On Saturday, 9 July 2022 at 10:09:44 UTC+1, Dominic O'Ceallaigh wrote:
> On Saturday, 22 February 2020 at 19:34:48 UTC, curly...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > > Kay
> >
> > Hello, I thought I would add that Hugh Fitz Grip and Hadvise, were parents to Hugh Boscherbert, he then headed up the Boscherville line. If you go to Rouen, or look on the map of that area it clearly shows places with each of the Boscher/Bascher line families. You will find this information confirmed in the land holdings belonging to Hadvise/Hawise and Hugh Boscherbert
> Hi Kay, My birth surname was Basher which seems to be derived from Boscher/Bascher. I just discovered this group yesterday and had no idea there was so much information about the early history of what is possibly a related lineage. Any advice on where to investigate further would be welcome! Thanks, Dominic (gluingel at gmail dot com)

Fitz Grip Martel was son of Geoffrey Martel. He married Hadvise Bausquervile or some thing similar. I have researched these families pretty vigourosly as they form the top of my tree. The Boschervilles became Boskervilles Boschers but did not become Baskervilles, the Baskerviles came from above Hadvise. I would think that the Baschers came from the Baskervilles, it would make more sense. All the families had distinct family trees that only really changed because of the use of English as apposed to French. They were after all literate. There is also the Boseviles as well. Each of these lines had distinct villages/land around Rouen. So I guessed that it was a father handing out land to various sons etc.
The Martels got their name from Martel in the South of France. It means hammer.

On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 9:37:52 AM UTC-7, Caroline Bosker wrote:
> On Saturday, 9 July 2022 at 10:09:44 UTC+1, Dominic O'Ceallaigh wrote:
> > On Saturday, 22 February 2020 at 19:34:48 UTC, curly...@gmail.com wrote:
> >
> > > > Kay
> > >
> > > Hello, I thought I would add that Hugh Fitz Grip and Hadvise, were parents to Hugh Boscherbert, he then headed up the Boscherville line. If you go to Rouen, or look on the map of that area it clearly shows places with each of the Boscher/Bascher line families. You will find this information confirmed in the land holdings belonging to Hadvise/Hawise and Hugh Boscherbert
> > Hi Kay, My birth surname was Basher which seems to be derived from Boscher/Bascher. I just discovered this group yesterday and had no idea there was so much information about the early history of what is possibly a related lineage. Any advice on where to investigate further would be welcome! Thanks, Dominic (gluingel at gmail dot com)
> Fitz Grip Martel was son of Geoffrey Martel. He married Hadvise Bausquervile or some thing similar. I have researched these families pretty vigourosly as they form the top of my tree. The Boschervilles became Boskervilles Boschers but did not become Baskervilles, the Baskerviles came from above Hadvise. I would think that the Baschers came from the Baskervilles, it would make more sense. All the families had distinct family trees that only really changed because of the use of English as apposed to French. They were after all literate. There is also the Boseviles as well. Each of these lines had distinct villages/land around Rouen. So I guessed that it was a father handing out land to various sons etc.
> The Martels got their name from Martel in the South of France. It means hammer.

I feel like you haven't read this thread, since you sound so certain about things that are uncertain

On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 9:37:52 AM UTC-7, Caroline Bosker wrote:

> Fitz Grip Martel was son of Geoffrey Martel. He married Hadvise Bausquervile or some thing similar.

The correct name was Hugh fitz Grip. Fitz Grip = filius Grip - son of Grip. His given name was Hugh. 'Grip' is likely a garbled representation of a name unfamiliar to the chronicler; that it represents 'Geoffrey Martel' seems unlikely. 'Fitz Grip Martel' seems to beg the question, and I don't think there is any basis for the husband of Hadvise being called 'Martel', which was not a surname at the time, so even were he son of a man named Geoffrey Martel that doesn't mean he was also named Martel.

> The Martels got their name from Martel in the South of France. It means hammer.

