On 2024-02-22, Sten deJoode <StendeJood@nospam.net> wrote:
> On 22 Feb 2024 00:21:13 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:
>
>> You have a huge grudge
>
> You have the grudge.

When "No you!" is the best you can come up with, you've lose the plot,
dip shit.

--
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JR

On 22/02/2024 15:49, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2024-02-22, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>>> On 2024-02-21, peter@easthope.ca <peter@easthope.ca> wrote:
>>>> In article <l3n45jF3k60U1@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger
>>>> <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>>>>> A quick search of the App Store shows plenty.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, there are several or many GPS loggers. I installed a shiny
>>>> app, logged a trail and found coordinates couldn't be uploaded
>>>> without a payment.
>>>>
>>>> Shiny won't help; I need a simple and functional app without
>>>> payment.
>>>
>>> Counterpoint: If an app is useful to you, you shouldn't mind
>>> supporting the developer of the app.
>>
>> Surely you are aware that free apps can be profitable for developers,
>> right?
>
> Of course, and typically those apps are plastered with ads. But if a
> developer chooses not to put ads in their app, and someone finds their
> app useful, they deserve to be paid for their hard work.

If the developer isn't happy with the freemuim model, they shouldn't use it.

>>> And if you purchased a smartphone with the intention of never buying
>>> a single app, you probably should have stuck with Android.
>>
>> Are you really that dumb?
>
> Nothing dumb about it. For most normal human beings who own a $800
> smartphone, if there are no free apps that do what they want but there
> is a $5 app that does, spending $5 isn't generally an issue.

Buying a phone and paying for apps are two different transactions. You
can buy a cheap android and then spend hundreds on apps or alternatively
spend hundreds on a phone and not pay for any apps. Both options and
everything in between are fine.

On 2024-02-22 10:45, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2024-02-22, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

>> Not sure if anyone who never DL'd it before can still pull it (Trails)
>> off of the AppStore.
>
> It looks like the developer pulled it from the App Store. Glad I have a
> copy!

Too bad. Hopefully he re-thinks his business model.

I personally don't mind paying a reasonable price for an app but I
despise (and won't) rent an app.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2024-02-22, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2024-02-22 10:45, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2024-02-22, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>
>>> Not sure if anyone who never DL'd it before can still pull it
>>> (Trails) off of the AppStore.
>>
>> It looks like the developer pulled it from the App Store. Glad I have
>> a copy!
>
> Too bad. Hopefully he re-thinks his business model.
>
> I personally don't mind paying a reasonable price for an app but I
> despise (and won't) rent an app.

Same here.

--
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JR

On 2024-02-22, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2024-02-22 10:45, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2024-02-22, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>
>>> Not sure if anyone who never DL'd it before can still pull it
>>> (Trails) off of the AppStore.
>>
>> It looks like the developer pulled it from the App Store. Glad I have
>> a copy!
>
> Too bad. Hopefully he re-thinks his business model.
>
> I personally don't mind paying a reasonable price for an app but I
> despise (and won't) rent an app.

Huh... Looks like I was wrong and it's still there (although it hasn't
been updated by the developer in years):

<https://apps.apple.com/us/app/trails-outdoor-gps-logbook/id913277014>

--
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JR

On 2024-02-22, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 22/02/2024 15:49, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2024-02-22, Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2024-02-21, peter@easthope.ca <peter@easthope.ca> wrote:
>>>>> In article <l3n45jF3k60U1@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger
>>>>> <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>>>>>> A quick search of the App Store shows plenty.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, there are several or many GPS loggers. I installed a shiny
>>>>> app, logged a trail and found coordinates couldn't be uploaded
>>>>> without a payment.
>>>>>
>>>>> Shiny won't help; I need a simple and functional app without
>>>>> payment.
>>>>
>>>> Counterpoint: If an app is useful to you, you shouldn't mind
>>>> supporting the developer of the app.
>>>
>>> Surely you are aware that free apps can be profitable for
>>> developers, right?
>>
>> Of course, and typically those apps are plastered with ads. But if a
>> developer chooses not to put ads in their app, and someone finds
>> their app useful, they deserve to be paid for their hard work.
>
> If the developer isn't happy with the freemuim model, they shouldn't
> use it.
>
>>>> And if you purchased a smartphone with the intention of never
>>>> buying a single app, you probably should have stuck with Android.
>>>
>>> Are you really that dumb?
>>
>> Nothing dumb about it. For most normal human beings who own a $800
>> smartphone, if there are no free apps that do what they want but
>> there is a $5 app that does, spending $5 isn't generally an issue.
>
> Buying a phone and paying for apps are two different transactions.

