After the theft of the Zero and seeing a couple more stolen in the UK I
wonder if the expensive battery is a bit of a thief magnet. Or maybe it's
just all small bikes...

I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
thought about using something other than the R1100RT since it drinks
petrol on this journey and it's a big old lump on the broken urban roads
that we suffer.

Something around 150kg or so with a top speed of a comfortable
80 or so seems to be all I want for this regular boring trip. Oh and
very good MPG with the ability to carry a small top box. I'd also
like it to be fairly new so less than three years old.

Certainly not interested in anything that's enduro based.

Looking at a few websites the boring old commuter bike now seems
to be all scooters; and I'm still too young for one of those.

So what is there?

KTM 390 looks like a thief magnet.
Yamaha MT-03 not sure
Kawasaki... well the electric bike they've got coming
has shit range so that's out. Shame. Z400 looks a
bit like a thief magnet also.
Honda CB300R looks like it's in the right sort of area

What am I missing?

On 28/09/2023 10:01, Stephen Packer wrote:
>
> What am I missing?

Bicycle with panniers? Or a cargo bike?

--
Eddie eddie@deguello.org

On 28/09/2023 10:01, Stephen Packer wrote:
> After the theft of the Zero and seeing a couple more stolen in the UK I
> wonder if the expensive battery is a bit of a thief magnet. Or maybe it's
> just all small bikes...
>
> I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
> thought about using something other than the R1100RT since it drinks
> petrol on this journey and it's a big old lump on the broken urban roads
> that we suffer.
>
> Something around 150kg or so with a top speed of a comfortable
> 80 or so seems to be all I want for this regular boring trip. Oh and
> very good MPG with the ability to carry a small top box. I'd also
> like it to be fairly new so less than three years old.
>
> Certainly not interested in anything that's enduro based.
>
> Looking at a few websites the boring old commuter bike now seems
> to be all scooters; and I'm still too young for one of those.
>
> So what is there?
>
> KTM 390 looks like a thief magnet.

Sadly, true by the experience of UKRM owners of them. My 401 is rarely
used in such a way as it is parked somewhere likely to be stolen.

> Yamaha MT-03 not sure
> Kawasaki... well the electric bike they've got coming
> has shit range so that's out. Shame. Z400 looks a
> bit like a thief magnet also.
> Honda CB300R looks like it's in the right sort of area
>
> What am I missing?

All kinds of generic Chinese badge engineered singles.
https://midwestmoto.co.uk/collections/zontes-motorcycle
I had a sit on a 310 last time I was at MidWest Moto.
149 Kgs.

Also CFMoto 300.

Though I don't know if there are any used ones about.

--
Moto Morini 2C/375
Gilera 175 Sport, Husqvarna 401 Svartpilen
Honda CB250RS (Not Waynetta!)
"Do not adjust your mind, there is a fault in the reality"

On Thu, 28 Sep 2023 02:01:56 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
<stephen.packer@gmail.com> wrote:

>I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
>thought about using something other than the R1100RT
..
..
..
>What am I missing?

Sacrilege it may be, but have you considered getting one with pedals?

--
Ace
http://www.chaletbeauroc.com/

On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 10:01:58 UTC+1, Stephen Packer wrote:
> I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
> thought about using something other than the R1100RT since it drinks
> petrol on this journey and it's a big old lump on the broken urban roads
> that we suffer.
>
> So what is there?

For a five mile journey? To a gym and back?

https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/

On 28/09/2023 11:46, ogden wrote:
> On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 10:01:58 UTC+1, Stephen Packer wrote:
>> I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
>> thought about using something other than the R1100RT since it drinks
>> petrol on this journey and it's a big old lump on the broken urban roads
>> that we suffer.
>>
>> So what is there?
>
> For a five mile journey? To a gym and back?
>
> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/

Scrote magnet ++ ?
--
Moto Morini 2C/375
Gilera 175 Sport, Husqvarna 401 Svartpilen
Honda CB250RS (Not Waynetta!)
"Do not adjust your mind, there is a fault in the reality"

On Thu, 28 Sep 2023 11:48:45 +0100, Pete Fisher
<peter@ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote:

>> For a five mile journey? To a gym and back?
>>
>> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/

>Scrote magnet ++ ?

Depends where you live. I just rode our [1] electric bike to the post
office, and just left it outside while I queued at the counter etc.
No question that it would be there when I came out.

[1] ok, she bought it, but hardly ever uses it. Whereas I use it all
the time
--
Champ
neal at champ dot org dot uk

I don't know, but I been told
You never slow down, you never grow old

On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 10:59:17 UTC+1, Eddie wrote:
> On 28/09/2023 10:01, Stephen Packer wrote:
> >
> > What am I missing?
>
> Bicycle with panniers? Or a cargo bike?