This might have been the case for a minority of people named Martel, but the majority of them bore it as a nickname rather than a toponymic. This also means that 'the Martels' do not represent a coherent genealogical grouping, since such a nickname could have been borne by any number of unrelated people whom their contemporaries viewed as embodying the metaphorical characteristics of a hammer.

taf

On 25-Oct-23 3:24 PM, taf wrote:
> On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 9:37:52 AM UTC-7, Caroline Bosker wrote:
>
>> Fitz Grip Martel was son of Geoffrey Martel. He married Hadvise Bausquervile or some thing similar.
>
> The correct name was Hugh fitz Grip. Fitz Grip = filius Grip - son of Grip. His given name was Hugh. 'Grip' is likely a garbled representation of a name unfamiliar to the chronicler; that it represents 'Geoffrey Martel' seems unlikely. 'Fitz Grip Martel' seems to beg the question, and I don't think there is any basis for the husband of Hadvise being called 'Martel', which was not a surname at the time, so even were he son of a man named Geoffrey Martel that doesn't mean he was also named Martel.

Grippo was the name of a bishop of Rouen in the late 7th century, and
this was given for the father of Hugo of Wareham (sheriff of Dorset) in
the charter of his wife Hawise, Nicolas de Bacqueville's daughter, for
Montivilliers abbey evidently issued 1066/76 ("Ego Haduidis filia
Nicolai de Baschelvilla, uxor Hugonis de Varhan filii Gripponis", see
here:
https://pdnprod.unicaen.fr/scripta/ead.html?id=scripta&c=scripta_sc_6537,
and here:
https://thesauri.unicaen.fr/autorites/personnes/doc/pddn_p.1557738667237.html).
The same name was given for the father of Hugo's brother Walter in a
charter of their nephew William Martel, dapifer of King Stephen, for Eye
priory in the mid-12th century ("ego Willelmus Martell(us) dapifer regis
.... Walterus filius Grip avunculus meus").

Hawise and Hugo had no known offspring.

>
>> The Martels got their name from Martel in the South of France. It means hammer.
>
> This might have been the case for a minority of people named Martel, but the majority of them bore it as a nickname rather than a toponymic. This also means that 'the Martels' do not represent a coherent genealogical grouping, since such a nickname could have been borne by any number of unrelated people whom their contemporaries viewed as embodying the metaphorical characteristics of a hammer.

This Norman family surnamed Martel, lords at Bacqueville where their
eponymous castle has disappeared, lasted until the late-17th century -
they came from Angerville-la-Martel, ca 10 kms east of Fécamp. Nothing
to do with Martel in the département of Lot in south-western France.

Peter Stewart

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

On Wednesday, 25 October 2023 at 06:30:28 UTC+1, Peter Stewart wrote:
> On 25-Oct-23 3:24 PM, taf wrote:
> > On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 9:37:52 AM UTC-7, Caroline Bosker wrote:
> >
> >> Fitz Grip Martel was son of Geoffrey Martel. He married Hadvise Bausquervile or some thing similar.
> >
> > The correct name was Hugh fitz Grip. Fitz Grip = filius Grip - son of Grip. His given name was Hugh. 'Grip' is likely a garbled representation of a name unfamiliar to the chronicler; that it represents 'Geoffrey Martel' seems unlikely. 'Fitz Grip Martel' seems to beg the question, and I don't think there is any basis for the husband of Hadvise being called 'Martel', which was not a surname at the time, so even were he son of a man named Geoffrey Martel that doesn't mean he was also named Martel.
> Grippo was the name of a bishop of Rouen in the late 7th century, and
> this was given for the father of Hugo of Wareham (sheriff of Dorset) in
> the charter of his wife Hawise, Nicolas de Bacqueville's daughter, for
> Montivilliers abbey evidently issued 1066/76 ("Ego Haduidis filia
> Nicolai de Baschelvilla, uxor Hugonis de Varhan filii Gripponis", see
> here:
> https://pdnprod.unicaen.fr/scripta/ead.html?id=scripta&c=scripta_sc_6537,
> and here:
> https://thesauri.unicaen.fr/autorites/personnes/doc/pddn_p.1557738667237.html).
> The same name was given for the father of Hugo's brother Walter in a
> charter of their nephew William Martel, dapifer of King Stephen, for Eye
> priory in the mid-12th century ("ego Willelmus Martell(us) dapifer regis
> ... Walterus filius Grip avunculus meus").
>
> Hawise and Hugo had no known offspring.
> >
> >> The Martels got their name from Martel in the South of France. It means hammer.
> >
> > This might have been the case for a minority of people named Martel, but the majority of them bore it as a nickname rather than a toponymic. This also means that 'the Martels' do not represent a coherent genealogical grouping, since such a nickname could have been borne by any number of unrelated people whom their contemporaries viewed as embodying the metaphorical characteristics of a hammer.
> This Norman family surnamed Martel, lords at Bacqueville where their
> eponymous castle has disappeared, lasted until the late-17th century -
> they came from Angerville-la-Martel, ca 10 kms east of Fécamp. Nothing
> to do with Martel in the département of Lot in south-western France.
>
> Peter Stewart
>
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
> www.avg.com
Thank you Peter, I could find nothing much of Fitz Grip this has been very helpful. I found very little about the Martels, its just that I stumbled across this town close to a Charlemagne cathedral. They had lost a town special award many centuries before and had the same emblem as the Bausqueviles, whose history I was interested in. Personally this more from the south of France, certainly does not fit with my DNA. I have found a huge of amount of evidence for Fitz Grip Martel and this wife, and their successive off spring in https://opendomesday.org/map/. I believe that Fitz Grip Martel was under investigation, and his goods and chattels were about to the be seized, his wife appears to have come from a far wealthier family, so all assetts were in her name, these appeared to have been passed down to the next generation, but they took a variation of the Bausquervile name, which is impossible to spell.

