Hi-jacked

On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:48:20 AM UTC-7, Guy Acheson wrote:
> Hi-jacked

I thought we had a moderator who would remove all this extraneous crap from ras? I know at least one ration of non-soaring crap has been removed about a month ago!
JJ

One of the great things about RAS is that it's not moderated. Ya just
gotta ignore the crap.

Dan
5J

On 11/2/23 13:47, John Sinclair wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:48:20 AM UTC-7, Guy Acheson wrote:
>> Hi-jacked
>
>
>
> I thought we had a moderator who would remove all this extraneous crap from ras? I know at least one ration of non-soaring crap has been removed about a month ago!
> JJ

Dan
5J

On 11/2/23 13:47, John Sinclair wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 10:48:20 AM UTC-7, Guy Acheson wrote:
>> Hi-jacked
>
>
>
> I thought we had a moderator who would remove all this extraneous crap from ras? I know at least one ration of non-soaring crap has been removed about a month ago!
> JJ

On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 1:20:26 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
> One of the great things about RAS is that it's not

Great? What’s great about hawking LSD, Mushrooms, Gambling, & let’s not forget Mary Monkey Tree and Penis Whore Hoppers! All posted over and over again!
I’m not going to wade through this shit much longer!
JJ

On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 2:39:09 PM UTC-7, John Sinclair wrote:
> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 1:20:26 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
> > One of the great things about RAS is that it's not
> Great? What’s great about hawking LSD, Mushrooms, Gambling, & let’s not forget Mary Monkey Tree and Penis Whore Hoppers! All posted over and over again!
> I’m not going to wade through this shit much longer!
> JJ
You can hide them by clicking the icon to the left of the message, then clicking the "!" in the circle (upper right). The "This conversation has been hidden..." message will disappear after you use RAS some more.

It's been Whack-A-Mole lately, though, with repeated postings, but reporting them does bring an inner peace.
Eric

I don't see any of what you're talking about. Are you using a news
reader or google groups?

Dan
5J

On 11/2/23 15:39, John Sinclair wrote:
> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 1:20:26 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
>> One of the great things about RAS is that it's not
>
>
> Great? What’s great about hawking LSD, Mushrooms, Gambling, & let’s not forget Mary Monkey Tree and Penis Whore Hoppers! All posted over and over again!
> I’m not going to wade through this shit much longer!
> JJ

On Thu, 2 Nov 2023 14:39:07 -0700 (PDT), John Sinclair wrote:

> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 1:20:26 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
>> One of the great things about RAS is that it's not
>
>
> Great? What’s great about hawking LSD, Mushrooms, Gambling, & let’s not
> forget Mary Monkey Tree and Penis Whore Hoppers! All posted over and
> over again!
> I’m not going to wade through this shit much longer!
> JJ

If you're using a good newsreader, you can kill off posters and threads
you don't want to see. I use Pan as my newsreader. It can kill threads
and/or posters for various lengths of time or 'forever' and you can also
look at their posts again to see if they've improved while they were
suppressed (they usually haven't.

Pan is open source, so free, and IIRC it works OK under Windows as well as
Linux. IMO other good newsreader is Forte's Agent, but is Windows-only.
Both programs are free to download..

--

Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

Eric Greenwell avait soumis l'idée :
> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 3:25:44 PM UTC-7, Martin Gregorie wrote:
>> On Thu, 2 Nov 2023 14:39:07 -0700 (PDT), John Sinclair wrote:
>>
>>> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 1:20:26 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
>>>> One of the great things about RAS is that it's not
>>>
>>>
>>> Great? What’s great about hawking LSD, Mushrooms, Gambling, & let’s not
>>> forget Mary Monkey Tree and Penis Whore Hoppers! All posted over and
>>> over again!
>>> I’m not going to wade through this shit much longer!
>>> JJ
>> If you're using a good newsreader, you can kill off posters and threads
>> you don't want to see. I use Pan as my newsreader. It can kill threads
>> and/or posters for various lengths of time or 'forever' and you can also
>> look at their posts again to see if they've improved while they were
>> suppressed (they usually haven't.
>>
>> Pan is open source, so free, and IIRC it works OK under Windows as well as
>> Linux. IMO other good newsreader is Forte's Agent, but is Windows-only.
>> Both programs are free to download..
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Martin | martin at
>> Gregorie | gregorie dot org
> What Usenet server do you use, or recommend?