Wow, we learn something new every day! Thanks! /s

> You can buy a cheap android and then spend hundreds on apps or
> alternatively spend hundreds on a phone and not pay for any apps. Both
> options and everything in between are fine.

That doesn't contradict anything I've said.

--
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JR

On 2024-02-22 08:00, Sten deJoode wrote:
> On 22 Feb 2024 15:49:28 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:
>
>>> Surely you are aware that free apps can be profitable for developers,
>>> right?
>>
>> Of course, and typically those apps are plastered with ads.
>
> Jolly Roger is dead wrong.
> *There are no ads in free apps*

*Were you high when you wrote that? ...

....Arlen?*

Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2024-02-22 07:53, Chris wrote:
>> Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>> On 2024-02-21 13:49, peter@easthope.ca wrote:
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> To allow mapping, I want to log points while walking a trail and
>>>> upload a GPX or KML file without paying a fee.
>>>>
>>>> For Android, GPS Logger from BasicAirData serves very well. Is there
>>>> a comparable app for iPhone?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, ... Peter E.
>>>
>>> I use "Trails". Free as long as you keep the number of recorded tracks
>>> to 5 or less (in the app on your phone).
>>
>> That's a great app. However, the free version is only one that works as
>> since 2022 it has stopped accepting payment and it hasn't been updated in
>> three years.
>>
>> A real shame it's an orphan as I haven't been able to find any alternative
>> which matches it.
>
> Well, I have it (and it works), and other apps that I paid for that
> work.

I also have it and used to pay for the pro version, but since that was
disabled I can't create any new tracks. Did you pay for the pro version?

> Trails is the most convenient to use - and I can start/stop and
> monitor it from my Watch. (Not that that is all that necessary)
>
> Not sure if anyone who never DL'd it before can still pull it (Trails)
> off of the AppStore.
>

On 2024-02-22, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
> On 2024-02-22 08:00, Sten deJoode wrote:
>> On 22 Feb 2024 15:49:28 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>
>>>> Surely you are aware that free apps can be profitable for
>>>> developers, right?
>>>
>>> Of course, and typically those apps are plastered with ads.
>>
>> Jolly Roger is dead wrong. *There are no ads in free apps*
>
> *Were you high when you wrote that? ...
>
> ...Arlen?*

He's losing touch with reality.

--
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I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

On 22 Feb 2024 17:45:47 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:

> you've lose the plot,

The plot is always the same.

1. Someone states a fact about Apple products that you dislike.
2. So you attack the person (because you can't attack the fact).

In reality, you do that because you hate that Apple designed the iPhone as
a dumb terminal that an expensive but brain-dead iPhone can't even run the
kind of basic but detailed app search every other platform easily does.

In addition, you hate that the iOS dumb terminal is designed such that you
can't install an app that isn't on the App Store, when every other platform
other than iOS has no problem installing the app (even years after it's
gone from the respective App Store).

The reason is unknown to you - but Android automatically backs up every
installer you've ever installed so you _always_ already have it.

You hate these facts.
So you attack the person.

It's all you can do because of your hatred of what Apple products are.

On 22 Feb 2024 17:45:02 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:

>> Jolly Roger is dead wrong.
>
> Nope, it's true.

Look at this screenshot, Jolly Roger, and tell us all that it's true.
<https://i.postimg.cc/q7zvZYfc/gpslogger.jpg>

Read the description of what the search engine does too.
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=scadica.aq>

After both those datapoints, come back & tell us all that it's true.
--
The Apple nutjobs hate Apple products so much that they lie about them.

