From Lebrecht's "Slipped Disc" today :

A new biodoc by Bruno Monsaingeon examines how the young Finn makes recordings:

‘When we record these days, everything has been done over and over and done very well. We therefore want to push our concept as far as possible. The priority is obviously music made on stage recorded during concerts and patching sessions. This is the heart of the CD and it is pushed to the maximum. But then the question arises: How much more can we refine things?

‘We record with a lot of microphones, which allows us to refine the balances slightly. Post-production, I adore. You take the best shots while maintaining the illusion of a single take. My ideal is to make music on stage as best as possible and improve it a little bit.’

Q. A kind of sound Photoshop?

A. ‘In a way, yes.’

I don't see any problem with this if it sounds better in the end.

The problem with Mäkelä is more that he is not very musical... if Herman was born a little later, he might have become a Mäkelä ;)

I think one of the problems of these days is that people sort of feel compelled to be authentic... maybe even only subconsciously, always trying to be without contradictions (Herman doesn't realize his own contradictions, similar to Dan)... thing is, the capitalist world is full of contradictions (which affects us as well - most people just don't realize this consciously); contradictions which need to be resolved... anyway this drive to be authentic which is doomed to fail is just some form of rebellion against this world I beieve...

and now people want authentic records (no "photoshop") or HIP music... etc etc

just some thoughts

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> I think one of the problems of these days is that people sort of feel compelled to be authentic... maybe even only subconsciously, always trying to be without contradictions (Herman doesn't realize his own contradictions, similar to Dan)... thing is, the capitalist world is full of contradictions (which affects us as well - most people just don't realize this consciously); contradictions which need to be resolved... anyway this drive to be authentic which is doomed to fail is just some form of rebellion against this world I beieve...

> and now people want authentic records (no "photoshop") or HIP music... etc etc

or want to change their gender to be their "authentic" selves ;) fake men, fake women - no matter what the passport says... "born in the wrong body" -- also a rebellion (albeit an infantile and insane one) against this world (which in many ways suggests stereotypcial gender roles which sometimes confuse kids and against which they rebel etc and if they suffer from body dysmorphia in the first place, they might easily fall for the transgender-ideology). A very serious illness which is unfortunately being normalized these days.

> just some thoughts

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> JudeoN4zi wrote:

>> I think one of the problems of these days is that people sort of feel compelled to be authentic... maybe even only subconsciously, always trying to be without contradictions (Herman doesn't realize his own contradictions, similar to Dan)... thing is, the capitalist world is full of contradictions (which affects us as well - most people just don't realize this consciously); contradictions which need to be resolved... anyway this drive to be authentic which is doomed to fail is just some form of rebellion against this world I beieve...

>> and now people want authentic records (no "photoshop") or HIP music... etc etc

> or want to change their gender to be their "authentic" selves ;) fake men, fake women - no matter what the passport says... "born in the wrong body" -- also a rebellion (albeit an infantile and insane one) against this world (which in many ways suggests stereotypcial gender roles which sometimes confuse kids and against which they rebel etc and if they suffer from body dysmorphia in the first place, they might easily fall for the transgender-ideology). A very serious illness which is unfortunately being normalized these days.

Self-mutilation to become their true selves... and surgeons and pharma-people who should actually know better just go on with it...

This also seems to be some trauma from the Shoah - at least in Germany - but generally, the west sort of wants to atone for their wrongdoings.

A German you couldn't be a Jew, today a man can even be a woman and vice versa.

The will to do good - as in being more liberal, not only reached, but breached he limit -- this is too muchg lbieralism. We can't normalize insanity - plain and simple.

>> just some thoughts

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> A German you couldn't be a Jew, today a man can even be a woman and vice versa.

Or rather a Jew couldn't be a German -- I started the sentence wrong (I wrote: In Germany... and then corrected it).

Anyways isn't it itneresting that one of the leading transgender-ideologues Judith Butler (who receveid the Adorno-Prize despite much criticism) called the massacre on Jews by Hamas an "act of resistance" -- she lost relatives in the shoah. Nothing learned, just completely deluded and an antisemite herself.

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> JudeoN4zi wrote:

>> A German you couldn't be a Jew, today a man can even be a woman and vice versa.

> Or rather a Jew couldn't be a German -- I started the sentence wrong (I wrote: In Germany... and then corrected it).

The irony ofc is by letting all the muslims in without confronting their ideology wrt antisemitism and how it is also tied to how many of them view Jews and Israel which is influenced by their ideology, the Jews again have problems being (openly) Jewish in Germany.