On 26-Oct-23 6:07 PM, Caroline Bosker wrote:
> On Wednesday, 25 October 2023 at 06:30:28 UTC+1, Peter Stewart wrote:
>> On 25-Oct-23 3:24 PM, taf wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 9:37:52 AM UTC-7, Caroline Bosker wrote:
>>>
>>>> Fitz Grip Martel was son of Geoffrey Martel. He married Hadvise Bausquervile or some thing similar.
>>>
>>> The correct name was Hugh fitz Grip. Fitz Grip = filius Grip - son of Grip. His given name was Hugh. 'Grip' is likely a garbled representation of a name unfamiliar to the chronicler; that it represents 'Geoffrey Martel' seems unlikely. 'Fitz Grip Martel' seems to beg the question, and I don't think there is any basis for the husband of Hadvise being called 'Martel', which was not a surname at the time, so even were he son of a man named Geoffrey Martel that doesn't mean he was also named Martel.
>> Grippo was the name of a bishop of Rouen in the late 7th century, and
>> this was given for the father of Hugo of Wareham (sheriff of Dorset) in
>> the charter of his wife Hawise, Nicolas de Bacqueville's daughter, for
>> Montivilliers abbey evidently issued 1066/76 ("Ego Haduidis filia
>> Nicolai de Baschelvilla, uxor Hugonis de Varhan filii Gripponis", see
>> here:
>> https://pdnprod.unicaen.fr/scripta/ead.html?id=scripta&c=scripta_sc_6537,
>> and here:
>> https://thesauri.unicaen.fr/autorites/personnes/doc/pddn_p.1557738667237.html).
>> The same name was given for the father of Hugo's brother Walter in a
>> charter of their nephew William Martel, dapifer of King Stephen, for Eye
>> priory in the mid-12th century ("ego Willelmus Martell(us) dapifer regis
>> ... Walterus filius Grip avunculus meus").
>>
>> Hawise and Hugo had no known offspring.
>>>
>>>> The Martels got their name from Martel in the South of France. It means hammer.
>>>
>>> This might have been the case for a minority of people named Martel, but the majority of them bore it as a nickname rather than a toponymic. This also means that 'the Martels' do not represent a coherent genealogical grouping, since such a nickname could have been borne by any number of unrelated people whom their contemporaries viewed as embodying the metaphorical characteristics of a hammer.
>> This Norman family surnamed Martel, lords at Bacqueville where their
>> eponymous castle has disappeared, lasted until the late-17th century -
>> they came from Angerville-la-Martel, ca 10 kms east of Fécamp. Nothing
>> to do with Martel in the département of Lot in south-western France.
>>
>> Peter Stewart
>>
>>
>> --
>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
>> www.avg.com
> Thank you Peter, I could find nothing much of Fitz Grip this has been very helpful. I found very little about the Martels, its just that I stumbled across this town close to a Charlemagne cathedral. They had lost a town special award many centuries before and had the same emblem as the Bausqueviles, whose history I was interested in. Personally this more from the south of France, certainly does not fit with my DNA. I have found a huge of amount of evidence for Fitz Grip Martel and this wife, and their successive off spring in https://opendomesday.org/map/. I believe that Fitz Grip Martel was under investigation, and his goods and chattels were about to the be seized, his wife appears to have come from a far wealthier family, so all assetts were in her name, these appeared to have been passed down to the next generation, but they took a variation of the Bausquervile name, which is impossible to spell.
>

It's not clear to me why you are confident that there were any
descendants of Hugo fitz Grip of Wareham - assuming that is who is meant
by "Fitz Grip Martel", rather than one of his three known brothers. Only
one of them, Geoffrey, is recorded with the surname Martel.

