Bad actor: A person who behaves immorally or makes trouble (OED)
OED has four citations, from 1879, all American.

I feel I have known this expression for quite a while, but have been
running into it more just recently.
I have understood it as a person or persons, within a system. who behave
badly by violating the understood norms of the system. Their actions are
bad but not necessarily criminal.

Eyebrows went up when I heard it used by the Kansas City police person
to refer to those who did the recent shooting -- it sounded as if they
had just spoiled people's happy day by being rude, or pissing in the
street or something, rather than killing people.

Any thoughts?

Le 16/02/2024 à 04:45, Ross Clark a écrit :
>
> Bad actor: A person who behaves immorally or makes trouble (OED)
> OED has four citations, from 1879, all American.
>
> I feel I have known this expression for quite a while, but have been
> running into it more just recently.
> I have understood it as a person or persons, within a system. who behave
> badly by violating the understood norms of the system. Their actions are
> bad but not necessarily criminal.

I seem to hear it most in the context of cyber-criminality.

> Eyebrows went up when I heard it used by the Kansas City police person
> to refer to those who did the recent shooting -- it sounded as if they
> had just spoiled people's happy day by being rude, or pissing in the
> street or something, rather than killing people.
>
> Any thoughts?

To me, a bad actor is someone who will never play The Dane - so when bad
actors come into contact with the police, that's hams meeting pigs.

On 16/02/24 15:45, Ross Clark wrote:

> Bad actor: A person who behaves immorally or makes trouble (OED) OED
> has four citations, from 1879, all American.
>
> I feel I have known this expression for quite a while, but have been
> running into it more just recently. I have understood it as a person
> or persons, within a system. who behave badly by violating the
> understood norms of the system. Their actions are bad but not
> necessarily criminal.
>
> Eyebrows went up when I heard it used by the Kansas City police
> person to refer to those who did the recent shooting -- it sounded as
> if they had just spoiled people's happy day by being rude, or pissing
> in the street or something, rather than killing people.
>
> Any thoughts?

I can't resist mentioning Ronald Reagan, but of course he was a bad
actor in a different sense.

What brought him to mind, though, is that we've had quite a run of
politicians who have given politics a bad name. I can't recall the term
being applied to them, but I think I've heard it applied to, for
example, some people who have worked for Trump.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

On 16/02/2024 08:26, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 16/02/24 15:45, Ross Clark wrote:
>
>> Bad actor: A person who behaves immorally or makes trouble (OED) OED
>> has four citations, from 1879, all American.
>>
>> I feel I have known this expression for quite a while, but have been
>> running into it more just recently. I have understood it as a person
>> or persons, within a system. who behave badly by violating the
>> understood norms of the system. Their actions are bad but not
>> necessarily criminal.
>>
>> Eyebrows went up when I heard it used by the Kansas City police
>> person to refer to those who did the recent shooting -- it sounded as
>> if they had just spoiled people's happy day by being rude, or pissing
>> in the street or something, rather than killing people.
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>
> I can't resist mentioning Ronald Reagan, but of course he was a bad
> actor in a different sense.
>
> What brought him to mind, though, is that we've had quite a run of
> politicians who have given politics a bad name. I can't recall the term
> being applied to them, but I think I've heard it applied to, for
> example, some people who have worked for Trump.
>

When people trust politicians less than (say) journalists, it says a lot
about politicians.

According to Ipsos
(https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/ipsos-veracity-index-2022) (UK pollsters)

Trust in politicians has fallen by seven percentage points since 2021,
making them the least trusted profession in Britain. Just twelve per
cent of the public say they trust politicians to tell the truth, down
from 19% in 2021 and 15% in 2020.

The five least-trusted professions are politicians, advertising
executives, government ministers, estate agents and journalists.
Politicians and Ministers, as well as estate agents, have seen a
decrease in their level of public trust since 2021.