The Germans were allied with the muslims in WWI and WWII... as a sidenote...

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> JudeoN4zi wrote:

>> JudeoN4zi wrote:

>>> A German you couldn't be a Jew, today a man can even be a woman and vice versa.

>> Or rather a Jew couldn't be a German -- I started the sentence wrong (I wrote: In Germany... and then corrected it).

> The irony ofc is by letting all the muslims in without confronting their ideology wrt antisemitism and how it is also tied to how many of them view Jews and Israel which is influenced by their ideology, the Jews again have problems being (openly) Jewish in Germany.

> The Germans were allied with the muslims in WWI and WWII... as a sidenote...

Karl Lagerfeld put it succinctly: "You can't murder Millions of Jews and bring Millions of their worst enemies into the country."

This might be too politically uncorrect for many people - especially people of the sort of Andy and Herman -, but it's the truth.

Bloomfield wrote:

> From Lebrecht's "Slipped Disc" today :

> A new biodoc by Bruno Monsaingeon examines
> how the young Finn makes recordings:
> ‘When we record these days, everything has
> been done over and over and done very well.
> We therefore want to push our concept as far
> as possible. The priority is obviously music
> made on stage recorded during concerts and
> patching sessions. This is the heart of the
> CD and it is pushed to the maximum. But then
> the question arises: How much more can we
> refine things?
> ‘We record with a lot of microphones, which
> allows us to refine the balances slightly.
> Post-production, I adore. You take the best
> shots while maintaining the illusion of a
> single take. My ideal is to make music on
> stage as best as possible and improve it a
> little bit.’
> Q. A kind of sound Photoshop?
> A. ‘In a way, yes.’

What else can one expect from Le Klaus? He is
a fashion model with a baton. No more, no less,
and nothing else. He makes even Herbie Kharajan
look and sound decent by comparison.

Ciao!

DeepBlue wrote:

> Bloomfield wrote:

>> From Lebrecht's "Slipped Disc" today :

>> A new biodoc by Bruno Monsaingeon examines
>> how the young Finn makes recordings:
>> ‘When we record these days, everything has
>> been done over and over and done very well.
>> We therefore want to push our concept as far
>> as possible. The priority is obviously music
>> made on stage recorded during concerts and
>> patching sessions. This is the heart of the
>> CD and it is pushed to the maximum. But then
>> the question arises: How much more can we
>> refine things?
>> ‘We record with a lot of microphones, which
>> allows us to refine the balances slightly.
>> Post-production, I adore. You take the best
>> shots while maintaining the illusion of a
>> single take. My ideal is to make music on
>> stage as best as possible and improve it a
>> little bit.’
>> Q. A kind of sound Photoshop?
>> A. ‘In a way, yes.’

> What else can one expect from Le Klaus? He is
> a fashion model with a baton. No more, no less,
> and nothing else.

Indeed, he is vapid. There are superior musicians and conductors who don't have a fraction of the career he has somehow secured for himself. At least his on-again, off-again girlfriend-model has real talent at the piano. She should dump him once and for all.

DeepBlue wrote:

> What else can one expect from Le Klaus? He is
> a fashion model with a baton. No more, no less,
> and nothing else. He makes even Herbie Kharajan
> look and sound decent by comparison.

If this guy is a fashion model, man, I should be Mr Universe or sth ;D

He comes off as a little kid, looking for his mommy - who he likely found in Yuja Wang (Freud!).

> Ciao!

JudeoN4zi wrote:
>
> The Germans were allied with the
> muslims in WWI and WWII... as a
> sidenote...

Not so fast. Which Muslims? In WWI
Germany and Turkey were allies, and
the Brits supported the Arabs against
the Turks. Please be more accurate!

Cheers

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> I don't see any problem with this
> if it sounds better in the end.

It is no longer the same performance.
"Sounds better" is meaningless and
irrelevant.

Music is a PERFORMING ART and true
performances are indivisible. Just
like the steak or the salmon fillet
on one's plate one bit cannot be
replaced by a different bit.

Capisce?

JudeoN4zi wrote:
>
> and now people want authentic records
> (no "photoshop") or HIP music... etc

I don't want "authentic" records. I want
live performances, and I want unedited
records that capture those performances.

This has nothing to do with "authenticity".
It is the performance that matters to me,
not the "authenticity", nor the "intent".

Capisce?