The circumstantial evidence that Hugo fitz Grip's wife Hawise de
Bacqueville probably had no offspring by him, or at any rate none than
survived to have offspring in turn, is fairly strong. The speculation
(originating from Thomas Bond in 1893) that she or perhaps a daughter of
hers married Alfred de Lincoln (as Katherine Keats-Rohan maintained) is
fairly weak.

Peter Stewart

On Thursday, 26 October 2023 at 22:00:51 UTC+1, Peter Stewart wrote:
> On 26-Oct-23 6:07 PM, Caroline Bosker wrote:
> > On Wednesday, 25 October 2023 at 06:30:28 UTC+1, Peter Stewart wrote:
> >> On 25-Oct-23 3:24 PM, taf wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 9:37:52 AM UTC-7, Caroline Bosker wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Fitz Grip Martel was son of Geoffrey Martel. He married Hadvise Bausquervile or some thing similar.
> >>>
> >>> The correct name was Hugh fitz Grip. Fitz Grip = filius Grip - son of Grip. His given name was Hugh. 'Grip' is likely a garbled representation of a name unfamiliar to the chronicler; that it represents 'Geoffrey Martel' seems unlikely. 'Fitz Grip Martel' seems to beg the question, and I don't think there is any basis for the husband of Hadvise being called 'Martel', which was not a surname at the time, so even were he son of a man named Geoffrey Martel that doesn't mean he was also named Martel.
> >> Grippo was the name of a bishop of Rouen in the late 7th century, and
> >> this was given for the father of Hugo of Wareham (sheriff of Dorset) in
> >> the charter of his wife Hawise, Nicolas de Bacqueville's daughter, for
> >> Montivilliers abbey evidently issued 1066/76 ("Ego Haduidis filia
> >> Nicolai de Baschelvilla, uxor Hugonis de Varhan filii Gripponis", see
> >> here:
> >> https://pdnprod.unicaen.fr/scripta/ead.html?id=scripta&c=scripta_sc_6537,
> >> and here:
> >> https://thesauri.unicaen.fr/autorites/personnes/doc/pddn_p.1557738667237.html).
> >> The same name was given for the father of Hugo's brother Walter in a
> >> charter of their nephew William Martel, dapifer of King Stephen, for Eye
> >> priory in the mid-12th century ("ego Willelmus Martell(us) dapifer regis
> >> ... Walterus filius Grip avunculus meus").
> >>
> >> Hawise and Hugo had no known offspring.
> >>>
> >>>> The Martels got their name from Martel in the South of France. It means hammer.
> >>>
> >>> This might have been the case for a minority of people named Martel, but the majority of them bore it as a nickname rather than a toponymic. This also means that 'the Martels' do not represent a coherent genealogical grouping, since such a nickname could have been borne by any number of unrelated people whom their contemporaries viewed as embodying the metaphorical characteristics of a hammer.
> >> This Norman family surnamed Martel, lords at Bacqueville where their
> >> eponymous castle has disappeared, lasted until the late-17th century -
> >> they came from Angerville-la-Martel, ca 10 kms east of Fécamp. Nothing
> >> to do with Martel in the département of Lot in south-western France.
> >>
> >> Peter Stewart
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
> >> www.avg.com
> > Thank you Peter, I could find nothing much of Fitz Grip this has been very helpful. I found very little about the Martels, its just that I stumbled across this town close to a Charlemagne cathedral. They had lost a town special award many centuries before and had the same emblem as the Bausqueviles, whose history I was interested in. Personally this more from the south of France, certainly does not fit with my DNA. I have found a huge of amount of evidence for Fitz Grip Martel and this wife, and their successive off spring in https://opendomesday.org/map/. I believe that Fitz Grip Martel was under investigation, and his goods and chattels were about to the be seized, his wife appears to have come from a far wealthier family, so all assetts were in her name, these appeared to have been passed down to the next generation, but they took a variation of the Bausquervile name, which is impossible to spell.
> >
> It's not clear to me why you are confident that there were any
> descendants of Hugo fitz Grip of Wareham - assuming that is who is meant
> by "Fitz Grip Martel", rather than one of his three known brothers. Only
> one of them, Geoffrey, is recorded with the surname Martel.
>
> The circumstantial evidence that Hugo fitz Grip's wife Hawise de
> Bacqueville probably had no offspring by him, or at any rate none than
> survived to have offspring in turn, is fairly strong. The speculation
> (originating from Thomas Bond in 1893) that she or perhaps a daughter of
> hers married Alfred de Lincoln (as Katherine Keats-Rohan maintained) is
> fairly weak.
>
> Peter Stewart
Hi Peter, I started my search from my own family and worked back into history. At the top of the tree I was finding Boscherviles and Boschers, I realised there was some link to the Bausquerviles of Rouen because of the monastries around that area were being after Boskervilles, and priests don`t generally go to war. As well as that the Baskervilles name the Bausquerviles as being the top of their family tree, and historically they appear to have known each other, lived close, briefly, and choose the same names for their children.

