Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote

>> I'll try to remember them when VPN switch time comes.
>
> I've enjoyed it for a few years now. They have a really cool Secure Core
> feature which routes your VPN traffic through secure servers in
> countries with strong data privacy laws before connecting to secondary
> VPN servers, essentially doubling your privacy and making it that much
> harder to discover your network activity:
>
> <https://protonvpn.com/secure-vpn/secure-core>

As a somewhat related datum, the one email domain ProtonMail will NOT
accept when you create the free VPN account - is their own domain!

The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote

>> When it comes to VPN's there are plenty of companies to choose from and
>> the offerings are pretty much the same. Which is why the discounts are
>> so steep.
>
> The Brits recognize some of them as VPN numbers and keep locking you out
> of the BBC stuff you want to see.

I disagree with Alan Browne's (supposed) logic, but I do agree with the
experience of The Real Bev in that one by one, VPNs & proxies are blocked,
(specifically by cloudflare in my humble experiences lately with proxies).

The bad news is many VPNs & proxies are blocked by entities like the BBC.
The good news is there are thousands upon thousands of free VPN servers.

I wrote up multiple tutorials on how to set up a free VPN server on your
Android, Windows or Linux device so you can look them up in the archives.

As for Alan Browne's comment, it's as ridiculous as the lady who buys
jewelry because it's marked down 50% as the discount % isn't what matters.

Classic though for an iKook to fall for every marketing trick in the book.
(Do none of these iKooks have an MBA, perchance? It's covered there.)
--
Note I'm using VPN simply for IP address obfuscation - for posting public
messages on the Internet - so security requirements are simpler to attain.

On 2023-10-06 19:55, Wally J wrote:
> Dorper <usenet@dorper.me> wrote
>
>> Chrome is baked into Android System WebView the same way that WebKit is
>> baked into iOS.
>
> WebView? I had never heard of Android System WebView before.

But you're ignorant of so much...

On 10/6/23, 7:55 PM, in article ufqhbu$1c53f$1@paganini.bofh.team, "Wally J"
<walterjones@invalid.nospam> wrote:

> Dorper <usenet@dorper.me> wrote
>
>> Chrome is baked into Android System WebView the same way that WebKit is
>> baked into iOS.
>
> WebView? I had never heard of Android System WebView before.
>
> It was here.
> <https://i.postimg.cc/8kfsyKdV/webview01.jpg> WebView is here
> Now it's gone.
> <https://i.postimg.cc/dtLBhFqh/webview02.jpg> WebView is gone
>
> I am not ashamed to say I've never heard of Android System WebView
> (although I'm all too familiar with Apple's walled-garden WebKit).
> a. Ignorance can be cured (rather easily);
> b. It's stupidity that can't be cured.
>
> Thank you for bringing up Android System WebView so we can learn from you.
> And thank you for making the (presumed) "equivalence" with Apple's WebKit.
>
> This presumed equivalence may be true. Or it may not be true.
> I'd have to know more since I never looked up Android System WebView.
>
> To find out more about what WebView does for Android 10 and up,
> and to then compare & contrast it with WebKit, I opened this thread.
>
> *Compare & contrast Apple's WebKit with Google's Android System WebView*
> <https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/hKRmO7SdoUI>
>
> Thank you for bringing up a fact and an assessment of that fact, where I
> will discuss that further with you when I learn more of the facts.
>
> FACT: "Chrome is baked into Android System WebView..."
> ASSESSMENT: "...the same way that WebKit is baked into iOS."

WebView is a copy of Chrome that is baked into the Android system libraries.
It isn't an "app." android.webkit.WebView. You cannot remove it. Whenever an
application wants to render HTML, it calls WebView to do so. They switched
it from Gecko (I think) to Blink (Chrome) so that they can continue to
enforce the Google (Business Model: Uber for Spyware) web browser monopoly.
I don't think you understand how dynamic linking works. An app doesn't
include a copy of WebView, it uses the system version of WebView, which is
Chrome. It's primary use is not for web browsers but instead to render rich
text, HTML, and most importantly, Google® DoubleClick (Business Model: Uber
for Data Mining) Advertisements!

