I'm taking another pass through Sorabji's _Sequentia Cyclica_ as
performed by Jonathan Powell. This is not a very practical piece
of music, at more than 8 hours, but there are some wonderful textures
embedded throughout, both fast & slow passages.

Todd M. McComb wrote:

> I'm taking another pass through
> Sorabji's _Sequentia Cyclica_ as
> performed by Jonathan Powell.
> This is not a very practical piece
> of music, at more than 8 hours,
> but there are some wonderful
> textures embedded throughout,
> both fast & slow passages.

Could you please summarize for
the rest of us who are unable
to invest 8 hours in Sorabji:

Does it suck? Or does it not?

Thanks!

PS. The name of this thread
should be changed to WAYSTL.
"what are you sucking to
lately" !!!

Interesting, McComb. I have never cottoned onto Sorabji's music. I will investigate and audition as per yr recommendation.

Last night I auditioned via AppleMusic a fantastic new album by Yoshiko Shimizu of the music of George Crumb for amplified piano(s). Really, really good; in fact,I will place an order for the CD forthwith. This is Shimizu's second CD of Crumb words for amplified piano, if I am not mistaken. The first one is a 2CD of the Makrokosmos !-III. Both discs are on the enterprising Kairos label.

-Celestial Mechanics (Makrokosmos IV) (1979/2012)
-Zeitgeist, Six tableaux for two amplified pianos (1988)
-Otherworldly Resonances (2005)

Oscar wrote:

> Interesting, McComb. I have never cottoned
> onto Sorabji's music. I will investigate
> and audition as per yr recommendation.

There are plenty of musics that are easier
to cotton to than Sorabji's. Do you keep
the cotton in your mouth or in your ears?

> Last night I auditioned via AppleMusic a
> fantastic new album by Yoshiko Shimizu of
> the music of George Crumb for amplified
> piano(s). Really, really good; in fact, I
> will place an order for the CD forthwith.
>

Why don't you listen to some Godowsky? He
oacks more music in a 10 minute piano work
than Brother Anton and Dick Wagner packed
in all their symphonies and operas. And
his music does not suck and does not
blow into brass plumbing.

Cheers

In article <8b459aac6269d7d6647083f909446883@www.novabbs.com>,
Oscar <oe3@aol.com> wrote:
>Last night I auditioned via AppleMusic a fantastic new album by
>Yoshiko Shimizu of the music of George Crumb for amplified piano(s).
>Really, really good; in fact,I will place an order for the CD
>forthwith. This is Shimizu's second CD of Crumb words for amplified
>piano, if I am not mistaken. The first one is a 2CD of the Makrokosmos
>!-III. Both discs are on the enterprising Kairos label.

Kairos is usually a safe bet for something new & worth hearing.
That they're releasing a second volume says something. (I thought
I'd reconized the pianist too, but wasn't able to place her. So I
guess not.)

Anyway, I'm not sure I ever really listened to this music in quantity
like this. It's kind of a step beyond Cage (& prepared piano) with
the amplification, but at least what I've heard in the first volume
generally has a tonal orientation as well, so more contact with
traditional piano music (& of course these are also mostly 20th
century compositions...). Vocalizing as well....

Tan Dun - Buddha Passion (2018) Recorded in 2019

Inspired by the Buddhist wall paintings in the Mogao Caves near Dunhuang
(northwest China) from the 5th to the 14th century, apparently
cross-fertilized with Miro', Picasso and Chagall according to the
composer himself. Described as a "music ritual", so far performed as an
oratorio. Supposedly an opera, most definitely operatic.

Lots of musical echoes, quite appropriate for a piece inspired by murals
found at the crossroads of the Silk Road. Starting from the obvious, Tan
Dun is very much under the spell of Puccini's Turandot. Funny. After
Puccini was (and is) bashed for his very Westernized approach to a
mythical Ancient China, Tan Dun has no problems looking at Liu and Calaf
from his Easternized perspective. Besides Puccini, film music looms
large (not a surprise, Tan Dun is best known as the composer of the
soundtrack of Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon and Hero). But also
Stravinsky's Nightingale (the 1914 opera more than the 1917 symphonic
poem). The 1958 Liang Shanbo and Zhu Yingtai (i.e. the Butterfly Lovers)
violin concerto by Chen and He. Philip Glass' 1983 Akhnaten and 1999 5th
Symphony (Requiem, Bardo, Nirmanakaya). And with a bit of a stretch even
Schoenberg's Gurrelieder and Mahler's Lied Von der Erde. Way more
indirect is the link with the baroque Lutheran passions, despite the title.

