Ed Cryer wrote:

> I'd appreciate knowing how to show number of items in outbox without
> having to tick total message count, which shows for all folders.

The issue seems to be "the number of what"?

In most folders, the counter is the number of unread messages, if I go
offline and send a message to myself, it is in the outbox, but the
counter doesn't show.

If I highlight the unsent message and do "Mark/unread" then the counter
shows 1

So I suggest the counter needs to display the number of unsent, rather
than unread. Do you know for sure this this worked properly in v102.x ?

On Thu, 12 Oct 2023 16:50:42 -0400, Big Al <Bears@invalid.com> wrote:

>On 10/12/23 04:39 PM, this is what Zaghadka wrote:
>> On Thu, 12 Oct 2023 16:21:05 -0400, Big Al <Bears@invalid.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 10/12/23 01:05 PM, this is what Zaghadka wrote:
>>>> For reference, this is what my UI configuration looks like.
>>>>
>>>> https://i.imgur.com/bUmbwO4.png
>>>>
>>> You have the horizontal arrangement and cards at least that's what it looks like..
>>> This is my tb. https://i.postimg.cc/137NRshp/TB115.png
>>>
>> Exactly. On the layout menu, that's called the "Classic View." I don't
>> like the name. It's like they're calling it the "old-timey" view.
>>
>> It's a perfectly workable interface that way.
>>
>>> Carlos may have this same arrangement. I think it's the default.
>>> With that arrangement I too have the same jumping out of sight issue. Like this message. It's way too far down the list
>>> to get to the header, as you scroll down, at some point the list starts jumping back up. I can get to the message only
>>> by hitting 'next unread' and the next message shows in the preview pane, but the header is off the list and I can't
>>> scroll down in the headers to see it. And worse, I don't see who you replied to, even though I can deduce that from the
>>> preview pane.
>>>
>>> I'm not trying to put words in Carlos' mouth. This is how my issue works, maybe it's his too.
>>
>> Yeah. This may be a Linux thing. It may be distro specific, as various
>> desktop environments use different UI libraries. Is yours KDE? It's been
>> a long time since I've mucked around in Debian or Red Hat.
>>
>> If you can't get nightly or beta from your repo and try a fresh setup to
>> test, it might be time to hit Bugzilla. They will probably ask you to try
>> a fresh setup and test, though. ;^)
>>
>I've seen reference to card view, but for the life of me I can't find it on a menu. Where is it, I'd like to try it?

LOL. I didn't even know it was there. Luckily, I knew it was promised, so
I went a'looking for it.

If you have a header on your message list, next to Quick Filter there is
this weird little icon that looks like a film strip with a scroll bar
next to it. Tooltip is: "Message List Display Options." Click it, choose
Cards View, done.

If you don't have the header:

Hamburger Menu: View -> Layout, (+)Message List Header

Then you can finally click on the weird-ass filmstrip icon and choose
Cards View.

Then you can get rid of the header if it annoys you, but Quick Filter is
in it, so you might not want to.

This one took some work on my part when I first upgraded. It's not in the
view menu when you press ALT. It's not in the hamburger menu. AFAIK, it's
just that weird little icon.

--
Zag

No one ever said on their deathbed, 'Gee, I wish I had
spent more time alone with my computer.' ~Dan(i) Bunten

On 10/13/23 09:37 AM, this is what Zaghadka wrote:
> On Fri, 13 Oct 2023 10:19:57 +0100, Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> Zaghadka wrote:
>>> On Thu, 12 Oct 2023 19:30:47 +0100, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ed Cryer wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> These hamburgers you mention aren't here; neither is anything resembling
>>>>> a "spaces bar"?
>>>>
>>>> The spaces toolbar is viewed by clicking the "-->|" icon, either in the
>>>> very bottom left of status bar, or in the first icon of the main toolbar
>>>> (but I've disabled just that icon via CSS as it's superfluous)
>>>>
>>>>> Do you speak English?
>>>>
>>>> It's not entirely clear to people what the proper names of all the
>>>> screen areas within TB actually are ... someone might produce an
>>>> annotated screenshot?
>>>
>>> Good idea. Problem is, everyone has a different setup because the program
>>> is so customizable. So I could annotate my setup, and another user could
>>> have several of the elements missing or very different.
>>>
>>> I can mark up my screenshot though if you think it would help.
>>>
>>
>> I'd appreciate knowing how to show number of items in outbox without
>> having to tick total message count, which shows for all folders.
>>
>
> Okay. Screenshot:
>
> https://i.imgur.com/HRMT70U.png
>
> Do you have that header at the top of your message list (List Pane)? You
> may have turned it off, because "why have it" under most circumstances.
> It now contains the quick filter button and message count, so that's why
> I have it.
>
> It shows number of messages, as circled. That's the only other way I know
> how to do it.
>
> If that works for you, the special sauce is:
>
> Hamburger menu: View -> Layout, (+) Message List Header
>
> Otherwise, I'm outta ideas.
>
It kinda looks like any folder with 0 items just doesn't show the count. You draft folder is probably empty and has no
count. I just turned on the count column and saw I had an archive item with count 1, so I deleted it and the counter
disappeared.
--
Linux Mint 21.2 Cinnamon
Al

