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sport / rec.sport.soccer / Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

SubjectAuthor
* Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Werner Pichler
`* Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Werner Pichler
 +- Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Binder Dundat
 +* Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Binder Dundat
 |`- Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Werner Pichler
 `* Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Werner Pichler
  `* Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Werner Pichler
   +- Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Mark
   `- Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023Werner Pichler

1
Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
From: wpichler@gmail.com (Werner Pichler)
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 by: Werner Pichler - Tue, 20 Jun 2023 12:08 UTC

In brackets the player's position in the previous ranking (Winter 2022/23)

Part 1

__

Goalkeepers

Weltklasse (World Class)

None

Internationale Klasse (International Class)

1. Gregor Kobel / SUI / Borussia Dortmund (IK-1)
2. Mark Flekken / NED / SC Freiburg / will transfer to Brentford (IK-6)
3. Kevin Trapp / GER / Eintracht Frankfurt (IK-3)

Nationale Klasse (National Class)

4. Lukáš Hrádecký / FIN / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
5. Ralf Fährmann / GER / Schalke 04 (-)
6. Jonas Omlin / SUI / Mönchengladbach (-)
7. Frederik Rønnow / DEN / Union Berlin (NK-10)
8 Janis Blaswich / GER / RB Leipzig (NK-9)
9. Koen Casteels / BEL / VfL Wolfsburg (IK-5)

No Manuel Neuer on the list, obviously, but also no Yann Sommer. To add
insult to injury, Kicker usually publish an additional short paragraph
explaining why certain players in their opinion haven't made the grade, and
they don't mention him even there.

__

Central Defenders

Weltklasse (World Class)

none

Internationale Klasse (International Class)

1. Matthijs de Ligt / NED / Bayern München (NK-5)
2. Jonathan Tah / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
3. Matthias Ginter / GER / SC Freiburg (IK-2)
4. Benjamin Pavard / FRA / Bayern München (NK-5 fullbacks)
5. Mats Hummels / GER / Borussia Dortmund (NK-4)
6. Edmond Tapsoba / BFA / Bayer Leverkusen (-)

Nationale Klasse (National Class)

7. Willi Orbán / HUN / RB Leipzig (NK-9)
8. Julian Chabot / GER / 1. FC Köln (-)
9. Joško Gvardiol / CRO / RB Leipzig (NK-7)
10. Hiroki Itō / JAP / VfB Stuttgart (-)
11. Niklas Süle / GER / Borussia Dortmund (NK-13)
12. Moritz Jenz / GER / Schalke 04 on loan from Lorient, will transfer to Wolfsburg (-)
13. Timo Hübers / GER / 1. FC Köln (-)
14. Micky van de Ven / NED / VfL Wolfsburg (-)
15. Robin Knoche / GER / Union Berlin (NK-11)
16. Piero Hincapié / ECU / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
17. Lukas Klostermann / GER / RB Leipzig (-)
18. Nico Schlotterbeck / GER / Borussia Dortmund (-)
19. Philipp Lienhart / AUT / SC Freiburg (NK-14)

A plethora of players, but previous #1 Upamecano didn't make the list at all.
Come on, even Schlotterbeck is on it!

Ciao,
Werner

Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
From: wpichler@gmail.com (Werner Pichler)
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 by: Werner Pichler - Thu, 22 Jun 2023 12:44 UTC

On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 2:08:35 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> In brackets the player's position in the previous ranking (Winter 2022/23)

Part 2

___

Fullbacks ('defensive laterals')

Weltklasse (World Class)

none

Internationale Klasse (International Class)

1. Raphaël Guerreiro / POR / Borussia Dortmund (-)
2. Jeremie Frimpong / NED / Bayer Leverkusen (IK-2)

Nationale Klasse (National Class)

3. Benjamin Henrichs / GER / RB Leipzig (-)
4. Jonas Hector / GER / 1. FC Köln (NK-9)
5. Mohamed Simakan / FRA / RB Leipzig (NK-6)

Five players. That's it.