Exotically atmospheric use of non-Western instruments in the Thousand
Arms and Thousand Eye section, as well as inventive water basin sounds
in the Zen Garden section. Beautifully recorded, especially the
extraordinary singing by Batubagen (from the Hangaai band, a Mongolian
group at the intersection between folk music and punk rock) in the Heart
Sutra section.

Overall very appealing as aural tapestry, not sure about depth and
intensity. As the libretto says, "futile will be the quest for
explanations".

Dvorak Piano Trios, Borodin Trio, Chandos, Nos.1-3, dont care much for No.4:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30haHDP-LZM&list=OLAK5uy_nyDBSpBAakPebA8EeUiI3J-xPkjz1-S3c

Per liner notes, No.2 written soon after the death in infancy of one of his children, No.3 after death of his mother.

I recently learned (and you may know) about the 11 hours of private recordings of Sorabji playing Sorabji in the mid to late 1960s. Judging from his insanely freewheeling and fast Gulistan which is up on youtube, these recordings have attained 'holy grail' status for me. Anyway I like Powell a lot but could never get through all eight hours of the Sequentia even over several days...

Eduard Tubin, Symphonies 3 and 8, BIS recording with Neeme Järvi
conducting the Swedish Radio Symphony Orchestra. I don't know much
Tubin; this recording convinces me I should.

#3 is irresistzble. The first movemeny is highly contrapuntal; the
second often rather scherzo-like; the third self-confident, with heavy
use of ostinato. Colorfully orchestrated, with a short theme providing
a unifying motif. #8 is darker, less varied (but still often colorful, as
in the surprising coda to (ii)). It also uses ostinato extensively,
and I think very effectively. Performance and sonics seem very
successful in bringing out the qualities of the works.

Probably only the second Estonian (or indeed Baltic) composer I know
anything about.
--
Al Eisner

Sweelinck _Keyboard Works_ by Andrea Vivanet (piano), released last
month on Piano Classics.

Sweelinck wrote keyboard music in a style derived from Byrd (although
not at the same level). His keyboard works are thus related directly
to Elizabethan keyboard music, meaning that this release can be
grouped together with other Elizabethan keyboard releases on piano,
as discussed occasionally here.

And then Vivanet's recording does not seem to show awkwardness,
which I found in all the others... it seems quite idiomatic, almost
as if I'm listening to a harpsichord at times (which, I suppose,
is not what the piano mavens here want to read...). So an impressive
interpretation in terms of repertory/technique more generally.

On 3/13/2024 3:57 PM, Todd M. McComb wrote:
> Sweelinck _Keyboard Works_ by Andrea Vivanet (piano), released last
> month on Piano Classics.
>
> Sweelinck wrote keyboard music in a style derived from Byrd (although
> not at the same level). His keyboard works are thus related directly
> to Elizabethan keyboard music, meaning that this release can be
> grouped together with other Elizabethan keyboard releases on piano,
> as discussed occasionally here.
>
> And then Vivanet's recording does not seem to show awkwardness,
> which I found in all the others... it seems quite idiomatic, almost
> as if I'm listening to a harpsichord at times (which, I suppose,
> is not what the piano mavens here want to read...). So an impressive
> interpretation in terms of repertory/technique more generally.
>

On this subject, and piano mavens notwithstanding, Gould recorded
Sweelinck's Fantasia from the Fitzwilliam Virginal Book (II 297) for a
CBC television recital. More than Byrd or Gibbons, Sweelinck's style is
quite a good match for the early Gould (Sweelinck is to Byrd what
Clementi is to Mozart, so to speak).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybwNZwL1j4A

From Glenn to Glen, this is a great (and less controversial) 2008
reading of the Fantasia chromatica in Dorian mode (SwWV258) by Glen
Wilson.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kg3bJT_--mw

I had heard some of these sonatas previously and did not listen again here at this time , some here new to me I only sampled ( unfavorably), some new to me I heard whole but ultimately did not connect with, and a couple new I skipped for various reasons and may go back to hear. Of the new ones I heard in full , these I will re-hear and may be of interest to you ( as may be the others ) . All audio with scores, in most cases with background info from the YT poster or in the Comments.Some live performances, but no videos.All major challenges for the pianist, but friendly to the listener. Most are quite brief. Pianists all new to me, no recording labels given , alas.

