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interests / soc.genealogy.medieval / Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

SubjectAuthor
* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Johnny Brananas
`* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Johnny Brananas
 +* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Johnny Brananas
 |`* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Leslie Mahler
 | +- Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Brad Verity
 | `* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?JBrand
 |  `* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Brad Verity
 |   `* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Brad Verity
 |    `* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?JBrand
 |     `* Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Brad Verity
 |      `- Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?JBrand
 `- Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?Brad Verity

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Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: ravinmaven2001@yahoo.com (Johnny Brananas)
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 by: Johnny Brananas - Fri, 9 Jun 2023 14:09 UTC

i.e., the mother of "The British Bombshell," actress Anna Lee. Nee Joan Boniface Winnifrith.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Lee

The name "Digby-Roper" sounds a bit posh.

Anna Lee was fairly well-known as an actress, featuring in "How Green Was My Valley," "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane," "The Unsinkable Molly Brown," "The Sound of Music," "In Like Flint," and various TV and soap roles.

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: ravinmaven2001@yahoo.com (Johnny Brananas)
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 by: Johnny Brananas - Fri, 9 Jun 2023 14:30 UTC

On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:10:01 AM UTC-4, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> i.e., the mother of "The British Bombshell," actress Anna Lee. Nee Joan Boniface Winnifrith.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Lee
>
> The name "Digby-Roper" sounds a bit posh.
>
> Anna Lee was fairly well-known as an actress, featuring in "How Green Was My Valley," "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane," "The Unsinkable Molly Brown," "The Sound of Music," "In Like Flint," and various TV and soap roles.

Here the surname is given as "Digby Blaker" ...
https://collections.westminster.org.uk/index.php/winnifrith-alfred-john-digby-1908-1993

There may be some (illegitimate) connection to the gentry Digby family. Anna Lee's autobiography says, "One evening after dinner, Colonel Wingfield Digby showed me the family portraits. He pointed to one, a man dressed all in black, John Digby Wingfield Digby (yes, a double Digby), the Rector of Coleshill. 'He is the great-great grandfather that you and Simon have in common,' he explained."

There are also references to a Digby daughter having an illegitimate child (apparently, ... I can only see snippets). Possibly that child was Anna Lee's mother?

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: ravinmaven2001@yahoo.com (Johnny Brananas)
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 by: Johnny Brananas - Fri, 9 Jun 2023 14:36 UTC

On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:30:19 AM UTC-4, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:10:01 AM UTC-4, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> > i.e., the mother of "The British Bombshell," actress Anna Lee. Nee Joan Boniface Winnifrith.
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Lee
> >
> > The name "Digby-Roper" sounds a bit posh.
> >
> > Anna Lee was fairly well-known as an actress, featuring in "How Green Was My Valley," "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane," "The Unsinkable Molly Brown," "The Sound of Music," "In Like Flint," and various TV and soap roles.
> Here the surname is given as "Digby Blaker" ...
> https://collections.westminster.org.uk/index.php/winnifrith-alfred-john-digby-1908-1993
>
> There may be some (illegitimate) connection to the gentry Digby family. Anna Lee's autobiography says, "One evening after dinner, Colonel Wingfield Digby showed me the family portraits. He pointed to one, a man dressed all in black, John Digby Wingfield Digby (yes, a double Digby), the Rector of Coleshill. 'He is the great-great grandfather that you and Simon have in common,' he explained."
>
> There are also references to a Digby daughter having an illegitimate child (apparently, ... I can only see snippets). Possibly that child was Anna Lee's mother?

The Wingfield Digbys connected to Coleshill, Warwickshire ...
https://www.google.com/books/edition/A_Genealogical_and_Heraldic_History_of_t/3RVXAAAAYAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=%22john+digby+wingfield+digby%22+coleshill&pg=RA1-PA503&printsec=frontcover

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: lesliemahler1@gmail.com (Leslie Mahler)
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 by: Leslie Mahler - Sat, 10 Jun 2023 02:19 UTC

On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 9:36:46 AM UTC-5, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:30:19 AM UTC-4, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> > On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:10:01 AM UTC-4, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> > > i.e., the mother of "The British Bombshell," actress Anna Lee. Nee Joan Boniface Winnifrith.
> > >
> > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Lee
> > >
> > > The name "Digby-Roper" sounds a bit posh.
> > >
> > > Anna Lee was fairly well-known as an actress, featuring in "How Green Was My Valley," "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane," "The Unsinkable Molly Brown," "The Sound of Music," "In Like Flint," and various TV and soap roles..
> > Here the surname is given as "Digby Blaker" ...
> > https://collections.westminster.org.uk/index.php/winnifrith-alfred-john-digby-1908-1993
> >
> > There may be some (illegitimate) connection to the gentry Digby family. Anna Lee's autobiography says, "One evening after dinner, Colonel Wingfield Digby showed me the family portraits. He pointed to one, a man dressed all in black, John Digby Wingfield Digby (yes, a double Digby), the Rector of Coleshill. 'He is the great-great grandfather that you and Simon have in common,' he explained."
> >
> > There are also references to a Digby daughter having an illegitimate child (apparently, ... I can only see snippets). Possibly that child was Anna Lee's mother?
> The Wingfield Digbys connected to Coleshill, Warwickshire ...
> https://www.google.com/books/edition/A_Genealogical_and_Heraldic_History_of_t/3RVXAAAAYAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=%22john+digby+wingfield+digby%22+coleshill&pg=RA1-PA503&printsec=frontcover