On 22 Feb 2024 21:22:08 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:

> He's losing touch with reality.

It's intereswting that you lied about Apple's lack of capability,
and then when proven wrong, you can only make an ad hominem attack.

Why?
Why do you hate all facts about Apple products, Jolly Roger?

Specifically, why do you hate the truth about Apple so much that you resort
to ad hominem attacks whenever someone merely informs you of facts?

FACT: When you run the search, you check any number of 30 boxes.
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=scadica.aq>

The first three of those search filters are the following:
1. No ads (or No ads/removable ads)
2. Free
3. No in-app purchases

The rest are in the sig although the search takes regular expressions so
there are literally almost an infinite amount of detail to search for.

Here is my own screenshot, which you'll recognize as fact.
<https://i.postimg.cc/q7zvZYfc/gpslogger.jpg>
--
1. No ads (or No ads/removable ads)
2. Free
3. No in-app purchases
4. User rating (where you can set the limit range)
5. Number of ratings (where you can set the limit range)

If you know you're going to purchase an app, you can check if it's on sale
6. On sale

Or if you're willing to accept in-app purchases, you can check that box
7. Has in-app purchases

And if you are using Play Pass, you can check if that is applicable too
8. Play Pass
9. Play Store installable

There are a few more basic but rather useful switches such as
10. Default exclusions
11. Number of downloads (where you can set the limit range)
12. Recent downloads/month (where you can set the limit range)
13. Price range (where you can set the limit range)
l4. In-app price range (where you can set the limit range)
15. Date updated (where you can set the limit range)
16. Date released (where you can set the limit range)
17. Content rating (where you can set the limit range)
18. Download size (where you can set the limit range)
19. Required Android (where you can set the limit range)
20. Target API (where you can set the limit range)
21. Extended filter ranges (where you can set the limit range)

From those filters, you can then select your sort criteria such as
22. Sort by Relevance
23. Average user rating
24. Number of ratings
25. Number of downloads
26. Recent downloads/month
27. Downloads/month increase %
28. Date released
29. Date updated
30. Download size

There are hundreds more (due to the use of regular expressions),
and due to the ability to spoof your API and to spoof your hardware,
and to spoof your gps location for the regionally restricted apps,
but one question to ask the OP is why not use an equivalent search
for the iOS app that the OP is looking to install?

How many of just those basic 30 things does the iOS sort allow you?

On Thu, 22 Feb 2024 18:18:07 +0000, Chris wrote:

> Buying a phone and paying for apps are two different transactions. You
> can buy a cheap android and then spend hundreds on apps or alternatively
> spend hundreds on a phone and not pay for any apps. Both options and
> everything in between are fine.

Is there ever a useful app functionality that you and most people want that
you can't find an app for it that is both free and without advertisements?

On Fri, 23 Feb 2024 12:12:06 +1100, Mickey D <mickeydavis078XX@ptd.net>
wrote:

> On Thu, 22 Feb 2024 18:18:07 +0000, Chris wrote:
>
>> Buying a phone and paying for apps are two different transactions. You
>> can buy a cheap android and then spend hundreds on apps or alternatively
>> spend hundreds on a phone and not pay for any apps. Both options and
>> everything in between are fine.
>
> Is there ever a useful app functionality that you and most people want
> that
> you can't find an app for it that is both free and without
> advertisements?

Yep, nothing like that for what FlightRadar24 does

On 2024-02-23, Sten deJoode <StendeJood@nospam.net> wrote:
> On 22 Feb 2024 21:22:08 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:
>
>> He's losing touch with reality.
>
> you lied about Apple's lack of capability

Projection from a loser troll.

--
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JR

On 23 Feb 2024 03:49:02 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:

> Projection from a loser troll.

You attack the messenger because you _hate_ the iPhone can't do thousands
of useful things that every other platform (but iOS) easily does, JR.

