Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
motor vehicles than there used to be? People caught in flash floods or
trying to navigate inundated roads who end up trapped in their cars:
that sort of thing?

I just wondered whether modern vehicle electronics had anything to do
with it? Will automatically-locking doors automatically unlock in the
event of the vehicle computer becoming flooded with water? Will
electric windows still work? Is this sort of resilience part of the
design spec?

Fifty years ago I reversed a car into a lake until the rear end was
completely submerged but all the electrics continued to work as
normal. Would this still have happened today?

Nick
[]1Prompted by the Baltimore Bridge Disaster but probably not relevant
to it.
[2]No, not drunk and out of control. Carefully reversed a car and
trailer down a boat slipway but a combination of the slipway slope,
depth of the water and height of the trailer meant that the rear of
the vehicle had to be well underwater before the boat could be floated
free of the trailer.

Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote

> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many moredrownings in motor
> vehicles than there used to be?

Never seen any stats on that.

> People caught in flash floods or trying to navigateinundated roads who
> end up trapped in their cars:
> that sort of thing?

> I just wondered whether modern vehicle electronics had anythingto do
> with it? Will automatically-locking doors automatically unlockin the
> event of the vehicle computer becoming flooded with water?

Even if they do, its not trivial to get the door open in deep enough water

> Will electric windows still work?

Should do except maybe in sea water.

> Is this sort of resilience part of the design spec?

Not aware of that.

Its certainly possible to have an automatic
center pop to break the door windows.

> Fifty years ago I reversed a car into a lake until the rear endwas
> completely submerged but all the electrics continued towork as normal.
> Would this still have happened today?

Yes, river water isnt very conductive.

> Nick
> []1Prompted by the Baltimore Bridge Disasterbut probably not relevant
> to it.

It would be if you were in one of the cars that came off the bridge.

> [2]No, not drunk and out of control.

Corse you would say that...

> Carefully reversed a car and
> trailer down a boat slipway but a combination of the slipway slope,
> depth of the water and height of the trailer meant that the rear of
> the vehicle had to be well underwater before the boat could be floated
> free of the trailer.

Yeah, not uncommon at all.

Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
> motor vehicles than there used to be?

I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
off” for financial gain. It’s hard to believe that all the eejits trying
to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are ignorant of
the possible consequences.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>
> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
> off” for financial gain. It’s hard to believe that all the eejits trying
> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are ignorant of
> the possible consequences.
>

Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
(Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU

--
Regards
wasbit

On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 11:08:09 +0000, wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:

>On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>>
>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
>> off” for financial gain. It’s hard to believe that all the eejits trying
>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are ignorant of
>> the possible consequences.
>>
>
>Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
>(Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU

Came for the guy on the moto, stayed for... all of it, actually.

Hilarious!

Nick

wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>>
>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
>> off” for financial gain. It’s hard to believe that all the eejits trying
>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are ignorant of
>> the possible consequences.
>>
>
> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU
>

The guy has fitted a snorkel to the engine air intake. You can see him
holding up a rubber tube as he rides through.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 22:08:09 +1100, wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:

> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
>> off” for financial gain. It’s hard to believe that all the eejits
>> trying
>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are ignorant
>> of
>> the possible consequences.
>>
>
> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).

Pause at that time, right mouse click, select
copy url at this time

https://youtu.be/gdDtuVCQZrU?t=360

> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU

On 29/03/2024 18:04, Rod Speed wrote:
> On Fri, 29 Mar 2024 22:08:09 +1100, wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
>
>> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>>>  I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
>>> off” for financial gain.  It’s hard to believe that all the eejits
>>> trying
>>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are
>>> ignorant of
>>> the possible consequences.
>>>
>>
>> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
>> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
>
> Pause at that time, right mouse click, select
> copy url at this time
>
> https://youtu.be/gdDtuVCQZrU?t=360
>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU

Thanks. Didn't know that method.

--
Regards
wasbit

On 29/03/2024 17:09, Tim+ wrote:
> wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
>> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>>>
>>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
>>> off” for financial gain. It’s hard to believe that all the eejits trying
>>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are ignorant of
>>> the possible consequences.
>>>
>>
>> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
>> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU
>>
>
> The guy has fitted a snorkel to the engine air intake. You can see him
> holding up a rubber tube as he rides through.
>

Yes, I saw that but I wondered why there was no electrical problems.