Someone has figured out the line of descent, as given here:
https://www.geni.com/people/Edith-Blaker/6000000029153359019

Edith Henrietta Georgina Wingfield-Digby is the 4th child, recorded in Burke:
https://books.google.com/books?id=93M-AQAAIAAJ&pg=PA515&dq=john+digby+wingfield+digby+eliza+smith&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjAhOmZzrf_AhWkIEQIHV-lAZoQ6AF6BAgGEAE#v=onepage&q=john%20digby%20wingfield%20digby%20eliza%20smith&f=false

Leslie

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: bradverity@dhdesigns.com (Brad Verity)
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 by: Brad Verity - Sat, 10 Jun 2023 02:20 UTC

On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 7:30:19 AM UTC-7, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:10:01 AM UTC-4, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> > i.e., the mother of "The British Bombshell," actress Anna Lee. Nee Joan Boniface Winnifrith.
> >
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Lee
> >
> > The name "Digby-Roper" sounds a bit posh.
> >
> > Anna Lee was fairly well-known as an actress, featuring in "How Green Was My Valley," "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane," "The Unsinkable Molly Brown," "The Sound of Music," "In Like Flint," and various TV and soap roles.

Per the England & Wales Civil Registration Marriage Index, the marriage of Bertram Thomas Winnifrith and Edith Maude Blaker was registered Oct-Nov-Dec 1897 in Elham, Kent.

The Rev. Bertram Thomas Winnifrith of Ightham Rectory died 30 July 1924 at Ewell Grove, Surrey.

Per a passenger manifest, Edith Maude Winnifrith, widow, crossed from Canada to Seattle, Wash. in July 1946, en route to visit her daughter Mrs. Ruth Wood of Beverly Hills, CA. Edith was aged 70, born in Bishopstone, England..

Edith Maude Winnifrith died 24 December 1966 at Warwick Nursing Home in Tunbridge Wells, Kent. Per the England & Wales Civil Registration Death Index she was age 91, so born about 1875.

Per the 1939 England & Wales Register, Edith Winnifrith, widow was born 1 August 1875.

The birth of Edith Maude Blaker was registered July-Aug-Sept 1875 in Clifton, Gloucestershire per the England & Wales Civil Registration Birth Index.

Edith Maude, daughter of Henry Blaker "seaman" of Bishopston, Bristol, and his wife Ellen was christened 3 October 1875 at St Michael & All Angels Church, Bishopston.

> Here the surname is given as "Digby Blaker" ...
> https://collections.westminster.org.uk/index.php/winnifrith-alfred-john-digby-1908-1993

Per the U.S. Social Security Claims Index, Anna Lee [Winnifrith] Nathan, was daughter of Bertram T. Winnifrith and Edith M. Digby.

> There may be some (illegitimate) connection to the gentry Digby family. Anna Lee's autobiography says, "One evening after dinner, Colonel Wingfield Digby showed me the family portraits. He pointed to one, a man dressed all in black, John Digby Wingfield Digby (yes, a double Digby), the Rector of Coleshill. 'He is the great-great grandfather that you and Simon have in common,' he explained."

I don't know who the "Simon" was that Col. Wingfield Digby claimed shared with Anna Lee, Rev. John Digby Wingfield Digby as a great-great-grandfather..

Rev. JOHN DIGBY WINGFIELD, afterwards WINGFIELD-DIGBY, Vicar of Coleshill, Warwickshire 1848-74, b. 26 March 1799 Lincoln's Inn, London, bap. 23 Apr. 1799 St Giles in the Fields, London; died 24 Jan. 1878 Bournemouth, Hampshire, bur. 30 Jan. 1878 Sherborne Abbey, Dorset; m. 20 Apr. 1826 St Mary Bryanston Square, London, ANNE ELIZA SMITH (b. 11 May 1803, bap. 6 Sep. 1803 Holy Trinity Church, Godmanstone, Dorset; d. 22 July 1859 Norfolk Crescent, London, bur. 29 July 1859 St Peter & St Paul Church, Coleshill), dau. of Sir John Wyldbore Smith, 2nd Baronet of Sydling St Nicholas (1770-1852) & Elizabeth Anne Marriott (c.1766-1844).

I only have two of his children in my database so far, John Digby Wingfield Digby of Sherborne Castle (1832-1888) and Harriet Margaretta (Wingfield Digby) Pinney (1841-1877).

Rev. Wingfield Digby is descended from Isabel (Plantagenet), Countess of Essex, and appears in Ruvigny's Isabel of Essex volume (19--) p. 160.

He is in the Genealogics database, and the Essex descent thru his mother Lady Charlotte Maria (Digby) Wingfield (1772-1807) can be traced there:
https://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00173025&tree=LEO

> There are also references to a Digby daughter having an illegitimate child (apparently, ... I can only see snippets). Possibly that child was Anna Lee's mother?

