#

"I knew which screw to turn."

Then there was the hospitals where someone noticed that patients died
between 6 and 7. The cleaners would plug out things to plug in vacuum
cleaners.

equally old

--
greymausg@mail.com
Where is our money gone, dude?

greymaus <maus@darkstar.org> writes:

> A bit of a story from many, many years ago.
>
> The machine was not working, so a learned man came from afar,
> contemplated it for a while, then turned a screw, the machine started,
> and the learned man presented his bill
>
> "How can you justify charging so much for turning a screw?."

The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."

In the more grease-stained trades,

s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/

and so on.

> "I knew which screw to turn."

--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada

On 11 May 2023 15:09:46 -0300
Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:

> The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
> turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."
>
>
> In the more grease-stained trades,
>
> s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/

That was the version I first heard - with an extra zero in the bill
and without the 1 at the end - the figures were $50 for call out and hitting
with hammer, $950 for knowing where to hit.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/

On 2023-05-11 21:57, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
> On 11 May 2023 15:09:46 -0300
> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>
>> The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
>> turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."
>>
>>
>> In the more grease-stained trades,
>>
>> s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/
>
> That was the version I first heard - with an extra zero in the bill
> and without the 1 at the end - the figures were $50 for call out and hitting
> with hammer, $950 for knowing where to hit.

It's an old story that have been around in multiple variants for a long
time.

Just google for "where to tap", and you'll find a bunch.

Johnny

On Fri, 12 May 2023 12:13:05 +0200
Johnny Billquist <bqt@softjar.se> wrote:

> On 2023-05-11 21:57, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
> > On 11 May 2023 15:09:46 -0300
> > Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
> >
> >> The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
> >> turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."
> >>
> >>
> >> In the more grease-stained trades,
> >>
> >> s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/
> >
> > That was the version I first heard - with an extra zero in the
> > bill and without the 1 at the end - the figures were $50 for call out
> > and hitting with hammer, $950 for knowing where to hit.
>
> It's an old story that have been around in multiple variants for a long
> time.

I'm pretty sure it was ancient when I heard it circa 1980.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/

On 2023-05-12, Johnny Billquist <bqt@softjar.se> wrote:
> On 2023-05-11 21:57, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>> On 11 May 2023 15:09:46 -0300
>> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>>
>>> The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
>>> turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."
>>>
>>>
>>> In the more grease-stained trades,
>>>
>>> s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/
>>
>> That was the version I first heard - with an extra zero in the bill
>> and without the 1 at the end - the figures were $50 for call out and hitting
>> with hammer, $950 for knowing where to hit.
>
> It's an old story that have been around in multiple variants for a long
> time.
>
> Just google for "where to tap", and you'll find a bunch.
>
> Johnny
>

This is alt.FOLKLORE.computers. just a thought from olden time that
came to me .

--
greymausg@mail.com
Where is our money gone, dude?

greymaus <maus@darkstar.org> wrote:

> On 2023-05-12, Johnny Billquist <bqt@softjar.se> wrote:
> > On 2023-05-11 21:57, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
> >> On 11 May 2023 15:09:46 -0300
> >> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
> >>
> >>> The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
> >>> turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> In the more grease-stained trades,
> >>>
> >>> s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/
> >>
> >> That was the version I first heard - with an extra zero in the bill
> >> and without the 1 at the end - the figures were $50 for call out and
> >> hitting with hammer, $950 for knowing where to hit.
> >
> > It's an old story that have been around in multiple variants for a long
> > time.
> >
> > Just google for "where to tap", and you'll find a bunch.
> >
> > Johnny
> >
>
> This is alt.FOLKLORE.computers. just a thought from olden time that
> came to me .

Percussive maintenance was certainly a thing in 1969.

--
^Ï^. – Sn!pe – My pet rock Gordon just is.

<https://youtu.be/_kqytf31a8E>

On 11 May 2023 in alt.folklore.computers, greymaus wrote:

> On 2023-05-11, Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid>
> wrote:
>> On 03/05/2023 21:34, Peter Flass wrote:
>>> Right, or at least it should give a warning “the message
>>> you’re replying to is more than xxx days old, do you want to
>>> continue.” Google should hire us old-timers to fix their code.
>>
>> I had a perfectly good job. I stopped when I decided I had enough
>> money to do the things I wanted, but might not have enough time.
>>
>> I imagine that's true of a lot of people.
>>
>> Andy
>
> A bit of a story from many, many years ago.
....
> "How can you justify charging so much for turning a screw?."#
>
> "I knew which screw to turn."

I've heard a version of the story attributed to Charles Proteus
Steinmetz. He had gone his own way, perhaps nudged a bit in that
direction by General Electric. But nobody understood his material* as
he did, so he got called back in. They gave him the specs and plans
for the device they were having trouble with. He returned home and
contemplated the problem for a couple of days, came back, grabbed a
piece of chalk, marked the device, dropped a bill for ${large number}
on the table and left.

A few days later, comes a missive from GE - they want an /itemized/
bill. (Bean counters are always with us.) So Steinmetz sent the bill:
- $100 placing chalk mark on device
- ${large number} - $100 knowing where to put the chalk mark

GE, at least according to this story, paid.

* High voltage electricity

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Proteus_Steinmetz

Ah, not quite. Footnote 13 of that article refers to this article:

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/charles-proteus-steinmetz-the-wizard-of-schenectady-51912022

Apparently, the victim was Henry Ford, not GE.