Then I realised that there was also a switch to names such as Boscherbert, and Boscherberti etc, so I saw that there could be a link, but I could understand where the Herberti came into play until I found Fitz Grip, who I was led to believe was the brother of Geoffrey Martel. When I looked at the history of Dorset, and realised that his wife, a Bausquervile had huge land holdings I then looked into her family to find out where the Herbeti came in and realised that it came from his wifes side. With this I found the area of Herberti, and then realised that his wife`s mother had close members of her family with the Herberti name who were extremely wealthy and powerful. I believe that this is where his wife gained much of her wealth. I then started chasing the money. Fitz Grip had little in his name, even as Sheriff, he unusually never made it to Earl. (Perhaps through his appauling behaviour which attracted the attention of the King, or his short life). Either way the money was all in her name and she appeared to pass it on to (from memory Hugh Boscherbert who was either a baron, or an Earl). Beyond that there also seems to be Tierec Bosco de Herberti who lived in Dorset as well.

Obviously I am not a proffessional researcher, I am just trying to get to the bottom of where my family came from. Fortunately my family has never had too many off spring, always appear to have got to the top of their proffession, and are quite feisty individuals who make their mark, so they have successively appeared in the history books.

..

On Friday, 27 October 2023 at 21:49:02 UTC+1, Caroline Bosker wrote:
> On Thursday, 26 October 2023 at 22:00:51 UTC+1, Peter Stewart wrote:
> > On 26-Oct-23 6:07 PM, Caroline Bosker wrote:
> > > On Wednesday, 25 October 2023 at 06:30:28 UTC+1, Peter Stewart wrote:
> > >> On 25-Oct-23 3:24 PM, taf wrote:
> > >>> On Tuesday, October 24, 2023 at 9:37:52 AM UTC-7, Caroline Bosker wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> Fitz Grip Martel was son of Geoffrey Martel. He married Hadvise Bausquervile or some thing similar.
> > >>>
> > >>> The correct name was Hugh fitz Grip. Fitz Grip = filius Grip - son of Grip. His given name was Hugh. 'Grip' is likely a garbled representation of a name unfamiliar to the chronicler; that it represents 'Geoffrey Martel' seems unlikely. 'Fitz Grip Martel' seems to beg the question, and I don't think there is any basis for the husband of Hadvise being called 'Martel', which was not a surname at the time, so even were he son of a man named Geoffrey Martel that doesn't mean he was also named Martel.
> > >> Grippo was the name of a bishop of Rouen in the late 7th century, and
> > >> this was given for the father of Hugo of Wareham (sheriff of Dorset) in
> > >> the charter of his wife Hawise, Nicolas de Bacqueville's daughter, for
> > >> Montivilliers abbey evidently issued 1066/76 ("Ego Haduidis filia
> > >> Nicolai de Baschelvilla, uxor Hugonis de Varhan filii Gripponis", see
> > >> here:
> > >> https://pdnprod.unicaen.fr/scripta/ead.html?id=scripta&c=scripta_sc_6537,
> > >> and here:
> > >> https://thesauri.unicaen.fr/autorites/personnes/doc/pddn_p.1557738667237.html).
> > >> The same name was given for the father of Hugo's brother Walter in a
> > >> charter of their nephew William Martel, dapifer of King Stephen, for Eye
> > >> priory in the mid-12th century ("ego Willelmus Martell(us) dapifer regis
> > >> ... Walterus filius Grip avunculus meus").
> > >>
> > >> Hawise and Hugo had no known offspring.
> > >>>
> > >>>> The Martels got their name from Martel in the South of France. It means hammer.
> > >>>
> > >>> This might have been the case for a minority of people named Martel, but the majority of them bore it as a nickname rather than a toponymic. This also means that 'the Martels' do not represent a coherent genealogical grouping, since such a nickname could have been borne by any number of unrelated people whom their contemporaries viewed as embodying the metaphorical characteristics of a hammer.
> > >> This Norman family surnamed Martel, lords at Bacqueville where their
> > >> eponymous castle has disappeared, lasted until the late-17th century -
> > >> they came from Angerville-la-Martel, ca 10 kms east of Fécamp. Nothing
> > >> to do with Martel in the département of Lot in south-western France.
> > >>
> > >> Peter Stewart