FACT: The brain-dead iPhone can't run a decent app search with any power.
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=scadica.aq>

FACT: The dumb-terminal iPhone can't extract an app off the device
(specifically when it is no longer on the Apple App Store).
<https://play.google.com/store/search?q=apk%20extractor&c=apps>

On 2024-02-23, Sten deJoode <StendeJood@nospam.net> wrote:
> On 23 Feb 2024 03:49:02 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:
>
>> Projection from a loser troll.
>
> You attack

You attack people here because you are jealous of them.

--
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I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

Mickey D <mickeydavis078XX@ptd.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 22 Feb 2024 18:18:07 +0000, Chris wrote:
>
>> Buying a phone and paying for apps are two different transactions. You
>> can buy a cheap android and then spend hundreds on apps or alternatively
>> spend hundreds on a phone and not pay for any apps. Both options and
>> everything in between are fine.
>
> Is there ever a useful app functionality that you and most people want that
> you can't find an app for it that is both free and without advertisements?

Plenty.

On 2024-02-22 15:22, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2024-02-22, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>> On 2024-02-22 10:45, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>> On 2024-02-22, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> Not sure if anyone who never DL'd it before can still pull it
>>>> (Trails) off of the AppStore.
>>>
>>> It looks like the developer pulled it from the App Store. Glad I have
>>> a copy!
>>
>> Too bad. Hopefully he re-thinks his business model.
>>
>> I personally don't mind paying a reasonable price for an app but I
>> despise (and won't) rent an app.
>
> Huh... Looks like I was wrong and it's still there (although it hasn't
> been updated by the developer in years):
>
> <https://apps.apple.com/us/app/trails-outdoor-gps-logbook/id913277014>

Good. Then to the OP: recommended. To run it "free" just copy your
recorded trails to the Notes app on your phone to keep the number of
recordings under 5. Then of course from Notes you can upload to
programs such as Google Earth quite easily.

Or rent it for more in app storage events.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2024-02-22 16:21, Chris wrote:
> Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>> On 2024-02-22 07:53, Chris wrote:
>>> Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2024-02-21 13:49, peter@easthope.ca wrote:
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> To allow mapping, I want to log points while walking a trail and
>>>>> upload a GPX or KML file without paying a fee.
>>>>>
>>>>> For Android, GPS Logger from BasicAirData serves very well. Is there
>>>>> a comparable app for iPhone?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks, ... Peter E.
>>>>
>>>> I use "Trails". Free as long as you keep the number of recorded tracks
>>>> to 5 or less (in the app on your phone).
>>>
>>> That's a great app. However, the free version is only one that works as
>>> since 2022 it has stopped accepting payment and it hasn't been updated in
>>> three years.
>>>
>>> A real shame it's an orphan as I haven't been able to find any alternative
>>> which matches it.
>>
>> Well, I have it (and it works), and other apps that I paid for that
>> work.
>
> I also have it and used to pay for the pro version, but since that was
> disabled I can't create any new tracks. Did you pay for the pro version?

Nope. I use it in "rent free" mode. I have other GPS apps that I've
paid for, but don't need to pay an annual fee like Trails demands.

This just means offloading recordings as they occur to keep under the
qty 5 limit. (Prob'y missing other features, but I get all I need).

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2024-02-22 16:22, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2024-02-22, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
>> On 2024-02-22 08:00, Sten deJoode wrote:
>>> On 22 Feb 2024 15:49:28 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Surely you are aware that free apps can be profitable for
>>>>> developers, right?
>>>>
>>>> Of course, and typically those apps are plastered with ads.
>>>
>>> Jolly Roger is dead wrong. *There are no ads in free apps*
>>
>> *Were you high when you wrote that? ...
>>
>> ...Arlen?*
>
> He's losing touch with reality.

Has reality ever touched it?[1]

[1] Please note that this is a rhetorical question and does not need a
reply.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2024-02-22 20:12, Mickey D wrote:
> On Thu, 22 Feb 2024 18:18:07 +0000, Chris wrote:
>
>> Buying a phone and paying for apps are two different transactions. You
>> can buy a cheap android and then spend hundreds on apps or alternatively
>> spend hundreds on a phone and not pay for any apps. Both options and
>> everything in between are fine.
>
> Is there ever a useful app functionality that you and most people want that
> you can't find an app for it that is both free and without advertisements?