No Alphonso Davies ('too many mistakes'), Borna Sosa ('played his part in condemning Stuttgart
to the relegation play-offs'), Ramy Bensebaïni ('liability'), Mitchell Weiser ('facilitated too many
goals against'), Christian Günter ('lost his energy'), David Raum ('disappointing'), João Cancelo
('defensive frailties and risky dribblings'), or Angeliño ('dismal defensive performances').

___

Defensive Midfielders

Weltklasse (World Class)

none

Internationale Klasse (International Class)

1. Ellyes Skhiri / TUN / 1. FC Köln (NK-8)
2. Konrad Laimer / AUT / RB Leipzig, will transfer to Bayern München (-)
3. Emre Can / GER / Borussia Dortmund (-)
4. Robert Andrich / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
5. Joshua Kimmich / GER / Bayern München (IK-2)
6. Wataru Endō / JAP / VfB Stuttgart (IK-6)

Nationale Klasse (National Class)

7. Xaver Schlager / AUT / RB Leipzig (IK-5)
8. Exequiel Palacios / ARG / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
9. Leandro Barreiro / LUX / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
10. Eric Martel / GER / 1. FC Köln (-)
11. Anthony Lusilla / FRA / VfL Bochum (-)
12. Alex Král / CZE / Schalke 04 on loan from Spartak Moscow, will transfer on loan to Union Berlin (-)

Most notably missing: Leon Goretzka ('had an emblematic last matchday, as Tuchel took him
off 14 minutes after having subbed him on when Bayern urgently needed a goal').

Barreiro is only the second Luxembourger ever on this list, former Kaiserslautern and Gladbach
centre-back Jeff Strasser twice made it into the 'Blickfeld' category in the 2000's.

___

Offensive Midfielders

Weltklasse (World Class)

None

Internationale Klasse (International Class)

1. Dani Olmo / ESP / RB Leipzig (-)
2. Florian Wirtz / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
3. Julian Brandt / GER / Borussia Dortmund (NK-9)

Nationale Klasse (National Class)

4. Jude Bellingham / ENG / Borussia Dortmund, will transfer to Real Madrid (IK-1 def. MF)
5. Jamal Musiala / GER / Bayern München (IK-1)
6. Dominik Szoboszlai / HUN / RB Leipzig (NK-6)
7. Lee Jae-sung / KOR / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
8. Thomas Müller / GER / Bayern München (NK-5)
9. Andrej Kramarić / CRO / Hoffenheim (-)
10. Florian Kainz / AUT / 1. FC Köln (NK-7 Wingers)
11. Mario Götze / GER / Eintracht Frankfurt (IK-3)
12. Lars Stindl / GER / Mönchengladbach (-)

Typical for Frankfurt's season, there were three Eintracht players listed as
International Class in the Winter ranking, and now Götze in 11th is the only one
remaining (gone missing have Lindstrøm and Kamada).

Ciao,
Werner

Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
From: dundat@gmail.com (Binder Dundat)
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 by: Binder Dundat - Sat, 24 Jun 2023 12:10 UTC

I have rarely if ever agreed with kicker's ratings.

On Thursday, June 22, 2023 at 8:45:00 a.m. UTC-4, Werner Pichler wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 2:08:35 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > In brackets the player's position in the previous ranking (Winter 2022/23)
> Part 2
>
>
> ___
>
> Fullbacks ('defensive laterals')
> Weltklasse (World Class)
>
> none
>
>
> Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> 1. Raphaël Guerreiro / POR / Borussia Dortmund (-)

I believe Bayern just signed him in another example of them weakening the opposition.

> 2. Jeremie Frimpong / NED / Bayer Leverkusen (IK-2)
>
>
> Nationale Klasse (National Class)
>
> 3. Benjamin Henrichs / GER / RB Leipzig (-)
> 4. Jonas Hector / GER / 1. FC Köln (NK-9)
> 5. Mohamed Simakan / FRA / RB Leipzig (NK-6)
>
>
> Five players. That's it.
>
> No Alphonso Davies ('too many mistakes'), Borna Sosa ('played his part in condemning Stuttgart
> to the relegation play-offs'), Ramy Bensebaïni ('liability'), Mitchell Weiser ('facilitated too many
> goals against'), Christian Günter ('lost his energy'), David Raum ('disappointing'), João Cancelo
> ('defensive frailties and risky dribblings'), or Angeliño ('dismal defensive performances').
>
>
> ___
>
> Defensive Midfielders
> Weltklasse (World Class)
>
> none
>
>
> Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> 1. Ellyes Skhiri / TUN / 1. FC Köln (NK-8)
> 2. Konrad Laimer / AUT / RB Leipzig, will transfer to Bayern München (-)
> 3. Emre Can / GER / Borussia Dortmund (-)
> 4. Robert Andrich / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> 5. Joshua Kimmich / GER / Bayern München (IK-2)
> 6. Wataru Endō / JAP / VfB Stuttgart (IK-6)