If as she relayed in her book, Anna Lee was a great-great-granddaughter of Rev. Wingfield Digby, one of her maternal grandparents would have been the grandchild of the clergyman.

Ruvigny pp. 160-162 assigns six children and twenty-eight grandchildren to Rev. Wingfield Digby. None named Edith Maude, nor any with an immediate connection to Bristol, though the reverend's youngest son became a clergyman in Gloucestershire.

It's interesting that Anna Lee gave her mother's maiden name on her social security application as 'Digby' when it was otherwise in British records 'Blaker'. It seems the only way this could be accurate is if her mother was illegitimate, and given to a Bristol seaman to raise as his own, which, though it could be a plot out of 'Downton Abbey', still doesn't seem likely at all. The full name of Lee's brother, a knighted civil servant, was Sir Alfred John Digby Winnifrith. The Winnifriths were a clergyman family, as were the Wingfield Digbys. More research would be needed into those families to uncover any genealogical connection.

Hope this helps.

Cheers, ----Brad

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: bradverity@dhdesigns.com (Brad Verity)
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 by: Brad Verity - Sat, 10 Jun 2023 03:17 UTC

On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 7:19:15 PM UTC-7, Leslie Mahler wrote:
> Someone has figured out the line of descent, as given here:
> https://www.geni.com/people/Edith-Blaker/6000000029153359019
>
> Edith Henrietta Georgina Wingfield-Digby is the 4th child, recorded in Burke:

Interesting. Ruvigny doesn't list her.

Genealogics doesn't have any ancestry for the father of Rev. John Digby Wingfield Digby. He has four lines of descent from Edward IV.

Edward IV had an illegitimate dau:
A1) Margaret Plantagenet m. Sir Thomas Lumley (c.1462-1503) and had two daus A2 and D2 (see below)
A2) Sybil Lumley (c.1480-by 1526) m. William, 9th Lord Hilton (d. by 1537), and had a son A3 and two daus B3 & C3 (see below)
A3) William, 11th Lord Hilton (c.1508-1562) m. Margaret Metcalfe (d. 1566), and had
A4) William, 12th Lord Hilton (c.1535-1600) m. Anne Yorke (descended from Edward I), and had
A5) Thomas Hilton, Heir of Hilton Castle (c.1560-1598) m. Anne Bowes (c.1563-1608, descended from Edward I), and had
A6) Jane Hilton (c. 1584-1645) m. 1) Sir Ralph Delaval of Seaton Delaval Hall (see D5 below), and had
A7) Dorothy Delaval (1604-1662) m. John Hedworth of Harraton Hall (see C6 below), and had
A8) John Hedworth of Harraton Hall (1630-1656) m. Susan Grey (see B7 below), and had
A9) John Hedworth of Harraton Hall (c.1652-1683) m. Anne James (b. c.1655), and had
A10) Elizabeth Hedworth (1680-1736) m. Sir William Williamson, 4th Baronet of East Markham (1681-1747, descended from Edward I), and had
A11) Anne Williamson (1706-1780) m. William Whinfield of Cleadon Tower (1702-1763, descended from Edward III), and had
A12) George Wingfield of Cotham (c.1735-1774) m. Mary Barkas (d. 1778), and had
A13) WILLIAM WINGFIELD, later WINGFIELD-BAKER, of Orsett Hall, Essex, M.P. Bodmin 1806-1807, bap. 20 July 1772 St Michael & All Angels Church, Mickleham, Surrey; d. 21 Mar. 1858 Sherborne Castle, Dorset, bur. 30 Mar. 1858 St Giles & All Saints Churchyard, Orsett, Essex; m. 1st 22 July 1796 Sherborne Abbey, Dorset, Lady CHARLOTTE MARIA DIGBY (b. 18 Jan. 1772 Lower Brook Street, London, bap. 11 Feb. 1772 St George Hanover Square, London; d. 15 May 1807 Hampstead, Middlesex, bur. 23 May 1807 St John Church, Hampstead), dau of Henry, 1st Earl Digby (1731-1793, descended from Edward III) & Mary Knowler (1745-1794), and had
A14) Rev. JOHN DIGBY WINGFIELD DIGBY (1799-1878)

B3) Elizabeth Hilton m. Marmaduke Threlkeld of Easthorpe (1531-1593), and had
B4) Elizabeth Threlkeld (d. 1585) m. Matthew Amcotts of Vere Temple, and had
B5) Matthew Amcotts of Wickenby (b. 1585) m. Susan Velez de Guevara, and had
B6) Susan Amcotts m. George Grey of Southwick (c.1575-c.1661, descended from Edward III), and had
B7) Susan Grey m. 1) John Hedworth of Harraton Hall (see A8 above)

C3) Anne Hilton (b. c.1515) m. Sir Ralph Hedworth of Harraton Hall (c.1517-1566), and had
C4) John Hedworth of Harraton Hall (c.1537-1600) m. Jane Bellasis (c.1535-1601), and had
C5) Ralph Hedworth, heir of Harraton Hall (c.1564-1590) m. Jane Rutland (descended from Edward III), and had
C6) John Hedworth of Harraton Hall (1587-1643) m. 2) Dorothy Delaval (see A7 above)

