I know this is supposed to be about college football, but I can't find a similar
newsgroup for pro football and I saw someone else post about the NFL here,
so I will say this here too..

First of all, let me say I'm a Chiefs fan. That said, the offsides call on Toney
that negated one of the greatest plays of the year was 100% the right call.
I don't blame the official. I blame Toney. The official did his job right. Toney
did not. Chiefs nation is saying it was a ticky tack call and that Toney was
only a few inches offsides. No, he wasn't. He was at least two feet offside.
A lot fans don't realize there are actually two lines of scrimmage, on for
offense, and one for the defense. The O-line of scrimmage runs through the
back point of the ball and the D-line of scrimmage runs through the front
point of the ball. The area between those two lines is what is called the
neutral zone. Technically, only the center is allowed to be in the neutral zone
at the snap because he has to put his hands on the ball. From what I have
observed, officials don't flag wideouts for putting a foot in the neutral zone
and if a D-lineman has his head in the neutral zone, those fouls will
generally get a warning before a flag is thrown. It's when a player lines up
on the other team's side of the line of scrimmage a flag will be thrown
without warning. If one ignores the blue line CBS superimposed and looks
only at the position of the ball and Toney, he was clearly offside. The front
of the ball was a foot outside the 49 yard line and Toney's foot was on the
49 yard line. A defender in press coverage could have actually put his hands
on Toney before the snap without being offside. If that sort of alignment was
allowed at any point in the game, it would become chaotic. As much as it
hurt the Chiefs, it was the proper call.

On 2023-12-16, JE Corbett <jecorbett4@gmail.com> wrote:
> I know this is supposed to be about college football, but I can't find a similar
> newsgroup for pro football and I saw someone else post about the NFL here,
> so I will say this here too..
>
> First of all, let me say I'm a Chiefs fan. That said, the offsides call on Toney
> that negated one of the greatest plays of the year was 100% the right call.

I thought so too, because before the snap I looked at it and said to
myself "That WR is offside, they should call that." That is very nearly
a first.

I see lots of borderline lineup and motion errors I think could be
called, but they are minor and borderline compared to that one. I
frequently see possible defensive neutral zone infractions, but almost
never the same for offense.

> I don't blame the official. I blame Toney. The official did his job right. Toney
> did not. Chiefs nation is saying it was a ticky tack call and that Toney was
> only a few inches offsides. No, he wasn't. He was at least two feet offside.
> A lot fans don't realize there are actually two lines of scrimmage, on for
> offense, and one for the defense. The O-line of scrimmage runs through the
> back point of the ball and the D-line of scrimmage runs through the front
> point of the ball. The area between those two lines is what is called the
> neutral zone. Technically, only the center is allowed to be in the neutral zone
> at the snap because he has to put his hands on the ball. From what I have
> observed, officials don't flag wideouts for putting a foot in the neutral zone
> and if a D-lineman has his head in the neutral zone, those fouls will
> generally get a warning before a flag is thrown.

Yup.

> It's when a player lines up
> on the other team's side of the line of scrimmage a flag will be thrown
> without warning. If one ignores the blue line CBS superimposed and looks
> only at the position of the ball and Toney, he was clearly offside. The front
> of the ball was a foot outside the 49 yard line and Toney's foot was on the
> 49 yard line. A defender in press coverage could have actually put his hands
> on Toney before the snap without being offside. If that sort of alignment was
> allowed at any point in the game, it would become chaotic. As much as it
> hurt the Chiefs, it was the proper call.

Nice to see a Chiefs fan say that. I also appreciated the fact that
Mahomes came out and said he was wrong to react like he did,
because...he was. I am not a huge fan of his, but this admission
actually makes me like him a little.

--
Being against torture ought to be sort of a bipartisan thing.
-- Karl Lehenbauer

On Saturday, December 16, 2023 at 6:47:21 AM UTC-6, JE Corbett wrote:
"It's the officials fault because he didn't warn me and I'm too entitled to accept responsibility"

So obviously offsides, the only question is what league official actually demanded he line up that offside so the Chiefs would lose?

Mike

On Sunday, December 17, 2023 at 3:45:05 AM UTC-8, Corky wrote:
> On Saturday, December 16, 2023 at 6:47:21 AM UTC-6, JE Corbett wrote:
> "It's the officials fault because he didn't warn me and I'm too entitled to accept responsibility"

Because he believed Queen Taylor would save him, as she had for a number of other games this season.

Mike

On Saturday, December 16, 2023 at 6:47:21 AM UTC-6, JE Corbett wrote:
> I know this is supposed to be about college football, but I can't find a similar
> newsgroup for pro football and I saw someone else post about the NFL here,
> so I will say this here too..
>
> First of all, let me say I'm a Chiefs fan. That said, the offsides call on Toney
> that negated one of the greatest plays of the year was 100% the right call.
> I don't blame the official. I blame Toney. The official did his job right.. Toney
> did not. Chiefs nation is saying it was a ticky tack call and that Toney was
> only a few inches offsides. No, he wasn't. He was at least two feet offside.
> A lot fans don't realize there are actually two lines of scrimmage, on for
> offense, and one for the defense. The O-line of scrimmage runs through the
> back point of the ball and the D-line of scrimmage runs through the front
> point of the ball. The area between those two lines is what is called the
> neutral zone. Technically, only the center is allowed to be in the neutral zone
> at the snap because he has to put his hands on the ball. From what I have
> observed, officials don't flag wideouts for putting a foot in the neutral zone
> and if a D-lineman has his head in the neutral zone, those fouls will
> generally get a warning before a flag is thrown. It's when a player lines up
> on the other team's side of the line of scrimmage a flag will be thrown
> without warning. If one ignores the blue line CBS superimposed and looks
> only at the position of the ball and Toney, he was clearly offside. The front
> of the ball was a foot outside the 49 yard line and Toney's foot was on the
> 49 yard line. A defender in press coverage could have actually put his hands
> on Toney before the snap without being offside. If that sort of alignment was
> allowed at any point in the game, it would become chaotic. As much as it
> hurt the Chiefs, it was the proper call.

He absolutely wasn't two feet off sides. His toe was definitely on the line tho. They were just upset that it negated such a great play. Emotions will do that. No reason for Toney not to know wtf he was doing tho.

On 2023-12-20, jimbr...@yahoo.com <jimbrowndoc@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Saturday, December 16, 2023 at 6:47:21 AM UTC-6, JE Corbett wrote:
>> I know this is supposed to be about college football, but I can't find a similar
>> newsgroup for pro football and I saw someone else post about the NFL here,
>> so I will say this here too..
>>
>> First of all, let me say I'm a Chiefs fan. That said, the offsides call on Toney
>> that negated one of the greatest plays of the year was 100% the right call.
>> I don't blame the official. I blame Toney. The official did his job right. Toney
>> did not. Chiefs nation is saying it was a ticky tack call and that Toney was
>> only a few inches offsides. No, he wasn't. He was at least two feet offside.
>> A lot fans don't realize there are actually two lines of scrimmage, on for
>> offense, and one for the defense. The O-line of scrimmage runs through the
>> back point of the ball and the D-line of scrimmage runs through the front
>> point of the ball. The area between those two lines is what is called the
>> neutral zone. Technically, only the center is allowed to be in the neutral zone
>> at the snap because he has to put his hands on the ball. From what I have
>> observed, officials don't flag wideouts for putting a foot in the neutral zone
>> and if a D-lineman has his head in the neutral zone, those fouls will
>> generally get a warning before a flag is thrown. It's when a player lines up
>> on the other team's side of the line of scrimmage a flag will be thrown
>> without warning. If one ignores the blue line CBS superimposed and looks
>> only at the position of the ball and Toney, he was clearly offside. The front
>> of the ball was a foot outside the 49 yard line and Toney's foot was on the
>> 49 yard line. A defender in press coverage could have actually put his hands
>> on Toney before the snap without being offside. If that sort of alignment was
>> allowed at any point in the game, it would become chaotic. As much as it
>> hurt the Chiefs, it was the proper call.
>
>
> He absolutely wasn't two feet off sides. His toe was definitely on the line tho. They were just upset that it negated such a great play. Emotions will do that. No reason for Toney not to know wtf he was doing tho.

His toe was past the football. It was the most blatant offside I've
seen from an offensive player since I don't know when. I was pointing
at the screen when they snapped it...

--
The problem with Internet quotations is that many of them
are not genuine. -- Abraham Lincoln

On Wednesday, December 20, 2023 at 2:08:18 PM UTC-8, Con Reeder, unhyphenated American wrote:

> His toe was past the football. It was the most blatant offside I've
> seen from an offensive player since I don't know when. I was pointing
> at the screen when they snapped it...

He was on the defensive line.

Seriously.

The neutral zone is the length of the football and he was past THAT.

That was intentional, and it was intended as an NFL means for Toney to throw the game, and Taylor Swift will not be at the Super Bowl unless she's singing the National Anthem.

Mike (The latest conspiracy theory out there is "Colors of the Super Bowl LVIII Logo" -- 49ers vs. Ravens... And who are the best teams in each conference, probably not as close as some might think??)