On 25/12/2023 01:04, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <4m3hoitf4j24knkn8gf5d0iv4499h5kpl9@4ax.com> at Sun, 24 Dec
> 2023 20:28:38, Penny <spam@labyrinth.freeuk.com> writes
> []
>> I like pork-based stuffing too, particularly with chestnuts, but don't
>> make
>> my own these days so have to rely upon whatever strange concoctions I can
>> find in the shops. I couldn't find chestnut this year, just sage and
>> onion
>> (which I've never liked) or apple and cranberry. I had some this evening
>
> I never liked sage and onion, which seemed to be the default. On the
> whole, I always found turkey overrated too, as it can easily be dry: I
> was always very content when mum did something other for the Christmas
> meal. She did goose one year, which was nice but I think she said hard
> work; we sometimes just had a meat joint, which I liked. (Birds in
> general do seem to involve a lot of effort.)
>
>> (froze the rest as balls) and it was horribly sweet. I thought cranberry
>> was sharp, not sweet - why add honey?

We find turkey overrated too. We've had guinea fowl a couple of times,
which is much tastier than turkey. I make a blue cheese based sauce
which goes equally well with beef or pork.

On 25/12/2023 01:07, Sam Plusnet wrote:
> On 24-Dec-23 20:28, Penny wrote:
>> On Sun, 24 Dec 2023 12:28:18 +0000, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk>
>> scrawled in the dust...
>>
>>> re umra passim
>>>
>>> The Sunday Times reveals that it's all Delia's fault. No wonder none of
>>> us remembered them in our youth.
>>
>> I heard that nonsense on the radio this morning. My mother certainly
>> served
>> sausages wrapped in bacon in the '50s. 'Making' her own, of course, as I
>> do, with carefully stretched bacon so it clung to the sausage. More bread
>> and less meat in the  sausages back then - a way to stretch the meal with
>> cheap ingredients.
>>
>>> Sunday Times 24 December 2023
>>>
>>> In the 1990 festive cookbook Delia Smith’s Christmas, you’ll find a
>>> recipe for a little-known delicacy invented in 1957. It involved pork
>>> wrapped in pork, a sausage swaddled in crispy bacon. It was a bit weird
>>> at the time, no one had ever heard of it. Although they weren’t referred
>>> to as “pigs in blankets” in the book, that’s how they ended up being
>>> popularly known. A British icon was born.
>>
>> Not sure when I first saw them ready wrapped in the shops.
>>
>> I like pork-based stuffing too, particularly with chestnuts, but don't
>> make
>> my own these days so have to rely upon whatever strange concoctions I can
>> find in the shops. I couldn't find chestnut this year, just sage and
>> onion
>> (which I've never liked) or apple and cranberry. I had some this evening
>> (froze the rest as balls) and it was horribly sweet. I thought cranberry
>> was sharp, not sweet - why add honey?
>
> It might be different elsewhere, but chestnuts seemed very hard to find
> around here.  Chestnut stuffing has always been the most important
> Christmas dish in this house.
>

My ma made a wonderful stuffing which we all continue to make (and
indeed the recipe has successfully colonised several other families)
which is breadcrumbs mixed with finely chopped celery, lots of grated
lemon peel, a bit of butter, a little salt, a little thyme and tons of
parsley which makes it all bright green. Some went in the bird, lots
more made into balls, wrapped in bacon, and cooked under the bird. Balls
in blankets, much nicer than pigs!

Off to eat this, preceded by champagne cocktails, at my sister's...

--
Kate B

In message <kut5mfFa2joU1@mid.individual.net> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
11:00:31, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
[]
>Off to eat this, preceded by champagne cocktails, at my sister's...
>
I was thinking, at the celebrations at the vet practice (sorry to be
on-topic!): I don't like champagne, never have: it's far too dry for me.
And I wonder how many others there are like me, who feel like the
umbrella at the feast whenever some is brought out to celebrate
something (at, presumably, some expense on the part of the bringer, or
at least provider). [I think I usually sip one glass to be polite.]

I've never knowingly had a champagne cocktail; I might like those, but -
when someone is providing it/them for me at least - it'd be cheaper to
use a different ingredient to start with.

Not meaning to spoil anyone's day given what it is: enjoy and be happy,
everyone!
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Never make the same mistake twice...there are so many new ones to make!