D2) Anne Lumley (b. c.1495) m. Robert, 4th Lord Ogle (c.1490-1532, descended from Edward III), and had
D3) Agnes Ogle m. Sir John Delaval of Seaton Delaval Hall (by 1523-1572, descended from Edward III), and had
D4) Sir Robert Delaval of Seaton Delaval Hall (by 1542-1607) m. Dorothy Gray (c.1554-bef.1600, descended from Edward III), and had
D5) Sir Ralph Delaval of Seaton Delaval Hall (c.1575-1628) m. Jane Hilton (see A6 above)

Cheers, ----Brad

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: starbuck95@hotmail.com (JBrand)
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 by: JBrand - Sat, 10 Jun 2023 03:57 UTC

On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:19:15 PM UTC-4, Leslie Mahler wrote:
> On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 9:36:46 AM UTC-5, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> > On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:30:19 AM UTC-4, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> > > On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:10:01 AM UTC-4, Johnny Brananas wrote:
> > > > i.e., the mother of "The British Bombshell," actress Anna Lee. Nee Joan Boniface Winnifrith.
> > > >
> > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Lee
> > > >
> > > > The name "Digby-Roper" sounds a bit posh.
> > > >
> > > > Anna Lee was fairly well-known as an actress, featuring in "How Green Was My Valley," "What Ever Happened to Baby Jane," "The Unsinkable Molly Brown," "The Sound of Music," "In Like Flint," and various TV and soap roles.
> > > Here the surname is given as "Digby Blaker" ...
> > > https://collections.westminster.org.uk/index.php/winnifrith-alfred-john-digby-1908-1993
> > >
> > > There may be some (illegitimate) connection to the gentry Digby family. Anna Lee's autobiography says, "One evening after dinner, Colonel Wingfield Digby showed me the family portraits. He pointed to one, a man dressed all in black, John Digby Wingfield Digby (yes, a double Digby), the Rector of Coleshill. 'He is the great-great grandfather that you and Simon have in common,' he explained."
> > >
> > > There are also references to a Digby daughter having an illegitimate child (apparently, ... I can only see snippets). Possibly that child was Anna Lee's mother?
> > The Wingfield Digbys connected to Coleshill, Warwickshire ...
> > https://www.google.com/books/edition/A_Genealogical_and_Heraldic_History_of_t/3RVXAAAAYAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=%22john+digby+wingfield+digby%22+coleshill&pg=RA1-PA503&printsec=frontcover
> Someone has figured out the line of descent, as given here:

https://www.geni.com/people/Edith-Blaker/6000000029153359019

Note that the birth year given here for Edith Digby (1825) would make her age 49 or 50 at the birth of Edith Maude. Possible, but seems a bit fishy. Unless the 1825 birth was just a guess (it could be, as Brad says the parents married in 1826).

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: bradverity@dhdesigns.com (Brad Verity)
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 by: Brad Verity - Sat, 10 Jun 2023 05:38 UTC

On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 8:57:06 PM UTC-7, JBrand wrote:
> https://www.geni.com/people/Edith-Blaker/6000000029153359019
> Note that the birth year given here for Edith Digby (1825) would make her age 49 or 50 at the birth of Edith Maude. Possible, but seems a bit fishy. Unless the 1825 birth was just a guess (it could be, as Brad says the parents married in 1826).

EDITH HENRIETTA GEORGIANA WINGFIELD DIGBY, b. 14 Nov. 1847 Clarence Buildings, Weymouth, Dorset, christened privately, bap. 15 June 1848 St Andrew Church, West Stafford, Dorset; d. umm. 13 Mar. 1935 Ethelburg, Rempstone Road, Swanage, Dorset.

Her paternal grandfather assumed the surname Baker in addition to Wingfield.. 'Baker' is very similar to 'Blaker', the surname of the father in the baptism entry for Edith Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith.

Cheers, ---Brad

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: bradverity@dhdesigns.com (Brad Verity)
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 by: Brad Verity - Sat, 10 Jun 2023 07:41 UTC

On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:38:17 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
> Her paternal grandfather assumed the surname Baker in addition to Wingfield. 'Baker' is very similar to 'Blaker', the surname of the father in the baptism entry for Edith Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith.

Some family trees on Ancestry have the father of Edith Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith as John Henry Macfarlane.

JOHN HENRY MACFARLANE of 4 Bridge Street, Bath died 24 January 1916, bur. 27 Jan. 1916 Abbey Cemetery, Bath, age 88. Administration of his estate was granted 14 Mar. 1916 to Ellen Jane Macfarlane widow, and was re-granted (with his Will) 3 January 1940 to Edith Maude Winnifrith widow.

Clara Emily Macfarlane, dau of John Henry Macfarlane of Widcombe, Bath "Professor of Music" & his wife Diana, was baptized 11 Feb. 1846 Temple Church, Bristol.