You can see this list: http://usenet.ovh/?article=faq_serveur_gratuit
(sorry, it's in french language).

Somme news server fight again spam and flood.
You have mine: news.usenet.ovh
and a well-know server: news.eternal-september.org

Sincerely

On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 4:20:05 PM UTC-7, llp wrote:
> Eric Greenwell avait soumis l'idée :
> > On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 3:25:44 PM UTC-7, Martin Gregorie wrote:
> >> On Thu, 2 Nov 2023 14:39:07 -0700 (PDT), John Sinclair wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 1:20:26 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
> >>>> One of the great things about RAS is that it's not
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Great? What’s great about hawking LSD, Mushrooms, Gambling, & let’s not
> >>> forget Mary Monkey Tree and Penis Whore Hoppers! All posted over and
> >>> over again!
> >>> I’m not going to wade through this shit much longer!
> >>> JJ
> >> If you're using a good newsreader, you can kill off posters and threads
> >> you don't want to see. I use Pan as my newsreader. It can kill threads
> >> and/or posters for various lengths of time or 'forever' and you can also
> >> look at their posts again to see if they've improved while they were
> >> suppressed (they usually haven't.
> >>
> >> Pan is open source, so free, and IIRC it works OK under Windows as well as
> >> Linux. IMO other good newsreader is Forte's Agent, but is Windows-only..
> >> Both programs are free to download..
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Martin | martin at
> >> Gregorie | gregorie dot org
> > What Usenet server do you use, or recommend?
> You can see this list: http://usenet.ovh/?article=faq_serveur_gratuit
> (sorry, it's in french language).
>
> Somme news server fight again spam and flood.
> You have mine: news.usenet.ovh
> and a well-know server: news.eternal-september.org
>
> Sincerely
Thanks, I'll try them out. I formerly used a news reader and a usenet server, but it disappeared. RAS on Google is OK, but I'd like to try Usenet again.

Just to be clear. While you may well be reading this thread at groups.google.com it is important to know that our beloved RAS (rec.aviation.soaring) group is not a true Google group. It just seems that way.

RAS is a truly wonderful benefit to soaring as a repository of glider related questions and answers that spans decades. But it has its faults. Every true Google group is governed by administrator(s) that approve members before they are allowed to post messages. There is no such limit for rec.aviation.soaring because it is a "Usenet" group. A Usenet group is similar to a Google group except for one key fact - zero control. The glory, and problem, with Usenet groups is that ANYONE can say ANYTHING they want at ANY TIME. Thus we get the situation where RAS is being flooded with non-glider related postings which has no place in our rec.aviation.soaring forum.

Unfortunately, there is simply no way to stop this flood of SPAM. You can ignore the offending postings or you can configure a Usenet reader program to block offending senders and/or block content by using key words. The Usenet reader approach is good but not a perfect solution as it requires watching for, and actively blocking, specific content - coupled with the potential issue of unintentionally blocking good content with the bad. Been there, done that. I will let others detail how to implement a Usenet reader if you are interested.

True Google groups (and other like sites such as Groups.IO) have several key advantages over Usenet groups;

- Approval of membership.
- Attach images and documents to postings.
- You can remove or edit your prior postings.

Thanks for listening.