Vladimir Shcherbachov
Nikolai Peiko
Dmitri Blagoy
Bernhard Lewkovitch No.4
Vlastimir Nikolovski
Volfgangs Darzins
Ulvi Cemal Erkin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erfLq96Wox0&list=PLBCINLbRAJXmiBSpdeZ6pgu6TSt0L1RND

And as encore:

Felix Draeseke’s (1835-1913) Piano Sonata Op.6,which Liszt allegedly said was the one of most important sonatas since Beethoven :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BWotUFkiso

Listening to the Szymanowski quartets: https://www.prestomusic.com/classical/products/7987110--szymanowski-string-quartets-nos-1-2

I've long really appreciated the violin concertos, but somehow found the quartets less memorable. The quartets sound like Debussy and Ravel with Bartok thrown in, certainly interesting but not masterpieces. I'm now going to try the Szymanowski piano music again - I have a Nimbus box with Martin Jones and a Carol Rosenberger recording - anyone have favorite works and versions?

Going through my Opera albums - liking the Manon with Alagna and Gheorghiu, but the De Los Angeles with Monteux has much more character...

Also getting into Erwartung. I've somehow accumulated multiple versions - my imprint version was Jessye Norman and that seemed fine - well sung and conducted - not sure what exactly is missing there, but the ancient Columbia recording with Craft and Helga Pilarczyk just has much more life and conviction - although the fabled Washington Opera Orchestra doubtlessly missed a few notes here and there. My other versions - Dow with Mitropoulos and Silja with Dohnanyi - are OK too but the Pilarczyk sizzles!

On 3/15/2024 1:17 AM, Notsure01 wrote:
> I'm now
> going to try the Szymanowski piano music again - I have a Nimbus box
> with Martin Jones and a Carol Rosenberger recording - anyone have
> favorite works and versions?
>

Many years ago I was lucky enough to listen to Richter in a concert
where he combined Szymanowsky's second sonata with the first book of
Debussy's Preludes. Mesmerizing and revealing, he made Szymanowsky sound
like a synthesis of the whole history of piano music from Beethoven to
the early XX century in 30 minutes. For the first sonata I recommend
Blechacz 2011.

> Also getting into Erwartung. I've somehow accumulated multiple versions
> - my imprint version was Jessye Norman and that seemed fine - well sung
> and conducted - not sure what exactly is missing there, but the ancient
> Columbia recording with Craft and Helga Pilarczyk just has much more
> life and conviction - although the fabled Washington Opera Orchestra
> doubtlessly missed a few notes here and there. My other versions - Dow
> with Mitropoulos and Silja with Dohnanyi - are OK too but the Pilarczyk
> sizzles!

Consider adding Scherchen 1955 with Magda Laszlo.

Notsure01 wrote:

> ...now going to try the Szymanowski piano music again - I have a Nimbus box with Martin Jones and a Carol Rosenberger recording - anyone have favorite works and versions?

Suggest hearing all the Mazurkas and 4 early Etudes,Op.4.I have a different Mazurka recording , but I believe Hamelin recorded the Mazurkas complete.My Etudes are Rosenbereger, # 3 a fav encore of Van Cliburn.

Bloomfield wrote:

> Notsure01 wrote:

>> ...now going to try the Szymanowski piano music again - I have a Nimbus box with Martin Jones and a Carol Rosenberger recording - anyone have favorite works and versions?

> Suggest hearing all the Mazurkas and 4 early Etudes,Op.4.I have a different Mazurka recording , but I believe Hamelin recorded the Mazurkas complete.My Etudes are Rosenbereger, # 3 a fav encore of Van Cliburn.

Zimerman has a relatively recent Szymanowski album of assorted works that is excellent.

Too bad Joyce Hatto never got around to recording Szymanowski.

