The descendants of Juan Montes Vigil are descended from Charlemagne through the illegitimate daughter of Alfonso IX. Her name was Aldonza Alfonso de Leon. This means tens of thousands of Vigil descendants mostly in New Mexico and Colorado recently found out their noble connection.

https://sites.google.com/site/beyondoriginsofnmfamilies/nm-families-a-z/montes-vigil-royal-lineage

https://www.lcsun-news.com/story/news/local/2019/07/15/new-mexico-vigil-descendant-european-emperor-charlemagne/1735327001/

On Thursday, September 21, 2023 at 7:40:57 PM UTC-7, Andrew Sullivan wrote:
> The descendants of Juan Montes Vigil are descended from Charlemagne through the illegitimate daughter of Alfonso IX. Her name was Aldonza Alfonso de Leon. This means tens of thousands of Vigil descendants mostly in New Mexico and Colorado recently found out their noble connection.
>
> https://sites.google.com/site/beyondoriginsofnmfamilies/nm-families-a-z/montes-vigil-royal-lineage
>
> https://www.lcsun-news.com/story/news/local/2019/07/15/new-mexico-vigil-descendant-european-emperor-charlemagne/1735327001/

Interesting
I wish this gave me another royal descent
All of these people are my cousins, however this is because a few of my French DesMarais, went to New Mexico and intermarried with the Spanish lines shown here. So they are my cousins, but not my own ancestors.

On Thursday, September 21, 2023 at 7:40:57 PM UTC-7, Andrew Sullivan wrote:
> The descendants of Juan Montes Vigil are descended from Charlemagne through the illegitimate daughter of Alfonso IX. Her name was Aldonza Alfonso de Leon. This means tens of thousands of Vigil descendants mostly in New Mexico and Colorado recently found out their noble connection.
>
> https://sites.google.com/site/beyondoriginsofnmfamilies/nm-families-a-z/montes-vigil-royal-lineage
>
> https://www.lcsun-news.com/story/news/local/2019/07/15/new-mexico-vigil-descendant-european-emperor-charlemagne/1735327001/

There is another Charlemagne line, in addition to the one shown, if one accepts the Vermandois/Capet marriage. It goes through the Burgundy dukedom and Afonso I of Portugal to the mother of Alfonso IX of León.

Additional notes:

The line down to the Ponce de León is solid. I am not familiar below that.

There are some surnames in the presentation that look out of place. In particular, Inés de Miranda y Ponce de León predates common use of the modern Spanish paternal and maternal dual surnames. Most people in this period used only a single surname, usually paternal but occasionally maternal, and in her time we are entering a period when there were some arbitrary choices of other ancestral surnames that one sees in the 16th century and into the next, e.g. that of a grandmother or great-grandmother, as in some of the 5-generation trees of his contemporaries that Salazar y Castro recorded in the late 17th century, and in some of the documented records of early conquistadors. I can't exclude that someone might coincidentally adopt this style as a one-off, rather than as part of ordinary practice, since this was a period of experimentation and you see some unexpected combinations, but it seems anachronistic.

A sexta-feira, 22 de setembro de 2023 à(s) 03:40:57 UTC+1, Andrew Sullivan escreveu:
> The descendants of Juan Montes Vigil are descended from Charlemagne through the illegitimate daughter of Alfonso IX. Her name was Aldonza Alfonso de Leon. This means tens of thousands of Vigil descendants mostly in New Mexico and Colorado recently found out their noble connection.
>
> https://sites.google.com/site/beyondoriginsofnmfamilies/nm-families-a-z/montes-vigil-royal-lineage
>
> https://www.lcsun-news.com/story/news/local/2019/07/15/new-mexico-vigil-descendant-european-emperor-charlemagne/1735327001/
This was already discussed in the newsgroup back in 2019, read https://groups.google.com/g/soc.genealogy.medieval/c/sRCZbhqryus/m/zjyAiOWFAAAJ.

On Monday, September 25, 2023 at 11:01:00 AM UTC-7, taf wrote:
> On Thursday, September 21, 2023 at 7:40:57 PM UTC-7, Andrew Sullivan wrote:
> > The descendants of Juan Montes Vigil are descended from Charlemagne through the illegitimate daughter of Alfonso IX. Her name was Aldonza Alfonso de Leon. This means tens of thousands of Vigil descendants mostly in New Mexico and Colorado recently found out their noble connection.
> >
> > https://sites.google.com/site/beyondoriginsofnmfamilies/nm-families-a-z/montes-vigil-royal-lineage
> >
> > https://www.lcsun-news.com/story/news/local/2019/07/15/new-mexico-vigil-descendant-european-emperor-charlemagne/1735327001/
> There is another Charlemagne line, in addition to the one shown, if one accepts the Vermandois/Capet marriage. It goes through the Burgundy dukedom and Afonso I of Portugal to the mother of Alfonso IX of León.
>
> Additional notes:
>
> The line down to the Ponce de León is solid. I am not familiar below that.
>
> There are some surnames in the presentation that look out of place. In particular, Inés de Miranda y Ponce de León predates common use of the modern Spanish paternal and maternal dual surnames.

With Paulo's pointer to the previous discussion, which includes sources, I can now supplement this.

The claimed primary sources that give the name of this woman are:

- In his testament dated 13 October 1456, Martyn Vazquez de Quirós identifies his wife as “Ignes de Miranda,” recording her surname.

- A sixteenth-century epitaph for Diego de Miranda (d. abt. 1506), identifies him as “fijo de Martín Vásques de Quirós e de donna Inés Ponce de Miranda,” recording Ponce as a surname of Inés.

- González Calle also summarizes this document, dated to the period 1470–1474: “Menén Peláez y María Peláez solicitan al juez correspondiente que les dé posesión de los bienes de María González, quien les había proahijado, y que establezca un coto o multa a quien les contraviniese de 600 maravedíes ‘para la parte del señor Diego de Miranda e de su madre sennora dona Ynés de Miranda’ y de 48 maravedíes para el propio juez (Fernández Suárez, 1993: doc. 287).” Citing: Ana Fernández Suárez, Registro notariales del archivo de la Casa de Valdecarzana (1397–1495) (Oviedo, 1993), doc. 207.

We thus have two calling her Ines de Miranda and one calling her Ines Ponce de Miranda, with none giving the dual surnames I originally flagged. What is unclear is whether she: a) used alternative surname forms, Ponce de Miranda versus de Miranda, at different times, b) if she went by de Minerva but the later epitaph wished to stress the Ponce de Leon link so added something she never used, Ponce, to or before her surname, or c) if Ponce was fulfilling the role of pseudo-middle-name typically played by patronymic-derived forms (often omitted, particularly for women, in this period), with de Miranda being the full surname in each case.