You know a list has zero credibility when it includes Emre Can in the "International Klasse".

>
>
> Nationale Klasse (National Class)
>
> 7. Xaver Schlager / AUT / RB Leipzig (IK-5)
> 8. Exequiel Palacios / ARG / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> 9. Leandro Barreiro / LUX / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
> 10. Eric Martel / GER / 1. FC Köln (-)
> 11. Anthony Lusilla / FRA / VfL Bochum (-)
> 12. Alex Král / CZE / Schalke 04 on loan from Spartak Moscow, will transfer on loan to Union Berlin (-)
>
>
> Most notably missing: Leon Goretzka ('had an emblematic last matchday, as Tuchel took him
> off 14 minutes after having subbed him on when Bayern urgently needed a goal').
>
> Barreiro is only the second Luxembourger ever on this list, former Kaiserslautern and Gladbach
> centre-back Jeff Strasser twice made it into the 'Blickfeld' category in the 2000's.
>
>
> ___
>
> Offensive Midfielders
> Weltklasse (World Class)
>
> None
>
>
> Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> 1. Dani Olmo / ESP / RB Leipzig (-)
> 2. Florian Wirtz / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> 3. Julian Brandt / GER / Borussia Dortmund (NK-9)
>
>
> Nationale Klasse (National Class)
>
> 4. Jude Bellingham / ENG / Borussia Dortmund, will transfer to Real Madrid (IK-1 def. MF)
> 5. Jamal Musiala / GER / Bayern München (IK-1)
> 6. Dominik Szoboszlai / HUN / RB Leipzig (NK-6)
> 7. Lee Jae-sung / KOR / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
> 8. Thomas Müller / GER / Bayern München (NK-5)
> 9. Andrej Kramarić / CRO / Hoffenheim (-)
> 10. Florian Kainz / AUT / 1. FC Köln (NK-7 Wingers)
> 11. Mario Götze / GER / Eintracht Frankfurt (IK-3)
> 12. Lars Stindl / GER / Mönchengladbach (-)
>
>
> Typical for Frankfurt's season, there were three Eintracht players listed as
> International Class in the Winter ranking, and now Götze in 11th is the only one
> remaining (gone missing have Lindstrøm and Kamada).
>
>
> Ciao,
> Werner

Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
From: dundat@gmail.com (Binder Dundat)
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 by: Binder Dundat - Sat, 24 Jun 2023 12:15 UTC

