On Tue, 12 Dec 2023 16:23:28 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
<usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:

>Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>> On Tue, 12 Dec 2023 10:26:32 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
>> <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/12/2023 09:59, Tim+ wrote:
>>>> Was it ever ?a right??
>>>>
>>>> Sure, having a phone system that continued to work during a power cut is a
>>>> nice thing to have but I?m not sure it was ever legalised as a ?right?.
>>>>
>>> In fact here, when I get a power cut. I use my laptop with a mobile
>>> phone as a router to contact the power company. Both have a few hours
>>> battery life. Really the only thing thta matters is that I have *some*
>>> form of access to emergency services if needs be, and an idea of how
>>> long the power cut will last, so I can go shopping if its a long time.
>>> My car also has a battery and a handy supply of diesel fuel to keep it
>>> charged.
>>
>> That may be okay assuming the base station remains in service but how
>> much back-up capacity do you think it has? I understand it is measured
>> in hours not days.
>>
>There’s nothing to stop you buying a battery to power your router and fibre
>ONT during a power outage. You don’t even have to turn it on unless you
>have need to communicate. If it is a real concern and the householder
>doesn’t know how to implement it then hire someone who does. (See also gas
>fitters and any other sort of trades person that might be hired in).

Can you be sure that the incoming signal will not be lost if the power
supply fails? I realise it is optical not electrical but I thought
power would be needed for switching or amplification or cooling or
something.

However, I was actually referring to TNP's comment about using a
laptop with a mobile phone. (I was postulating that the mobile base
station may itself have limited backup.)

On 12/12/2023 16:47, Scott wrote:
> On Tue, 12 Dec 2023 16:23:28 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 12 Dec 2023 10:26:32 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
>>> <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 12/12/2023 09:59, Tim+ wrote:
>>>>> Was it ever ?a right??
>>>>>
>>>>> Sure, having a phone system that continued to work during a power cut is a
>>>>> nice thing to have but I?m not sure it was ever legalised as a ?right?.
>>>>>
>>>> In fact here, when I get a power cut. I use my laptop with a mobile
>>>> phone as a router to contact the power company. Both have a few hours
>>>> battery life. Really the only thing thta matters is that I have *some*
>>>> form of access to emergency services if needs be, and an idea of how
>>>> long the power cut will last, so I can go shopping if its a long time.
>>>> My car also has a battery and a handy supply of diesel fuel to keep it
>>>> charged.
>>>
>>> That may be okay assuming the base station remains in service but how
>>> much back-up capacity do you think it has? I understand it is measured
>>> in hours not days.
>>>
>> There’s nothing to stop you buying a battery to power your router and fibre
>> ONT during a power outage. You don’t even have to turn it on unless you
>> have need to communicate. If it is a real concern and the householder
>> doesn’t know how to implement it then hire someone who does. (See also gas
>> fitters and any other sort of trades person that might be hired in).
>
> Can you be sure that the incoming signal will not be lost if the power
> supply fails? I realise it is optical not electrical but I thought
> power would be needed for switching or amplification or cooling or
> something.

Cooling !? Nope (Openreach's version of) FTTP is passive all the way
to the 'exchange'.

Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:
> Tim+ <timdownieuk@yahoo.co.youkay> wrote:
>> Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:
>>> Tim+ wrote:
>>>
>>>> If you were daft enough not to have a
>>>> basic wired phone for use in a power cut (which a large number of people
>>>> seem to be) unsurprisingly you’re stuffed in the event of a power cut.
>>>
>>> I can understand that once people have DECT phones, they're not likely
>>> to keep an old wired phone plugged in (I don't); but what I don't
>>> understand is why they throw away all the wired phones ...
>>>
>>
>> Well I didn’t mention it having to be plugged in. Mine certainly isn’t.
>>
> Why not leave it plugged in?