DeepBlue wrote:

> JudeoN4zi wrote:
>>
>> The Germans were allied with the
>> muslims in WWI and WWII... as a
>> sidenote...

> Not so fast. Which Muslims? In WWI
> Germany and Turkey were allies, and
> the Brits supported the Arabs against
> the Turks. Please be more accurate!

Well, the Turks were _the_ muslim power; and the Arabs with which the Allies allied themselves with had progression in mind (Emancipation from the Ottoman Empire) -- the Arabs with which the Allies allied themselves were also not a major power.

Did the Brits mobilize Arabs to do a Jihad against Germay? As far as I know it was only Germany that mobilized the Ottoman's to do a jihad against the triple-entente; and the Germans continued to use this strategy in world war 2 (Read: David Motadel Islam and Nazi Germany's War) -- Mufti of Jerusalem (inspiration for muslim brotherhood and arafat).

Generally Germany was always on the regressive side - also apparent in the French Reovlution. After Napoleon lost, Germany went back to it's old self -- Jews again had lesser rights, sth the French had fought for and guaranteed -- equal rights for Jews.

> Cheers

DeepBlue wrote:

> JudeoN4zi wrote:

>> I don't see any problem with this
>> if it sounds better in the end.

> It is no longer the same performance.
> "Sounds better" is meaningless and
> irrelevant.

Sounding better is what music is about :)

> Music is a PERFORMING ART and true
> performances are indivisible. Just
> like the steak or the salmon fillet
> on one's plate one bit cannot be
> replaced by a different bit.

You are a "little" fucked in the brain - verstanden?

keep your "wisdom" for yourself.

Equating food with music lol

DeepBlue wrote:

> JudeoN4zi wrote:
>>
>> and now people want authentic records
>> (no "photoshop") or HIP music... etc

> I don't want "authentic" records. I want
> live performances, and I want unedited
> records that capture those performances.

If that's what you want okay -- fine with me.

> This has nothing to do with "authenticity".
> It is the performance that matters to me,
> not the "authenticity", nor the "intent".

Obviously it has sth to do with "authenticity"... you yourself were speaking about "true" performances lol...

As if you could tell in each and every case if sth was edited or not... lol -- a "little" brainfucked.

Sidenote: Israel is being viewed as an "inauthentic" state by the fakestinians, Jews were always seen as "das Fremde" in the world... etc... the fakestinians want to go "back to the roots"... Ursprünglihckeit (tribal customs etc)...

> Capisce?

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> Sidenote: Israel is being viewed as an "inauthentic" state by the fakestinians, Jews were always seen as "das Fremde" in the world... etc... the fakestinians want to go "back to the roots"... Ursprünglihckeit (tribal customs etc)...

The massacre on Jews on 7/10 can also be seen as an act of revolt against the capitalist world order (similar to Nazism) - it's a form of vulgar anti-capitalism in which the characteristics of capitalism which are hated are identified with the Jews; and by ridding the world of Jews, they feel like they are liberating themselves from the domincance of the capital (it's a subconscious mechanism - these people can't make sense of this world, it's too complex for them - Answer: Jews/Israel).

"Nazism was rather a vulgar form of anti-capitalism. The rejection of the bourgeoisie and its values is present in Nazism, but Postone saw Nazi ideology as the affirmation of the concrete dimension of capitalism — which includes technology and industrial production, as well as the peasantry and manual labour — as the heart of a healthy, organic social life. This stood in contrast with the abstract dimension represented by finance capital. The abstract is instead rejected, and it is personified by the Jews. Postone analyzed the figure of the Jew in modern antisemitism as the embodiment of abstract value, and extermination camps as a misbegotten notion of a "factory" to destroy value."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moishe_Postone

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> JudeoN4zi wrote:

>> Sidenote: Israel is being viewed as an "inauthentic" state by the fakestinians, Jews were always seen as "das Fremde" in the world... etc... the fakestinians want to go "back to the roots"... Ursprünglihckeit (tribal customs etc)...

> The massacre on Jews on 7/10 can also be seen as an act of revolt against the capitalist world order (similar to Nazism) - it's a form of vulgar anti-capitalism in which the characteristics of capitalism which are hated are identified with the Jews; and by ridding the world of Jews, they feel like they are liberating themselves from the domincance of the capital (it's a subconscious mechanism - these people can't make sense of this world, it's too complex for them - Answer: Jews/Israel).