On Thursday, June 22, 2023 at 8:45:00 a.m. UTC-4, Werner Pichler wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 2:08:35 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > In brackets the player's position in the previous ranking (Winter 2022/23)
> Part 2
>
>
> ___
>
> Fullbacks ('defensive laterals')
> Weltklasse (World Class)
>
> none
>
>
> Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> 1. Raphaël Guerreiro / POR / Borussia Dortmund (-)
> 2. Jeremie Frimpong / NED / Bayer Leverkusen (IK-2)
>
>
> Nationale Klasse (National Class)
>
> 3. Benjamin Henrichs / GER / RB Leipzig (-)
> 4. Jonas Hector / GER / 1. FC Köln (NK-9)
> 5. Mohamed Simakan / FRA / RB Leipzig (NK-6)
>
>
> Five players. That's it.
>
> No Alphonso Davies ('too many mistakes'), Borna Sosa ('played his part in condemning Stuttgart
> to the relegation play-offs'), Ramy Bensebaïni ('liability'), Mitchell Weiser ('facilitated too many
> goals against'), Christian Günter ('lost his energy'), David Raum ('disappointing'), João Cancelo
> ('defensive frailties and risky dribblings'), or Angeliño ('dismal defensive performances').
>
>
> ___
>
> Defensive Midfielders
> Weltklasse (World Class)
>
> none
>
>
> Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> 1. Ellyes Skhiri / TUN / 1. FC Köln (NK-8)
> 2. Konrad Laimer / AUT / RB Leipzig, will transfer to Bayern München (-)
> 3. Emre Can / GER / Borussia Dortmund (-)
> 4. Robert Andrich / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> 5. Joshua Kimmich / GER / Bayern München (IK-2)
> 6. Wataru Endō / JAP / VfB Stuttgart (IK-6)
>
>
> Nationale Klasse (National Class)
>
> 7. Xaver Schlager / AUT / RB Leipzig (IK-5)
> 8. Exequiel Palacios / ARG / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> 9. Leandro Barreiro / LUX / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
> 10. Eric Martel / GER / 1. FC Köln (-)
> 11. Anthony Lusilla / FRA / VfL Bochum (-)
> 12. Alex Král / CZE / Schalke 04 on loan from Spartak Moscow, will transfer on loan to Union Berlin (-)
>
>
> Most notably missing: Leon Goretzka ('had an emblematic last matchday, as Tuchel took him
> off 14 minutes after having subbed him on when Bayern urgently needed a goal').
>
> Barreiro is only the second Luxembourger ever on this list, former Kaiserslautern and Gladbach
> centre-back Jeff Strasser twice made it into the 'Blickfeld' category in the 2000's.
>
>
> ___
>
> Offensive Midfielders
> Weltklasse (World Class)
>
> None
>
>
> Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> 1. Dani Olmo / ESP / RB Leipzig (-)
> 2. Florian Wirtz / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> 3. Julian Brandt / GER / Borussia Dortmund (NK-9)
>
>
> Nationale Klasse (National Class)
>
> 4. Jude Bellingham / ENG / Borussia Dortmund, will transfer to Real Madrid (IK-1 def. MF)
> 5. Jamal Musiala / GER / Bayern München (IK-1)
> 6. Dominik Szoboszlai / HUN / RB Leipzig (NK-6)
> 7. Lee Jae-sung / KOR / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
> 8. Thomas Müller / GER / Bayern München (NK-5)
> 9. Andrej Kramarić / CRO / Hoffenheim (-)
> 10. Florian Kainz / AUT / 1. FC Köln (NK-7 Wingers)
> 11. Mario Götze / GER / Eintracht Frankfurt (IK-3)
> 12. Lars Stindl / GER / Mönchengladbach (-)

Here is another example of a rating system that makes no sense. Wirtz (who I had high hopes for at one time) has been injured and missed over half the season and scored a grand total of one goal. He is somehow above Musiala, who was bayerns only one good offensive player, scoring lots of goals. ANd lets not even talk about Brandt being in the list period.

>
>
> Typical for Frankfurt's season, there were three Eintracht players listed as
> International Class in the Winter ranking, and now Götze in 11th is the only one
> remaining (gone missing have Lindstrøm and Kamada).
>
>
> Ciao,
> Werner

Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
From: wpichler@gmail.com (Werner Pichler)
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 by: Werner Pichler - Sat, 24 Jun 2023 14:13 UTC

On Saturday, June 24, 2023 at 2:15:25 PM UTC+2, Binder Dundat wrote:
> On Thursday, June 22, 2023 at 8:45:00 a.m. UTC-4, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 2:08:35 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > > In brackets the player's position in the previous ranking (Winter 2022/23)
> > Part 2
> >
> >
> > ___
> >
> > Fullbacks ('defensive laterals')
> > Weltklasse (World Class)
> >
> > none
> >
> >
> > Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> > 1. Raphaël Guerreiro / POR / Borussia Dortmund (-)

Yeah I forgot the 'will transfer to Bayern München' here.