Because power cuts are very rare where I live. My mobile has continued to
work (on past occasions). I don’t need the clutter of an extra phone that
I’ll probably never need but if I *do* need it, it only takes a minute to
pull it out of a drawer and plugging it in. It also removes the
possibility of it getting knocked off the hook and remaining unnoticed.
Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
> We had to ditch it when we found it could only block 50 numbers but
> otherwise it was a very good piece of kit.
>

But how many could it white list? Call blocking became a bit of a waste of
time IMO once number spoofing became widespread.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On Tue, 12 Dec 2023 16:49:48 +0000, Mark Carver <mark@invalid.com>
wrote:

>On 12/12/2023 16:47, Scott wrote:
>> On Tue, 12 Dec 2023 16:23:28 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
>> <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Scott <newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 12 Dec 2023 10:26:32 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
>>>> <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 12/12/2023 09:59, Tim+ wrote:
>>>>>> Was it ever ?a right??
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sure, having a phone system that continued to work during a power cut is a
>>>>>> nice thing to have but I?m not sure it was ever legalised as a ?right?.
>>>>>>
>>>>> In fact here, when I get a power cut. I use my laptop with a mobile
>>>>> phone as a router to contact the power company. Both have a few hours
>>>>> battery life. Really the only thing thta matters is that I have *some*
>>>>> form of access to emergency services if needs be, and an idea of how
>>>>> long the power cut will last, so I can go shopping if its a long time.
>>>>> My car also has a battery and a handy supply of diesel fuel to keep it
>>>>> charged.
>>>>
>>>> That may be okay assuming the base station remains in service but how
>>>> much back-up capacity do you think it has? I understand it is measured
>>>> in hours not days.
>>>>
>>> There’s nothing to stop you buying a battery to power your router and fibre
>>> ONT during a power outage. You don’t even have to turn it on unless you
>>> have need to communicate. If it is a real concern and the householder
>>> doesn’t know how to implement it then hire someone who does. (See also gas
>>> fitters and any other sort of trades person that might be hired in).
>>
>> Can you be sure that the incoming signal will not be lost if the power
>> supply fails? I realise it is optical not electrical but I thought
>> power would be needed for switching or amplification or cooling or
>> something.
>
>Cooling !? Nope (Openreach's version of) FTTP is passive all the way
>to the 'exchange'.

Thanks. While I'm on to a winner, what requires to be powered? Is the
ONT separate to the router and does it need a power supply. Does the
router need to be switched on or can the phone be plugged directly
into the ONT during an outage? Apologies for extreme ignorance on the
subject.

On 12/12/2023 16:47, Scott wrote:

>
> Can you be sure that the incoming signal will not be lost if the power
> supply fails? I realise it is optical not electrical but I thought
> power would be needed for switching or amplification or cooling or
> something.
>
It's passive *all the way* to the regional concentrators which will have
serious backup power. They *could* be up to 20 miles away.

> However, I was actually referring to TNP's comment about using a
> laptop with a mobile phone. (I was postulating that the mobile base
> station may itself have limited backup.)

Well yes, I am not sure and I dunno who is about that.

Certainly Id be happier to trust the fibre than the mobile signal in a
big wide area power cut.

My problem is that the router is nowhere near the optical modem thingy -
Id need two batteries/UPS Plus probably power for the rack with the
ethernet switch...that would get the office going, at least...I' still
be fscked with respect to central heating and normal wifi.

--
“But what a weak barrier is truth when it stands in the way of an
hypothesis!”

Mary Wollstonecraft

On 12/12/2023 17:11, Scott wrote:
> While I'm on to a winner, what requires to be powered? Is the ONT
> separate to the router

Yes.

> and does it need a power supply.

Yes.

> Does the router need to be switched on

Almost certainly, yes.

> or can the phone be plugged directly into the ONT during an outage?

It is sometimes possible but it looks like OpenReach are moving away
from that.

> Apologies for extreme ignorance on the subject.

We are all ignorant. It's merely a matter of degree :-)

--
“Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit
atrocities.”

― Voltaire, Questions sur les Miracles à M. Claparede, Professeur de
Théologie à Genève, par un Proposant: Ou Extrait de Diverses Lettres de
M. de Voltaire

Mark Carver <mark@invalid.com> wrote:
> On 12/12/2023 15:02, Chris Green wrote:
> > Tim+ <timdownieuk@yahoo.co.youkay> wrote:
> >> Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:
> >>> Tim+ wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> If you were daft enough not to have a
> >>>> basic wired phone for use in a power cut (which a large number of people
> >>>> seem to be) unsurprisingly you’re stuffed in the event of a power cut.
> >>>
> >>> I can understand that once people have DECT phones, they're not likely
> >>> to keep an old wired phone plugged in (I don't); but what I don't
> >>> understand is why they throw away all the wired phones ...
> >>>
> >>
> >> Well I didn’t mention it having to be plugged in. Mine certainly isn’t.
> >>
> > Why not leave it plugged in?
>
> Because it keeps ringing with scam calls ? Better to only plug it in,
> for that once in a lifetime occurrence (for most) to need to make a call
> in a power cut.
> Or switch the ringer off

Not an issue here, obviously scammers don't want customers in Suffolk.

