'I Hope It Bankrupts Them'

'If the casinos don’t see a massive recurring profit that offsets the
pain from construction and teardown, then this race will be dead.

No one gives a crap about the sport. No one.'

https://jalopnik.com/i-hope-it-bankrupts-them-las-vegas-residents-enraged-a-1851009102

On Wednesday, November 15, 2023 at 5:16:01 PM UTC, News wrote:
> 'I Hope It Bankrupts Them'
>
> 'If the casinos don’t see a massive recurring profit that offsets the
> pain from construction and teardown, then this race will be dead.
>
> No one gives a crap about the sport. No one.'
>
> https://jalopnik.com/i-hope-it-bankrupts-them-las-vegas-residents-enraged-a-1851009102

"Jalopnik spoke in depth to 15 different people connected to Las Vegas in some way. "

I wonder how hard it would be to find 15 people in Monaco who hate the disruption that F1 causes every May ...

On 11/15/2023 1:27 PM, Martin Harran wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 15, 2023 at 5:16:01 PM UTC, News wrote:
>> 'I Hope It Bankrupts Them'
>>
>> 'If the casinos don’t see a massive recurring profit that offsets the
>> pain from construction and teardown, then this race will be dead.
>>
>> No one gives a crap about the sport. No one.'
>>
>> https://jalopnik.com/i-hope-it-bankrupts-them-las-vegas-residents-enraged-a-1851009102
>
> "Jalopnik spoke in depth to 15 different people connected to Las Vegas in some way."
>
> I wonder how hard it would be to find 15 people in Monaco who hate the disruption that F1 causes every May ...

Las Vegas' first year since 1981-1982 and the Caesars Place fiascos.
Possibly its last (again). TBD. I'll venture a higher percentage of
locals (if not Liberty) would rather see Watkins Glen return.

Whereas Monaco was first held in 1929, and annually since 1955, with
1938-1947, 1949, 1951, and 1953-1954 races cancelled for various
geopolitical, financial, and sporting reasons.

[In 1937, von Brauchitsch dueled with Caracciola before coming out on
top, the last prewar Grand Prix at Monaco. In 1938, the lack of profits
for organisers, and demand for nearly £500 in appearance money per top
entrant (approximately £37,000 in 2023 UKL) led AIACR to cancel the
event. Looming war overtook Monaco in 1939, the Second World War ended
organized racing in Europe until 1945. The Monaco event was not run
between 1945 and 1947 for financial reasons. A Monaco Grand Prix was run
to the new FIA GP formula (replacing the AIACR formula) in 1948, won by
Nino Farina in a Maserati 4CLT, while the 1949 event was cancelled due
to the death of Prince Louis II. Monaco was canceled again in 1951 for
financial reasons, and in 1953-1954 due to the lack of a finalized GP
formula. Then held annually since 1955.]

Note reasons for 1938 and 1945-1947 and 1951 cancellations. Financial.

With the record since 1955, held annually, think anyone in Monaco cares
about naysayers?

Whereas in Las Vegas, 'No one gives a crap about the sport. No one.'

On 16/11/2023 6:15 am, News wrote:
> 'I Hope It Bankrupts Them'
>
> 'If the casinos don’t see a massive recurring profit that offsets the
> pain from construction and teardown, then this race will be dead.
>
>  No one gives a crap about the sport. No one.'
>
> https://jalopnik.com/i-hope-it-bankrupts-them-las-vegas-residents-enraged-a-1851009102

"Oh dear, how sad, never mind."

geoff

geoff <geoff@nospamgeoffwood.org> wrote:
> On 16/11/2023 6:15 am, News wrote:
>> 'I Hope It Bankrupts Them'
>>
>> 'If the casinos don’t see a massive recurring profit that offsets the
>> pain from construction and teardown, then this race will be dead.
>>
>>  No one gives a crap about the sport. No one.'
>>
>> https://jalopnik.com/i-hope-it-bankrupts-them-las-vegas-residents-enraged-a-1851009102
>
>
> "Oh dear, how sad, never mind."
>
> geoff
>

It’s just one of News’s little obsessions.

--
Sir Tim

On 11/16/2023 5:16 AM, Sir Tim wrote:
> geoff <geoff@nospamgeoffwood.org> wrote:
>> On 16/11/2023 6:15 am, News wrote:
>>> 'I Hope It Bankrupts Them'
>>>
>>> 'If the casinos don’t see a massive recurring profit that offsets the
>>> pain from construction and teardown, then this race will be dead.
>>>
>>>  No one gives a crap about the sport. No one.'
>>>
>>> https://jalopnik.com/i-hope-it-bankrupts-them-las-vegas-residents-enraged-a-1851009102
>>
>>
>> "Oh dear, how sad, never mind."
>>
>> geoff
>>
>
> It’s just one of News’s little obsessions.
>

Just calling out the facts. Don't shoot the messenger.