> > 2. Jeremie Frimpong / NED / Bayer Leverkusen (IK-2)
> >
> >
> > Nationale Klasse (National Class)
> >
> > 3. Benjamin Henrichs / GER / RB Leipzig (-)
> > 4. Jonas Hector / GER / 1. FC Köln (NK-9)
> > 5. Mohamed Simakan / FRA / RB Leipzig (NK-6)
> >
> >
> > Five players. That's it.
> >
> > No Alphonso Davies ('too many mistakes'), Borna Sosa ('played his part in condemning Stuttgart
> > to the relegation play-offs'), Ramy Bensebaïni ('liability'), Mitchell Weiser ('facilitated too many
> > goals against'), Christian Günter ('lost his energy'), David Raum ('disappointing'), João Cancelo
> > ('defensive frailties and risky dribblings'), or Angeliño ('dismal defensive performances').
> >
> >
> > ___
> >
> > Defensive Midfielders
> > Weltklasse (World Class)
> >
> > none
> >
> >
> > Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> > 1. Ellyes Skhiri / TUN / 1. FC Köln (NK-8)
> > 2. Konrad Laimer / AUT / RB Leipzig, will transfer to Bayern München (-)
> > 3. Emre Can / GER / Borussia Dortmund (-)
> > 4. Robert Andrich / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> > 5. Joshua Kimmich / GER / Bayern München (IK-2)
> > 6. Wataru Endō / JAP / VfB Stuttgart (IK-6)
> >
> >
> > Nationale Klasse (National Class)
> >
> > 7. Xaver Schlager / AUT / RB Leipzig (IK-5)
> > 8. Exequiel Palacios / ARG / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> > 9. Leandro Barreiro / LUX / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
> > 10. Eric Martel / GER / 1. FC Köln (-)
> > 11. Anthony Lusilla / FRA / VfL Bochum (-)
> > 12. Alex Král / CZE / Schalke 04 on loan from Spartak Moscow, will transfer on loan to Union Berlin (-)
> >
> >
> > Most notably missing: Leon Goretzka ('had an emblematic last matchday, as Tuchel took him
> > off 14 minutes after having subbed him on when Bayern urgently needed a goal').
> >
> > Barreiro is only the second Luxembourger ever on this list, former Kaiserslautern and Gladbach
> > centre-back Jeff Strasser twice made it into the 'Blickfeld' category in the 2000's.
> >
> >
> > ___
> >
> > Offensive Midfielders
> > Weltklasse (World Class)
> >
> > None
> >
> >
> > Internationale Klasse (International Class)
> > 1. Dani Olmo / ESP / RB Leipzig (-)
> > 2. Florian Wirtz / GER / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
> > 3. Julian Brandt / GER / Borussia Dortmund (NK-9)
> >
> >
> > Nationale Klasse (National Class)
> >
> > 4. Jude Bellingham / ENG / Borussia Dortmund, will transfer to Real Madrid (IK-1 def. MF)
> > 5. Jamal Musiala / GER / Bayern München (IK-1)
> > 6. Dominik Szoboszlai / HUN / RB Leipzig (NK-6)
> > 7. Lee Jae-sung / KOR / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
> > 8. Thomas Müller / GER / Bayern München (NK-5)
> > 9. Andrej Kramarić / CRO / Hoffenheim (-)
> > 10. Florian Kainz / AUT / 1. FC Köln (NK-7 Wingers)
> > 11. Mario Götze / GER / Eintracht Frankfurt (IK-3)
> > 12. Lars Stindl / GER / Mönchengladbach (-)
>
> Here is another example of a rating system that makes no sense. Wirtz (who I had high hopes for at one time) has been injured and missed over half the season

Well, you know how (in theory) Kicker strictly look only at matches played since the beginning of the year, and completely disregard anything else.

Ciao,
Werner

> and scored a grand total of one goal. He is somehow > above Musiala, who was bayerns only one good offensive player, scoring lots of goals. ANd lets not even talk about Brandt being in the list period.
> >
> >
> > Typical for Frankfurt's season, there were three Eintracht players listed as
> > International Class in the Winter ranking, and now Götze in 11th is the only one
> > remaining (gone missing have Lindstrøm and Kamada).
> >
> >
> > Ciao,
> > Werner

Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
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 by: Werner Pichler - Mon, 26 Jun 2023 13:52 UTC

On Thursday, June 22, 2023 at 2:45:00 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 2:08:35 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> >
> > In brackets the player's position in the previous ranking (Winter 2022/23)