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
> > >> www.avg.com
> > > Thank you Peter, I could find nothing much of Fitz Grip this has been very helpful. I found very little about the Martels, its just that I stumbled across this town close to a Charlemagne cathedral. They had lost a town special award many centuries before and had the same emblem as the Bausqueviles, whose history I was interested in. Personally this more from the south of France, certainly does not fit with my DNA. I have found a huge of amount of evidence for Fitz Grip Martel and this wife, and their successive off spring in https://opendomesday.org/map/. I believe that Fitz Grip Martel was under investigation, and his goods and chattels were about to the be seized, his wife appears to have come from a far wealthier family, so all assetts were in her name, these appeared to have been passed down to the next generation, but they took a variation of the Bausquervile name, which is impossible to spell.
> > >
> > It's not clear to me why you are confident that there were any
> > descendants of Hugo fitz Grip of Wareham - assuming that is who is meant
> > by "Fitz Grip Martel", rather than one of his three known brothers. Only
> > one of them, Geoffrey, is recorded with the surname Martel.
> >
> > The circumstantial evidence that Hugo fitz Grip's wife Hawise de
> > Bacqueville probably had no offspring by him, or at any rate none than
> > survived to have offspring in turn, is fairly strong. The speculation
> > (originating from Thomas Bond in 1893) that she or perhaps a daughter of
> > hers married Alfred de Lincoln (as Katherine Keats-Rohan maintained) is
> > fairly weak.
> >
> > Peter Stewart
> Hi Peter, I started my search from my own family and worked back into history. At the top of the tree I was finding Boscherviles and Boschers, I realised there was some link to the Bausquerviles of Rouen because of the monastries around that area were being after Boskervilles, and priests don`t generally go to war. As well as that the Baskervilles name the Bausquerviles as being the top of their family tree, and historically they appear to have known each other, lived close, briefly, and choose the same names for their children.
>
> Then I realised that there was also a switch to names such as Boscherbert, and Boscherberti etc, so I saw that there could be a link, but I could understand where the Herberti came into play until I found Fitz Grip, who I was led to believe was the brother of Geoffrey Martel. When I looked at the history of Dorset, and realised that his wife, a Bausquervile had huge land holdings I then looked into her family to find out where the Herbeti came in and realised that it came from his wifes side. With this I found the area of Herberti, and then realised that his wife`s mother had close members of her family with the Herberti name who were extremely wealthy and powerful.. I believe that this is where his wife gained much of her wealth. I then started chasing the money. Fitz Grip had little in his name, even as Sheriff, he unusually never made it to Earl. (Perhaps through his appauling behaviour which attracted the attention of the King, or his short life). Either way the money was all in her name and she appeared to pass it on to (from memory Hugh Boscherbert who was either a baron, or an Earl). Beyond that there also seems to be Tierec Bosco de Herberti who lived in Dorset as well.
>
> Obviously I am not a proffessional researcher, I am just trying to get to the bottom of where my family came from. Fortunately my family has never had too many off spring, always appear to have got to the top of their proffession, and are quite feisty individuals who make their mark, so they have successively appeared in the history books.
>
> .
Also interestingly when I went dont to the South of France the area near Martel, I was visiting a big Cathedral built by Charlemagne. The Bausquevile insigne is a series of blue berries on a back ground, this I also found in Martel when I went to visit. Whilst researching the Bausquerville line, I found a link via wikepedia to half of the Kings of France and Charles Martel.

The French all keep very accurate records of their families as you probably know, as they like to prove not only their connections with the nobility but also to the King and beyond that Jesus Christ.