On 21 Feb. 1851, Kate Elvina Macfarlane and Marion Eliza Macfarlane were christened in Bath Abbey, daughters of John Henry Macfarlane of Bath Street, "Teacher of Music" and his wife Emily.

In the 1851 England Census, John Henry Macfarlane of Bath, age 25, was a "Professor of the Piano Forte" with wife Emily age 27 and daughters Kate E age 2 and Marian E age 5 months

Marian Eliza Macfarlane was bur. 1 Sep. 1851 Bath Abbey.

John Henry Macfarlane age 27 "Tutor", son of "Peter Macfarlane merchant" married 5 Sep. 1854 St Clement Danes, London, Emily Diana Cottle age 31 spinster, dau of Joseph Cottle farmer.

In the 1861 England Census, John Henry Macfarlane of Bath, age 33, was an "organist", with wife Emily age 31, daughters Clara M age 14, Kate E age 11, and sons Walter H age 8 and Edgar A age 5.

John Henry Macfarlane of Bath, age 41, widower and "Professor of music", son of "Peter Macfarlane, merchant", married 28 February 1872 Christ Church, Clifton, Bristol, Marion Day, widow, daughter of Frederick Lanning, farmer.

John Henry Macfarlane, age 52, widower and "Tutor", son of "Peter Macfarlane, banker", married 6 June 1894 St John Evangelist Fitzroy Square, London, Ellen Jane Blake, age 46, spinster, daughter of "George Blake, builder".

Ellen Jane Blake, daughter of George Blake of Bath, painter, was christened 25 July 1852 St Saviour Church, Bath. Ellen Jane Macfarlane died 20 June 1939 Bath, age 87.

In the 1881 England Census, Ellen J. Blake, age 25, of 5 Lower East Hayes, Bath, "Music teacher", was living with her widowed mother.

The obituary of John Henry Macfarlane, in the Bath Chronicle 29 Jan. 1916, mentions that among the chief mourners at his funeral were "Mrs Macfarlane (widow)" and "Mrs Winnifrith (niece)".

In the Victorian/Edwardian era, an illegitimate daughter could be passed off as a niece. The christening of Emily Maude Blaker in Bristol in 1877 listed her parents as "Henry and Ellen Blaker". John Henry Macfarlane's third wife and widow was born Ellen Jane Blake.

Was Emily Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith, the daughter of John Henry Macfarlane by Edith Henrietta Georgiana Wingfield Digby, or by his eventual third wife Ellen Jane Blake? Or an illegitimate daughter of either of those ladies by another man? Probably DNA could help determine.

Cheers, ----Brad

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: starbuck95@hotmail.com (JBrand)
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 by: JBrand - Sun, 11 Jun 2023 15:10 UTC

On Saturday, June 10, 2023 at 3:41:03 AM UTC-4, Brad Verity wrote:
> On Friday, June 9, 2023 at 10:38:17 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
> > Her paternal grandfather assumed the surname Baker in addition to Wingfield. 'Baker' is very similar to 'Blaker', the surname of the father in the baptism entry for Edith Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith.
> Some family trees on Ancestry have the father of Edith Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith as John Henry Macfarlane.
>
> JOHN HENRY MACFARLANE of 4 Bridge Street, Bath died 24 January 1916, bur. 27 Jan. 1916 Abbey Cemetery, Bath, age 88. Administration of his estate was granted 14 Mar. 1916 to Ellen Jane Macfarlane widow, and was re-granted (with his Will) 3 January 1940 to Edith Maude Winnifrith widow.
>
> Clara Emily Macfarlane, dau of John Henry Macfarlane of Widcombe, Bath "Professor of Music" & his wife Diana, was baptized 11 Feb. 1846 Temple Church, Bristol.
>
> On 21 Feb. 1851, Kate Elvina Macfarlane and Marion Eliza Macfarlane were christened in Bath Abbey, daughters of John Henry Macfarlane of Bath Street, "Teacher of Music" and his wife Emily.
>
> In the 1851 England Census, John Henry Macfarlane of Bath, age 25, was a "Professor of the Piano Forte" with wife Emily age 27 and daughters Kate E age 2 and Marian E age 5 months
>
> Marian Eliza Macfarlane was bur. 1 Sep. 1851 Bath Abbey.
>
> John Henry Macfarlane age 27 "Tutor", son of "Peter Macfarlane merchant" married 5 Sep. 1854 St Clement Danes, London, Emily Diana Cottle age 31 spinster, dau of Joseph Cottle farmer.
>
> In the 1861 England Census, John Henry Macfarlane of Bath, age 33, was an "organist", with wife Emily age 31, daughters Clara M age 14, Kate E age 11, and sons Walter H age 8 and Edgar A age 5.
>
> John Henry Macfarlane of Bath, age 41, widower and "Professor of music", son of "Peter Macfarlane, merchant", married 28 February 1872 Christ Church, Clifton, Bristol, Marion Day, widow, daughter of Frederick Lanning, farmer.
>
> John Henry Macfarlane, age 52, widower and "Tutor", son of "Peter Macfarlane, banker", married 6 June 1894 St John Evangelist Fitzroy Square, London, Ellen Jane Blake, age 46, spinster, daughter of "George Blake, builder".
>
> Ellen Jane Blake, daughter of George Blake of Bath, painter, was christened 25 July 1852 St Saviour Church, Bath. Ellen Jane Macfarlane died 20 June 1939 Bath, age 87.
>
> In the 1881 England Census, Ellen J. Blake, age 25, of 5 Lower East Hayes, Bath, "Music teacher", was living with her widowed mother.
>
> The obituary of John Henry Macfarlane, in the Bath Chronicle 29 Jan. 1916, mentions that among the chief mourners at his funeral were "Mrs Macfarlane (widow)" and "Mrs Winnifrith (niece)".
>
> In the Victorian/Edwardian era, an illegitimate daughter could be passed off as a niece. The christening of Emily Maude Blaker in Bristol in 1877 listed her parents as "Henry and Ellen Blaker". John Henry Macfarlane's third wife and widow was born Ellen Jane Blake.
>
> Was Emily Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith, the daughter of John Henry Macfarlane by Edith Henrietta Georgiana Wingfield Digby, or by his eventual third wife Ellen Jane Blake? Or an illegitimate daughter of either of those ladies by another man? Probably DNA could help determine.
>
> Cheers, ----Brad