On 25/12/2023 11:23, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <kut5mfFa2joU1@mid.individual.net> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
> 11:00:31, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
> []
>> Off to eat this, preceded by champagne cocktails, at my sister's...
>>
> I was thinking, at the celebrations at the vet practice (sorry to be
> on-topic!): I don't like champagne, never have: it's far too dry for me.
> And I wonder how many others there are like me, who feel like the
> umbrella at the feast whenever some is brought out to celebrate
> something (at, presumably, some expense on the part of the bringer, or
> at least provider). [I think I usually sip one glass to be polite.]
>
> I've never knowingly had a champagne cocktail; I might like those, but -
> when someone is providing it/them for me at least - it'd be cheaper to
> use a different ingredient to start with.
>
> Not meaning to spoil anyone's day given what it is: enjoy and be happy,
> everyone!

You'd like a champagne cocktail - the basis is a sugarlump soaked in
brandy :) But if you ever have a choice, ask for Asti Spumante, a sweet
Italian fizz that was my grandmother's favourite (and she ate sugar
sandwiches and put sugar in hock!). Happy Christmas!

--
Kate B

On 25/12/2023 00:59, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> (Yes, I know I could make my own sauces. I forget who said it - it was
> one of the Great Cooks, and I think before Delia, might even have been
> Fanny: "life's too short to stuff a mushroom." Especially for one person.)

That was Shirley Conran. How right she was!
--
Jenny M Benson

On 25/12/2023 01:04, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>
> I never liked sage and onion, which seemed to be the default.

Why has Parsley & Thyme stuffing gone completely out of favour? I much
preferred it to S & O. Paxo don't make it any more. I have managed to
track down a spcialist herb supplier who does a version but haven't
received it yet, but I anticipate liking it very much.
--
Jenny M Benson

On 25/12/2023 11:23, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <kut5mfFa2joU1@mid.individual.net> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
> 11:00:31, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
> []
>> Off to eat this, preceded by champagne cocktails, at my sister's...
>>
> I was thinking, at the celebrations at the vet practice (sorry to be
> on-topic!): I don't like champagne, never have: it's far too dry for me.
> And I wonder how many others there are like me, who feel like the
> umbrella at the feast whenever some is brought out to celebrate
> something (at, presumably, some expense on the part of the bringer, or
> at least provider). [I think I usually sip one glass to be polite.]
>
And there I was thinking I was weird (stop sniggering) when it is
actually "a thing" to not like champagne, maybe.

> I've never knowingly had a champagne cocktail; I might like those, but -
> when someone is providing it/them for me at least - it'd be cheaper to
> use a different ingredient to start with.
>
> Not meaning to spoil anyone's day given what it is: enjoy and be happy,
> everyone!

--
Ric

Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes:

> On 25/12/2023 11:23, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> In message <kut5mfFa2joU1@mid.individual.net> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
>> 11:00:31, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
>> []
>>> Off to eat this, preceded by champagne cocktails, at my sister's...
>>>
>> I was thinking, at the celebrations at the vet practice (sorry to be
>> on-topic!): I don't like champagne, never have: it's far too dry for
>> me. And I wonder how many others there are like me, who feel like
>> the umbrella at the feast whenever some is brought out to celebrate
>> something (at, presumably, some expense on the part of the bringer,
>> or at least provider). [I think I usually sip one glass to be
>> polite.]
>> I've never knowingly had a champagne cocktail; I might like those,
>> but - when someone is providing it/them for me at least - it'd be
>> cheaper to use a different ingredient to start with.
>> Not meaning to spoil anyone's day given what it is: enjoy and be
>> happy, everyone!
>
> You'd like a champagne cocktail - the basis is a sugarlump soaked in
> brandy :) But if you ever have a choice, ask for Asti Spumante, a
> sweet Italian fizz that was my grandmother's favourite (and she ate
> sugar sandwiches and put sugar in hock!). Happy Christmas!

Those were hard times, when you had to pawn the sugar.

Rosie

Jenny M Benson <NemoNews@hotmail.co.uk> writes:

> On 25/12/2023 01:04, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> I never liked sage and onion, which seemed to be the default.
>
> Why has Parsley & Thyme stuffing gone completely out of favour? I
> much preferred it to S & O. Paxo don't make it any more. I have
> managed to track down a spcialist herb supplier who does a version but
> haven't received it yet, but I anticipate liking it very much.