Given I live in the sticks, at the top of a dual carriageway with a posted
speed of 50, but a common speed of 70+ I'll be giving anything self-propelled
a pass. I did wonder about it, but watching cyclists suffer from arseholes on
the road I can't put myself through that.

On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 11:28:12 UTC+1, Ace wrote:
> On Thu, 28 Sep 2023 02:01:56 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
> <stephen...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
> >thought about using something other than the R1100RT
> .
> .
> .
> >What am I missing?
>
> Sacrilege it may be, but have you considered getting one with pedals?

As per other answer; I would if it wasn't for the section of dual carriageway.

On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 10:59:30 UTC+1, Pete Fisher wrote:
> > KTM 390 looks like a thief magnet.
> Sadly, true by the experience of UKRM owners of them. My 401 is rarely
> used in such a way as it is parked somewhere likely to be stolen.

I thought leaving it for five minutes in a busy supermarket car park was
fine... seems not.

If I had my time over again I'd have a motion detecting alarm fitted.
And I'd use a large lump of bavarian pig iron to run to the supermarket.

<snip>

> All kinds of generic Chinese badge engineered singles.
> https://midwestmoto.co.uk/collections/zontes-motorcycle
> I had a sit on a 310 last time I was at MidWest Moto.
> 149 Kgs.

The AJP I had whilst not Chinese used a lot of Chinese parts and
while the engine was fine the corrosion on the metal, the problems
with keeping brakes working etc. etc. make me cautious about this.

If it weren't for this I think I'd consider one of the Chinese electric bikes.

Might leave it for a while and think about how theft resistant a Zero
could be since I did really enjoy riding the bike.

On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 11:48:49 UTC+1, Pete Fisher wrote:
> On 28/09/2023 11:46, ogden wrote:
> > On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 10:01:58 UTC+1, Stephen Packer wrote:
> >> I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
> >> thought about using something other than the R1100RT since it drinks
> >> petrol on this journey and it's a big old lump on the broken urban roads
> >> that we suffer.
> >>
> >> So what is there?
> >
> > For a five mile journey? To a gym and back?
> >
> > https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
> Scrote magnet ++ ?

In pink, most definately.

On 28/09/2023 13:39, Champ wrote:
> On Thu, 28 Sep 2023 11:48:45 +0100, Pete Fisher
> <peter@ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>> For a five mile journey? To a gym and back?
>>>
>>> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
>
>> Scrote magnet ++ ?
>
> Depends where you live. I just rode our [1] electric bike to the post
> office, and just left it outside while I queued at the counter etc.
> No question that it would be there when I came out.
>

Indeed. Whereas my Specialized not e MTB was nicked in broad daylight
outside Leisure Lakes shop in town despite having a cable lock. The lad
had borrowed it.

TBF, I suppose a bike shop is in itself a good place to find bikes to steal.

My house insurance policy paid out fortunately.

Then the replacement got stolen from my garage along with SWMBO's bike,
the YZ450F and the 350SXF.

No wonder my house and car insurance premiums are so high in this post code.

--
Moto Morini 2C/375
Gilera 175 Sport, Husqvarna 401 Svartpilen
Honda CB250RS (Not Waynetta!)
"Do not adjust your mind, there is a fault in the reality"

On 28/09/2023 13:39, Champ wrote:
> On Thu, 28 Sep 2023 11:48:45 +0100, Pete Fisher
> <peter@ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>> For a five mile journey? To a gym and back?
>>>
>>> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
>
>> Scrote magnet ++ ?
>
> Depends where you live. I just rode our [1] electric bike to the post
> office, and just left it outside while I queued at the counter etc.
> No question that it would be there when I came out.

Yebbut, you live in a 'special place' :-)

Chris

--
The Deuchars BBB#40 COFF#14
Yamaha XV750SE & Suzuki GS550t
http://www.Deuchars.org.uk

On 28/09/2023 10:59, Eddie wrote:
> On 28/09/2023 10:01, Stephen Packer wrote:
>>
>> What am I missing?
>
> Bicycle with panniers? Or a cargo bike?
>

Works for me

--
Bruce Porter
"The internet is a huge and diverse community but mainly friendly"
http://ytc1.blogspot.co.uk/
There *is* an alternative! http://www.openoffice.org/

On 28/09/2023 14:23, Stephen Packer wrote:
> On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 11:28:12 UTC+1, Ace wrote:
>> On Thu, 28 Sep 2023 02:01:56 -0700 (PDT), Stephen Packer
>> <stephen...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
>>> thought about using something other than the R1100RT
>> .
>> .
>> .
>>> What am I missing?
>>
>> Sacrilege it may be, but have you considered getting one with pedals?
>
> As per other answer; I would if it wasn't for the section of dual carriageway.