Part 3

__

Wingers ('offensive laterals')

Weltklasse (World Class)

none

Internationale Klasse (International Class)

1. Donyell Malen / NED / Borussia Dortmund (-)
2. Kingsley Coman / FRA / Bayern München (-)
3. Karim Adeyemi / GER / Borussia Dortmund (-)

Nationale Klasse (National Class)

4. Moussa Diaby / FRA / Bayer Leverkusen (NK-9)
5. Jonas Hofmann / GER / Mönchengladbach (NK-8)
6. Marius Bülter / GER / Schalke 04 (-)
7. Leroy Sané / GER / Bayern München (IK-1)
8. Amine Adli / FRA / Bayer Leverkusen (-)
9. Patrick Wimmer / AUT / VfL Wolfsburg (-)
10. Vincenzo Grifo / ITA / SC Freiburg (IK-2)

Three at the top that you'd have expected to be there earlier, and more consistently.
Despite Binder's misgivings he and Kicker are once again basically of one mind
regarding Sané.

___

Strikers

Weltklasse (World Class)

none

Internationale Klasse (International Class)

1. Randal Kolo Muani / FRA / Eintracht Frankfurt (IK-2)
2. Christopher Nkunku / FRA / RB Leipzig (IK-1)

Nationale Klasse (National Class)

3. Niclas Füllkrug / GER / Werder Bremen (IK-5)
4. Sébastien Haller / CIV / Borussia Dortmund (-)
5. Serhou Guirassy / GUI / VfB Stuttgart (-)
6. Marvin Ducksch / GER / Werder Bremen (-)
7. Karim Onisiwo / AUT / FSV Mainz 05 (NK-13)
8. Ludovic Ajorque / FRA / FSV Mainz 05 (-)
9. Kevin Behrens / GER / Union Berlin (-)
10. Serge Gnabry / GER / Bayern München (IK-3 Wingers)
11. Mërgim Berisha / GER / FC Augsburg (NK-11)

No Gregoritsch? It's a sham.
More serious omissions: Marcus Thuram, Youssoufa Moukoko,
André Silva or Timo Werner. Eric Maxim Choupo-Moting was injured
and Bayern might have missed him more than would have appeared likely.

Also interesting that Behrens is one of just three Union Berlin players that
made the list, yet they will play Champions League.

Ciao,
Werner

Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
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 by: Werner Pichler - Sun, 2 Jul 2023 19:05 UTC

On Monday, June 26, 2023 at 3:52:29 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> On Thursday, June 22, 2023 at 2:45:00 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 2:08:35 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > >
> > > In brackets the player's position in the previous ranking (Winter 2022/23)

Germans Abroad

Top Leagues

Weltklasse (World Class)

İlkay Gündoğan / Manchester City (IK)

Internationale Klasse (International Class)

Marc-André Ter Stegen / Barcelona (IK)
Antonio Rüdiger / Real Madrid (IK)
Toni Kroos / Real Madrid (IK)
Pascal Groß / Brighton & Hove Albion (NK)

Nationale Klasse (National Class)

Bernd Leno / Fulham (-)
Malick Thiaw / Milan (-)
Kai Havertz / Chelsea (IK)

The last time Gündoğan (or any German abroad) was considered World Class
was in Winter 2020/21.

Pascal Groß has been on the periphery of these lists for many years, but this
is the first time he's been, deservedly, ranked international class - at the age
of 32. Which means that time is running out if he ever wants to be capped
by the German National Team (but he's half a year younger than Gündoğan).

_

Average Leagues

Herausragend ('Excellent')

Lars Unnerstall / Twente (H)
Jordan Beyer / Burnley (-)
Yann Aurel Bisseck / AGF (A)
Hany Mukhtar / Nashville SC (H)

Auffällig ('Conspicuous')

Timon Wellenreuther / Feyenoord (-)
Jordan Torunarigha / KAA Gent (A)
Eduard Löwen / St. Louis City SC (-)
Lukas Görtler / FC St. Gallen (H)
Max Meyer / Luzern (A)
Lukas Podolski / Górnik Zabrze (A)
Khaled Narey / PAOK (A)
Patrick Pflücke / Servette (-)
Andreas Voglsammer / Millwall (-)
John Yeboah / Śląsk Wrocław (-)

Has Yann Aurel Bisseck really been 'the best defender in the Danish League'?