On 2023-10-13 15:46, Zaghadka wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Oct 2023 16:50:42 -0400, Big Al <Bears@invalid.com> wrote:
>
>> On 10/12/23 04:39 PM, this is what Zaghadka wrote:
>>> On Thu, 12 Oct 2023 16:21:05 -0400, Big Al <Bears@invalid.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 10/12/23 01:05 PM, this is what Zaghadka wrote:

>>>
>> I've seen reference to card view, but for the life of me I can't find it on a menu. Where is it, I'd like to try it?
>
> LOL. I didn't even know it was there. Luckily, I knew it was promised, so
> I went a'looking for it.
>
> If you have a header on your message list, next to Quick Filter there is
> this weird little icon that looks like a film strip with a scroll bar
> next to it. Tooltip is: "Message List Display Options." Click it, choose
> Cards View, done.
>
> If you don't have the header:
>
> Hamburger Menu: View -> Layout, (+)Message List Header
>
> Then you can finally click on the weird-ass filmstrip icon and choose
> Cards View.
>
> Then you can get rid of the header if it annoys you, but Quick Filter is
> in it, so you might not want to.

Maybe there is a hot key to get the quick filter when needed :-?

>
> This one took some work on my part when I first upgraded. It's not in the
> view menu when you press ALT. It's not in the hamburger menu. AFAIK, it's
> just that weird little icon.
>

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

Zaghadka wrote:

> Big Al wrote:
>
>> I've seen reference to card view
>
> LOL. I didn't even know it was there. Luckily, I knew it was promised, so
> I went a'looking for it.
What do people like about card view?

To me it looks like table view where all the useful columns have been
removed and replaced with numerous copies of the message header pane
toolbar ...

On Fri, 13 Oct 2023 16:02:27 +0100, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:

>Zaghadka wrote:
>
>> Big Al wrote:
>>
>>> I've seen reference to card view
>>
>> LOL. I didn't even know it was there. Luckily, I knew it was promised, so
>> I went a'looking for it.
>What do people like about card view?
>
>To me it looks like table view where all the useful columns have been
>removed and replaced with numerous copies of the message header pane
>toolbar ...

It's basically the way most email clients list mails these days,
definitely webmail clients, and it makes vertical view *way* more
practical. It's a modernization. Thunderbird was looking
long-in-the-tooth. You may like it, but the previous design probably
turns off new adopters.

I was using vertical view in the first place, so I am very happy with
cards as they take up a third of the space that table view did. I can
switch to table view easily when I need its features. I agree with you
about missing very useful things like a spam column, turning threading on
and off, star, read/unread, etc. The right click menus can do it, but it
is unwieldy. I had to learn some keyboard commands.

I think the cards are very crude for now, but a welcome addition. I've
sent a feature request to Bugzilla to improve them.

I am very glad they kept the "classic" modes around, for the sake of
those who want it. I am concerned that "classic" means, "soon to be
deprecated when we get sick of supporting it."

YMMV, but that's why.

--
Zag

No one ever said on their deathbed, 'Gee, I wish I had
spent more time alone with my computer.' ~Dan(i) Bunten

Zaghadka wrote:

> Andy Burns wrote:
>
>> What do people like about card view?
>
> It's basically the way most email clients list mails these days,
> definitely webmail clients, and it makes vertical view *way* more
> practical.

OK, I hadn't looked at three-column mode together with card view, it
looks slightly better.

> I agree with you about missing very useful things like a spam column,
> turning threading on and off

It seems to show a single level of indent, not full thread levels

> I am very glad they kept the "classic" modes around, for the sake of
> those who want it. I am concerned that "classic" means, "soon to be
> deprecated when we get sick of supporting it."

Let's hope not.

On Fri, 13 Oct 2023 17:28:08 +0100, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk>
wrote:

>> I agree with you about missing very useful things like a spam column,
>> turning threading on and off
>
>It seems to show a single level of indent, not full thread levels

This too. Yes. This is one thing I don't like about most modern mail
clients and web clients. It's a casualty of this specific UI choice.

It is definitely not Usenet friendly. It works well enough for email. I
use Agent or Pan for Usenet though. There are a lot more things about the
way Tbird handles Usenet that I don't like.

That said, it's possible the people writing the general software have no
clear idea what Usenet is, and the Usenet maintainer is probably a single
coder at this point. We are an old, weird branch of the Internet at this
point.

--
Zag

No one ever said on their deathbed, 'Gee, I wish I had
spent more time alone with my computer.' ~Dan(i) Bunten