"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:tvv5ud$3qv0u$1@dont-email.me...

On 3/28/2023 5:14 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> Recording while welding tends to require an expensive datalogger that
> doesn't have other hobby uses. My cheap and simple DVM version can't
> measure voltage and current fast enough or at the same time, and my
> digital scope won't sample long enough. These require additional
> user-designed circuitry to isolate and condition the voltage and current
> signals.
> https://www.dataq.com/products/di-1100/
>

Years ago I used to use a relatively cheap DVOM with a serial port
output to prove to customers their power was "unclean." I'd just hook
it to the circuit, tie the serial port to a laptop computer with a
serial communications terminal program running, and leave it overnight.
12-16 hrs was no big deal on my old laptop computers. Sample time and
serial port speed is of course an issue as you indicated, but I don't
see why the same thing couldn't be done with a scope that has a data
output. I'll have to go look to see if my cheap 2 channel digital scope
has a communication port. (I've only ever used it for tuning servo
drives).

{{{ A DSO may be a bit much to suggest to someone who doesn't already know
electricity and how to use them. I don't think my Tenma DSO outputs
continuously in real time, only to internal files.

I do most of my battery charge / discharge and temperature data logging with
TP4000ZC serial comm DMMs and a laptop. The limitation is that it logs no
faster than one reading per second, fine for batteries or solar but not
welding where the arc conditions change too fast. The advantage is the
optically isolated channels that avoid ground loops. }}}

Upon a moments thought I recall that there are scopes with little more
than an interface that use a computer for the display and computational
capability. I am sure you could do data logging with something like
that. When last I looked those units were even cheaper than my import 2
channel scope.

{{{ Common ground. I may need to measure voltage and current at different
locations. Collecting accurate data from several places on a prototype
electric vehicle proved tricky. The datalogger was an industrial unit with
differential inputs, which helped. It programmed in some arcane proprietary
language, which didn't. }}}

I am aware that you used the word "Fluke." I understand that it might
be beneath notice to consider a "cheap" tool, but there are ways to get
most jobs done. I've never owned a Fluke meter.

{{{ I have a very old Fluke 8800A ($25) that still reads a voltage standard
to the last digit.
https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/fluke_digital_multimeter_8800a.html
My own AC/DC current probe is a "Hantek", good enough if you aren't fussy.
In product R&D for lawyer-proofing we always had to take data with equipment
that was in traceable calibration, which rules out the hobby stuff, and
makes obsolete lab gear quite affordable. I have "broken" meters that I've
fixed by reseating the ICs in their sockets. }}}

P.S. Upon another moments thought I recall I actually bought that 2
channel scope (4 channels would have been ideal, but was out of my
budget) to develop an idea I had for a medical heart monitor and
training device. I did not work on it full time, and sadly Hewlett
Packard came out with something a year or so later that performed a
nearly identical function. I guess as soon as I had the idea I should
have written it up and applied for at least a provisional patent. I
still have boxes of electronic components on the shelf (some unopened)
left over from that project idea. Its just that the only thing I
actually used the scope for was tuning servo drives.

{{{ I've had some involvement with defibrillators and other medical
equipment. Liability and the heavy hand of the government are too much for
me. }}}

--
Bob La Londe
Proffessional Hack, Hobbyist, Wannabe, Shade Tree, Button Pushing, Not a
real machinist

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

On 3/28/2023 3:20 PM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
> "Bob La Londe"  wrote in message news:tvv5ud$3qv0u$1@dont-email.me...
>
> On 3/28/2023 5:14 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>> Recording while welding tends to require an expensive datalogger that
>> doesn't have other hobby uses. My cheap and simple DVM version can't
>> measure voltage and current fast enough or at the same time, and my
>> digital scope won't sample long enough. These require additional
>> user-designed circuitry to isolate and condition the voltage and
>> current signals.
>> https://www.dataq.com/products/di-1100/
>>
>
> Years ago I used to use a relatively cheap DVOM with a serial port
> output to prove to customers their power was "unclean."  I'd just hook
> it to the circuit, tie the serial port to a laptop computer with a
> serial communications terminal program running, and leave it overnight.
> 12-16 hrs was no big deal on my old laptop computers.  Sample time and
> serial port speed is of course an issue as you indicated, but I don't
> see why the same thing couldn't be done with a scope that has a data
> output.  I'll have to go look to see if my cheap 2 channel digital scope
> has a communication port.  (I've only ever used it for tuning servo
> drives).
>
> {{{ A DSO may be a bit much to suggest to someone who doesn't already
> know electricity and how to use them. I don't think my Tenma DSO outputs
> continuously in real time, only to internal files.
>
> I do most of my battery charge / discharge and temperature data logging
> with TP4000ZC serial comm DMMs and a laptop. The limitation is that it
> logs no faster than one reading per second, fine for batteries or solar
> but not welding where the arc conditions change too fast. The advantage
> is the optically isolated channels that avoid ground loops. }}}
>
> Upon a moments thought I recall that there are scopes with little more
> than an interface that use a computer for the display and computational
> capability.  I am sure you could do data logging with something like
> that.  When last I looked those units were even cheaper than my import 2
> channel scope.
>
> {{{ Common ground. I may need to measure voltage and current at
> different locations. Collecting accurate data from several places on a
> prototype electric vehicle proved tricky. The datalogger was an
> industrial unit with differential inputs, which helped. It programmed in
> some arcane proprietary language, which didn't. }}}
>
> I am aware that you used the word "Fluke."  I understand that it might
> be beneath notice to consider a "cheap" tool, but there are ways to get
> most jobs done.  I've never owned a Fluke meter.
>
> {{{ I have a very old Fluke 8800A ($25) that still reads a voltage
> standard to the last digit.
> https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/fluke_digital_multimeter_8800a.html
> My own AC/DC current probe is a "Hantek", good enough if you aren't
> fussy. In product R&D for lawyer-proofing we always had to take data
> with equipment that was in traceable calibration, which rules out the
> hobby stuff, and makes obsolete lab gear quite affordable. I have
> "broken" meters that I've fixed by reseating the ICs in their sockets. }}}
>
> P.S.  Upon another moments thought I recall I actually bought that 2
> channel scope (4 channels would have been ideal, but was out of my
> budget) to develop an idea I had for a medical heart monitor and
> training device.  I did not work on it full time, and sadly Hewlett
> Packard came out with something a year or so later that performed a
> nearly identical function.  I guess as soon as I had the idea I should
> have written it up and applied for at least a provisional patent.  I
> still have boxes of electronic components on the shelf (some unopened)
> left over from that project idea.   Its just that the only thing I
> actually used the scope for was tuning servo drives.
>
> {{{ I've had some involvement with defibrillators and other medical
> equipment. Liability and the heavy hand of the government are too much
> for me. }}}
>