Ciao,
Werner

Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
From: Pammiesheart@yahoo.co.uk (Mark)
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 by: Mark - Mon, 3 Jul 2023 06:42 UTC

On Sunday, July 2, 2023 at 8:05:27 PM UTC+1, Werner Pichler wrote:
> On Monday, June 26, 2023 at 3:52:29 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > On Thursday, June 22, 2023 at 2:45:00 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, June 20, 2023 at 2:08:35 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
> > > >
> > > > In brackets the player's position in the previous ranking (Winter 2022/23)
> Germans Abroad
>
>
> Top Leagues
>
>
> Weltklasse (World Class)
>
> İlkay Gündoğan / Manchester City (IK)
>
>
> Internationale Klasse (International Class)
>
> Marc-André Ter Stegen / Barcelona (IK)
> Antonio Rüdiger / Real Madrid (IK)
> Toni Kroos / Real Madrid (IK)
> Pascal Groß / Brighton & Hove Albion (NK)
>
>
> Nationale Klasse (National Class)
>
> Bernd Leno / Fulham (-)
> Malick Thiaw / Milan (-)
> Kai Havertz / Chelsea (IK)
>
>
> The last time Gündoğan (or any German abroad) was considered World Class
> was in Winter 2020/21.
>
> Pascal Groß has been on the periphery of these lists for many years, but this
> is the first time he's been, deservedly, ranked international class - at the age
> of 32. Which means that time is running out if he ever wants to be capped
> by the German National Team (but he's half a year younger than Gündoğan).
>
>
> _
>
> Average Leagues
>
>
> Herausragend ('Excellent')
>
> Lars Unnerstall / Twente (H)
> Jordan Beyer / Burnley (-)
> Yann Aurel Bisseck / AGF (A)
> Hany Mukhtar / Nashville SC (H)
>
>
> Auffällig ('Conspicuous')
>
> Timon Wellenreuther / Feyenoord (-)
> Jordan Torunarigha / KAA Gent (A)
> Eduard Löwen / St. Louis City SC (-)
> Lukas Görtler / FC St. Gallen (H)
> Max Meyer / Luzern (A)
> Lukas Podolski / Górnik Zabrze (A)
> Khaled Narey / PAOK (A)
> Patrick Pflücke / Servette (-)
> Andreas Voglsammer / Millwall (-)
> John Yeboah / Śląsk Wrocław (-)
>
> Has Yann Aurel Bisseck really been 'the best defender in the Danish League'?
>
>
>
> Ciao,
> Werner

German women abroad

Sara Dabritz - International class

Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023

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Subject: Re: Kicker Bundesliga Ratings Summer 2023
From: wpichler@gmail.com (Werner Pichler)
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 by: Werner Pichler - Wed, 12 Jul 2023 11:21 UTC

On Sunday, July 2, 2023 at 9:05:27 PM UTC+2, Werner Pichler wrote:
>
> _
>
> Average Leagues
>
>
> Herausragend ('Excellent')
>
> Lars Unnerstall / Twente (H)
> Jordan Beyer / Burnley (-)
> Yann Aurel Bisseck / AGF (A)
> Hany Mukhtar / Nashville SC (H)
>
>
> Auffällig ('Conspicuous')
>
> Timon Wellenreuther / Feyenoord (-)
> Jordan Torunarigha / KAA Gent (A)
> Eduard Löwen / St. Louis City SC (-)
> Lukas Görtler / FC St. Gallen (H)
> Max Meyer / Luzern (A)
> Lukas Podolski / Górnik Zabrze (A)
> Khaled Narey / PAOK (A)
> Patrick Pflücke / Servette (-)
> Andreas Voglsammer / Millwall (-)
> John Yeboah / Śląsk Wrocław (-)
>
> Has Yann Aurel Bisseck really been 'the best defender in the Danish League'?

7m€ move to Inter imminent, so I guess yeah?

Ciao,
Werner

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