Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> On Wed 28/02/2024 07:36, Chris wrote:
>> Pamela <pamela.private.mailbox@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Has the UK enacted any regulation of its own to implement the coming EU
>>> replaceable battery directive for phones?
>>
>> Lol no. Not under this government. Maybe under the next but they've got a
>> lot damage to fix first.
>>
>
> Question: how many mobile phones do we manufacture in this country?
> Zero? So legislation will not be needed here if the EU imposes
> regulations as phones made for the EU are likely the same phones that we
> have here - and <they> will come with a replacement facility built-in.

Yes that's true now, but we may diverge in years to come.

> The problem is that if you can replace batteries the useful life of a
> phone will dramatically increase, so I would suggest you are likely to
> see more and more software that is OS dependent and thus become obsolete
> (and the phone with it) in many cases long before the battery needs to
> be changed.

Not if phones get fragile again. I remember the days of when you dropped
your phone it broke into three parts.

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> It’s easy to have different stock keeping units (sku) for each country and
> to pop the correct chargers in the box. It makes less sense to manufacture
> lots of different handset versions unless there are strong reasons for
> doing so.
>
Most often they have a common 'wall wart' power supply with different
adapters attached (more or less permananently) for the different
countries' power sockets.

--
Chris Green
·

On 29/02/2024 08:57, Chris Green wrote:
> Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> It’s easy to have different stock keeping units (sku) for each country and
>> to pop the correct chargers in the box. It makes less sense to manufacture
>> lots of different handset versions unless there are strong reasons for
>> doing so.
>>
> Most often they have a common 'wall wart' power supply with different
> adapters attached (more or less permananently) for the different
> countries' power sockets.
>
I bought a phone in the UAE about 20 years ago. Despite the country (and
some other Gulf states) using good old UK BS1363 sockets, it came with a
'Euro' charger.

On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 21:40:33 +0000, Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid>
wrote:

>On 28/02/2024 20:33, Scott wrote:
>> On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 19:45:52 +0000, Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 28/02/2024 18:33, Scott wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I think you have misunderstood my point and gone off at a tangent. I
>>>> was not referring to the charging port on the phone, but to the socket
>>>> in the wall, which you will find is different in the UK to other EU or
>>>> European countries. Until recently, when a charger was provided in the
>>>> box, a different charger would be needed for the UK (and Irish)
>>>> market. Now that a charger is not included in the box, this particular
>>>> consideration will no longer apply.
>>>
>>> No, this point had already been raised by you as another straw man
>>> earlier in that same thread, as in the following exchange
>>>
>>> On 06/09/2023 17:18, Scott wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, 6 Sep 2023 16:08:06 +0100, Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Apple will have to follow EU rules worldwide, because it won't be
>>>>> economical to make two models of the same phone with different
>>>>> charging connectors, hence what the EU has decided will affect what
>>>>> is sold in this country too. Hence my posting it here.
>>>>
>>>> Well, plenty of manufacturers produce products with different plug
>>>> types (and indeed voltage) for different markets.
>>>
>>> But leads with different plugs at the wall end to match different
>>> countries' electrical supplies usually have the *SAME* connector at the
>>> appliance end!
>>
>> Once again, I think you have misunderstood my point and gone off at a
>> tangent. I was referring to the continued need to provide variants for
>> the EU and UK/ROI markets (as was the practice when chargers were
>> included). Nothing to do with connecting the phone to the charger.
>
>No, your memory is conveniently forgetful, but I have the thread history
>here in the form of all my replies to you, and therefore know that, just
>as in this thread, you were arguing against someone who had bothered to
>do some research from a position of having done zilch, raising
>irrelevant straw men that didn't even apply to the point at issue, which
>was that the EU compelling the use of USB-C connectors within its
>borders would at last make Apple introduce them worldwide, because
>nothing else would make economic sense for them, and this was proved to
>be true the following week when, as had been widely predicted by
>everyone except you and one or two others, the latest model of iPhone
>was finally unveiled and indeed had a USB-C connector.
>
>One might have hoped that your being shown to be wrong so conclusively
>in that thread might subsequently have taught you the advisability of
>researching your replies, but sadly your answer to Woody in this one
>showed that you have learnt nothing, and simply peddled more irrelevant
>straw men exactly as you had before, inevitably the suspicion being
>raised again that this was because some find it impossible to judge
>rationally *anything* involving the EU. Be that as it may, Woody's
>argument remains entirely valid, that the EU compelling replaceable
>batteries within its borders most probably will ensure that in time we
>in the UK and everyone in the wider world will have replaceable
>batteries also, because it won't make economic sense for manufacturers
>to make two base models of each phone, one with replaceable batteries,
>one without.
>
>>>> As to research, I was wondering whether the frequencies and protocols
>>>> used in different countries for 2G, 3G, 4G and 5G are the same and -
>>>> not having any electronics background - I do not have the technical
>>>> knowledge to research this meaningfully.
>>>
>>> Search engines are there to be used.
>>
>> And discussion groups are there for discussion. There is no obligation
>> upon you to participate in any particular thread.
>
>However, if you want to participate in a discussion and not make a fool
>of yourself by repeating your own previous mistakes, it pays to do some
>prior research, but sadly this is something you have still to learn.