Right, DNA may be their last hope for resolving this ...

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Date: Mon, 12 Jun 2023 22:47:27 -0700 (PDT)
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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: bradverity@dhdesigns.com (Brad Verity)
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 by: Brad Verity - Tue, 13 Jun 2023 05:47 UTC

On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:10:56 AM UTC-7, JBrand wrote:
> Right, DNA may be their last hope for resolving this ...

I read 'Family History and a Maternal Mystery', the second chapter of Anna Lee's autobiography, published in 2014, ten years after her death: "My mother's genealogy is shrouded in mystery and conjecture."

The Simon with whom Anna Lee was told she shared a great-great-grandfather, Rev. John Digby Wingfield Digby (1799-1878), was (Kenelm) Simon Wingfield Digby (1910-1998), later a Conservative M.P. for West Dorset 1941-74:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Wingfield_Digby

Lee describes finding out from her mother at a young age that Simon Wingfield Digby was her cousin, then some years later as a young stage actress, met him in person in 1929. He took her on a visit to Sherborne Castle, which is when his father Col. Wingfield Digby confirmed that Lee's ancestor was Rev. Wingfield Digby.

It was Anna Lee and Simon Wingfield Digby who then tried to discover the exact relationship. They determined the likeliest candidate for being Lee's maternal grandmother was Edith Wingfield Digby (1847-1935), who never married and after her clergyman father's death, founded a home for unwed mothers in Bournemouth.

Sir Arthur Cochrane, then Clarenceux King of Arms, did his own research after his daughter became engaged to Anna Lee's brother John Winnifrith (later knighted). Sir Arthur discovered that the man, Henry Blaker, seaman, listed as father on the 1875 birth registration of Edith Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith, was not a Captain in the Royal Navy, as Mrs. Winnifrith had always told her children. There was no record of a Henry Blaker in the Admiralty records. Lee and her brother were also surprised to see that Ellen (Wilton) Blake, listed on the birth registration as the mother, was Ellen Jane (Blake) Macfarlane, a woman whom they had always known as their mother's aunt. Edith Winnifrith was so upset at Sir Arthur's attempts to trace her genealogy, that she refused to speak to him at the wedding of her son to his daughter.

But they could never get the full truth from their mother, nor from Ellen Macfarlane, whom they called Aunt Nellie, nor from elder Wingfield Digby relations. Anna Lee, her brother, and their cousin Simon Wingfield Digby, presumed that Edith Wingfield Digby could not, in 1875, when her father was still living, have been able to reasonably explain the sudden appearance of a baby, and so Ellen Blake, was paid off to claim the infant, Edith Maude, as her own.

Edith Wingfield Digby died at age 87 in 1935, and shortly before her passing, Anna Lee recalls her mother made a trip to Bournemouth and returned with a suitcase full of 50 and 100-pound bank notes. "It is a legacy from an old friend" was her mother's explanation.

Apparently, from family trees on Ancestry, Wingfield Digby and Winnifrith descendants have accepted the identification of Edith Wingfield Digby as the birth mother of Edith (Blaker) Winnifrith.

A couple points in favour of that conclusion.

1) John Henry Macfarlane, the music professor in Bath, whom Ellen Jane Blake, a music teacher in the 1881 Census, married in 1894, after living as his common law wife for a few years, can be ruled out as the father of Edith (Blaker) Winnifrith. Macfarlane had three daughters with his first wife Emily Diana Cottle, before their marriage in 1854, and fully acknowledged them as his own. If he had a daughter Edith with his third wife Ellen Blake, several years before their marriage, he would not have had an issue acknowledging her as such in public. Instead she was said to be his wife Ellen's niece.