--
Regards
wasbit

wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
> On 29/03/2024 17:09, Tim+ wrote:
>> wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>>>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>>>>
>>>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
>>>> off” for financial gain. It’s hard to believe that all the eejits trying
>>>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are ignorant of
>>>> the possible consequences.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
>>> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU
>>>
>>
>> The guy has fitted a snorkel to the engine air intake. You can see him
>> holding up a rubber tube as he rides through.
>>
>
> Yes, I saw that but I wondered why there was no electrical problems.
>

Diesel? ;-)

I guess the electrics are well enough sealed to get through. Japanese
rather than British Leyland standard electrics. ;-)

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 2024-03-30 10:13, wasbit wrote:
> On 29/03/2024 17:09, Tim+ wrote:
>> wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>>>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>>>>
>>>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
>>>> off” for financial gain.  It’s hard to believe that all the eejits
>>>> trying
>>>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are
>>>> ignorant of
>>>> the possible consequences.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
>>> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU
>>>
>>
>> The guy has fitted a snorkel to the engine air intake.  You can see him
>> holding up a rubber tube as he rides through.
>>
>
> Yes, I saw that but I wondered why there was no electrical problems.
>
>
>

Can't ask him now, but part of the preparation my father's unit was
engaged in in 1944-1945 was waterproofing their vehicles so they could
drive off the landing craft through the water, driving standing up if
necessary. As I understand it, long pipes for the gases and
waterproofing everything.

A very old-fashioned diesel, mechanical fuel pump and simple stop lever,
might work with just a long air intake tube?

nib

On 30/03/2024 10:13, wasbit wrote:
> On 29/03/2024 17:09, Tim+ wrote:
>> wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>>>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>>>>
>>>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles “written
>>>> off” for financial gain.  It’s hard to believe that all the eejits
>>>> trying
>>>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are
>>>> ignorant of
>>>> the possible consequences.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
>>> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU
>>>
>>
>> The guy has fitted a snorkel to the engine air intake.  You can see him
>> holding up a rubber tube as he rides through.
>>
>
> Yes, I saw that but I wondered why there was no electrical problems.
>

Edit: There were - not there was.

--
Regards
wasbit

On 31/03/2024 10:08, wasbit wrote:
> On 30/03/2024 10:13, wasbit wrote:
>> On 29/03/2024 17:09, Tim+ wrote:
>>> wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>>> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
>>>>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>>>>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>>>>>> motor vehicles than there used to be?
>>>>>
>>>>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles
>>>>> “written
>>>>> off” for financial gain.  It’s hard to believe that all the eejits
>>>>> trying
>>>>> to drive through Rufford ford that you can see on YouTube are
>>>>> ignorant of
>>>>> the possible consequences.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
>>>> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
>>>>
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU
>>>>
>>>
>>> The guy has fitted a snorkel to the engine air intake.  You can see him
>>> holding up a rubber tube as he rides through.
>>>
>>
>> Yes, I saw that but I wondered why there was no electrical problems.
>>
>
> Edit: There were - not there was.
>
>
>
sadly the modern idiom is to ape the USA and use the singular throughout

--
In todays liberal progressive conflict-free education system, everyone
gets full Marx.

On 3/27/2024 12:44 PM, Nick Odell wrote:
> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
> motor vehicles than there used to be? People caught in flash floods or
> trying to navigate inundated roads who end up trapped in their cars:
> that sort of thing?
>
> I just wondered whether modern vehicle electronics had anything to do
> with it? Will automatically-locking doors automatically unlock in the
> event of the vehicle computer becoming flooded with water? Will
> electric windows still work? Is this sort of resilience part of the
> design spec?
>
> Fifty years ago I reversed a car into a lake until the rear end was
> completely submerged but all the electrics continued to work as
> normal. Would this still have happened today?
>
> Nick
> []1Prompted by the Baltimore Bridge Disaster but probably not relevant
> to it.
> [2]No, not drunk and out of control. Carefully reversed a car and
> trailer down a boat slipway but a combination of the slipway slope,
> depth of the water and height of the trailer meant that the rear of
> the vehicle had to be well underwater before the boat could be floated
> free of the trailer.
>

There are two things you can carry in a car:

1) A glass-break device (a pointed hammer thingy, that breaks safety glass).
This helps with situations like pressure-differential. Your door may be
open, but it opens outwards against the pressure. When you're ready to leave,
you break the driver window with hammer tap, and head for the surface.