That and if he rode to the gym he wouldn't need to go to the gym. ;-)

--
Bruce Horrocks
FJR1300AS

On 28/09/2023 14:29, Stephen Packer wrote:
> On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 11:48:49 UTC+1, Pete Fisher wrote:
>> On 28/09/2023 11:46, ogden wrote:
>>> On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 10:01:58 UTC+1, Stephen Packer wrote:
>>>> I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town. I've
>>>> thought about using something other than the R1100RT since it drinks
>>>> petrol on this journey and it's a big old lump on the broken urban roads
>>>> that we suffer.
>>>>
>>>> So what is there?
>>>
>>> For a five mile journey? To a gym and back?
>>>
>>> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
>> Scrote magnet ++ ?
>
> In pink, most definately.

Am I the only one wondering why the URL includes the word 'crossbar'?

Clearly a bicycle fit for an emperor... just back from the tailor.
--
Bruce Horrocks
FJR1300AS

On 28/09/2023 23:21, Bruce Horrocks wrote:
> On 28/09/2023 14:29, Stephen Packer wrote:
>> On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 11:48:49 UTC+1, Pete Fisher wrote:
>>> On 28/09/2023 11:46, ogden wrote:
>>>> On Thursday, 28 September 2023 at 10:01:58 UTC+1, Stephen Packer wrote:
>>>>> I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town.
>>>>> I've
>>>>> thought about using something other than the R1100RT since it drinks
>>>>> petrol on this journey and it's a big old lump on the broken urban
>>>>> roads
>>>>> that we suffer.
>>>>>
>>>>> So what is there?
>>>>
>>>> For a five mile journey? To a gym and back?
>>>>
>>>> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
>>>>
>>> Scrote magnet ++ ?
>>
>> In pink, most definately.
>
> Am I the only one wondering why the URL includes the word 'crossbar'?
>
> Clearly a bicycle fit for an emperor... just back from the tailor.

A bit cool these days, isn't it?

--
Rusty Hinge
To err is human. To really foul things up requires a computer and the BOFH.

Bruce Horrocks wrote:
> >> ogden wrote:
> >>> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
>
> Am I the only one wondering why the URL includes the word 'crossbar'?

Hopefully, yes.

There are two frame types. One with a crossbar, and one without, like a traditional ladies' bike. That link was to the model with a crossbar in the frame, hence the url, what with Steve not being a lady and that.

> Clearly a bicycle fit for an emperor... just back from the tailor.

Uhuh.

On 28/09/2023 23:16, Bruce Horrocks wrote:
>
> That and if he rode to the gym he wouldn't need to go to the gym. ;-)

Depends what he's doing at the gym; a balanced routine should include
some cardio (the bike) and some strength (presumably, the gym).

--
Eddie eddie@deguello.org

Bruce Horrocks wrote:

> Stephen Packer wrote:
>
>> Pete Fisher wrote:
>>
>>> ogden wrote:
>>>
>>>> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
>>>
>>> Scrote magnet ++ ?
>>
>> In pink, most definately.
>
> Am I the only one wondering why the URL includes the word 'crossbar'?

Depending on the selected combination of frame size and frame shape, a
crossbar appears

<https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-hub-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/?attrFrameSize=53cm>

On 9/29/2023 1:35 AM, Andy Burns wrote:
> Bruce Horrocks wrote:
>
>> Stephen Packer wrote:
>>
>>> Pete Fisher wrote:
>>>
>>>> ogden wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
>>>>
>>>> Scrote magnet ++ ?
>>>
>>> In pink, most definately.
>>
>> Am I the only one wondering why the URL includes the word 'crossbar'?
>
> Depending on the selected combination of frame size and frame shape, a
> crossbar appears
>
> <https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-hub-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/?attrFrameSize=53cm>

So, what effect does a crossbar have on the bike? Durability,
performance, etc?

--
The erstwhile Thomas
FJR1300, R1200GS & ST1100 (in memoriam)

On 29/09/2023 10:01, Turby wrote:
> On 9/29/2023 1:35 AM, Andy Burns wrote:
>> Bruce Horrocks wrote:
>>
>> Depending on the selected combination of frame size and frame shape, a
>> crossbar appears
>>
>> <https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-hub-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/?attrFrameSize=53cm>
>
> So, what effect does a crossbar have on the bike? Durability,
> performance, etc?