--
Chris Elvidge, England
I WILL NOT SPANK OTHERS

On Fri, 16 Feb 2024 19:26:27 +1100, Peter Moylan
<peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:

>On 16/02/24 15:45, Ross Clark wrote:
>
>> Bad actor: A person who behaves immorally or makes trouble (OED) OED
>> has four citations, from 1879, all American.
>>
>> I feel I have known this expression for quite a while, but have been
>> running into it more just recently. I have understood it as a person
>> or persons, within a system. who behave badly by violating the
>> understood norms of the system. Their actions are bad but not
>> necessarily criminal.
>>
>> Eyebrows went up when I heard it used by the Kansas City police
>> person to refer to those who did the recent shooting -- it sounded as
>> if they had just spoiled people's happy day by being rude, or pissing
>> in the street or something, rather than killing people.
>>
>> Any thoughts?
>
>I can't resist mentioning Ronald Reagan, but of course he was a bad
>actor in a different sense.

What he learned as an actor served him well.

“Sincerity – if you can fake that, you've got it made.”

Google shows me attributions, none with years, to American
comedians George Burns and Groucho Marx, with one comment that,

It's possible George may have 'lifted' the quote from Jean
Giraudoux, a French novelist, diplomat and playwright.

Giraudoux, whose name is new to me, is credited about as
often as Burns or Marx. Apparently he was often quotable.

I guess we can figure that it is too new to give credit to
Mark Twain. Groucho was born in 1890, George in 1896
(died in 1996). Giraudoux lived from 1882 to 1944.

Pursuing this: I've only lately taken to searching Google
by decade. (Access: do a search, click Tools, click Any time>, )
Unexpectedly, searching by decades, the earliest that I
find this quote is in the 1990s. There is one citation for
Burns in 1994 (Chicago Tribune) and several cites from 1996,
usually naming Burns.

>
>What brought him to mind, though, is that we've had quite a run of
>politicians who have given politics a bad name. I can't recall the term
>being applied to them, but I think I've heard it applied to, for
>example, some people who have worked for Trump.

I have a cousin who has started saying 'right wing nut jobs'
too often, but that isn't general enough.

--
Rich Ulrich

On 16/02/24 23:15, Chris Elvidge wrote:

> When people trust politicians less than (say) journalists, it says a lot
> about politicians.
>
> According to Ipsos
> (https://www.ipsos.com/en-uk/ipsos-veracity-index-2022) (UK pollsters)
>
> Trust in politicians has fallen by seven percentage points since 2021,
> making them the least trusted profession in Britain. Just twelve per
> cent of the public say they trust politicians to tell the truth, down
> from 19% in 2021 and 15% in 2020.
>
> The five least-trusted professions are politicians, advertising
> executives, government ministers, estate agents and journalists.
> Politicians and Ministers, as well as estate agents, have seen a
> decrease in their level of public trust since 2021.

In the latest Australia survey, politicians had improved their standing,
being beaten in the least-trusted section by real estate agents. Here
are the bottom ten.

BOTTOM 10

10. Lawyers

9. Chief Executive Officers/ Managing Directors

8. Directors of Australian companies

7. Chairs of companies

6. Local politicians

5. Senior executives

4. State politicians

3. Federal politicians

2. Directors of foreign companies operating in Australia

1. Real estate agents

(Source: Governance Institute of Australia Ethics Index)

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

Ross Clark <benlizro@ihug.co.nz> writes:
> Bad actor: A person who behaves immorally or makes trouble (OED)
> OED has four citations, from 1879, all American.
>
> I feel I have known this expression for quite a while, but have been
> running into it more just recently.
> I have understood it as a person or persons, within a system. who
> behave badly by violating the understood norms of the system. Their
> actions are bad but not necessarily criminal.

Or one who "acts in bad faith". They seem similar in popularity:
https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=bad+actor%2C+act+in+bad+faith&year_start=1800&year_end=2019&corpus=en-2019&smoothing=3
(though the comparison is not A2O as one's the agent, and the other's
the act.)

Phil
--
We are no longer hunters and nomads. No longer awed and frightened, as we have
gained some understanding of the world in which we live. As such, we can cast
aside childish remnants from the dawn of our civilization.
-- NotSanguine on SoylentNews, after Eugen Weber in /The Western Tradition/