2) A belt cutter. In case the release jams and you need to cut yourself loose.
May be helpful in a rollover, and you're inverted.

You can't have this just "anywhere" in the car. These items must be within
reach, and secured in such a way, they'll be where you expect them to be.
If you leave the devices in the back of the car, they could be useless
to you.

*******

The departure conditions on that bridge are not good.

185 feet above water (G-force on impact).

Water is damn cold.

Water is dirty, and zero visibility.

That's hell. Hell on earth.

Paul

On 30 Mar 2024 15:29:34 GMT
Tim+ <timdownieuk@yahoo.co.youkay> wrote:

> wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
> > On 29/03/2024 17:09, Tim+ wrote:
> >> wasbit <wasbit@nowhere.com> wrote:
> >>> On 27/03/2024 19:49, Tim+ wrote:
> >>>> Nick Odell <nickodell49@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> >>>>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings
> >>>>> in motor vehicles than there used to be?
> >>>>
> >>>> I suspect it’s just down to more people trying to get vehicles
> >>>> “written off” for financial gain. It’s hard to believe that all
> >>>> the eejits trying to drive through Rufford ford that you can see
> >>>> on YouTube are ignorant of the possible consequences.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> Dunno, but how does this work? Start at 6 minutes in.
> >>> (Used to know how to do that but can't find the specific note).
> >>>
> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdDtuVCQZrU
> >>>
> >>
> >> The guy has fitted a snorkel to the engine air intake. You can
> >> see him holding up a rubber tube as he rides through.
> >>
> >
> > Yes, I saw that but I wondered why there was no electrical problems.
> >
>
> Diesel? ;-)
>
> I guess the electrics are well enough sealed to get through. Japanese
> rather than British Leyland standard electrics. ;-)
>
> Tim
>

The Austin Champ came well water-proofed, and had tiny little rubber
plugs attached to the wiper motors to prevent water ingress through the
ventilation holes
--
Davey.

On 31/03/2024 15:30, Paul wrote:
> On 3/27/2024 12:44 PM, Nick Odell wrote:
>> Is it my imagination or do there seem to be many more drownings in
>> motor vehicles than there used to be? People caught in flash floods or
>> trying to navigate inundated roads who end up trapped in their cars:
>> that sort of thing?
>>
>> I just wondered whether modern vehicle electronics had anything to do
>> with it? Will automatically-locking doors automatically unlock in the
>> event of the vehicle computer becoming flooded with water? Will
>> electric windows still work? Is this sort of resilience part of the
>> design spec?
>>
>> Fifty years ago I reversed a car into a lake until the rear end was
>> completely submerged but all the electrics continued to work as
>> normal. Would this still have happened today?
>>
>> Nick
>> []1Prompted by the Baltimore Bridge Disaster but probably not relevant
>> to it.
>> [2]No, not drunk and out of control. Carefully reversed a car and
>> trailer down a boat slipway but a combination of the slipway slope,
>> depth of the water and height of the trailer meant that the rear of
>> the vehicle had to be well underwater before the boat could be floated
>> free of the trailer.
>>
>
> There are two things you can carry in a car:
>
> 1) A glass-break device (a pointed hammer thingy, that breaks safety glass).
> This helps with situations like pressure-differential. Your door may be
> open, but it opens outwards against the pressure. When you're ready to leave,
> you break the driver window with hammer tap, and head for the surface.
>
> 2) A belt cutter. In case the release jams and you need to cut yourself loose.
> May be helpful in a rollover, and you're inverted.

Alternatively, a Swiss Army knife. Several cutty things on that and the
device for removing Boy Scouts from horses' hooves, makes a handy punch
if you hold the body with it sticking out between a couple of fingers.

Also, hit the glass near a bottom corner. I've watched a policeman's
truncheon bounce off a car window when he hit it really hard in the
centre. (A lady had locked her keys in the car and was desperate to get in).

> You can't have this just "anywhere" in the car. These items must be within
> reach, and secured in such a way, they'll be where you expect them to be.
> If you leave the devices in the back of the car, they could be useless
> to you.