John (OHM)
[Administrator of the RAS_Prime Google group]

On 02/11/2023 23:58, Eric Greenwell wrote:
> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 4:20:05 PM UTC-7, llp wrote:
>> Eric Greenwell avait soumis l'idée :
>>> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 3:25:44 PM UTC-7, Martin Gregorie wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 2 Nov 2023 14:39:07 -0700 (PDT), John Sinclair wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 1:20:26 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
>>>>>> One of the great things about RAS is that it's not
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Great? What’s great about hawking LSD, Mushrooms, Gambling, & let’s not
>>>>> forget Mary Monkey Tree and Penis Whore Hoppers! All posted over and
>>>>> over again!
>>>>> I’m not going to wade through this shit much longer!
>>>>> JJ
>>>> If you're using a good newsreader, you can kill off posters and threads
>>>> you don't want to see. I use Pan as my newsreader. It can kill threads
>>>> and/or posters for various lengths of time or 'forever' and you can also
>>>> look at their posts again to see if they've improved while they were
>>>> suppressed (they usually haven't.
>>>>
>>>> Pan is open source, so free, and IIRC it works OK under Windows as well as
>>>> Linux. IMO other good newsreader is Forte's Agent, but is Windows-only.
>>>> Both programs are free to download..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Martin | martin at
>>>> Gregorie | gregorie dot org
>>> What Usenet server do you use, or recommend?
>> You can see this list: http://usenet.ovh/?article=faq_serveur_gratuit
>> (sorry, it's in french language).
>>
>> Somme news server fight again spam and flood.
>> You have mine: news.usenet.ovh
>> and a well-know server: news.eternal-september.org
>>
>> Sincerely
> Thanks, I'll try them out. I formerly used a news reader and a usenet server, but it disappeared. RAS on Google is OK, but I'd like to try Usenet again.

I use news.eternal-september.org as a server and Thunderbird for reading
news (both free). I see none/very little of the junk being complained about.

Thunderbird also has the ability for me to select specific specific
threads to be ignored. Very useful.

I have another route into RAS which has no filtering where I can all the
junk.

Tim.

Spam is totally ruining this group at the moment.

It is 2023, no one under 70 knows what is usenet, nor use newsreader.

RAS prime is very difficult to find, even if you know the group name and search for it. Getting people there is difficult at the moment, and if there are no active subscribers, there are no posts, and no incentive to join.

Facebook groups are totally controlled by fb algorithm, so you might see something interesting sometimes, but more likely not. Maybe something is going on in instagram, don't know.

Most glider pilots do not like to interact in social media (this is a great mystery to me, in irl we interact and are social), so maybe it does not matter in the end.

On Thu, 2 Nov 2023 15:39:25 -0700 (PDT), Eric Greenwell wrote:

> What Usenet server do you use, or recommend?
>
news.eternal-september.org - I've been using it since at least 2000.

If you're using Pan, its defined on the Pan Servers configuration page as
news.eternal-september.org:563

IIRC the Eternal-september NNTP server works OK with both Pan:
https://pan.rebelbase.com/

- Pan runs on Linux, BSD systems, Mac OS X, and Windows.

and
Forte Agent https://www.forteinc.com/main/homepage.php,

which is Windows-only, but you may prefer it to Pan:
when I used Windows this was my preferred newsreader.

NOTE: the application that Google provides for NNTP access is NOT an NNTP
reader: it's an third party application that Google acquired some time
back in the '90s. It has two parts:
1) a NNTP scanner that adds news items from all available NNTP servers and
adds them to a central news database that it maintains.
2) a search and display application that retrieves news items and
threads from its central database and displays them via a web
browser.

Its only benefit was that it could retrieve items that had expired on NNTP
news stores. Some NNTP servers could store images as well as text, but I
don't think this application could display them.

--

Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

On 11/3/2023 6:12 AM, krasw wrote:
> Spam is totally ruining this group at the moment.
>
> It is 2023, no one under 70 knows what is usenet, nor use newsreader.
>
> RAS prime is very difficult to find, even if you know the group name and search for it. Getting people there is difficult at the moment, and if there are no active subscribers, there are no posts, and no incentive to join.
>
> Facebook groups are totally controlled by fb algorithm, so you might see something interesting sometimes, but more likely not. Maybe something is going on in instagram, don't know.
>
> Most glider pilots do not like to interact in social media (this is a great mystery to me, in irl we interact and are social), so maybe it does not matter in the end.
>

I'm using Thunderbird as a newsreader, and I don't know what this spam
problem you're talking about is, I don't see the spam! :-)

RAS_prime is not hard to find. https://groups.google.com/g/rasprime
But yes not much is happening there. There is a disadvantage to
splintering into more than one system.