Fav Mozart opera recordings update:

*sorted out Mitropoulos‘s DG (Sony) — too romantic, often voices too big and too much vibrato (even simoneau)
*sorted out Böhm‘s Serail (DG) — too romantic and way too heavy in places
*Reevaluating Böhm‘s Decca and Warner cosi
*Reevaluating Böhm‘s Decca Magic Flute
*probably sorting out Beecham‘s Serail

Serail: Krips (Decca)
Nozze: Klemperer (Warner), Suitner (Berlin Classics), Östman (Decca)
Dg: Klemperer (Warner), krips (Decca), östman (Decca)
Cosi: Klemperer (Warner), östman (Decca)
Zauberflöte: Klemperer (Warner), sawallisch (Warner), östman (Decca)

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> Fav Mozart opera recordings update:

> *sorted out Mitropoulos‘s DG (Sony) — too romantic, often voices too big and too much vibrato (even simoneau)

I have to correct myself a little here: The voices are good, and Simoneau too (except for a moment maybe) - the vibrato is more in the strings... I am just a bit conflicted about this record, because I don't feel it does justice to Mozart (similar to Schnabel's Mozart PCs)... the lines don't work together often (it feels as if the singers and orchestra don't match)... It's more drama than making the music visible (as Klemperer does, or as Ashkenazy does in op 31 no 2) - I think it's very important for Mozart to create this soundworld (*Bozo ;) ); something I had in the back of my head for quite a while about Mitropoulos's DG and also Beecham's Serail - they lack here... (although Beecham seems more coordinated than Mitropoulos)

Generally a very good recording... but... not my style I feel like...

Fav Mozart opera recordings update:

*Beecham's Serail and Böhm's Decca Zauberflöte have been sorted out (Böhm's Decca Zauberflöte is really lame from the accompaniment and much of the singers tbh; I actually dislike Simoneau very much now; Berry, Güden and Lipp are good -- oh and the three ladies. But no... -- much of the singers in Beecham's Serail suck as well).

*Still in re-evaluation: Böhm's Decca and Warner cosi.

Serail: Krips (Warner)
nozze: Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca), Suitner (Berlin Classics)
DG: Klemperer (Warner), Krips (Decca), Östman (Decca)
cosi: Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca)
Zauberflöte: Klemperer (Warner), Sawallisch (Warner), Östman (Decca)

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> Fav Mozart opera recordings update:

> nozze: Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca), Suitner (Berlin Classics)

Suitner has been sorted out... (always had a bit of trouble with this; the accompaniment as well as the singers - even Güden).

Fav Mozart opera recordings update:

I think Böhm's two cosis (Decca, Warner) are really beautiful, it's exceptionally sung, and the playing is also beautiful in most parts (even if I would do some things differently, but that would also be the case wrt Klemperer or Östman).

So, my fav Mozart opera recordings are:

Serail: Krips (Warner)
nozze: Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca)
DG: Klemperer (Warner), Krips (Decca), Östman (Decca)
cosi: Böhm (Decca), Böhm (Warner), Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca)
Zauberflöte: Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca), Sawallisch (Warner)

I think I can't sort any more out ;) these are the ones I need. Should maybe relisten to Fricsay's nozze, and check out some more hip serails...

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> Fav Mozart opera recordings update:

> I think Böhm's two cosis (Decca, Warner) are really beautiful, it's exceptionally sung, and the playing is also beautiful in most parts (even if I would do some things differently, but that would also be the case wrt Klemperer or Östman).

> So, my fav Mozart opera recordings are:

> Serail: Krips (Warner)
> nozze: Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca)
> DG: Klemperer (Warner), Krips (Decca), Östman (Decca)
> cosi: Böhm (Decca), Böhm (Warner), Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca)
> Zauberflöte: Klemperer (Warner), Östman (Decca), Sawallisch (Warner)

> I think I can't sort any more out ;) these are the ones I need. Should maybe relisten to Fricsay's nozze, and check out some more hip serails...

but naa... just thinking about it, I would rate Suitner's nozze above Fricsay's... and I don't need Suitner's.

I have intended to inform the group that I bought the Abbado doorstep megaton DG/Decca/UME box at Amoeba Music Hollywood last December for $400 used mint not-a-cut-out/promo copy. It was an impulse buy, and I am really happy I made that decision. I have working my way through 1/4 to 2/5 of it so far and the music making is consistently of a high caliber. I probably would have loved seeing him in concert.

Oscar wrote:

> I have intended to inform the group that I bought the Abbado doorstep megaton DG/Decca/UME box at Amoeba Music Hollywood last December for $400 used mint not-a-cut-out/promo copy. It was an impulse buy, and I am really happy I made that decision.

Happy for you, 90% of the shit I bought last year has been sorted out..

howard wrote:

> Too bad Joyce Hatto never got
> around to recording Szymanowski.

Or Cage! She could have recorded
a truly unique, individual 4'33".

Cheers