My SAK is always in my pocket (unless flying on a commercial airline),
secured to my belt with a chain and a snap clip. They are expensive to
replace if they fall out of the pocket.

>
> *******
>
> The departure conditions on that bridge are not good.
>
> 185 feet above water (G-force on impact).
>
> Water is damn cold.
>
> Water is dirty, and zero visibility.
>
> That's hell. Hell on earth.
>
> Paul

--
Colin Bignell

On 31/03/2024 17:01, Colin Bignell wrote:
> My SAK is always in my pocket
Yiu will be charged for carrying a concealed offensive weapon.
--
You can get much farther with a kind word and a gun than you can with a
kind word alone.

Al Capone

On 31/03/2024 17:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 31/03/2024 17:01, Colin Bignell wrote:
>> My SAK is always in my pocket
> Yiu will be charged for carrying a concealed offensive weapon.

It is a non-locking pocket knife with a blade not exceeding three
inches, so it can be carried without a valid reason. However, submerged
car escape tool could probably be put forward as one.

--
Colin Bignell

On Mon, 01 Apr 2024 04:16:59 +1100, Colin Bignell
<cpb@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:

> On 31/03/2024 17:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 31/03/2024 17:01, Colin Bignell wrote:
>>> My SAK is always in my pocket
>> Yiu will be charged for carrying a concealed offensive weapon.
>
> It is a non-locking pocket knife with a blade not exceeding three
> inches, so it can be carried without a valid reason. However, submerged
> car escape tool could probably be put forward as one.

But an automatic center pop kept in the car would
work much better, particularly for women and kids
and would be completely legal.

On 31/03/2024 18:27, Rod Speed wrote:
> On Mon, 01 Apr 2024 04:16:59 +1100, Colin Bignell
> <cpb@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 31/03/2024 17:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 31/03/2024 17:01, Colin Bignell wrote:
>>>> My SAK is always in my pocket
>>> Yiu will be charged for carrying a concealed offensive weapon.
>>
>> It is a non-locking pocket knife with a blade not exceeding three
>> inches, so it can be carried without a valid reason. However,
>> submerged car escape tool could probably be put forward as one.
>
> But an automatic center pop kept in the car would
> work much better, particularly for women and kids
> and would be completely legal.

Carrying kids would be illegal, as I don't have the requisite child
safety equipment, but the SAK is perfectly legal.

--
Colin Bignell

On Mon, 01 Apr 2024 06:00:08 +1100, Colin Bignell
<cpb@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:

> On 31/03/2024 18:27, Rod Speed wrote:
>> On Mon, 01 Apr 2024 04:16:59 +1100, Colin Bignell
>> <cpb@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> On 31/03/2024 17:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 31/03/2024 17:01, Colin Bignell wrote:
>>>>> My SAK is always in my pocket
>>>> Yiu will be charged for carrying a concealed offensive weapon.
>>>
>>> It is a non-locking pocket knife with a blade not exceeding three
>>> inches, so it can be carried without a valid reason. However,
>>> submerged car escape tool could probably be put forward as one.
>> But an automatic center pop kept in the car would
>> work much better, particularly for women and kids
>> and would be completely legal.
>
> Carrying kids would be illegal, as I don't have the requisite child
> safety equipment,

Depends on the age of the kids.

> but the SAK is perfectly legal.

But much more risky of a woman or a kid to
use and very few of those carry one of those.

Snip for brevity.

> >>
> >
> > There are two things you can carry in a car:
> >
> > 1) A glass-break device (a pointed hammer thingy, that breaks
> > safety glass). This helps with situations like
> > pressure-differential. Your door may be open, but it opens outwards
> > against the pressure. When you're ready to leave, you break the
> > driver window with hammer tap, and head for the surface.
> >
> > 2) A belt cutter. In case the release jams and you need to cut
> > yourself loose. May be helpful in a rollover, and you're inverted.
>
> Alternatively, a Swiss Army knife. Several cutty things on that and
> the device for removing Boy Scouts from horses' hooves, makes a handy
> punch if you hold the body with it sticking out between a couple of
> fingers.
>
> Also, hit the glass near a bottom corner. I've watched a policeman's
> truncheon bounce off a car window when he hit it really hard in the
> centre. (A lady had locked her keys in the car and was desperate to
> get in).
>
> > You can't have this just "anywhere" in the car. These items must be
> > within reach, and secured in such a way, they'll be where you
> > expect them to be. If you leave the devices in the back of the car,
> > they could be useless to you.
>
> My SAK is always in my pocket (unless flying on a
> commercialhttps://www.victorinox.com/en/Products/Swiss-Army-Knives/Large-Pocket-Knives/Rescue-Tool/p/0.8623.MWN
> airline), secured to my belt with a chain and a snap clip. They are
> expensive to replace if they fall out of the pocket.
>
snip