Paxo? PAXO? You'll be telling me next you have a bought Christmas
pudding!

A chopped onion, gently fried; stale breadcrumbs; parsley and thyme to
taste; salt; pepper; a beaten egg to bind. That should do the trick.

Rosie

In message <kut8naFa2joU2@mid.individual.net> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
11:52:10, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
>On 25/12/2023 11:23, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
[]
>> I've never knowingly had a champagne cocktail; I might like those,
>>but - when someone is providing it/them for me at least - it'd be
>>cheaper to use a different ingredient to start with.
>> Not meaning to spoil anyone's day given what it is: enjoy and be
>>happy, everyone!
>
>You'd like a champagne cocktail - the basis is a sugarlump soaked in

Sounds good, though don't waste the champagne on me!

>brandy :) But if you ever have a choice, ask for Asti Spumante, a sweet

Oh, I like Asti!

>Italian fizz that was my grandmother's favourite (and she ate sugar
>sandwiches and put sugar in hock!). Happy Christmas!
>
Ah, someone with a slightly sweeter tooth than me! Hock is one of the
few wines you can get here that's sweet enough for me - at least, if you
_can_ get it; last time I looked (which was some years ago), it was hard
to find, certainly in a Sainsburys or similar. (As for finding a
Spätlese or Auslese, no chance.)

The one time I visited a British vinyard - it was here in Kent,
somewhere around Canterbury I think - they _did_ have a sweet wine which
I liked; however, like all they made - not their fault - it was very
expensive.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

User Error: Replace user, hit any key to continue.

In message <87cyuuicha.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
14:27:29, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>Jenny M Benson <NemoNews@hotmail.co.uk> writes:
>
>> On 25/12/2023 01:04, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>>> I never liked sage and onion, which seemed to be the default.
>>
>> Why has Parsley & Thyme stuffing gone completely out of favour? I
>> much preferred it to S & O. Paxo don't make it any more. I have
>> managed to track down a spcialist herb supplier who does a version but
>> haven't received it yet, but I anticipate liking it very much.
>
>Paxo? PAXO? You'll be telling me next you have a bought Christmas
>pudding!
>
>A chopped onion, gently fried; stale breadcrumbs; parsley and thyme to
>taste; salt; pepper; a beaten egg to bind. That should do the trick.
>
>Rosie
>
>
Thinking about it, I think why I didn't (and mostly still don't) like
the default stuffing is not the sage and onion (I'm not sure I know what
sage tastes like), but the very high proportion of breadcrumbs or
whatever filler was/is used - just a tasteless mush. In the same way I'm
not keen on boiled potatoes (or the middle or roast ones, ditto _thick_
chips) - little or no taste (to me), just an absorbent texture.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

User Error: Replace user, hit any key to continue.

In message <87h6k6ictv.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
14:19:56, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes:
[]
>> sugar sandwiches and put sugar in hock!). Happy Christmas!
>
>Those were hard times, when you had to pawn the sugar.
>
>Rosie
(-:

For some reason I'm reminded of my Grandma Gilliver (dad's adoptive
mother, though I didn't know that then); she was an inveterate hoarder -
to the extent that, allegedly, they didn't suffer quite as much as some
during the war. When visiting her (and Granddad) in the '60s, she was
still using some sugar from jars in the cellar - which I think someone
said were from before the war.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

User Error: Replace user, hit any key to continue.

On 25/12/2023 14:27, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
> Paxo? PAXO? You'll be telling me next you have a bought Christmas
> pudding!

I confess my (fairly new tradition) at this season is to buy some
Georgie Porgie puddings!
--
Jenny M Benson

J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> In message <Q2%hN.81466$PuZ9.80521@fx11.iad> at Sun, 24 Dec 2023
> 18:49:20, Sam Plusnet <not@home.com> writes
> []
>> We both like pork belly, but the very high fat content tends to cause
>> some regrets afterwards.
>>
> So do I, especially the flavoured varieties (BBQ, Chinese, maple, ...);
> I'm a bit disappointed that those only appear in (what I presume the
> supermarkets consider) barbecue season.
>
> (Yes, I know I could make my own sauces. I forget who said it - it was
> one of the Great Cooks, and I think before Delia, might even have been
> Fanny: "life's too short to stuff a mushroom." Especially for one
> person.)