--
Joe Makowiec
http://makowiec.org/
Email: http://makowiec.org/contact/?Joe
Usenet Improvement Project: http://twovoyagers.com/improve-usenet.org/

On 2023-05-12, Sn!pe <snipeco.2@gmail.com> wrote:

> greymaus <maus@darkstar.org> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-05-12, Johnny Billquist <bqt@softjar.se> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2023-05-11 21:57, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 11 May 2023 15:09:46 -0300
>>>> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
>>>>> turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."
>>>>>
>>>>> In the more grease-stained trades,
>>>>>
>>>>> s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/
>>>>
>>>> That was the version I first heard - with an extra zero in the bill
>>>> and without the 1 at the end - the figures were $50 for call out and
>>>> hitting with hammer, $950 for knowing where to hit.
>>>
>>> It's an old story that have been around in multiple variants for a long
>>> time.
>>>
>>> Just google for "where to tap", and you'll find a bunch.
>>
>> This is alt.FOLKLORE.computers. just a thought from olden time that
>> came to me .
>
> Percussive maintenance was certainly a thing in 1969.

I've heard it referred to as a "broad-spectrum seismic impulse".

--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | You can't save the earth
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | unless you're willing to
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | make other people sacrifice.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Dogbert the green consultant

Sn!pe <snipeco.2@gmail.com> wrote:
> greymaus <maus@darkstar.org> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-05-12, Johnny Billquist <bqt@softjar.se> wrote:
>>> On 2023-05-11 21:57, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>>>> On 11 May 2023 15:09:46 -0300
>>>> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
>>>>> turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> In the more grease-stained trades,
>>>>>
>>>>> s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/
>>>>
>>>> That was the version I first heard - with an extra zero in the bill
>>>> and without the 1 at the end - the figures were $50 for call out and
>>>> hitting with hammer, $950 for knowing where to hit.
>>>
>>> It's an old story that have been around in multiple variants for a long
>>> time.
>>>
>>> Just google for "where to tap", and you'll find a bunch.
>>>
>>> Johnny
>>>
>>
>> This is alt.FOLKLORE.computers. just a thought from olden time that
>> came to me .
>
> Percussive maintenance was certainly a thing in 1969.
>

The six-inch-drop was a way to fix terminals and PCs au aulden days.

--
Pete

On 2023-05-12, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Sn!pe <snipeco.2@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> greymaus <maus@darkstar.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2023-05-12, Johnny Billquist <bqt@softjar.se> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2023-05-11 21:57, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 11 May 2023 15:09:46 -0300
>>>>> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The bill presented is for $101.00. The defence is, "One dollar for
>>>>>> turning the screw; $100 for knowing which screw to turn."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the more grease-stained trades,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> s/turned a screw/whacked it with a hammer/
>>>>>
>>>>> That was the version I first heard - with an extra zero in the bill
>>>>> and without the 1 at the end - the figures were $50 for call out and
>>>>> hitting with hammer, $950 for knowing where to hit.
>>>>
>>>> It's an old story that have been around in multiple variants for a long
>>>> time.
>>>>
>>>> Just google for "where to tap", and you'll find a bunch.
>>>
>>> This is alt.FOLKLORE.computers. just a thought from olden time that
>>> came to me .
>>
>> Percussive maintenance was certainly a thing in 1969.
>
> The six-inch-drop was a way to fix terminals and PCs au aulden days.

The contacts on the circuit boards in our mainframe terminals
(Uniscope 200) weren't gold-plated, and would often corrode.
A quick once-over with a pencil eraser usually fixed things.
(You'd have to be careful doing a six-inch drop - they weighed
50 pounds.)

--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | You can't save the earth
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | unless you're willing to
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | make other people sacrifice.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Dogbert the green consultant

> Percussive maintenance was certainly a thing in 1969.

I had an IBM 19" CRT that, circa 2010, responded to percussive
maintenance. Eventually I took it apart and firmly attached the loose
item. No more percussion until last month when I retired it.

--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada

On 2023-05-11, greymaus <maus@darkstar.org> wrote:
>
> Then there was the hospitals where someone noticed that patients died
> between 6 and 7. The cleaners would plug out things to plug in vacuum
> cleaners.

Twenty years or so ago when I was doing hardware support, I had a
customer whose network switch was ceasing to function at roughly the
same time every night, then would come back to life in the morning. I
strongly suspected it was a case of a cleaner unplugging it, but in the
end, it turned out to be a case of the light switch being wired to the
outlet the switch fed from. Apparently this is not uncommon in US homes,
and his office was in a converted home.

Niklas
--
"BASH! THUD! POW! OCTOTHORPE!"
-- SteveD

On 2023-05-14, Niklas Karlsson <nikke.karlsson@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 2023-05-11, greymaus <maus@darkstar.org> wrote:
>
>> Then there was the hospitals where someone noticed that patients died
>> between 6 and 7. The cleaners would plug out things to plug in vacuum
>> cleaners.
>
> Twenty years or so ago when I was doing hardware support, I had a
> customer whose network switch was ceasing to function at roughly the
> same time every night, then would come back to life in the morning. I
> strongly suspected it was a case of a cleaner unplugging it, but in the
> end, it turned out to be a case of the light switch being wired to the
> outlet the switch fed from. Apparently this is not uncommon in US homes,
> and his office was in a converted home.

One of the favourite stories I remember from this froup is about a
system that would go down overnight. When the staff came in in the
morning, they would find one or more disk drives offline. Hardware
testing revealed no problems that would make a drive spontaneously
go offline. Finally someone set up a cot in the machine room and
stayed overnight. In the middle of the night he saw a janitor come
in to clean the machine room. The janitor would push his cart between
the two rows of disk drives, and would occasionally bump into one,
sometimes hitting the "offline" button.

The solution was not, as one would initially think, to move the
disk drive rows farther part. Rather, they moved them closer
together so the janitor couldn't get his cart between them at all.
Problem solved.

--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | You can't save the earth
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | unless you're willing to
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | make other people sacrifice.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Dogbert the green consultant