2) Ellen Blake was from a working class family in Bath, who was living as a music teacher with her widowed mother in both the 1881 and 1891 Censuses. Her niece, her brother's daughter Ada Jessie Blake (1867-1913), a dressmaker, was living with them in both Censuses. If Ellen had a daughter of her own, born in 1875, it seems like she would have been included in the household with her mother and grandmother. Edith (Blaker) Winnifrith told her children she lived at Sherborne Castle after her mother died, until going to live with her Aunt Nellie and Uncle Jack Macfarlane in Bath. Edith not living with Ellen Blake in Bath in 1881 and 1891, backs up her story that she went to live with her Aunt Nellie when she was married to her Uncle. Ellen and John Henry Macfarlane were not married until 1894. The Wingfield Digbys, including Edith Wingfield Digby, were not in residence at Sherborne Castle when found in the 1881 and 1891 Censuses. So I'm not able to see if there was a girl living at the Castle in those years who matches the age of Edith Blaker (b. 1875) to verify her account told to her children.

Two facts throw a bit of a wrench into the conclusion arrived at by Anna Lee, her brother and Simon Wingfield Digby.

1) Anna Lee assumed that her mother's birth registration, signed by her Aunt Nellie (Ellen Blake Macfarlane) had been forged. I don't believe it could have been forged years afterwards, so it actually had been signed by Ellen Blake in the fall of 1875. In it she made up a false maiden name for herself, 'Wilton'. It doesn't seem Anna Lee or Simon Wingfield Digby were aware of the 1875 baptism of Edith Maude Blaker, daughter of Henry Blaker seaman and Ellen, in the parish register of Bishopston, Bristol. It was performed by Rev. George Wright Bence (c.1826-1898), Vicar of Bishopston 1862-89, Honorary Canon of Bristol 1884, Rector of Broad Blunsdon, Wilts 1889-98. Could the vicar have been in on an arrangement made by the Wingfield Digbys with Ellen Blake, and christened the two-month-old infant Edith Maude as the daughter of a fictitious father and pretend mother? It would be useful to see if there was ever a connection between Rev. Bence with Rev. Wingfield Digby and his family. For there doesn't seem to be any immediate connection with the Wingfield Digbys to Bishopton, nor one with Ellen Blake of Bath, to that Bristol parish.

2) Anna Lee could never figure out how Ellen Blake came to be the registered mother (now we know in two documents - the civil birth registration and the parish register) of her own mother Edith Blaker in 1875. She assumed she was brought to the attention of the Wingfield Digbys through the servants. It's interesting that a 23-year-old from Bath (six years later a music teacher) was selected by the landed gentry family to be the mother-on-paper of an illegitimate baby of a clergyman's daughter. Could Lee and her cousin Simon have deduced incorrectly? Were the documents correct and Edith Maude Blaker was actually the biological daughter of Ellen Blake? DNA could resolve the question.

But in its absence, I think the conclusion Anna Lee reached about the identity of her maternal grandmother, Edith Wingfield Digby, is convincing, and I've made the connection in my own database.

It's been interesting to delve into this. I saw the movie 'How Green Was My Valley' for the first time a few months ago, and thought it was great. Anna Lee was indeed a beauty.

Cheers, ---Brad

Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?

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Subject: Re: Who was Edith Maude Digby-Roper?
From: starbuck95@hotmail.com (JBrand)
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 by: JBrand - Wed, 14 Jun 2023 15:59 UTC

On Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 1:47:28 AM UTC-4, Brad Verity wrote:
> On Sunday, June 11, 2023 at 8:10:56 AM UTC-7, JBrand wrote:
> > Right, DNA may be their last hope for resolving this ...
> I read 'Family History and a Maternal Mystery', the second chapter of Anna Lee's autobiography, published in 2014, ten years after her death: "My mother's genealogy is shrouded in mystery and conjecture."
>
> The Simon with whom Anna Lee was told she shared a great-great-grandfather, Rev. John Digby Wingfield Digby (1799-1878), was (Kenelm) Simon Wingfield Digby (1910-1998), later a Conservative M.P. for West Dorset 1941-74:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Wingfield_Digby
>
> Lee describes finding out from her mother at a young age that Simon Wingfield Digby was her cousin, then some years later as a young stage actress, met him in person in 1929. He took her on a visit to Sherborne Castle, which is when his father Col. Wingfield Digby confirmed that Lee's ancestor was Rev. Wingfield Digby.
>
> It was Anna Lee and Simon Wingfield Digby who then tried to discover the exact relationship. They determined the likeliest candidate for being Lee's maternal grandmother was Edith Wingfield Digby (1847-1935), who never married and after her clergyman father's death, founded a home for unwed mothers in Bournemouth.
>
> Sir Arthur Cochrane, then Clarenceux King of Arms, did his own research after his daughter became engaged to Anna Lee's brother John Winnifrith (later knighted). Sir Arthur discovered that the man, Henry Blaker, seaman, listed as father on the 1875 birth registration of Edith Maude (Blaker) Winnifrith, was not a Captain in the Royal Navy, as Mrs. Winnifrith had always told her children. There was no record of a Henry Blaker in the Admiralty records. Lee and her brother were also surprised to see that Ellen (Wilton) Blake, listed on the birth registration as the mother, was Ellen Jane (Blake) Macfarlane, a woman whom they had always known as their mother's aunt. Edith Winnifrith was so upset at Sir Arthur's attempts to trace her genealogy, that she refused to speak to him at the wedding of her son to his daughter..
>
> But they could never get the full truth from their mother, nor from Ellen Macfarlane, whom they called Aunt Nellie, nor from elder Wingfield Digby relations. Anna Lee, her brother, and their cousin Simon Wingfield Digby, presumed that Edith Wingfield Digby could not, in 1875, when her father was still living, have been able to reasonably explain the sudden appearance of a baby, and so Ellen Blake, was paid off to claim the infant, Edith Maude, as her own.
>
> Edith Wingfield Digby died at age 87 in 1935, and shortly before her passing, Anna Lee recalls her mother made a trip to Bournemouth and returned with a suitcase full of 50 and 100-pound bank notes. "It is a legacy from an old friend" was her mother's explanation.
>
> Apparently, from family trees on Ancestry, Wingfield Digby and Winnifrith descendants have accepted the identification of Edith Wingfield Digby as the birth mother of Edith (Blaker) Winnifrith.
>
> A couple points in favour of that conclusion.
>
> 1) John Henry Macfarlane, the music professor in Bath, whom Ellen Jane Blake, a music teacher in the 1881 Census, married in 1894, after living as his common law wife for a few years, can be ruled out as the father of Edith (Blaker) Winnifrith. Macfarlane had three daughters with his first wife Emily Diana Cottle, before their marriage in 1854, and fully acknowledged them as his own. If he had a daughter Edith with his third wife Ellen Blake, several years before their marriage, he would not have had an issue acknowledging her as such in public. Instead she was said to be his wife Ellen's niece.
>
> 2) Ellen Blake was from a working class family in Bath, who was living as a music teacher with her widowed mother in both the 1881 and 1891 Censuses.. Her niece, her brother's daughter Ada Jessie Blake (1867-1913), a dressmaker, was living with them in both Censuses. If Ellen had a daughter of her own, born in 1875, it seems like she would have been included in the household with her mother and grandmother. Edith (Blaker) Winnifrith told her children she lived at Sherborne Castle after her mother died, until going to live with her Aunt Nellie and Uncle Jack Macfarlane in Bath. Edith not living with Ellen Blake in Bath in 1881 and 1891, backs up her story that she went to live with her Aunt Nellie when she was married to her Uncle. Ellen and John Henry Macfarlane were not married until 1894. The Wingfield Digbys, including Edith Wingfield Digby, were not in residence at Sherborne Castle when found in the 1881 and 1891 Censuses. So I'm not able to see if there was a girl living at the Castle in those years who matches the age of Edith Blaker (b. 1875) to verify her account told to her children.
>
> Two facts throw a bit of a wrench into the conclusion arrived at by Anna Lee, her brother and Simon Wingfield Digby.
>
> 1) Anna Lee assumed that her mother's birth registration, signed by her Aunt Nellie (Ellen Blake Macfarlane) had been forged. I don't believe it could have been forged years afterwards, so it actually had been signed by Ellen Blake in the fall of 1875. In it she made up a false maiden name for herself, 'Wilton'. It doesn't seem Anna Lee or Simon Wingfield Digby were aware of the 1875 baptism of Edith Maude Blaker, daughter of Henry Blaker seaman and Ellen, in the parish register of Bishopston, Bristol. It was performed by Rev. George Wright Bence (c.1826-1898), Vicar of Bishopston 1862-89, Honorary Canon of Bristol 1884, Rector of Broad Blunsdon, Wilts 1889-98. Could the vicar have been in on an arrangement made by the Wingfield Digbys with Ellen Blake, and christened the two-month-old infant Edith Maude as the daughter of a fictitious father and pretend mother? It would be useful to see if there was ever a connection between Rev. Bence with Rev. Wingfield Digby and his family. For there doesn't seem to be any immediate connection with the Wingfield Digbys to Bishopton, nor one with Ellen Blake of Bath, to that Bristol parish.
>
> 2) Anna Lee could never figure out how Ellen Blake came to be the registered mother (now we know in two documents - the civil birth registration and the parish register) of her own mother Edith Blaker in 1875. She assumed she was brought to the attention of the Wingfield Digbys through the servants. It's interesting that a 23-year-old from Bath (six years later a music teacher) was selected by the landed gentry family to be the mother-on-paper of an illegitimate baby of a clergyman's daughter. Could Lee and her cousin Simon have deduced incorrectly? Were the documents correct and Edith Maude Blaker was actually the biological daughter of Ellen Blake? DNA could resolve the question.
>
> But in its absence, I think the conclusion Anna Lee reached about the identity of her maternal grandmother, Edith Wingfield Digby, is convincing, and I've made the connection in my own database.
>
> It's been interesting to delve into this. I saw the movie 'How Green Was My Valley' for the first time a few months ago, and thought it was great. Anna Lee was indeed a beauty.
>
> Cheers, ---Brad

Anna Lee's use of the name "Venetia" for a daughter presumably indicates a belief in her Digby descent.

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