On 10/6/23 22:38, Dorper wrote:
> I don't think you understand how dynamic linking works. An app doesn't
> include a copy of WebView, it uses the system version of WebView, which is
> Chrome. It's primary use is not for web browsers but instead to render rich
> text, HTML, and most importantly, Google® DoubleClick (Business Model: Uber
> for Data Mining) Advertisements!
>

So, could you theoretically fork WebView and patch it out?
--
user <candycane> is generated from /dev/urandom

On 10/6/23, 8:46 PM, in article ufqkb9$1vve7$1@dont-email.me,
"candycanearter07" <no@thanks.net> wrote:

> On 10/6/23 22:38, Dorper wrote:
>> I don't think you understand how dynamic linking works. An app doesn't
>> include a copy of WebView, it uses the system version of WebView, which is
>> Chrome. It's primary use is not for web browsers but instead to render rich
>> text, HTML, and most importantly, Google® DoubleClick (Business Model: Uber
>> for Data Mining) Advertisements!
>>
>
> So, could you theoretically fork WebView and patch it out?

Patch what out? WebView? Theoretically yes (you would need to root your
phone, unlock the bootloader, find a project that supports your phone model,
etc.) but it would mean that your phone would be unable to render HTML.
Which happens a lot more than you'd think.

On 10/6/23 22:11, Wally J wrote:
> The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote
>
>>> When it comes to VPN's there are plenty of companies to choose from and
>>> the offerings are pretty much the same. Which is why the discounts are
>>> so steep.
>>
>> The Brits recognize some of them as VPN numbers and keep locking you out
>> of the BBC stuff you want to see.
>
> I disagree with Alan Browne's (supposed) logic, but I do agree with the
> experience of The Real Bev in that one by one, VPNs & proxies are blocked,
> (specifically by cloudflare in my humble experiences lately with proxies).
>
> The bad news is many VPNs & proxies are blocked by entities like the BBC.
> The good news is there are thousands upon thousands of free VPN servers.
>

Crazy how companies nowadays can just force you to give up privacy to
use their stuff.

> I wrote up multiple tutorials on how to set up a free VPN server on your
> Android, Windows or Linux device so you can look them up in the archives.
>
> As for Alan Browne's comment, it's as ridiculous as the lady who buys
> jewelry because it's marked down 50% as the discount % isn't what matters.
>
> Classic though for an iKook to fall for every marketing trick in the book.
> (Do none of these iKooks have an MBA, perchance? It's covered there.)

Right, you have to be super careful on what the % is based on. (%
increase? % compared to previous? etc)
--
user <candycane> is generated from /dev/urandom

On 10/6/23 22:59, Dorper wrote:
> On 10/6/23, 8:46 PM, in article ufqkb9$1vve7$1@dont-email.me,
> "candycanearter07" <no@thanks.net> wrote:
>> So, could you theoretically fork WebView and patch it out?
>
> Patch what out? WebView? Theoretically yes (you would need to root your
> phone, unlock the bootloader, find a project that supports your phone model,
> etc.) but it would mean that your phone would be unable to render HTML.
> Which happens a lot more than you'd think.
>

I mean like replace WebView with something less invasive (if it could be
done)
--
user <candycane> is generated from /dev/urandom

candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> wrote

>> Classic though for an iKook to fall for every marketing trick in the book.
>> (Do none of these iKooks have an MBA, perchance? It's covered there.)
>
> Right, you have to be super careful on what the % is based on. (%
> increase? % compared to previous? etc)

A classic marketing trick, particularly in the jewelry business, which has
the concept of low volume & high prices - is to double or triple the price.

Then "sell" it at that outrageous price for a while until suddenly...
*You have a sale!*

Sale! Only Today! 50% off all jewelry in the store! Come & get it!
--
One of the oldest marketing tricks in the book & the iKooks fall for it.

On 10/6/23 23:13, Wally J wrote:
> candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> wrote
>
>>> Classic though for an iKook to fall for every marketing trick in the book.
>>> (Do none of these iKooks have an MBA, perchance? It's covered there.)
>>
>> Right, you have to be super careful on what the % is based on. (%
>> increase? % compared to previous? etc)
>
> A classic marketing trick, particularly in the jewelry business, which has
> the concept of low volume & high prices - is to double or triple the price.
>
> Then "sell" it at that outrageous price for a while until suddenly...
> *You have a sale!*
>
> Sale! Only Today! 50% off all jewelry in the store! Come & get it!