--
Chris Green
·

On Tue, 12 Dec 2023 18:25:39 +0000
Chris Green <cl@isbd.net> wrote:

> Mark Carver <mark@invalid.com> wrote:
> > On 12/12/2023 15:02, Chris Green wrote:
> > > Tim+ <timdownieuk@yahoo.co.youkay> wrote:
> > >> Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:
> > >>> Tim+ wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> If you were daft enough not to have a
> > >>>> basic wired phone for use in a power cut (which a large number
> > >>>> of people seem to be) unsurprisingly you’re stuffed in the
> > >>>> event of a power cut.
> > >>>
> > >>> I can understand that once people have DECT phones, they're not
> > >>> likely to keep an old wired phone plugged in (I don't); but
> > >>> what I don't understand is why they throw away all the wired
> > >>> phones ...
> > >>
> > >> Well I didn’t mention it having to be plugged in. Mine certainly
> > >> isn’t.
> > > Why not leave it plugged in?
> >
> > Because it keeps ringing with scam calls ? Better to only plug it
> > in, for that once in a lifetime occurrence (for most) to need to
> > make a call in a power cut.
> > Or switch the ringer off
>
> Not an issue here, obviously scammers don't want customers in Suffolk.
>

I get about one call a day, that usually cuts off when the voice-mail
message starts. Some play the same "You have an unexpected charge on
some account or other..press 1 to cancel this charge.." message, that
then also cuts off when there is no further response.
This is north Suffolk.
If somebody really does need to talk to me, I can pick up, or they can
leave a message.

--
Davey.

On 12/12/2023 18:25, Chris Green wrote:
> Mark Carver <mark@invalid.com> wrote:
>> On 12/12/2023 15:02, Chris Green wrote:
>>> Tim+ <timdownieuk@yahoo.co.youkay> wrote:
>>>> Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:
>>>>> Tim+ wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> If you were daft enough not to have a
>>>>>> basic wired phone for use in a power cut (which a large number of people
>>>>>> seem to be) unsurprisingly you’re stuffed in the event of a power cut.
>>>>>
>>>>> I can understand that once people have DECT phones, they're not likely
>>>>> to keep an old wired phone plugged in (I don't); but what I don't
>>>>> understand is why they throw away all the wired phones ...
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Well I didn’t mention it having to be plugged in. Mine certainly isn’t.
>>>>
>>> Why not leave it plugged in?
>>
>> Because it keeps ringing with scam calls ? Better to only plug it in,
>> for that once in a lifetime occurrence (for most) to need to make a call
>> in a power cut.
>> Or switch the ringer off
>
> Not an issue here, obviously scammers don't want customers in Suffolk.
>
I get one or two landline scams a week these days, and one or two mobile
ones. Get far more spam mail.

What REALLY pisses me off is the mobile ringning in the office which I
get up and rush to pick up, and it then either goes to voicemail or its
some subcontinental cunt pretending to be BT or Sky, or 3 mobile or EE
....I mean, who phones at 8 a.m? Really?