Sauces are worth making and freezing in small portions as one would with
gravy.

Mrs McT

J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> In message <874jg7733d.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Sun, 24 Dec 2023
> 20:33:26, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>> "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:
>>
>>> There's a reason for some seasonalities. I'm not sure about
>>> cranberries - are they a winter fruit? - but I didn't think pork -
>>> either form - was particularly seasonal.
>>
>> Cranberries come with turkeys, and turkeys came here with Dickens, who'd
> []
>> mint. And it ended with perhaps the first reference to a Christmas
>> turkey in all literature. And cranberries grow here too, although they
>> are a different species. We didn't really have the wherewithal then for
>> cornbread.
>>
>>
>> Rosie
>
> Ah, so you're saying cranberries aren't particularly specific to this
> season, but tend to be due to their association with turkey.
>
> WIWAL - and young adult - I was often puzzled why certain sauces were
> associated with certain meats only: apple with pork, for example, or
> horseradish with whatever (I forget as I don't like horseradish), or
> cranberry with turkey.

Apple with pork: this because the acid in the apple ‘cuts through’ the
fatiness of the pork. ‘Norseradish goes with beef (but not here it doesn’t,
any hs would go in the bin! Cranberry with turkey - I suspect the ‘merkins
might be to blame for this (so just give thanks).

--
Toodle Pip, Mike McMillan

Steve Hague <stevehague82@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 25/12/2023 01:04, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> In message <4m3hoitf4j24knkn8gf5d0iv4499h5kpl9@4ax.com> at Sun, 24 Dec
>> 2023 20:28:38, Penny <spam@labyrinth.freeuk.com> writes
>> []
>>> I like pork-based stuffing too, particularly with chestnuts, but don't
>>> make
>>> my own these days so have to rely upon whatever strange concoctions I can
>>> find in the shops. I couldn't find chestnut this year, just sage and
>>> onion
>>> (which I've never liked) or apple and cranberry. I had some this evening
>>
>> I never liked sage and onion, which seemed to be the default. On the
>> whole, I always found turkey overrated too, as it can easily be dry: I
>> was always very content when mum did something other for the Christmas
>> meal. She did goose one year, which was nice but I think she said hard
>> work; we sometimes just had a meat joint, which I liked. (Birds in
>> general do seem to involve a lot of effort.)
>>
>>> (froze the rest as balls) and it was horribly sweet. I thought cranberry
>>> was sharp, not sweet - why add honey?
>
> We find turkey overrated too. We've had guinea fowl a couple of times,
> which is much tastier than turkey. I make a blue cheese based sauce
> which goes equally well with beef or pork.
>

My second boarding school had a headmaster was light years ahead of
education. He set up an aviary containing guinea fowl (3 I think), they
used to wander from the aviary opposite the main building and school
library where in summer walk in the open patio doors. Around a hundred
bunnies, a dozen guinea pigs and caged birds, though I remember a lonely
‘Eccles’ on the loose. On the whole it was a close circle of girls
(including me) who gave up free time, got up at sparrow fart to feed them
without waking our room mates or staff, cleaned them out and played with
them on Saturday mornings and thoroughly enjoyed not standing about on our
field with not a lot to do for two hours. We had a rota of two girls
each day. Can’t remember why me and a room mate also took the Sunday but we
did in our final year.

Have to say the Guinea fowl have left the lads who stayed on to A levels
with a bad taste in their mouths: they were rather nasty bits of work. A
level students worked in the library outside taught hours. I wasn’t A
level material.

Mrs McT

J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> In message <kut5mfFa2joU1@mid.individual.net> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
> 11:00:31, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
> []
>> Off to eat this, preceded by champagne cocktails, at my sister's...
>>
> I was thinking, at the celebrations at the vet practice (sorry to be
> on-topic!): I don't like champagne, never have: it's far too dry for me.
> And I wonder how many others there are like me, who feel like the
> umbrella at the feast whenever some is brought out to celebrate
> something (at, presumably, some expense on the part of the bringer, or
> at least provider). [I think I usually sip one glass to be polite.]
>
> I've never knowingly had a champagne cocktail; I might like those, but -
> when someone is providing it/them for me at least - it'd be cheaper to
> use a different ingredient to start with.
>
> Not meaning to spoil anyone's day given what it is: enjoy and be happy,
> everyone!