> Las Vegas' first year since 1981-1982 and the Caesars Place fiascos.
> Possibly its last (again). TBD. I'll venture a higher percentage of
> locals (if not Liberty) would rather see Watkins Glen return.

As a non-local, I would rather see a race at Watkins Glen myself. Of
course, I would rather watch Indycar race at the Glen vs. Long Beach or any
other street event, so I might be in a minority with that opinion.

IIRC, either US ChampCar and/or Indycar has held street races in Las Vegas
since 1982, but they didn't stay on the schedule long so they were
apparently not lucrative.

> Whereas Monaco was first held in 1929, and annually since 1955, with
> 1938-1947, 1949, 1951, and 1953-1954 races cancelled for various
> geopolitical, financial, and sporting reasons.

The Long Beach GP has run for several years under various organizations. I
have never read anything about locals fussing about that one, either. My
impression, having visited Long Beach when there was not a race on, is that
at least part of the course is regularly closed for street festivals, etc.,
so maybe closing that area does not cause as much trouble.

> Whereas in Las Vegas, 'No one gives a crap about the sport. No one.'

I bet some do give a crap but not like folks do about Monaco.

* SLMR 2.1a * May The Force be with you...

On 11/15/2023 4:57 PM, Dumas Walker wrote:
> IIRC, either US ChampCar and/or Indycar has held street races in Las
> Vegas since 1982, but they didn't stay on the schedule long so they
> were apparently not lucrative.

Not street races. The Caesar's Palace course was simplified into a
five-turn distorted oval for CART in 1983 and 1984.

https://www.racingcircuits.info/north-america/usa/caesars-palace.html

--
Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
It is the dice, in fact, that play God with the universe.
- King Luca (Darren Bleuel)

> > IIRC, either US ChampCar and/or Indycar has held street races in Las
> > Vegas since 1982, but they didn't stay on the schedule long so they
> > were apparently not lucrative.

> Not street races. The Caesar's Palace course was simplified into a
> five-turn distorted oval for CART in 1983 and 1984.

> https://www.racingcircuits.info/north-america/usa/caesars-palace.html

In 2007, ChampCar opened their season with a street race in Vegas. I don't
remember offhand what the circuit looked like, but it was apparently
downtown near the Children's Museum, which is farther north than the F1
curcuit. Will Power won the pole and the race.

I have read conflicting information about whether or not the event was renewed
for what turned out to be the aborted 2008 schedule.

Thanks for the info about the modified circuit they ran in 1983-84. I
didn't realize they simplified it for CART to run.

* SLMR 2.1a * "Einstein? Who's he? Another troublemaker?" - H.Baines

On 11/16/2023 1:40 PM, Dumas Walker wrote:
>>> IIRC, either US ChampCar and/or Indycar has held street races in Las
>>> Vegas since 1982, but they didn't stay on the schedule long so they
>>> were apparently not lucrative.
>
>> Not street races. The Caesar's Palace course was simplified into a
>> five-turn distorted oval for CART in 1983 and 1984.
>
>> https://www.racingcircuits.info/north-america/usa/caesars-palace.html
>
> In 2007, ChampCar opened their season with a street race in Vegas. I don't
> remember offhand what the circuit looked like, but it was apparently
> downtown near the Children's Museum, which is farther north than the F1
> curcuit. Will Power won the pole and the race.

Thanks, I stand corrected. Racingcircuits.info seems to have missed the
Fremont Street circuit, which indeed was considerably north of the
current layout. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Vegas_Grand_Prix

> I have read conflicting information about whether or not the event was renewed
> for what turned out to be the aborted 2008 schedule.

Wikipedia article says it was on the 2008 schedule until the merger with
IRL.

--
Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
It is the dice, in fact, that play God with the universe.
- King Luca (Darren Bleuel)

> Thanks, I stand corrected. Racingcircuits.info seems to have missed the
> Fremont Street circuit, which indeed was considerably north of the
> current layout. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Vegas_Grand_Prix

If you do a search on Champcar 2007 Las Vegas, a reddit link will come up
that has a map of both circuits that illustrates their positions. Glad
someone went to the trouble. ;)

I have noticed that a few circuit info and results sites tend to be missing
info from Champcar's later years.

> > I have read conflicting information about whether or not the event was
> renew
> > for what turned out to be the aborted 2008 schedule.

> Wikipedia article says it was on the 2008 schedule until the merger with
> IRL.

Yes, I saw that. The article about the actual 2008 (aborted) schedule does
not mention it at all, though. May just be an oversight that no one has
ever corrected.

For some reason, I thought they had raced more than just once (+ the two
CART races you mentioned) and wondered if some of those races I was
thinking of were not the "vapor events" that would often appear on their
schedules never to take place. I found no evidence of that, so I guess
CART/ChampCar only street raced there just the one time.

* SLMR 2.1a * How do you tell when you're out of invisible ink?