--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On 12/12/2023 15:59, Woody wrote:
> On Tue 12/12/2023 13:59, David Wade wrote:
>> On 12/12/2023 09:22, Brian Gaff wrote:
>>> Now this brave new world is coming fast, where there are only one
>>> connection
>>> to a house ove the internet, and reliant on the local mains supply
>>> being on,
>>> what are the rights of people who want some kind of back up as old land
>>> lines have?
>>
>> None. Well not a lot. Take read of :-
>>
>> https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultations-and-statements/category-2/access-emergency-organisations-power-cut
>>
>> short URL -> http://tinyurl.com/bdhht7t7
>>
>> and perhaps download the first document :-
>>
>> https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0016/123118/guidance-emergency-access-power-cut.pdf
>>
>> short url -> http://tinyurl.com/2kzmsp78
>>
>> but basically the rules are :-
>>
>> 1. Providers should have at least one solution available that enables
>> access to emergency organisations for a minimum of one hour in the
>> event of a power outage in the premises;
>>
>> 2. The solution should be suitable for customers’ needs and should be
>> offered free of charge to those who are at risk as they are dependent
>> on their landline;
>>
>> 3. Providers should
>>
>> i) take steps to identify at risk customers and
>> ii) engage in effective communications to ensure all customers
>> understand the risk and eligibility criteria and can request the
>> protection solution; and
>>
>> 4. Providers should have a process to ensure that customers who move
>> to a new house or whose circumstances change in some other way are
>> aware of the risk and protection solution available.
>>
>> ... so as I said above, not a lot, and I feel many elderly  don't
>> understand their rights and don't admit to being "at risk" so don't
>> get the solution they need...
>>
>>>   Also, do these old tone dialling devices still work if you use them
>>> to dial
>>> by holding them with the speaker to the handset microphone. This is a
>>> very
>>> handy way for some people who cannot use mobiles to dial certain
>>> numbers on
>>> phones elsewhere using an accessible directory.
>>
>> Only on phones connected via an Analogue Adaptor of some sorts. So I
>> would say DECT phones or traditional phones plugged into an ATA which
>> may be built into the router or a separate ATA. If you have a phone
>> which talks SIP probably not.
>>
>> But I wonder what the issue is with mobiles? Modern mobiles can be
>> driven entirely by voice. I can ring anything in my Samsungs directory
>> by voice.
>>
>>>   I'm mainly talking blind people here of course.
>>
>> The RNIB have mobiles with Synaptic software to assist.
>>
>>>   Also, the attitude of BT and virgin seems to be, you have a socket
>>> for the
>>> phone on the router, and its up to you to wire it to your extensions.
>>
>> I don't know about Virgin, but OpenReach who do the installations of
>> Fibre for BT have enhanced installations available, but not all ISPs
>> who use the OpenReach offer them. These cover some internal wiring.
>>
>> However for many its not necessary. The issue with many current
>> set-ups is they are DECT cordless and whilst the handsets have a long
>> battery life after a power fail, mine say a week, the DECT base
>> station needs power. However your router needs power to get a service.
>> If it is also the DECT base station then the system will continue to
>> work in a power cut.
>>
>> Both the BT and ZEN routers have this capability.
>>
>> If you want to retain a landline phone, then provided the router is
>> near a phone socket, you can get a patch cable to link the existing
>> wiring into the router. As Openreach usually remove the copper drop
>> this should work fine.
>>
>>
>>>   Brian
>>>
>>
>> Dave.
>
>
> We have a Panasonic desk phone with nuisance call blocking and acts as a
> DECT base station. The desk phone has four AA cells inside that keep the
> phone working (for how long - unknown) in the event of power failure.
>
> We had to ditch it when we found it could only block 50 numbers but
> otherwise it was a very good piece of kit.
>
>
When you go to VOIP you can block in many places. I have voipfone.co.uk.
I can block in there, it has many options. I have a Fritz!Box from Zen
and that also has flexible call blocking.

Dave

Am 12.12.2023 um 12:40:18 Uhr schrieb Andy Burns:

> I can understand that once people have DECT phones, they're not
> likely to keep an old wired phone plugged in (I don't); but what I
> don't understand is why they throw away all the wired phones ...

Because they either don't know about the benefits or don't care and
don't want to keep the old stuff around.

I know many people throwing away fully working devices because they got
new ones.

Yes, but a considerable number of security and fall alarm and elderly pull
cords relied on the land line being viable at all times. Also despite what
has been said here, the BT and Virgin folk made money out of installing
wired extensions. and we seem to be going down the minimal service route.
Thus you find many ISPs now no longer offering any other service than the
fibre connection and others will provide the rest. There is no good having a
battery backed router if the local fibre optic node is cut of when the mains
fails.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Liz Tuddenham" <liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:1qlmf8n.1knj6ktq1u0iN%liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid...
> Tim+ <timdownieuk@yahoo.co.youkay> wrote:
>
>> Was it ever �?oa right�?�?
>>
>> Sure, having a phone system that continued to work during a power cut is
>> a
>> nice thing to have but I�?Tm not sure it was ever legalised as a
>> �?oright�?�.
>
> As far as I remember, until recently, it was a legal obligation on the
> householder. At least one 'phone on each line had to be able to operate
> independently of the mains.
>
>
> --
> ~ Liz Tuddenham ~
> (Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
> www.poppyrecords.co.uk