I only asked if - apart from the supplied charger (if any) - EU phones
are the same specification as UK/ROI. I concede I should have asked Mr
Google first. BTW, I have nothing against the EU, having taken part in
the 'People's Vote'.

On 29/02/2024 07:40, Tweed wrote:
>
> Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> On 28/02/2024 20:33, Scott wrote:
>>
>> However, if you want to participate in a discussion and not make a fool
>> of yourself by repeating your own previous mistakes, it pays to do some
>> prior research, but sadly this is something you have still to learn.
>
> I think you are being unduly harsh. I think it’s entirely appropriate to
> discuss whether or not the upcoming EU regulations will impact the UK. You
> may have your view, but others may differ.

As do I, but genuine discussion moves forward, it doesn't endlessly go
over the same ground as was covered less than six months ago just
because the same people mindlessly regurgitate the same urban myths and
bigotries that have already shown to be false.

However, I accept that I've dwelt too long on this already, partly
because Scott kept making unfounded replies causing what was originally
meant to be just a single comment to become something of an overkill
tirade, for which I apologise to others. I will stop here.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

Tweed wrote:
>
> Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
> > On 28/02/2024 20:33, Scott wrote:
> >> On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 19:45:52 +0000, Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 28/02/2024 18:33, Scott wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I think you have misunderstood my point and gone off at a tangent. I
> >>>> was not referring to the charging port on the phone, but to the socket
> >>>> in the wall, which you will find is different in the UK to other EU or
> >>>> European countries. Until recently, when a charger was provided in the
> >>>> box, a different charger would be needed for the UK (and Irish)
> >>>> market. Now that a charger is not included in the box, this particular
> >>>> consideration will no longer apply.
> >>>
> >>> No, this point had already been raised by you as another straw man
> >>> earlier in that same thread, as in the following exchange
> >>>
> >>> On 06/09/2023 17:18, Scott wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, 6 Sep 2023 16:08:06 +0100, Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Apple will have to follow EU rules worldwide, because it won't be
> >>>>> economical to make two models of the same phone with different
> >>>>> charging connectors, hence what the EU has decided will affect what
> >>>>> is sold in this country too. Hence my posting it here.
> >>>>
> >>>> Well, plenty of manufacturers produce products with different plug
> >>>> types (and indeed voltage) for different markets.
> >>>
> >>> But leads with different plugs at the wall end to match different
> >>> countries' electrical supplies usually have the *SAME* connector at the
> >>> appliance end!
> >>
> >> Once again, I think you have misunderstood my point and gone off at a
> >> tangent. I was referring to the continued need to provide variants for
> >> the EU and UK/ROI markets (as was the practice when chargers were
> >> included). Nothing to do with connecting the phone to the charger.
> >
> > No, your memory is conveniently forgetful, but I have the thread history
> > here in the form of all my replies to you, and therefore know that, just
> > as in this thread, you were arguing against someone who had bothered to
> > do some research from a position of having done zilch, raising
> > irrelevant straw men that didn't even apply to the point at issue, which
> > was that the EU compelling the use of USB-C connectors within its
> > borders would at last make Apple introduce them worldwide, because
> > nothing else would make economic sense for them, and this was proved to
> > be true the following week when, as had been widely predicted by
> > everyone except you and one or two others, the latest model of iPhone
> > was finally unveiled and indeed had a USB-C connector.
> >
> > One might have hoped that your being shown to be wrong so conclusively
> > in that thread might subsequently have taught you the advisability of
> > researching your replies, but sadly your answer to Woody in this one
> > showed that you have learnt nothing, and simply peddled more irrelevant
> > straw men exactly as you had before, inevitably the suspicion being
> > raised again that this was because some find it impossible to judge
> > rationally *anything* involving the EU. Be that as it may, Woody's
> > argument remains entirely valid, that the EU compelling replaceable
> > batteries within its borders most probably will ensure that in time we
> > in the UK and everyone in the wider world will have replaceable
> > batteries also, because it won't make economic sense for manufacturers
> > to make two base models of each phone, one with replaceable batteries,
> > one without.
> >
> >>>> As to research, I was wondering whether the frequencies and protocols
> >>>> used in different countries for 2G, 3G, 4G and 5G are the same and -
> >>>> not having any electronics background - I do not have the technical
> >>>> knowledge to research this meaningfully.
> >>>
> >>> Search engines are there to be used.
> >>
> >> And discussion groups are there for discussion. There is no obligation
> >> upon you to participate in any particular thread.
> >
> > However, if you want to participate in a discussion and not make a fool
> > of yourself by repeating your own previous mistakes, it pays to do some
> > prior research, but sadly this is something you have still to learn.
> >
>
> I think you are being unduly harsh. I think it?s entirely appropriate to
> discuss whether or not the upcoming EU regulations will impact the UK. You
> may have your view, but others may differ.