And everyone does it (to a lesser extent) on Black Fridays
--
user <candycane> is generated from /dev/urandom

On 2023-10-06 20:49, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2023-10-07, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>> On 2023-10-06 19:29, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>> On 2023-10-06, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2023-10-06 17:56, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>>> On 2023-10-06, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2023-10-06 16:31, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think NORD gives the best bang for the buck.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I currently have Nord with no complaints.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As to bang for the buck, when the 2 year (or whatever) term is up I
>>>>>> just watch a few YouTube videos and shop the best sponsored offers
>>>>>> off of that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When it comes to VPN's there are plenty of companies to choose from
>>>>>> and the offerings are pretty much the same. Which is why the
>>>>>> discounts are so steep.
>>>>>
>>>>> Some are more private and protective of their users than others.
>>>>
>>>> Probably - Nord has a good rep in that regard. I'll do my research
>>>> before the next flip which is ... ugh, this coming Feb... <sigh>
>>>
>>> Yes, it appears Nord's no-logs policy has been verified by independent
>>> auditors, which is also the case for Proton's VPN service. But I do
>>> recall Nord VPN being breached a few years ago. I'm sure they've beefed
>>> up security since then. I prefer Proton anyway since I use them for
>>> other services.
>>
>> I've had Proton Mail since ... sheesh, a damned long time!
>
> I don't know of any really comparable mail service in terms of privacy.
>
>> I'll try to remember them when VPN switch time comes.
>
> I've enjoyed it for a few years now. They have a really cool Secure Core
> feature which routes your VPN traffic through secure servers in
> countries with strong data privacy laws before connecting to secondary
> VPN servers, essentially doubling your privacy and making it that much
> harder to discover your network activity:

Any reputable VPN that doesn't log traffic is good enough. Nice if they
are audited.

Proton's mission statement on mail privacy is why I have an account
there and that they are in a prosperous, independent and neutral country
that is mildly obsessed with privacy helps a lot.

And since my mail service with them is free, at least if I pay for a VPN
there, they'll get some revenue for their good to me.
OTOH: It's more expensive than Nord by a good chunk. ($173 v. $121 for 2
years). (The $121 being what I paid last time).

To be continued.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2023-10-06 22:41, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 10/6/23 2:42 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
>> On 2023-10-06 16:31, The Real Bev wrote:
>>
>>> I think NORD gives the best bang for the buck.
>>
>> I currently have Nord with no complaints.
>>
>> As to bang for the buck, when the 2 year (or whatever) term is up I just
>> watch a few YouTube videos and shop the best sponsored offers off of
>> that.
>>
>> When it comes to VPN's there are plenty of companies to choose from and
>> the offerings are pretty much the same.  Which is why the discounts are
>> so steep.
>
> The Brits recognize some of them as VPN numbers and keep locking you out
> of the BBC stuff you want to see.

I haven't watched BBC directly in a long time - don't even recall if I
used a VPN.

What show are you trying to watch? I'll give it a go. (I still have a
BBC account - but it may have timed out).

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 10/7/23 6:05 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
> On 2023-10-06 22:41, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 10/6/23 2:42 PM, Alan Browne wrote:
>>> On 2023-10-06 16:31, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think NORD gives the best bang for the buck.
>>>
>>> I currently have Nord with no complaints.
>>>
>>> As to bang for the buck, when the 2 year (or whatever) term is up I just
>>> watch a few YouTube videos and shop the best sponsored offers off of
>>> that.
>>>
>>> When it comes to VPN's there are plenty of companies to choose from and
>>> the offerings are pretty much the same.  Which is why the discounts are
>>> so steep.
>>
>> The Brits recognize some of them as VPN numbers and keep locking you out
>> of the BBC stuff you want to see.
>
> I haven't watched BBC directly in a long time - don't even recall if I
> used a VPN.
>
> What show are you trying to watch? I'll give it a go. (I still have a
> BBC account - but it may have timed out).

I don't remember. One (or more) of their channels is for UK only, and
it recognizes interlopers from The Colonies (and presumably everywhere
else)and rejects them.

--
Cheers, Bev
That's my opinion. Ought to be yours.