But even speaker phones that use a psu, revert back to normal phones if the
mains goes off.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Tim+" <timdownieuk@yahoo.co.youkay> wrote in message
news:1065577494.724069473.154605.timdownieuk-yahoo.co.youkay@news.individual.net...
> Liz Tuddenham <liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> Tim+ <timdownieuk@yahoo.co.youkay> wrote:
>>
>>> Was it ever “a right”?
>>>
>>> Sure, having a phone system that continued to work during a power cut is
>>> a
>>> nice thing to have but I’m not sure it was ever legalised as a
>>> “right”.
>>
>> As far as I remember, until recently, it was a legal obligation on the
>> householder. At least one 'phone on each line had to be able to operate
>> independently of the mains.
>>
>>
>
> It was a strong recommendation, not a legal obligation. You're not
> legally
> obliged to have any phone at all! If you were daft enough not to have a
> basic wired phone for use in a power cut (which a large number of people
> seem to be) unsurprisingly you're stuffed in the event of a power cut.
>
> Tim
>
> --
> Please don't feed the trolls

I know about mobiles, I have an I phone and there are many, no I'm talking
traditional landline here. Some years ago I got a plug in box for voip, and
although the internal dialling worked, the tone dialer against the
mouthpiece was very prone to dialing gibberish. I guess that could be just
the codec they used, but increasingly when you call a big company, you can
hear its Voip with that nasty compressed bandwidth limited audio with
occasional dropouts.
Brian.

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"David Wade" <g4ugm@dave.invalid> wrote in message
news:ulah9b$3q0a1$1@dont-email.me...
> On 12/12/2023 15:59, Woody wrote:
>> On Tue 12/12/2023 13:59, David Wade wrote:
>>> On 12/12/2023 09:22, Brian Gaff wrote:
>>>> Now this brave new world is coming fast, where there are only one
>>>> connection
>>>> to a house ove the internet, and reliant on the local mains supply
>>>> being on,
>>>> what are the rights of people who want some kind of back up as old land
>>>> lines have?
>>>
>>> None. Well not a lot. Take read of :-
>>>
>>> https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultations-and-statements/category-2/access-emergency-organisations-power-cut
>>>
>>> short URL -> http://tinyurl.com/bdhht7t7
>>>
>>> and perhaps download the first document :-
>>>
>>> https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0016/123118/guidance-emergency-access-power-cut.pdf
>>>
>>> short url -> http://tinyurl.com/2kzmsp78
>>>
>>> but basically the rules are :-
>>>
>>> 1. Providers should have at least one solution available that enables
>>> access to emergency organisations for a minimum of one hour in the event
>>> of a power outage in the premises;
>>>
>>> 2. The solution should be suitable for customers' needs and should be
>>> offered free of charge to those who are at risk as they are dependent on
>>> their landline;
>>>
>>> 3. Providers should
>>>
>>> i) take steps to identify at risk customers and
>>> ii) engage in effective communications to ensure all customers
>>> understand the risk and eligibility criteria and can request the
>>> protection solution; and
>>>
>>> 4. Providers should have a process to ensure that customers who move to
>>> a new house or whose circumstances change in some other way are aware of
>>> the risk and protection solution available.
>>>
>>> ... so as I said above, not a lot, and I feel many elderly don't
>>> understand their rights and don't admit to being "at risk" so don't get
>>> the solution they need...
>>>
>>>> Also, do these old tone dialling devices still work if you use them to
>>>> dial
>>>> by holding them with the speaker to the handset microphone. This is a
>>>> very
>>>> handy way for some people who cannot use mobiles to dial certain
>>>> numbers on
>>>> phones elsewhere using an accessible directory.
>>>
>>> Only on phones connected via an Analogue Adaptor of some sorts. So I
>>> would say DECT phones or traditional phones plugged into an ATA which
>>> may be built into the router or a separate ATA. If you have a phone
>>> which talks SIP probably not.
>>>
>>> But I wonder what the issue is with mobiles? Modern mobiles can be
>>> driven entirely by voice. I can ring anything in my Samsungs directory
>>> by voice.
>>>
>>>> I'm mainly talking blind people here of course.
>>>
>>> The RNIB have mobiles with Synaptic software to assist.
>>>
>>>> Also, the attitude of BT and virgin seems to be, you have a socket for
>>>> the
>>>> phone on the router, and its up to you to wire it to your extensions.
>>>
>>> I don't know about Virgin, but OpenReach who do the installations of
>>> Fibre for BT have enhanced installations available, but not all ISPs who
>>> use the OpenReach offer them. These cover some internal wiring.
>>>
>>> However for many its not necessary. The issue with many current set-ups
>>> is they are DECT cordless and whilst the handsets have a long battery
>>> life after a power fail, mine say a week, the DECT base station needs
>>> power. However your router needs power to get a service. If it is also
>>> the DECT base station then the system will continue to work in a power
>>> cut.
>>>
>>> Both the BT and ZEN routers have this capability.
>>>
>>> If you want to retain a landline phone, then provided the router is near
>>> a phone socket, you can get a patch cable to link the existing wiring
>>> into the router. As Openreach usually remove the copper drop this should
>>> work fine.
>>>
>>>
>>>> Brian
>>>>
>>>
>>> Dave.
>>
>>
>> We have a Panasonic desk phone with nuisance call blocking and acts as a
>> DECT base station. The desk phone has four AA cells inside that keep the
>> phone working (for how long - unknown) in the event of power failure.
>>
>> We had to ditch it when we found it could only block 50 numbers but
>> otherwise it was a very good piece of kit.
>>
>>
> When you go to VOIP you can block in many places. I have voipfone.co.uk.
> I can block in there, it has many options. I have a Fritz!Box from Zen and
> that also has flexible call blocking.
>
> Dave
>