Well said.

On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 10:09:20 +0000, Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid>
wrote:

>On 29/02/2024 07:40, Tweed wrote:
>>
>> Java Jive <java@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>> On 28/02/2024 20:33, Scott wrote:
>>>
>>> However, if you want to participate in a discussion and not make a fool
>>> of yourself by repeating your own previous mistakes, it pays to do some
>>> prior research, but sadly this is something you have still to learn.
>>
>> I think you are being unduly harsh. I think it’s entirely appropriate to
>> discuss whether or not the upcoming EU regulations will impact the UK. You
>> may have your view, but others may differ.
>
>As do I, but genuine discussion moves forward, it doesn't endlessly go
>over the same ground as was covered less than six months ago just
>because the same people mindlessly regurgitate the same urban myths and
>bigotries that have already shown to be false.
>
>However, I accept that I've dwelt too long on this already, partly
>because Scott kept making unfounded replies causing what was originally
>meant to be just a single comment to become something of an overkill
>tirade, for which I apologise to others. I will stop here.

As will I.

On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 09:25:34 +0000, Scott
<newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:

>On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 08:35:49 +0000, Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Wed 28/02/2024 07:36, Chris wrote:
>>> Pamela <pamela.private.mailbox@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Has the UK enacted any regulation of its own to implement the coming EU
>>>> replaceable battery directive for phones?
>>>
>>> Lol no. Not under this government. Maybe under the next but they've got a
>>> lot damage to fix first.
>>>
>>
>>Question: how many mobile phones do we manufacture in this country?
>>Zero? So legislation will not be needed here if the EU imposes
>>regulations as phones made for the EU are likely the same phones that we
>>have here - and <they> will come with a replacement facility built-in.
>
>Is it now the case that new phones come without chargers?

The iPhone SE that I bought in August last year came with a cable, but
no charger. I have no need for yet another charger so I'm quite happy
I didn't get one.

On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 11:13:51 +0000, Chris in Makati <mail@nospam.com>
wrote:

>On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 09:25:34 +0000, Scott
><newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 08:35:49 +0000, Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Wed 28/02/2024 07:36, Chris wrote:
>>>> Pamela <pamela.private.mailbox@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Has the UK enacted any regulation of its own to implement the coming EU
>>>>> replaceable battery directive for phones?
>>>>
>>>> Lol no. Not under this government. Maybe under the next but they've got a
>>>> lot damage to fix first.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Question: how many mobile phones do we manufacture in this country?
>>>Zero? So legislation will not be needed here if the EU imposes
>>>regulations as phones made for the EU are likely the same phones that we
>>>have here - and <they> will come with a replacement facility built-in.
>>
>>Is it now the case that new phones come without chargers?
>
>The iPhone SE that I bought in August last year came with a cable, but
>no charger. I have no need for yet another charger so I'm quite happy
>I didn't get one.

Bizarrely, I got the same with a new shaver. I suppose it makes sense
to plug it into an existing USB charger rather than carry a charger
for the shaver (unless you want to use it in the bathroom, I suppose).

On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 11:30:35 +0000, Scott
<newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:

>On Thu, 29 Feb 2024 11:13:51 +0000, Chris in Makati <mail@nospam.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 09:25:34 +0000, Scott
>><newsgroups@gefion.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>On Wed, 28 Feb 2024 08:35:49 +0000, Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Wed 28/02/2024 07:36, Chris wrote:
>>>>> Pamela <pamela.private.mailbox@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Has the UK enacted any regulation of its own to implement the coming EU
>>>>>> replaceable battery directive for phones?
>>>>>
>>>>> Lol no. Not under this government. Maybe under the next but they've got a
>>>>> lot damage to fix first.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Question: how many mobile phones do we manufacture in this country?
>>>>Zero? So legislation will not be needed here if the EU imposes
>>>>regulations as phones made for the EU are likely the same phones that we
>>>>have here - and <they> will come with a replacement facility built-in.
>>>
>>>Is it now the case that new phones come without chargers?
>>
>>The iPhone SE that I bought in August last year came with a cable, but
>>no charger. I have no need for yet another charger so I'm quite happy
>>I didn't get one.
>
>Bizarrely, I got the same with a new shaver. I suppose it makes sense
>to plug it into an existing USB charger rather than carry a charger
>for the shaver (unless you want to use it in the bathroom, I suppose).

Now that so many devices I own charge from USB, all I need is one or
two decent quality USB chargers. I have one that I can take with me
when I travel and it does for everything.