If it was on a "social media" "platform" I would not touch it with a ten
foot pole.

Thunderbird and "news.eternal-september.org" as the news server took 10 minutes to setup. Easy even for someone who used news
readers back in the 80s. I'm sure a smart young person could do it even faster.

http://www.eternal-september.org/
https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/

The message filter tool has made RAS tolerable again. Most spam is never shown, and additional filters are easy to create.

On 11/3/23 5:12 AM, krasw wrote:
> Spam is totally ruining this group at the moment.
>
> It is 2023, no one under 70 knows what is usenet, nor use newsreader.
>
> RAS prime is very difficult to find, even if you know the group name and search for it. Getting people there is difficult at the moment, and if there are no active subscribers, there are no posts, and no incentive to join.
>
> Facebook groups are totally controlled by fb algorithm, so you might see something interesting sometimes, but more likely not. Maybe something is going on in instagram, don't know.
>
> Most glider pilots do not like to interact in social media (this is a great mystery to me, in irl we interact and are social), so maybe it does not matter in the end.

I'm using Thunderbird, a free and open source email client. It displays
RAS messages just like any email though in a separate folder. It also
has all the rule-making and filtering capabilities that you'd have with
regular email.

I'll bet Windows and IOS email clients would work in identical fashion.
All that's required is a little research. Look through the help files.

Dan
5J

On 11/2/23 16:25, Martin Gregorie wrote:
> On Thu, 2 Nov 2023 14:39:07 -0700 (PDT), John Sinclair wrote:
>
>> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 1:20:26 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
>>> One of the great things about RAS is that it's not
>>
>>
>> Great? What’s great about hawking LSD, Mushrooms, Gambling, & let’s not
>> forget Mary Monkey Tree and Penis Whore Hoppers! All posted over and
>> over again!
>> I’m not going to wade through this shit much longer!
>> JJ
>
> If you're using a good newsreader, you can kill off posters and threads
> you don't want to see. I use Pan as my newsreader. It can kill threads
> and/or posters for various lengths of time or 'forever' and you can also
> look at their posts again to see if they've improved while they were
> suppressed (they usually haven't.
>
> Pan is open source, so free, and IIRC it works OK under Windows as well as
> Linux. IMO other good newsreader is Forte's Agent, but is Windows-only.
> Both programs are free to download..
>
>

THANK YOU, Sarah!

You put it in words that those "young whipper snappers" might take as
encouragement. As one "over 70", it probably took me at least 20
minutes to figure it out.

Dan
5J

On 11/3/23 08:11, Sarah Anderson wrote:
> Thunderbird and "news.eternal-september.org" as the news server took 10
> minutes to setup. Easy even for someone who used news readers back in
> the 80s.  I'm sure a smart young person could do it even faster.
>
> http://www.eternal-september.org/
> https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/
>
> The message filter tool has made RAS tolerable again. Most spam is never
> shown, and additional filters are easy to create.
>
>
>
> On 11/3/23 5:12 AM, krasw wrote:
>> Spam is totally ruining this group at the moment.
>>
>> It is 2023, no one under 70 knows what is usenet, nor use newsreader.
>>
>> RAS prime is very difficult to find, even if you know the group name
>> and search for it. Getting people there is difficult at the moment,
>> and if there are no active subscribers, there are no posts, and no
>> incentive to join.
>>
>> Facebook groups are totally controlled by fb algorithm, so you might
>> see something interesting sometimes, but more likely not. Maybe
>> something is going on in instagram, don't know.
>>
>> Most glider pilots do not like to interact in social media (this is a
>> great mystery to me, in irl we interact and are social), so maybe it
>> does not matter in the end.
>

On 11/3/2023 12:49 PM, Dan Marotta wrote:
> THANK YOU, Sarah!
>
> You put it in words that those "young whipper snappers" might take as
> encouragement.  As one "over 70", it probably took me at least 20
> minutes to figure it out.
>
> Dan
> 5J
>
> On 11/3/23 08:11, Sarah Anderson wrote:
>> Thunderbird and "news.eternal-september.org" as the news server took
>> 10 minutes to setup. Easy even for someone who used news readers back
>> in the 80s.  I'm sure a smart young person could do it even faster.
>>
>> http://www.eternal-september.org/
>> https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/
>>
>> The message filter tool has made RAS tolerable again. Most spam is
>> never shown, and additional filters are easy to create.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 11/3/23 5:12 AM, krasw wrote:
>>> Spam is totally ruining this group at the moment. ...