On 13/12/2023 10:32, Brian Gaff wrote:
> Yes, but a considerable number of security and fall alarm and elderly pull
> cords relied on the land line being viable at all times. Also despite what
> has been said here, the BT and Virgin folk made money out of installing
> wired extensions. and we seem to be going down the minimal service route.
> Thus you find many ISPs now no longer offering any other service than the
> fibre connection and others will provide the rest. There is no good having a
> battery backed router if the local fibre optic node is cut of when the mains
> fails.
> Brian
>
There is no 'local fibre optic node'

There are regional concentrators with batteries and generators.

--
"An intellectual is a person knowledgeable in one field who speaks out
only in others...”

Tom Wolfe

On 13/12/2023 10:40, Brian Gaff wrote:
> I know about mobiles, I have an I phone and there are many, no I'm talking
> traditional landline here. Some years ago I got a plug in box for voip, and
> although the internal dialling worked, the tone dialer against the
> mouthpiece was very prone to dialing gibberish. I guess that could be just
> the codec they used, but increasingly when you call a big company, you can
> hear its Voip with that nasty compressed bandwidth limited audio with
> occasional dropouts.
> Brian.
>
>
Thats more mobile - VOIP in my experience is way better than landline,
quality wise

--
It is the folly of too many to mistake the echo of a London coffee-house
for the voice of the kingdom.

Jonathan Swift

Well, I also think those dodgy headsets call centres use are not exactly
good. Very middle frequency prone with no pop rejection at all. Does not
help if the lady you speak to is on the other side of the world.
Talking of echo, I get that merely talking from kingston to Croydon on the
land line. That tells me there is a digital link somewhere and its very
annoying as both parties sound drunk.
Brian

--

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"The Natural Philosopher" <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:ulcb48$s9p8$2@dont-email.me...
> On 13/12/2023 10:40, Brian Gaff wrote:
>> I know about mobiles, I have an I phone and there are many, no I'm
>> talking
>> traditional landline here. Some years ago I got a plug in box for voip,
>> and
>> although the internal dialling worked, the tone dialer against the
>> mouthpiece was very prone to dialing gibberish. I guess that could be
>> just
>> the codec they used, but increasingly when you call a big company, you
>> can
>> hear its Voip with that nasty compressed bandwidth limited audio with
>> occasional dropouts.
>> Brian.
>>
>>
> Thats more mobile - VOIP in my experience is way better than landline,
> quality wise
>
> --
> It is the folly of too many to mistake the echo of a London coffee-house
> for the voice of the kingdom.
>
> Jonathan Swift
>
>

On 12/12/2023 16:04, Scott wrote:
> I have never noticed that. I assumed if I blocked the call on the DECT
> handset this would then prevent it ringing for more than a millisecond
> on my other phone. Am I labouring under a misapprehension?