There is always this:
https://www.victorinox.com/en/Products/Swiss-Army-Knives/Large-Pocket-Knives/Rescue-Tool/p/0.8623.MWN

--
Davey.

On 31/03/2024 23:19, Rod Speed wrote:
> On Mon, 01 Apr 2024 06:00:08 +1100, Colin Bignell
> <cpb@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:
>
>> On 31/03/2024 18:27, Rod Speed wrote:
>>> On Mon, 01 Apr 2024 04:16:59 +1100, Colin Bignell
>>> <cpb@bignellremovethis.me.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 31/03/2024 17:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>> On 31/03/2024 17:01, Colin Bignell wrote:
>>>>>> My SAK is always in my pocket
>>>>> Yiu will be charged for carrying a concealed offensive weapon.
>>>>
>>>> It is a non-locking pocket knife with a blade not exceeding three
>>>> inches, so it can be carried without a valid reason. However,
>>>> submerged car escape tool could probably be put forward as one.
>>>  But an automatic center pop kept in the car would
>>> work much better, particularly for women and kids
>>> and would be completely legal.
>>
>> Carrying kids would be illegal, as I don't have the requisite child
>> safety equipment,
>
> Depends on the age of the kids.

Pre-teens and teens don't count as kids.

>
>> but the SAK is perfectly legal.
>
> But much more risky of a woman or a kid to
> use and very few of those carry one of those.

Even fewer travel in my car, so it is not a problem I need to worry about.

--
Colin Bignell

On 31/03/2024 23:48, Davey wrote:
> Snip for brevity.
>
>>>>
>>>
>>> There are two things you can carry in a car:
>>>
>>> 1) A glass-break device (a pointed hammer thingy, that breaks
>>> safety glass). This helps with situations like
>>> pressure-differential. Your door may be open, but it opens outwards
>>> against the pressure. When you're ready to leave, you break the
>>> driver window with hammer tap, and head for the surface.
>>>
>>> 2) A belt cutter. In case the release jams and you need to cut
>>> yourself loose. May be helpful in a rollover, and you're inverted.
>>
>> Alternatively, a Swiss Army knife. Several cutty things on that and
>> the device for removing Boy Scouts from horses' hooves, makes a handy
>> punch if you hold the body with it sticking out between a couple of
>> fingers.
>>
>> Also, hit the glass near a bottom corner. I've watched a policeman's
>> truncheon bounce off a car window when he hit it really hard in the
>> centre. (A lady had locked her keys in the car and was desperate to
>> get in).
>>
>>> You can't have this just "anywhere" in the car. These items must be
>>> within reach, and secured in such a way, they'll be where you
>>> expect them to be. If you leave the devices in the back of the car,
>>> they could be useless to you.
>>
>> My SAK is always in my pocket (unless flying on a
>> commercialhttps://www.victorinox.com/en/Products/Swiss-Army-Knives/Large-Pocket-Knives/Rescue-Tool/p/0.8623.MWN
>> airline), secured to my belt with a chain and a snap clip. They are
>> expensive to replace if they fall out of the pocket.
>>
> snip
>
> There is always this:
> https://www.victorinox.com/en/Products/Swiss-Army-Knives/Large-Pocket-Knives/Rescue-Tool/p/0.8623.MWN
>

Pity it is bright yellow though.

--
Colin Bignell

That's all very well. However when Mythbusters played around with ways to
escape a submerged car, the biggest problem was the disorientation of
[Adam Savage] going in. And as they pointed out he was expecting it and
prepared.

IIRC there are also some CoG factors that will try to upend a car going
into the water - certainly an ICE with a heavy engine and gearbox at the
front.