Tee totals here. We toasted each other in fresh orange juice st our
wedding - and it took some difficulty to make my dad realise we meant it!

Mrs McT

In message <umcfee$347d5$1@dont-email.me> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023 17:51:10,
Mike McMillan <toodle.pip1@virginmedia.com> writes
>J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
[]
>> WIWAL - and young adult - I was often puzzled why certain sauces were
>> associated with certain meats only: apple with pork, for example, or
>> horseradish with whatever (I forget as I don't like horseradish), or
>> cranberry with turkey.
>
>Apple with pork: this because the acid in the apple ‘cuts through’ the
>fatiness of the pork. ‘Norseradish goes with beef (but not here it doesn’t,
>any hs would go in the bin! Cranberry with turkey - I suspect the ‘merkins
>might be to blame for this (so just give thanks).
>
That makes sense, apple thus with pork - but can it not go with other
things? IIRR, mutton and goose are both alleged to be fatty too, but I
can't remember hearing of apple with either of those. (I have a vague
feeling that mutton had its own associated sauce/whatever. It's
something - mutton altogether I mean, not just its sauce if there was
one - you rarely see on menus these days.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Look at those early black-and-white episodes of /Coronation Street/;
like Ibsen in an flowered pinny. - Iam McMillan, RT 2020/2/22-28

In message <umcfcd$3474h$2@dont-email.me> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023 17:50:05,
Chris <chris.mcmillan@ntlworld.com> writes
>J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
[]
>> (Yes, I know I could make my own sauces. I forget who said it - it was
>> one of the Great Cooks, and I think before Delia, might even have been
>> Fanny: "life's too short to stuff a mushroom." Especially for one
>> person.)
>
>Sauces are worth making and freezing in small portions as one would with
>gravy.
>
>Mrs McT
>
I don't think I've ever frozen anything. (Oh, except semi-skimmed milk,
which freezes fine. But I mean anything I've made myself.) If I did, I'd
probably mess up the defrosting sequencing. And I've never made gravy.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Look at those early black-and-white episodes of /Coronation Street/;
like Ibsen in an flowered pinny. - Iam McMillan, RT 2020/2/22-28

J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> In message <umcfee$347d5$1@dont-email.me> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023 17:51:10,
> Mike McMillan <toodle.pip1@virginmedia.com> writes
>> J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> []
>>> WIWAL - and young adult - I was often puzzled why certain sauces were
>>> associated with certain meats only: apple with pork, for example, or
>>> horseradish with whatever (I forget as I don't like horseradish), or
>>> cranberry with turkey.
>>
>> Apple with pork: this because the acid in the apple ‘cuts through’ the
>> fatiness of the pork. ‘Norseradish goes with beef (but not here it doesn’t,
>> any hs would go in the bin! Cranberry with turkey - I suspect the ‘merkins
>> might be to blame for this (so just give thanks).
>>
> That makes sense, apple thus with pork - but can it not go with other
> things? IIRR, mutton and goose are both alleged to be fatty too, but I
> can't remember hearing of apple with either of those. (I have a vague
> feeling that mutton had its own associated sauce/whatever. It's
> something - mutton altogether I mean, not just its sauce if there was
> one - you rarely see on menus these days.)

Mint sauce is often associated with lamb and mutton.

--
Toodle Pip, Mike McMillan

J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> In message <umcfcd$3474h$2@dont-email.me> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023 17:50:05,
> Chris <chris.mcmillan@ntlworld.com> writes
>> J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> []
>>> (Yes, I know I could make my own sauces. I forget who said it - it was
>>> one of the Great Cooks, and I think before Delia, might even have been
>>> Fanny: "life's too short to stuff a mushroom." Especially for one
>>> person.)
>>
>> Sauces are worth making and freezing in small portions as one would with
>> gravy.
>>
>> Mrs McT
>>
> I don't think I've ever frozen anything. (Oh, except semi-skimmed milk,
> which freezes fine. But I mean anything I've made myself.) If I did, I'd
> probably mess up the defrosting sequencing. And I've never made gravy.