You can't block calls on analogue lines, you can only ignore them.

Also, if you don't have the BT caller ID system (I'm not sure if any
operators, in the UK, still use the US one), there will be one ring
cycle before the caller ID is sent.

Systems like TruCall connect the local phones through the screening
device, so they don't ring them until the call has been accepted.

The only way a parallel wired DECT base station could prevent calls
ringing on other phones is if it answered before the second ring, and
that assumes the BT caller ID protocol.

On Thu, 14 Dec 2023 14:13:42 +0000, David Woolley
<david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> wrote:

>On 12/12/2023 16:04, Scott wrote:
>> I have never noticed that. I assumed if I blocked the call on the DECT
>> handset this would then prevent it ringing for more than a millisecond
>> on my other phone. Am I labouring under a misapprehension?
>
>You can't block calls on analogue lines, you can only ignore them.

What happens if I 'Copy to blacklist' on my Gigaset phone?
>
>Also, if you don't have the BT caller ID system (I'm not sure if any
>operators, in the UK, still use the US one), there will be one ring
>cycle before the caller ID is sent.
>
>Systems like TruCall connect the local phones through the screening
>device, so they don't ring them until the call has been accepted.
>
>The only way a parallel wired DECT base station could prevent calls
>ringing on other phones is if it answered before the second ring, and
>that assumes the BT caller ID protocol.

On 14/12/2023 14:51, Scott wrote:
> What happens if I 'Copy to blacklist' on my Gigaset phone?

I would expect analogue phones, with a black list to suppress or
terminate local ringing when they see a blocked number, and let the call
ring out. The less likely option is that they accept it for a few
seconds then hangup.

On Fri, 15 Dec 2023 12:44:40 +0000, David Woolley
<david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> wrote:

>On 14/12/2023 14:51, Scott wrote:
>> What happens if I 'Copy to blacklist' on my Gigaset phone?
>
>I would expect analogue phones, with a black list to suppress or
>terminate local ringing when they see a blocked number, and let the call
>ring out. The less likely option is that they accept it for a few
>seconds then hangup.

When you say 'suppress local ringing' do you prevent the DECT phone
ringing or prevent all the phones on the line ringing? This will
determine whether a DECT phone and a wired phone can co-exist.

On 15/12/2023 14:24, Scott wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Dec 2023 12:44:40 +0000, David Woolley
> <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 14/12/2023 14:51, Scott wrote:
>>> What happens if I 'Copy to blacklist' on my Gigaset phone?
>>
>> I would expect analogue phones, with a black list to suppress or
>> terminate local ringing when they see a blocked number, and let the call
>> ring out. The less likely option is that they accept it for a few
>> seconds then hangup.

This is what the do. If you have multiple devices this is the only option.

>
> When you say 'suppress local ringing' do you prevent the DECT phone
> ringing or prevent all the phones on the line ringing? This will
> determine whether a DECT phone and a wired phone can co-exist.

Dave

On 15/12/2023 14:24, Scott wrote:
> When you say 'suppress local ringing' do you prevent the DECT phone
> ringing or prevent all the phones on the line ringing? This will
> determine whether a DECT phone and a wired phone can co-exist.

There is no way of signalling to parallel connected phones not to ring
other than actually answering the call.

On Fri, 15 Dec 2023 17:42:56 +0000, David Woolley
<david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> wrote:

>On 15/12/2023 14:24, Scott wrote:
>> When you say 'suppress local ringing' do you prevent the DECT phone
>> ringing or prevent all the phones on the line ringing? This will
>> determine whether a DECT phone and a wired phone can co-exist.
>
>There is no way of signalling to parallel connected phones not to ring
>other than actually answering the call.

Good, that's what I assumed. Now, is the DECT phone able to blacklist
the call in the usual way (bringing all ringing to an end) or does the
presence of a wired phone stop the blacklist function working?