> "Nazism was rather a vulgar form of anti-capitalism. The rejection of the bourgeoisie and its values is present in Nazism, but Postone saw Nazi ideology as the affirmation of the concrete dimension of capitalism — which includes technology and industrial production, as well as the peasantry and manual labour — as the heart of a healthy, organic social life. This stood in contrast with the abstract dimension represented by finance capital. The abstract is instead rejected, and it is personified by the Jews. Postone analyzed the figure of the Jew in modern antisemitism as the embodiment of abstract value, and extermination camps as a misbegotten notion of a "factory" to destroy value."

The Nazis glorified "schaffendes Kapital" ("honest workers", using their hands) and demonized "raffendes Kapital" (Finance capitalism -- no hands involved) and saw the Jews as being behind all of this -- the master conspirators so to speak ;D

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moishe_Postone

Israel is the "Emanzipationsgewalt" of the Jews (means of Emancipation - a rather poor translation).

JudeoN4zi wrote:

> Israel is the "Emanzipationsgewalt" of the Jews (means of Emancipation - a rather poor translation).

Emancipationpower (power in the sense of how the judiciary is a power etc)

howard wrote:
> Indeed, he is vapid. There are superior musicians and conductors who don't have a fraction of the career he has somehow secured for himself. At least his on-again, off-again girlfriend-model has real talent at the piano. She should dump him once and for all.

I have not heard him conducting but once, so no judge, but am puzzled if he was able to head both the Oslo and Paris positions simultaneously,while doing a lot of guesting, and now seems he will simultaneously be heading Royal Concertgebouw and Chicago Symphony.I believe I read it alleged his performances recently with Vienna Phil and Berlin Phil did not impress the orchestra members themselves, but I dont how accurate the reports or why if true, and RCO and Chicago dont seem concerned ?

Here he is conducting live the Opera de Paris Orchestra live at Carnegie this past Saturday in Stravinsky's Firebird and Rite, free listening:

https://www.wqxr.org/story/orchestre-de-paris/

Bloomfield wrote:

> howard wrote:
>> Indeed, he is vapid. There are superior musicians and conductors who don't have a fraction of the career he has somehow secured for himself. At least his on-again, off-again girlfriend-model has real talent at the piano. She should dump him once and for all.

> I have not heard him conducting but once, so no judge, but am puzzled if he was able to head both the Oslo and Paris positions simultaneously,while doing a lot of guesting, and now seems he will simultaneously be heading Royal Concertgebouw and Chicago Symphony.I believe I read it alleged his performances recently with Vienna Phil and Berlin Phil did not impress the orchestra members themselves, but I dont how accurate the reports or why if true, and RCO and Chicago dont seem concerned ?

As a subscriber, if those were my regular orchestras, I would be pretty annoyed. I am not interested in hearing Mahler or Bruckner conducted by an immature boy who has lived in a bubble his whole life.

These orchestras are in a race to the bottom. They are trying to reproduce the Dudamel model for financial success, merit be damned. Not even Leonard Bernstein rose so rapidly as these people, Lenny didn't get named conductor of the New York Philharmonic until he was nearly 40.

On 19/03/2024 6:51 am, howard wrote:
> Bloomfield wrote:
>
>> howard wrote:
>>> Indeed, he is vapid. There are superior musicians and conductors who
>>> don't have a fraction of the career he has somehow secured for
>>> himself.  At least his on-again, off-again girlfriend-model has real
>>> talent at the piano. She should dump him once and for all.
>
>
>> I have not heard him conducting but once, so no judge, but am puzzled
>> if he was able to head both the Oslo and Paris positions
>> simultaneously,while doing a lot of guesting, and now seems he will
>> simultaneously be heading Royal Concertgebouw and Chicago Symphony.I
>> believe I read it alleged his performances recently with Vienna Phil
>> and Berlin Phil did not impress the orchestra members themselves, but
>> I dont how accurate the reports or why if true, and RCO and Chicago
>> dont seem concerned ?
>
>
> As a subscriber, if those were my regular orchestras, I would be pretty
> annoyed. I am not interested in hearing Mahler or Bruckner conducted by
> an immature boy who has lived in a bubble his whole life.
> These orchestras are in a race to the bottom. They are trying to
> reproduce the Dudamel model for financial success, merit be damned. Not
> even Leonard Bernstein rose so rapidly as these people, Lenny didn't get
> named conductor of the New York Philharmonic until he was nearly 40.

Spot on. He is no more than an anaemic looking metronome. Light years
away from people like Temirkanov who never really courted the limelight.

Ray Hall, Taree