Duck a l’ orange?

--
Toodle Pip, Mike McMillan

On 25/12/2023 20:56, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <umcfee$347d5$1@dont-email.me> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023 17:51:10,
> Mike McMillan <toodle.pip1@virginmedia.com> writes
>> J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> []
>>> WIWAL - and young adult - I was often puzzled why certain sauces were
>>> associated with certain meats only: apple with pork, for example, or
>>> horseradish with whatever (I forget as I don't like horseradish), or
>>> cranberry with turkey.
>>
>> Apple with pork: this because the acid in the apple ‘cuts through’ the
>> fatiness of the pork. ‘Norseradish goes with beef (but not here it
>> doesn’t,
>> any hs would go in the bin! Cranberry with turkey - I suspect the
>> ‘merkins
>> might be to blame for this (so just give thanks).
>>
> That makes sense, apple thus with pork - but can it not go with other
> things? IIRR, mutton and goose are both alleged to be fatty too, but I
> can't remember hearing of apple with either of those. (I have a vague
> feeling that mutton had its own associated sauce/whatever. It's
> something - mutton altogether I mean, not just its sauce if there was
> one - you rarely see on menus these days.)

Mutton with sauce based on capers (little pickled thingies), goose with
apple too, or in Germanic lands with European cranberries -
Preiselbeeren - much tarter and tastier than American ones. You can buy
it in IKEA as lingonberry jam.

--
Kate B

On 25-Dec-23 12:23, Joe Kerr wrote:
> On 25/12/2023 11:23, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> In message <kut5mfFa2joU1@mid.individual.net> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023
>> 11:00:31, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
>> []
>>> Off to eat this, preceded by champagne cocktails, at my sister's...
>>>
>> I was thinking, at the celebrations at the vet practice (sorry to be
>> on-topic!): I don't like champagne, never have: it's far too dry for
>> me. And I wonder how many others there are like me, who feel like the
>> umbrella at the feast whenever some is brought out to celebrate
>> something (at, presumably, some expense on the part of the bringer, or
>> at least provider). [I think I usually sip one glass to be polite.]
>>
> And there I was thinking I was weird (stop sniggering) when it is
> actually "a thing" to not like champagne, maybe.

I/we don't actually dislike Champagne, but don't see the point when
there are plenty of other palatable fizzy wines, available at far
cheaper prices - if fizzy wine is what you're hankering for[1].

[1] We had Cava with Christmas dinner - I suspect that bottle had been
lurking in the fridge since summer.

--
Sam Plusnet

On Sun, 24 Dec 2023 13:24:04 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver"
<G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:

>In message <kuqmf1Fr95uU1@mid.individual.net> at Sun, 24 Dec 2023
>12:28:18, Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
>>re umra passim
>>
>>The Sunday Times reveals that it's all Delia's fault. No wonder none of
>>us remembered them in our youth. As for pigs in blankets icecream, I'm
>>surprised Tom Archer hasn't foisted that on the dairy...
>>
>>Sunday Times 24 December 2023
>>
>>In the 1990 festive cookbook Delia Smith’s Christmas, you’ll find a
>>recipe for a little-known delicacy invented in 1957. It involved pork
>>wrapped in pork, a sausage swaddled in crispy bacon. It was a bit weird
>>at the time, no one had ever heard of it. Although they weren’t
>>referred to as “pigs in blankets” in the book, that’s how they
>>ended up being popularly known. A British icon was born.
>
>My mum certainly served them at cocktail parties in the '70s and
>possibly '60s; I can't remember whether she called them that, though I
>think so. I also can't remember them being specific to any particular
>season, though they might have been.
>[]
>>It’s unusual for a festive food to break out of its Christmas
>>shackles in this way. Devils on horseback (prunes wrapped in bacon) and
>>brie and cranberry parcels rarely show their faces outside of the
>>festive season. But something about the naughty decadence of double
>>pork, the softness of the sausage contrasted with the crunch of bacon,
>>has proven totally irresistible.
>
>There's a reason for some seasonalities. I'm not sure about cranberries
>- are they a winter fruit? - but I didn't think pork - either form - was
>particularly seasonal.
>[]
>>Moore believes that pork is unfairly demonised as an unhealthy meat but
>>it contains monounsaturated fats — the kind we get in avocados or
>>olive
>
>Interesting; so as well as being cheaper than most other meats, ...
>[]
>>Given our growing aversion to ultra-processed food, now might not be
>>the time to indulge too heavily in pigs in blankets nuts or crisps. “As
>
>I have noticed - or, become more aware of - increasing silly marketing
>of crisp flavours; by the time they've become the powder that's added to
>crisps, most things are far from their origin anyway. Cheese and onion
>is now likely to be "Stilton and spring onion", beef "steak and ale",
>even salt and vinegar "sea salt and xxx vinegar"; since they almost
>certainly include the universal weasel-word "flavour" in the
>description, I doubt there's any difference. Since both parts of PIB are
>of pig origin, I'd be surprised if "PIB" crisps are any different from
>what used to be called bacon flavour. But they're all sold in black
>packaging (seems to be this decade's shorthand for "quality"), at a
>higher price. (Oh, and "hand-cooked", as often as not.)
>[]
>>Still, it’s Christmas, so there’s no harm in raising a glass to
>>Delia and indulging in a sleeping pig or two. Maybe just go easy on the
>>pork ice cream.
>[]
>No PIBs here - I like them, but just didn't occur to buy any. Plus I
>think they probably can't be microwaved, and I don't like things that
>have to be ovened, just for me. I'd decided I would have something such
>anyway for tomorrow, and selected beef brisket - but then reading the
>box discovered that can be microwaved too, so that's nice!
>
>(Actually, I grill almost anything that's supposed to be ovened anyway,
>if I can't figure out a way to microwave it. I've not used my oven since
>I replaced the combination after the 2020 fire, and don't think I'd used
>it before that either!)

On the subject of microwaves - or, as I believe Nigella pronounces
them , me-crow-wah-vez - I'm pretty sure almost anything except eggs
in their shells can be cooked in a microwave oven to make it safe to
eat. The problem usually lies in the taste and texture being sub-par
from the manufacturer's point of view not in the danger to the
consumer's life expectancy. Whole eggs are the exception whilst
microwaved poached eggs can be just as bad if you don't cook them
gently and prick all membranes first.

Christmas pudding is an example of taste and texture. I can ladle
loads of Christmas pudding mix into a bowl, cover it in greaseproof
paper and steam it for eight hours and the result is a recognisable
Christmas pudding. If I take the same mix and put it in a container
and microwave it for two minutes it fluffs up and bubbles and expands
and makes a delicious, light, spicy, fruity, spongy desert which is
nothing like a Christmas pud but nice to eat anyway.

Talking of Christmas pud. I brought one of my home made ones over here
and we had it with guests for the traditional Christmas Eve dinner -
which just to add to the confusion we celebrated on Christmas Eve Eve.

Most of the guests had never seen a Christmas pudding before. Quite
understandable really as it is rather a relic of wintry northern
hemisphere Christmases. I think they liked it. I'm not so sure they
were quite so keen after they had eaten and enjoyed it and I had then
explained it had been steamed for eight hours then stored for over two
years without freezing or any refrigeration before they came to eat it
and was all the better for that.

Nick

On Mon, 25 Dec 2023 20:59:21 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver"
<G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:

>In message <umcfcd$3474h$2@dont-email.me> at Mon, 25 Dec 2023 17:50:05,
>Chris <chris.mcmillan@ntlworld.com> writes
>>J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
>[]
>>> (Yes, I know I could make my own sauces. I forget who said it - it was
>>> one of the Great Cooks, and I think before Delia, might even have been
>>> Fanny: "life's too short to stuff a mushroom." Especially for one
>>> person.)
>>
>>Sauces are worth making and freezing in small portions as one would with
>>gravy.
>>
>>Mrs McT
>>
>I don't think I've ever frozen anything. (Oh, except semi-skimmed milk,
>which freezes fine. But I mean anything I've made myself.) If I did, I'd
>probably mess up the defrosting sequencing. And I've never made gravy.

Ah, gravy. Tricky stuff, gravy. I have a 720-page book called "How to
Make Gravy." There's even a video - here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgUG07_unsI

(And by way of explanation, this Wikipedia article:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Make_Gravy )

Nick