On 10/08/2023 09:32, Chris in Makati wrote:
> How many 999 calls did you need to make in those few days but were
> unable to do so?

Not sure of the relevance of that?

>
> The mains supply here is reliable but I have been at places where that
> is not the case.  I was visiting friend one Christmas when we lost mains
> power, landline telephone and mobile phone coverage for several days.
> Fortunately it was in a town but a much bigger problem in a rural area
> where more likely to happen.
>
>

Where did this happen ? I was under the impression that BTOR would
deploy portable emergency generators at those "exchanges" with no built
in facilities.

--
random signature text inserted here

MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
> On 04/08/2023 09:36, David Wade wrote:
>> Well according to OFCOM 68% of homes with a landline only have a
>> cordless system which does not work in power cut. So for two thirds of
>> the population this is actually a "no change" to the status quo.
>
>
> I have a wall mounted phone in the hall which can be plugged into the
> master socket if necessary.
>
> I suspect many homes similarly still have a real telephone somewhere
> that can be used if necessary.

I doubt it very for people under the age of 30

In message <ub22ib$a3u1$1@dont-email.me>
MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:

> On 04/08/2023 09:36, David Wade wrote:
> > Well according to OFCOM 68% of homes with a landline only have a
> > cordless system which does not work in power cut. So for two thirds of
> > the population this is actually a "no change" to the status quo.
>
>
> I have a wall mounted phone in the hall which can be plugged into the
> master socket if necessary.
>
> I suspect many homes similarly still have a real telephone somewhere that
> can be used if necessary.

I have a couple of corded phones in a drawer, but, since BT's upgrade
to "Digital Voice", they would have to be plugged in to the router.
The master socket no longer provides POTS. So they would only work
if the router were in some way to remain powered.

David

David Higton <dave@davehigton.me.uk> wrote:
> In message <ub22ib$a3u1$1@dont-email.me>
> MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:
>
>> On 04/08/2023 09:36, David Wade wrote:
>>> Well according to OFCOM 68% of homes with a landline only have a
>>> cordless system which does not work in power cut. So for two thirds of
>>> the population this is actually a "no change" to the status quo.
>>
>>
>> I have a wall mounted phone in the hall which can be plugged into the
>> master socket if necessary.
>>
>> I suspect many homes similarly still have a real telephone somewhere that
>> can be used if necessary.
>
> I have a couple of corded phones in a drawer, but, since BT's upgrade
> to "Digital Voice", they would have to be plugged in to the router.
> The master socket no longer provides POTS. So they would only work
> if the router were in some way to remain powered.
>
> David
>

I think the earlier point about how often you need to make a 999 call is
relevant. Of more relevance is where. The few times I have called 999 I’ve
been nowhere near my house and therefore my landline. Each time I’ve been
out and about and have used my mobile.

On Thu, 10 Aug 2023 12:03:17 +0100, MB <MB@nospam.net> wrote:

>On 10/08/2023 09:32, Chris in Makati wrote:
>> How many 999 calls did you need to make in those few days but were
>> unable to do so?
>
>
>
>Not sure of the relevance of that?

It's relevant to my post which you commented on. The one in which I
suggested the chances of having a power failure AND your home
broadband down AND no mobile phone signal AND needing to make a 999
call all at the same time are vanishingly small.

You said you'd had three out of those four things happened
simultaneously, so I wondered whether the fifth occurred as well.

Chris

On Friday, 11 August 2023 at 13:50:03 UTC+1, Chris in Makati wrote:
> On Thu, 10 Aug 2023 12:03:17 +0100, MB <M...@nospam.net> wrote:
>
> >On 10/08/2023 09:32, Chris in Makati wrote:
> >> How many 999 calls did you need to make in those few days but were
> >> unable to do so?
> >
> >
> >
> >Not sure of the relevance of that?
> It's relevant to my post which you commented on. The one in which I
> suggested the chances of having a power failure AND your home
> broadband down AND no mobile phone signal AND needing to make a 999
> call all at the same time are vanishingly small.
>
> You said you'd had three out of those four things happened
> simultaneously, so I wondered whether the fifth occurred as well.
>
> Chris

Well a major flood could lead to all these - they are not mutually exclusive risks.

Indeed a wildfire in Hawaii caused all of these with a woman [on BBC news] complaining that the power, and mobiles were out (mast burnt out) and some people needed urgent treatment for burns.

Although fibre would decrease the likelihood of landline phone failure in a flood conditions I doubt our local exchange would still operate after submersion.

On 12/08/2023 12:46, notya...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> Well a major flood could lead to all these - they are not mutually exclusive risks.

Whilst I agree that major disasters can create a common cause of all
these problems...

> Although fibre would decrease the likelihood of landline phone failure in a flood conditions I doubt our local exchange would still operate after submersion.

Your local exchange will cease to operate once the switch to fibre is
complete, even without a disaster, although I do wonder if lessons are
being learned from Ukraine, as the further you are from you local
exchange, the more likely it is under the control of a different country.

David Woolley <david@ex.djwhome.demon.invalid> wrote:
> On 12/08/2023 12:46, notya...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> Well a major flood could lead to all these - they are not mutually exclusive risks.
>
> Whilst I agree that major disasters can create a common cause of all
> these problems...
>
>> Although fibre would decrease the likelihood of landline phone failure
>> in a flood conditions I doubt our local exchange would still operate after submersion.
>
> Your local exchange will cease to operate once the switch to fibre is
> complete, even without a disaster, although I do wonder if lessons are
> being learned from Ukraine, as the further you are from you local
> exchange, the more likely it is under the control of a different country.
>
>

You mean the inhabitants of Berwick upon Tweed should be worried?

On 10/08/2023 12:45, Abandoned_Trolley wrote:
> Where did this happen ? I was under the impression that BTOR would
> deploy portable emergency generators at those "exchanges" with no built
> in facilities.

That is OK when one site lost power but more difficult when dozens lose
power unless they keep a large stock of generators and in that case they
might as well just install one at every site as was the case with the
previous emergency services radio networks.

On 13/08/2023 07:54, MB wrote:
> On 10/08/2023 12:45, Abandoned_Trolley wrote:
>> Where did this happen ? I was under the impression that BTOR would
>> deploy portable emergency generators at those "exchanges" with no
>> built in facilities.
>
>
> That is OK when one site lost power but more difficult when dozens lose
> power unless they keep a large stock of generators and in that case they
> might as well just install one at every site as was the case with the
> previous emergency services radio networks.
>
>

And at one time thats exactly what they did - a lot of the massive
battery rooms were "rationalised" to much smaller batteries and
permanent diesel generators were fitted to take up the slack.

--
random signature text inserted here

On Sun 13/08/2023 08:38, Abandoned_Trolley wrote:
> On 13/08/2023 07:54, MB wrote:
>> On 10/08/2023 12:45, Abandoned_Trolley wrote:
>>> Where did this happen ? I was under the impression that BTOR would
>>> deploy portable emergency generators at those "exchanges" with no
>>> built in facilities.
>>
>>
>> That is OK when one site lost power but more difficult when dozens
>> lose power unless they keep a large stock of generators and in that
>> case they might as well just install one at every site as was the case
>> with the previous emergency services radio networks.
>>
>>
>
>
> And at one time thats exactly what they did - a lot of the massive
> battery rooms were "rationalised" to much smaller batteries and
> permanent diesel generators were fitted to take up the slack.
>
>

Surprisingly many of those 'diesel' generators were actually gas
powered. Perhaps diesel on big sites, but small switches and radio link
sites gas was preferred. Some had the Propane cylinders inside, others
outside in a secure cage.

Chris in Makati wrote:

> It's relevant to my post which you commented on. The one in which I
> suggested the chances of having a power failure AND your home broadband
> down AND no mobile phone signal AND needing to make a 999 call all at
> the same time are vanishingly small.

The point where someone suggested each person only calls 999 a couple of
times during their lifetime isn't far removed from saying we might as
well scrap 999 calls.

On Sun, 13 Aug 2023 13:07:37 +0100, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:

>Chris in Makati wrote:
>
>> It's relevant to my post which you commented on. The one in which I
>> suggested the chances of having a power failure AND your home broadband
>> down AND no mobile phone signal AND needing to make a 999 call all at
>> the same time are vanishingly small.
>
>The point where someone suggested each person only calls 999 a couple of
>times during their lifetime isn't far removed from saying we might as
>well scrap 999 calls.

I didn't say "each person" only makes a couple of 999 calls in their
lifetime. I said I can only remember ever making one or two 999 calls
myself.

I certainly wasn't trying to suggest that the 999 service should be
scrapped. That would be quite ridiculous.

On Sunday, 13 August 2023 at 13:07:40 UTC+1, Andy Burns wrote:
> Chris in Makati wrote:
>
> > It's relevant to my post which you commented on. The one in which I
> > suggested the chances of having a power failure AND your home broadband
> > down AND no mobile phone signal AND needing to make a 999 call all at
> > the same time are vanishingly small.
> The point where someone suggested each person only calls 999 a couple of
> times during their lifetime isn't far removed from saying we might as
> well scrap 999 calls.

At least half a dozen times, probably at least ten, plus five occasions getting emergency assistance in person - 1 fire, 1 ambulance and 3 police (two resulting in arrests :-) )

Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:
> Chris in Makati wrote:
>
>> It's relevant to my post which you commented on. The one in which I
>> suggested the chances of having a power failure AND your home broadband
>> down AND no mobile phone signal AND needing to make a 999 call all at
>> the same time are vanishingly small.
>
> The point where someone suggested each person only calls 999 a couple of
> times during their lifetime isn't far removed from saying we might as
> well scrap 999 calls.

That's obviously a ridiculous interpretation.