Less flex in the frame with a crossbar, hence the standard 'double
triangle' design of conventional bike frames, although _some_ flex can
be a desirable characteristic. Looks like the non-crossbar version has a
suspension seatpost too, for added comfort.

For the sort of bike it is, I don't suppose many people are that
bothered about how many watts per hour they can personally sustain, so
they might as well go for the comfortable version.

I suppose somebody who's quite fit might notice that they can get more
range out of the crossbar version, but it's probably quite marginal.

--
Eddie eddie@deguello.org

Stephen Packer wrote:

> After the theft of the Zero and seeing a couple more stolen in the UK
> I wonder if the expensive battery is a bit of a thief magnet. Or
> maybe it's just all small bikes...
>
> I go to a gym regularly that's about a five mile trip across town.
> I've thought about using something other than the R1100RT since it
> drinks petrol on this journey and it's a big old lump on the broken
> urban roads that we suffer.
>
> Something around 150kg or so with a top speed of a comfortable
> 80 or so seems to be all I want for this regular boring trip. Oh and
> very good MPG with the ability to carry a small top box. I'd also
> like it to be fairly new so less than three years old.
>
> Certainly not interested in anything that's enduro based.
>
> Looking at a few websites the boring old commuter bike now seems
> to be all scooters; and I'm still too young for one of those.
>
> So what is there?
>
> KTM 390 looks like a thief magnet.
> Yamaha MT-03 not sure
> Kawasaki... well the electric bike they've got coming
> has shit range so that's out. Shame. Z400 looks a
> bit like a thief magnet also.
> Honda CB300R looks like it's in the right sort of area
>
> What am I missing?

This one maybe?

https://www.gulas.bike/

Although I suspect the 30 grand price tag might possibly put you off.
OTOh it's so fugly, surely no one is going to nick that?
--

Geoff
NTV650

Eddie wrote:
> Turby wrote:
> > Andy Burns wrote:
> >> Bruce Horrocks wrote:
> >> Depending on the selected combination of frame size and frame shape, a
> >> crossbar appears
> >>
> >> <https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-hub-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/?attrFrameSize=53cm>
> >
> > So, what effect does a crossbar have on the bike? Durability,
> > performance, etc?
>
> Less flex in the frame with a crossbar, hence the standard 'double
> triangle' design of conventional bike frames, although _some_ flex can
> be a desirable characteristic. Looks like the non-crossbar version has a
> suspension seatpost too, for added comfort.

Conversely, without the stiffness from the crossbar the downtube has to be stronger to compensate. In the absence of more exotic materials, stiffer = bigger = heavier, so the frame without the crossbar is likely to be heavier. Those downtubes are massive now, big enough to store the battery internally.

> For the sort of bike it is, I don't suppose many people are that
> bothered about how many watts per hour they can personally sustain, so
> they might as well go for the comfortable version.

And along the same lines, for the sort of bike it is, a bit more weight isn't going to be much of an issue for anyone but the poor cunt who has to lift it into the back of a van or over a fence from time to time, and both versions are heavy enough for that to be a pain anyway.

I think M's bike, without the crossbar, also came with a suspension seat post originally. Though it had to be swapped out for a solid one because she's a dwarf and couldn't get the seat low enough.

Turby wrote:

> On 9/29/2023 1:35 AM, Andy Burns wrote:
> > Bruce Horrocks wrote:
> >
> > > Stephen Packer wrote:
> > >
> > > > Pete Fisher wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > ogden wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >
https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-derailleur-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/
> > > > >
> > > > > Scrote magnet ++ ?
> > > >
> > > > In pink, most definately.
> > >
> > > Am I the only one wondering why the URL includes the word
> > > 'crossbar'?
> >
> > Depending on the selected combination of frame size and frame
> > shape, a crossbar appears
> >
> >
<https://www.raleigh.co.uk/gb/en/motus-tour-hub-gear-electric-bike/crossbar/?attrFrameSize=53cm>
>
> So, what effect does a crossbar have on the bike? Durability,
> performance, etc?

Makes the frame much more rigid. Indian cargo bikes (rickshaws etc)
usually have a double crossbar.
I don't like them because it means you have to swing your leg over the
back wheel when getting on, something which can be quite amusing to
watch if you have forgotten you have a crate of beer (or a child) on
the back.
Indian rickshaw drivers have a very impressive move where they swing
one leg forwards over the handlebars thereby letting go of said bars
whilst strenuously exerting pressure with the other leg to get the
whole contraption moveing.

--

Geoff
NTV650