On 2023-10-07, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2023-10-06 20:49, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2023-10-07, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>> On 2023-10-06 19:29, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>> On 2023-10-06, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 2023-10-06 17:56, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>>>> On 2023-10-06, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2023-10-06 16:31, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think NORD gives the best bang for the buck.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I currently have Nord with no complaints.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As to bang for the buck, when the 2 year (or whatever) term is
>>>>>>> up I just watch a few YouTube videos and shop the best sponsored
>>>>>>> offers off of that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When it comes to VPN's there are plenty of companies to choose
>>>>>>> from and the offerings are pretty much the same. Which is why
>>>>>>> the discounts are so steep.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Some are more private and protective of their users than others.
>>>>>
>>>>> Probably - Nord has a good rep in that regard. I'll do my
>>>>> research before the next flip which is ... ugh, this coming Feb...
>>>>> <sigh>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, it appears Nord's no-logs policy has been verified by
>>>> independent auditors, which is also the case for Proton's VPN
>>>> service. But I do recall Nord VPN being breached a few years ago.
>>>> I'm sure they've beefed up security since then. I prefer Proton
>>>> anyway since I use them for other services.
>>>
>>> I've had Proton Mail since ... sheesh, a damned long time!
>>
>> I don't know of any really comparable mail service in terms of
>> privacy.
>>
>>> I'll try to remember them when VPN switch time comes.
>>
>> I've enjoyed it for a few years now. They have a really cool Secure
>> Core feature which routes your VPN traffic through secure servers in
>> countries with strong data privacy laws before connecting to
>> secondary VPN servers, essentially doubling your privacy and making
>> it that much harder to discover your network activity:
>
> Any reputable VPN that doesn't log traffic is good enough. Nice if
> they are audited.
>
> Proton's mission statement on mail privacy is why I have an account
> there and that they are in a prosperous, independent and neutral
> country that is mildly obsessed with privacy helps a lot.
>
> And since my mail service with them is free, at least if I pay for a
> VPN there, they'll get some revenue for their good to me. OTOH: It's
> more expensive than Nord by a good chunk. ($173 v. $121 for 2 years).
> (The $121 being what I paid last time).

We are lucky enough to have a Visionary account with Proton, which means
we get everything they have to offer at the highest limits, including
any new services and products they release.

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

On 2023-10-07 14:46, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2023-10-07, Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:

>> Any reputable VPN that doesn't log traffic is good enough. Nice if
>> they are audited.
>>
>> Proton's mission statement on mail privacy is why I have an account
>> there and that they are in a prosperous, independent and neutral
>> country that is mildly obsessed with privacy helps a lot.
>>
>> And since my mail service with them is free, at least if I pay for a
>> VPN there, they'll get some revenue for their good to me. OTOH: It's
>> more expensive than Nord by a good chunk. ($173 v. $121 for 2 years).
>> (The $121 being what I paid last time).
>
> We are lucky enough to have a Visionary account with Proton, which means
> we get everything they have to offer at the highest limits, including
> any new services and products they release.

Sounds great.

Never used it enough in the early days to consider adding the other
features. I recall a period when they were promoting this and that on a
continuous basis - a bit of a noisy period that I didn't pay very much
attention to.

Proton is my anonymous e-mail for those times when I really need such.
About 2 times per year. 3? Maybe.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2023-10-06 21:06, candycanearter07 wrote:
> On 10/6/23 22:59, Dorper wrote:
>> On 10/6/23, 8:46 PM, in article ufqkb9$1vve7$1@dont-email.me,
>> "candycanearter07" <no@thanks.net> wrote:
>>> So, could you theoretically fork WebView and patch it out?
>>
>> Patch what out? WebView? Theoretically yes (you would need to root your
>> phone, unlock the bootloader, find a project that supports your phone
>> model,
>> etc.) but it would mean that your phone would be unable to render HTML.
>> Which happens a lot more than you'd think.
>>
>
> I mean like replace WebView with something less invasive (if it could be
> done)

You can't; not if you have Android >9

On 2023-10-06 21:04, candycanearter07 wrote:
> On 10/6/23 22:11, Wally J wrote:
>> The Real Bev <bashley101@gmail.com> wrote
>>
>>>> When it comes to VPN's there are plenty of companies to choose from and
>>>> the offerings are pretty much the same.  Which is why the discounts are
>>>> so steep.
>>>
>>> The Brits recognize some of them as VPN numbers and keep locking you out
>>> of the BBC stuff you want to see.
>>
>> I disagree with Alan Browne's (supposed) logic, but I do agree with the
>> experience of The Real Bev in that one by one, VPNs & proxies are
>> blocked,
>> (specifically by cloudflare in my humble experiences lately with
>> proxies).
>>
>> The bad news is many VPNs & proxies are blocked by entities like the BBC.
>> The good news is there are thousands upon thousands of free VPN servers.
>>
>
> Crazy how companies nowadays can just force you to give up privacy to
> use their stuff.

You want to use MY stuff... ...you play by MY rules.