I've noticed that the way RAS appears to me, via eternal-september.org
and Thunderbird, not only do I not see postings from a couple of people
that I set up explicit "rules" to reject, but I also have not seen any
of the recent multitude of spam messages - even though I have not set up
any rules for that. (I took a look via Google to compare, oh my!) I
don't know how that happened - does eternal-september have spam
filtering? Does Thunderbird? Based on what criteria? Perhaps it
rejects postings that are directed to multiple Newsgroups, as this spam
tends to be?

From http://www.eternal-september.org/index.php?showpage=nocem

"Eternal-September scans all articles for all groups originating from Google using a custom ruleset for Spamassassin from within
Cleanfeed. All articles marked as spam are saved for later processing and then rejected by the server. "

Definitely one of the biggest advantages of ES.

On 11/6/23 1:43 PM, Moshe Braner wrote:
....
>>> On 11/3/23 5:12 AM, krasw wrote:
>>>> Spam is totally ruining this group at the moment.  ...
>
>
> I've noticed that the way RAS appears to me, via eternal-september.org and Thunderbird, not only do I not see postings from a couple
> of people that I set up explicit "rules" to reject, but I also have not seen any of the recent multitude of spam messages - even
> though I have not set up any rules for that.  (I took a look via Google to compare, oh my!)  I don't know how that happened - does
> eternal-september have spam filtering?  Does Thunderbird?  Based on what criteria?  Perhaps it rejects postings that are directed to
> multiple Newsgroups, as this spam tends to be?
>

Thunderbird has junk filters as well as rule writing capability. The
first time something that TB considers "junk" hits my in box, it's
flagged as suspected junk. I can simply delete it and it's considered
junk and won't be displayed again. If the message is not junk, there's
a "Not Junk" button. A simple click and the message and future messages
from that sender are passed through.

As to the Crazy Canadian, I wrote a rule excluding his name or email
address or any number of phrases that identify his rants. All is
peaceful here.

Dan
5J

On 11/6/23 12:43, Moshe Braner wrote:
> On 11/3/2023 12:49 PM, Dan Marotta wrote:
>> THANK YOU, Sarah!
>>
>> You put it in words that those "young whipper snappers" might take as
>> encouragement.  As one "over 70", it probably took me at least 20
>> minutes to figure it out.
>>
>> Dan
>> 5J
>>
>> On 11/3/23 08:11, Sarah Anderson wrote:
>>> Thunderbird and "news.eternal-september.org" as the news server took
>>> 10 minutes to setup. Easy even for someone who used news readers back
>>> in the 80s.  I'm sure a smart young person could do it even faster.
>>>
>>> http://www.eternal-september.org/
>>> https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/
>>>
>>> The message filter tool has made RAS tolerable again. Most spam is
>>> never shown, and additional filters are easy to create.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 11/3/23 5:12 AM, krasw wrote:
>>>> Spam is totally ruining this group at the moment.  ...
>
>
> I've noticed that the way RAS appears to me, via eternal-september.org
> and Thunderbird, not only do I not see postings from a couple of people
> that I set up explicit "rules" to reject, but I also have not seen any
> of the recent multitude of spam messages - even though I have not set up
> any rules for that.  (I took a look via Google to compare, oh my!)  I
> don't know how that happened - does eternal-september have spam
> filtering?  Does Thunderbird?  Based on what criteria?  Perhaps it
> rejects postings that are directed to multiple Newsgroups, as this spam
> tends to be?
>