My plan was a working proof of concept (secret), patent, sell to
somebody like HP. I guess I should have patented first. LOL.

More recently there is a very talented surgeon who develops orthopedic
medical implants in his home shop. He has tried to get me to help
design and machine with him a couple times. I've always turned him down
for the same reason. Liability.

--
Bob La Londe
CNC Molds N Stuff

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message news:tvvtfu$3uotl$1@dont-email.me...

More recently there is a very talented surgeon who develops orthopedic
medical implants in his home shop. He has tried to get me to help
design and machine with him a couple times. I've always turned him down
for the same reason. Liability.

Bob La Londe

----------------------

I noticed that the engineers in a medical equipment company never put their
names on anything. I couldn't determine who had designed or programmed
anything that they asked me to fix.

Bob La Londe <none@none.com99> writes:

> On 3/28/2023 5:14 AM, Jim Wilkins wrote:
>> "Richard Smith"  wrote in message news:ly355pjniz.fsf@void.com...
>>
>> David Billington <djb@invalid.com> writes:
>>
>>> ...
>>> ... . I have an oscilloscope but have never connected it up when
>>> using the rectifier so don't know how well the rectifier smoothed
>>> things, maybe one day.
>>
>> Interesting to investigate, but the good question is always "does it
>> weld well?"
>>
>> ---------------------
>>
>> Recording while welding tends to require an expensive datalogger
>> that doesn't have other hobby uses. My cheap and simple DVM version
>> can't measure voltage and current fast enough or at the same time,
>> and my digital scope won't sample long enough. These require
>> additional user-designed circuitry to isolate and condition the
>> voltage and current signals.
>> https://www.dataq.com/products/di-1100/
>>
>
> Years ago I used to use a relatively cheap DVOM with a serial port
> output to prove to customers their power was "unclean." I'd just hook
> it to the circuit, tie the serial port to a laptop computer with a
> serial communications terminal program running, and leave it
> overnight. 12-16 hrs was no big deal on my old laptop computers.
> Sample time and serial port speed is of course an issue as you
> indicated, but I don't see why the same thing couldn't be done with a
> scope that has a data output. I'll have to go look to see if my cheap
> 2 channel digital scope has a communication port. (I've only ever
> used it for tuning servo drives).
>
> Upon a moments thought I recall that there are scopes with little more
> than an interface that use a computer for the display and
> computational capability. I am sure you could do data logging with
> something like that. When last I looked those units were even cheaper
> than my import 2 channel scope.
>
> I am aware that you used the word "Fluke." I understand that it might
> be beneath notice to consider a "cheap" tool, but there are ways to
> get most jobs done. I've never owned a Fluke meter.
>
> P.S. Upon another moments thought I recall I actually bought that 2
> channel scope (4 channels would have been ideal, but was out of my
> budget) to develop an idea I had for a medical heart monitor and
> training device. I did not work on it full time, and sadly Hewlett
> Packard came out with something a year or so later that performed a
> nearly identical function. I guess as soon as I had the idea I should
> have written it up and applied for at least a provisional patent. I
> still have boxes of electronic components on the shelf (some unopened)
> left over from that project idea. Its just that the only thing I
> actually used the scope for was tuning servo drives.
>
> --
> Bob La Londe
> Proffessional Hack, Hobbyist, Wannabe, Shade Tree, Button Pushing, Not
> a real machinist
>
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
> www.avg.com

12 years ago
http://weldsmith.co.uk/dropbox/cranu/160128_datalog_AMV4000F/160128_datalog_AMV4000F.html
"Datalogging using a weld-monitor"

The devices have obviously come along since then