Like many things in life, the things most useful to you will cost you
one way or another.

If one designs and polishes an app to the point that demand is high,
there is no way there is anything wrong with compensation and profit
from it.

That said I have dozens of apps (iPhone, Mac, iPad, Windows, Linux),
etc. that were free to acquire and free to run and I use them frequently.

To my shock my old VueScan license still works 20+ years after acquiring
it 2 Macs ago. I paid around US$50 at the time (I don't recall exactly)
for the pro version. I used this with various scanners from Minolta and
Nikon as well as flatbeds to numerous to ... er, enumerate.

US$120 ish (Pro) US$50 standard version; basic $20 or so.

For all of you with aging scanner/printers, I urge you to get a VueScan
license. The product is very good and the ongoing support for new and
old scanners is incessant.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 23 Feb 2024 06:13:18 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:

> You attack people here because you are jealous of them.

Heh heh heh...

Luckily, I don't take anything personally on Usenet, and even more
importantly, I _study_ the strangeness that you and nospam are.

For nospam, the way I understand him is I think of him being paid by Apple
to refute everything possible that people say that is the truth about it.

For you... I think of you differently, as I put you in the same category of
Alan Baker, Snit and Alan Browne where you actually believe what you say.

Alan Browne actually _believes_ there is no such thing as a walled garden.
Snit actually _believes_ the iPhone graphs Wi-Fi signal strength over time.
You, Jolly Roger, _believe_ you can extract old apps off the phone.

None of you have the intelligence to comprehend the truth.
Nor do any of you have the education you need to comprehend it.

They go together, unfortunately for you.
a. No education
b. Lack of intelligence

But there's a third piece that makes you nut jobs what you are.
c. A fanatical adherence to the herd mentality

I have assessed the reason you hate all the truths about Apple is because
you bought the iPhone only because of a herd mentality advertised by Apple.
--
HINT: Look at an Apple "yellow" ad and you see Apple advertises the herd
mentality - which, combined with lack of intelligence & education,
is why you refute every fact that has ever been stated about Apple.

On 2024-02-23, Sten deJoode <StendeJood@nospam.net> wrote:
> On 23 Feb 2024 06:13:18 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:
>
>> You attack people here because you are jealous of them.
>
> Heh heh heh...

Predictable response.

> Luckily, I don't take anything personally on Usenet

Yes, that must be why you like to claim people have supposedly
threatened to kill you right here in this newsgroup. 🤡

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

On 2024-02-23, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2024-02-22 20:12, Mickey D wrote:
>> On Thu, 22 Feb 2024 18:18:07 +0000, Chris wrote:
>>
>>> Buying a phone and paying for apps are two different transactions.
>>> You can buy a cheap android and then spend hundreds on apps or
>>> alternatively spend hundreds on a phone and not pay for any apps.
>>> Both options and everything in between are fine.
>>
>> Is there ever a useful app functionality that you and most people
>> want that you can't find an app for it that is both free and without
>> advertisements?
>
> Like many things in life, the things most useful to you will cost you
> one way or another.
>
> If one designs and polishes an app to the point that demand is high,
> there is no way there is anything wrong with compensation and profit
> from it.
>
> That said I have dozens of apps (iPhone, Mac, iPad, Windows, Linux),
> etc. that were free to acquire and free to run and I use them
> frequently.
>
> To my shock my old VueScan license still works 20+ years after
> acquiring it 2 Macs ago. I paid around US$50 at the time (I don't
> recall exactly) for the pro version. I used this with various
> scanners from Minolta and Nikon as well as flatbeds to numerous to ...
> er, enumerate.
>
> US$120 ish (Pro) US$50 standard version; basic $20 or so.
>
> For all of you with aging scanner/printers, I urge you to get a
> VueScan license. The product is very good and the ongoing support for
> new and old scanners is incessant.

VueScan is indeed terrific!

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR