"TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) — A group of Chinese citizens living and working in Florida sued the state Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from purchasing property in large swaths of the state.

The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16 kilometers) of military installations and other “critical infrastructure” and also affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling property to them face the harshest penalties. The prohibition also applies to agricultural land.

The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit says the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of their government and there is no evidence of national security risk from Chinese citizens buying Florida property.

The law “will codify and expand housing discrimination against people of Asian descent in violation of the Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,” the ACLU said in a news release announcing the suit. “It will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or Syrian.”"

"The number of states restricting foreign ownership of agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.

Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So far this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.

Foreign land ownership has become “a political flashpoint,” said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center at the University of Arkansas.

Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng Group’s planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant threat to national security.”

After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile governments, including China."

https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1

TB

On 5/22/2023 7:55 PM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) — A group of Chinese citizens living and working in Florida sued the state Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
>
> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16 kilometers) of military installations and other “critical infrastructure” and also affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling property to them face the harshest penalties. The prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
>
> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit says the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of their government and there is no evidence of national security risk from Chinese citizens buying Florida property.
>
> The law “will codify and expand housing discrimination against people of Asian descent in violation of the Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,” the ACLU said in a news release announcing the suit. “It will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or Syrian.”"
>
> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>
> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So far this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>
> Foreign land ownership has become “a political flashpoint,” said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center at the University of Arkansas.
>
> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng Group’s planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant threat to national security.”
>
> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile governments, including China."
>
> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>
> TB

So you agree with the Biden's and think we should sell or give
everything we own to the ChiComs.
--
(Space holder for future brilliant signature line)

Technobarbarian wrote:
> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) — A group of Chinese citizens living and
> working in Florida sued the state Monday over a new law that bans
> Chinese nationals from purchasing property in large swaths of the
> state.
>
> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16 kilometers) of
> military installations and other “critical infrastructure” and
> also affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and
> North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling property to
> them face the harshest penalties. The prohibition also applies to
> agricultural land.
>
> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have a
> substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and Asian people
> who can legally buy property. The suit says the law unfairly
> equates Chinese people with the actions of their government and
> there is no evidence of national security risk from Chinese
> citizens buying Florida property.
>
> The law “will codify and expand housing discrimination against
> people of Asian descent in violation of the Constitution and the
> Fair Housing Act,” the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
> suit. “It will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on anyone
> seeking to buy property whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian,
> Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or Syrian.”"
>
> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of agricultural
> land has risen by 50% this year.
>
> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign ownership
> or investments in private agricultural land. So far this year,
> restrictive laws also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho,
> Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>
> Foreign land ownership has become “a political flashpoint,”
> said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National Agricultural
> Law Center at the University of Arkansas.
>
> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land ownership
> by foreign entities stems from some highly publicized cases of
> Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near military bases.
> Earlier this year, the U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
> Group’s planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base
> in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant threat to
> national security.”
>
> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind
> farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021
> by banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
> governments, including China."
>
> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1

What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
infrastructure?

--
bill
Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) — A group of Chinese citizens living and
> > working in Florida sued the state Monday over a new law that bans
> > Chinese nationals from purchasing property in large swaths of the
> > state.
> >
> > The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16 kilometers) of
> > military installations and other “critical infrastructure†and
> > also affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and
> > North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling property to
> > them face the harshest penalties. The prohibition also applies to
> > agricultural land.
> >
> > The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have a
> > substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and Asian people
> > who can legally buy property. The suit says the law unfairly
> > equates Chinese people with the actions of their government and
> > there is no evidence of national security risk from Chinese
> > citizens buying Florida property.
> >
> > The law “will codify and expand housing discrimination against
> > people of Asian descent in violation of the Constitution and the
> > Fair Housing Act,†the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
> > suit. “It will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on anyone
> > seeking to buy property whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian,
> > Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or Syrian.†"
> >
> > "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of agricultural
> > land has risen by 50% this year.
> >
> > Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign ownership
> > or investments in private agricultural land. So far this year,
> > restrictive laws also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho,
> > Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
> >
> > Foreign land ownership has become “a political flashpoint,â€
> > said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National Agricultural
> > Law Center at the University of Arkansas.
> >
> > Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land ownership
> > by foreign entities stems from some highly publicized cases of
> > Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near military bases.
> > Earlier this year, the U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
> > Group’s planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base
> > in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant threat to
> > national security.â€
> >
> > After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind
> > farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021
> > by banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
> > governments, including China."
> >
> > https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> infrastructure?
>
> --
> bill
> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

I don't know anything about that subject and the article I posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying critical USA infrastructures. What critical infrastructure did they buy and what is your opinion about that?

TB

Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) — A group of Chinese citizens
>>> living and working in Florida sued the state Monday over a new
>>> law that bans Chinese nationals from purchasing property in
>>> large swaths of the state.
>>>
>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16 kilometers)
>>> of military installations and other “critical
>>> infrastructure†and also affects citizens of Cuba,
>>> Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and North Korea. But Chinese
>>> citizens and those selling property to them face the harshest
>>> penalties. The prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
>>>
>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have a
>>> substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and Asian
>>> people who can legally buy property. The suit says the law
>>> unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of their
>>> government and there is no evidence of national security risk
>>> from Chinese citizens buying Florida property.
>>>
>>> The law “will codify and expand housing discrimination
>>> against people of Asian descent in violation of the
>>> Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,†the ACLU said in a
>>> news release announcing the suit. “It will also cast an
>>> undue burden of suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property
>>> whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban,
>>> Venezuelan, or Syrian.†"
>>>
>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>>>
>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign
>>> ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So far
>>> this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in Arkansas,
>>> Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>
>>> Foreign land ownership has become “a political
>>> flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the
>>> National Agricultural Law Center at the University of
>>> Arkansas.
>>>
>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land
>>> ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly publicized
>>> cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near
>>> military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air Force said that
>>> the Fufeng Group’s planned $700 million wet corn milling
>>> plant near a base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
>>> “significant threat to national security.â€
>>>
>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a
>>> wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded
>>> in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied
>>> to hostile governments, including China."
>>>
>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>
>>>
What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>> infrastructure?
>>
>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>
> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I posted
> doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> infrastructures.

Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
----------------------------------------
After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind
farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021
by banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
governments, including China."
---------------------------------------

> What critical infrastructure did they buy

Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't even know
what critical infrastructure is:
-------------------------------------------------------------------
There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so vital to
the United States that their incapacitation or destruction would have
a debilitating effect on security, national economic security,
national public health or safety, or any combination thereof.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

> and what
> is your opinion about that?

Now can you provide your own opinion?

--
bill
Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)  A group of Chinese citizens
> >>> living and working in Florida sued the state Monday over a new
> >>> law that bans Chinese nationals from purchasing property in
> >>> large swaths of the state.
> >>>
> >>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16 kilometers)
> >>> of military installations and other “critical
> >>> infrastructure†and also affects citizens of Cuba,
> >>> Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and North Korea. But Chinese
> >>> citizens and those selling property to them face the harshest
> >>> penalties. The prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
> >>>
> >>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have a
> >>> substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and Asian
> >>> people who can legally buy property. The suit says the law
> >>> unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of their
> >>> government and there is no evidence of national security risk
> >>> from Chinese citizens buying Florida property.
> >>>
> >>> The law “will codify and expand housing discrimination
> >>> against people of Asian descent in violation of the
> >>> Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,†the ACLU said in a
> >>> news release announcing the suit. “It will also cast an
> >>> undue burden of suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property
> >>> whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban,
> >>> Venezuelan, or Syrian.†"
> >>>
> >>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
> >>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
> >>>
> >>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign
> >>> ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So far
> >>> this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in Arkansas,
> >>> Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
> >>>
> >>> Foreign land ownership has become “a political
> >>> flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the
> >>> National Agricultural Law Center at the University of
> >>> Arkansas.
> >>>
> >>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land
> >>> ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly publicized
> >>> cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near
> >>> military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air Force said that
> >>> the Fufeng Group’s planned $700 million wet corn milling
> >>> plant near a base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
> >>> “significant threat to national security.â€
> >>>
> >>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a
> >>> wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded
> >>> in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied
> >>> to hostile governments, including China."
> >>>
> >>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> >>
> >>>
> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >> infrastructure?
> >>
> >> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >
> > I don't know anything about that subject and the article I posted
> > doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> > infrastructures.
> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
> ----------------------------------------
> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind
> farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021
> by banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
> governments, including China."
> ---------------------------------------
> > What critical infrastructure did they buy
> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't even know
> what critical infrastructure is:
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so vital to
> the United States that their incapacitation or destruction would have
> a debilitating effect on security, national economic security,
> national public health or safety, or any combination thereof.
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> > and what
> > is your opinion about that?
> Now can you provide your own opinion?
> --
> bill
> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might have bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your opinion about this.

I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of getting a straight answer about my opinions, you will need to start by stating your opinion.

TB

Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)  A group of Chinese
>>>>> citizens living and working in Florida sued the state
>>>>> Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from
>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
>>>>>
>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
>>>>> “critical infrastructure†and also
>>>>> affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
>>>>> and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling
>>>>> property to them face the harshest penalties. The
>>>>> prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
>>>>>
>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have
>>>>> a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and
>>>>> Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit says
>>>>> the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of
>>>>> their government and there is no evidence of national
>>>>> security risk from Chinese citizens buying Florida
>>>>> property.
>>>>>
>>>>> The law “will codify and expand housing
>>>>> discrimination against people of Asian descent in violation
>>>>> of the Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,â€
>>>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the suit.
>>>>> “It will also cast an undue burden of
>>>>> suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property whose name
>>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan,
>>>>> or Syrian.†"
>>>>>
>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
>>>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>>>>>
>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign
>>>>> ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So
>>>>> far this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in
>>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>>>
>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become “a
>>>>> political flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a staff
>>>>> attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center at the
>>>>> University of Arkansas.
>>>>>
>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land
>>>>> ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly
>>>>> publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing
>>>>> land near military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng Group’s planned
>>>>> $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in Grand
>>>>> Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant
>>>>> threat to national security.â€
>>>>>
>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought
>>>>> a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
>>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with
>>>>> individuals tied to hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>
>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>>>>>
What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>
>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>
>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I
>>> posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying
>>> critical USA infrastructures.
>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese army
>> veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air
>> Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
>> governments, including China."
>> ---------------------------------------
>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't even
>> know what critical infrastructure is:
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so
>> vital to the United States that their incapacitation or
>> destruction would have a debilitating effect on security,
>> national economic security, national public health or safety, or
>> any combination thereof.
>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>
and what
>>> is your opinion about that?
>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory don't mean
>> squat if it don't work.
>
> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might have
> bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical infrastructure
> Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your opinion about
> this.
>
> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in
> opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of getting a
> straight answer about my opinions, you will need to start by
> stating your opinion.

Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not contain facts?
That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese national? That he did Not BUY a
wind farm? That a wind farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?

And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably reorient
and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely possible metric of hope
that I may have on the table of literally getting a straight answer
from you at any point in the passage of time?

--
bill
Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)  A group of Chinese
> >>>>> citizens living and working in Florida sued the state
> >>>>> Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from
> >>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
> >>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
> >>>>> “critical infrastructure†and also
> >>>>> affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
> >>>>> and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling
> >>>>> property to them face the harshest penalties. The
> >>>>> prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have
> >>>>> a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and
> >>>>> Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit says
> >>>>> the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of
> >>>>> their government and there is no evidence of national
> >>>>> security risk from Chinese citizens buying Florida
> >>>>> property.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The law “will codify and expand housing
> >>>>> discrimination against people of Asian descent in violation
> >>>>> of the Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,â€
> >>>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the suit.
> >>>>> “It will also cast an undue burden of
> >>>>> suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property whose name
> >>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan,
> >>>>> or Syrian.†"
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
> >>>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign
> >>>>> ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So
> >>>>> far this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in
> >>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Foreign land ownership has become “a
> >>>>> political flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a staff
> >>>>> attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center at the
> >>>>> University of Arkansas.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land
> >>>>> ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly
> >>>>> publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing
> >>>>> land near military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
> >>>>> Force said that the Fufeng Group’s planned
> >>>>> $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in Grand
> >>>>> Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant
> >>>>> threat to national security.â€
> >>>>>
> >>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought
> >>>>> a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
> >>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with
> >>>>> individuals tied to hostile governments, including China."
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>
> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >>>> infrastructure?
> >>>>
> >>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>
> >>> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I
> >>> posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying
> >>> critical USA infrastructures.
> >> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
> >> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese army
> >> veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air
> >> Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
> >> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
> >> governments, including China."
> >> ---------------------------------------
> >>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
> >> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't even
> >> know what critical infrastructure is:
> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
> >> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so
> >> vital to the United States that their incapacitation or
> >> destruction would have a debilitating effect on security,
> >> national economic security, national public health or safety, or
> >> any combination thereof.
> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>
> >>
> and what
> >>> is your opinion about that?
> >> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory don't mean
> >> squat if it don't work.
> >
> > I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might have
> > bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical infrastructure
> > Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your opinion about
> > this.
> >
> > I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in
> > opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of getting a
> > straight answer about my opinions, you will need to start by
> > stating your opinion.
> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not contain facts?
> That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese national? That he did Not BUY a
> wind farm? That a wind farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?
>
> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably reorient
> and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely possible metric of hope
> that I may have on the table of literally getting a straight answer
> from you at any point in the passage of time?
> --
> bill
> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered "critical infrastructure." The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about buying property near "critical infrastructure." I don't think anyone is worried about Chinese nationals buying our military bases out from under us.

If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read the written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state your opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking about. In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if we are talking about the same subject, I have a black and white answer and I think it's a good one.

BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.

TB

On 5/23/2023 3:06 PM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)  A group of Chinese
>>>>>>> citizens living and working in Florida sued the state
>>>>>>> Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from
>>>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
>>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
>>>>>>> “critical infrastructure†and also
>>>>>>> affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
>>>>>>> and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling
>>>>>>> property to them face the harshest penalties. The
>>>>>>> prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have
>>>>>>> a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and
>>>>>>> Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit says
>>>>>>> the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of
>>>>>>> their government and there is no evidence of national
>>>>>>> security risk from Chinese citizens buying Florida
>>>>>>> property.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The law “will codify and expand housing
>>>>>>> discrimination against people of Asian descent in violation
>>>>>>> of the Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,â€
>>>>>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the suit.
>>>>>>> “It will also cast an undue burden of
>>>>>>> suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property whose name
>>>>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan,
>>>>>>> or Syrian.†"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
>>>>>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign
>>>>>>> ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So
>>>>>>> far this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in
>>>>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become “a
>>>>>>> political flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a staff
>>>>>>> attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center at the
>>>>>>> University of Arkansas.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land
>>>>>>> ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly
>>>>>>> publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing
>>>>>>> land near military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
>>>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng Group’s planned
>>>>>>> $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in Grand
>>>>>>> Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant
>>>>>>> threat to national security.â€
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought
>>>>>>> a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
>>>>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with
>>>>>>> individuals tied to hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I
>>>>> posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying
>>>>> critical USA infrastructures.
>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese army
>>>> veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air
>>>> Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
>>>> governments, including China."
>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't even
>>>> know what critical infrastructure is:
>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>
>> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so
>>>> vital to the United States that their incapacitation or
>>>> destruction would have a debilitating effect on security,
>>>> national economic security, national public health or safety, or
>>>> any combination thereof.
>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>
>> and what
>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory don't mean
>>>> squat if it don't work.
>>>
>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might have
>>> bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical infrastructure
>>> Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your opinion about
>>> this.
>>>
>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in
>>> opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of getting a
>>> straight answer about my opinions, you will need to start by
>>> stating your opinion.
>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not contain facts?
>> That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese national? That he did Not BUY a
>> wind farm? That a wind farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?
>>
>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably reorient
>> and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely possible metric of hope
>> that I may have on the table of literally getting a straight answer
>> from you at any point in the passage of time?
>> --
>> bill
>> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>
> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered "critical infrastructure."

Oh yeah. Try telling that to your liberal, tree hugging, woke friends.

The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it is NEAR
"critical infrastructure". The whole law is about buying property near
"critical infrastructure." I don't think anyone is worried about Chinese
nationals buying our military bases out from under us.
>
> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read the written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state your opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking about. In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if we are talking about the same subject, I have a black and white answer and I think it's a good one.
>
> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
>
> TB

--
(Space holder for future brilliant signature line)

On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 1:55:40 PM UTC-7, George Anthony wrote:
> On 5/23/2023 3:06 PM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> > On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)  A group of Chinese
> >>>>>>> citizens living and working in Florida sued the state
> >>>>>>> Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from
> >>>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
> >>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
> >>>>>>> “critical infrastructure†and also
> >>>>>>> affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
> >>>>>>> and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling
> >>>>>>> property to them face the harshest penalties. The
> >>>>>>> prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have
> >>>>>>> a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and
> >>>>>>> Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit says
> >>>>>>> the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of
> >>>>>>> their government and there is no evidence of national
> >>>>>>> security risk from Chinese citizens buying Florida
> >>>>>>> property.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The law “will codify and expand housing
> >>>>>>> discrimination against people of Asian descent in violation
> >>>>>>> of the Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,â€
> >>>>>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the suit.
> >>>>>>> “It will also cast an undue burden of
> >>>>>>> suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property whose name
> >>>>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan,
> >>>>>>> or Syrian.†"
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
> >>>>>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign
> >>>>>>> ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So
> >>>>>>> far this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in
> >>>>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become “a
> >>>>>>> political flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a staff
> >>>>>>> attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center at the
> >>>>>>> University of Arkansas.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land
> >>>>>>> ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly
> >>>>>>> publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing
> >>>>>>> land near military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
> >>>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng Group’s planned
> >>>>>>> $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in Grand
> >>>>>>> Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant
> >>>>>>> threat to national security.â€
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought
> >>>>>>> a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
> >>>>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with
> >>>>>>> individuals tied to hostile governments, including China."
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >>>>>> infrastructure?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I
> >>>>> posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying
> >>>>> critical USA infrastructures.
> >>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
> >>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese army
> >>>> veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air
> >>>> Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
> >>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
> >>>> governments, including China."
> >>>> ---------------------------------------
> >>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
> >>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't even
> >>>> know what critical infrastructure is:
> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
> >>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so
> >>>> vital to the United States that their incapacitation or
> >>>> destruction would have a debilitating effect on security,
> >>>> national economic security, national public health or safety, or
> >>>> any combination thereof.
> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >> and what
> >>>>> is your opinion about that?
> >>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory don't mean
> >>>> squat if it don't work.
> >>>
> >>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might have
> >>> bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical infrastructure
> >>> Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your opinion about
> >>> this.
> >>>
> >>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in
> >>> opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of getting a
> >>> straight answer about my opinions, you will need to start by
> >>> stating your opinion.
> >> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not contain facts?
> >> That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese national? That he did Not BUY a
> >> wind farm? That a wind farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?
> >>
> >> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably reorient
> >> and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely possible metric of hope
> >> that I may have on the table of literally getting a straight answer
> >> from you at any point in the passage of time?
> >> --
> >> bill
> >> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >
> > The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered "critical infrastructure."
> Oh yeah. Try telling that to your liberal, tree hugging, woke friends.
> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it is NEAR
> "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about buying property near
> "critical infrastructure." I don't think anyone is worried about Chinese
> nationals buying our military bases out from under us.
> >
> > If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read the written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state your opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking about. In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if we are talking about the same subject, I have a black and white answer and I think it's a good one.
> >
> > BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
> >
> > TB
> --
> (Space holder for future brilliant signature line)

Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7,
>>>>> bfh wrote:
>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)
>>>>>>>  A group of Chinese
>>>>>>> citizens living and working in Florida sued the state
>>>>>>> Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from
>>>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
>>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
>>>>>>> “critical
>>>>>>> infrastructure†and also affects
>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and
>>>>>>> North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling
>>>>>>> property to them face the harshest penalties. The
>>>>>>> prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will
>>>>>>> have a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese
>>>>>>> and Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit
>>>>>>> says the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the
>>>>>>> actions of their government and there is no evidence of
>>>>>>> national security risk from Chinese citizens buying
>>>>>>> Florida property.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The law “will codify
>>>>>>> and expand housing discrimination against people of
>>>>>>> Asian descent in violation of the Constitution and the
>>>>>>> Fair Housing Act,†the ACLU said
>>>>>>> in a news release announcing the suit.
>>>>>>> “It will also cast an
>>>>>>> undue burden of suspicion on anyone seeking to buy
>>>>>>> property whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian,
>>>>>>> Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or
>>>>>>> Syrian.†"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
>>>>>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting
>>>>>>> foreign ownership or investments in private
>>>>>>> agricultural land. So far this year, restrictive laws
>>>>>>> also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho, Montana,
>>>>>>> Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become
>>>>>>> “a political
>>>>>>> flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a
>>>>>>> staff attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center
>>>>>>> at the University of Arkansas.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting
>>>>>>> land ownership by foreign entities stems from some
>>>>>>> highly publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies
>>>>>>> purchasing land near military bases. Earlier this year,
>>>>>>> the U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
>>>>>>> Group’s planned
>>>>>>> $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in
>>>>>>> Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
>>>>>>> “significant threat
>>>>>>> to national security.â€
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas,
>>>>>>> that state responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure
>>>>>>> deals with individuals tied to hostile governments,
>>>>>>> including China."
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>>
What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I
>>>>> posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying
>>>>> critical USA infrastructures.
>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese
>>>> army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near
>>>> an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by
>>>> banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
>>>> hostile governments, including China."
>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't
>>>> even know what critical infrastructure is:
>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>>>
There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so
>>>> vital to the United States that their incapacitation or
>>>> destruction would have a debilitating effect on security,
>>>> national economic security, national public health or safety,
>>>> or any combination thereof.
>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>>>
and what
>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory don't
>>>> mean squat if it don't work.
>>>
>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might
>>> have bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical
>>> infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your
>>> opinion about this.
>>>
>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in
>>> opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of
>>> getting a straight answer about my opinions, you will need to
>>> start by stating your opinion.
>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not contain
>> facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese national? That he
>> did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind farm is Not critical
>> infrastructure? What?
>>
>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably
>> reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely possible
>> metric of hope that I may have on the table of literally getting
>> a straight answer from you at any point in the passage of time?
>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>
> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered "critical
> infrastructure."

Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and wind power
is part of the energy structure.
----------------------------------------------------------------
The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated segments:
electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S. electricity segment
contains more than 6,413 power plants (this includes 3,273 traditional
electric utilities and 1,738 nonutility power producers) with
approximately 1,075 gigawatts of installed generation. Approximately
48 percent of electricity is produced by combusting coal (primarily
transported by rail), 20 percent in nuclear power plants, and 22
percent by combusting natural gas. The remaining generation is
provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent), oil (1 percent), and
renewable sources (solar, wind, and geothermal) (3 percent).
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
critical infrastructure?

On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7,
> >>>>> bfh wrote:
> >>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)
> >>>>>>>  A group of Chinese
> >>>>>>> citizens living and working in Florida sued the state
> >>>>>>> Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from
> >>>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
> >>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
> >>>>>>> “critical
> >>>>>>> infrastructure†and also affects
> >>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and
> >>>>>>> North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling
> >>>>>>> property to them face the harshest penalties. The
> >>>>>>> prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will
> >>>>>>> have a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese
> >>>>>>> and Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit
> >>>>>>> says the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the
> >>>>>>> actions of their government and there is no evidence of
> >>>>>>> national security risk from Chinese citizens buying
> >>>>>>> Florida property.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The law “will codify
> >>>>>>> and expand housing discrimination against people of
> >>>>>>> Asian descent in violation of the Constitution and the
> >>>>>>> Fair Housing Act,†the ACLU said
> >>>>>>> in a news release announcing the suit.
> >>>>>>> “It will also cast an
> >>>>>>> undue burden of suspicion on anyone seeking to buy
> >>>>>>> property whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian,
> >>>>>>> Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or
> >>>>>>> Syrian.†"
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
> >>>>>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting
> >>>>>>> foreign ownership or investments in private
> >>>>>>> agricultural land. So far this year, restrictive laws
> >>>>>>> also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho, Montana,
> >>>>>>> Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become
> >>>>>>> “a political
> >>>>>>> flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a
> >>>>>>> staff attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center
> >>>>>>> at the University of Arkansas.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting
> >>>>>>> land ownership by foreign entities stems from some
> >>>>>>> highly publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies
> >>>>>>> purchasing land near military bases. Earlier this year,
> >>>>>>> the U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
> >>>>>>> Group’s planned
> >>>>>>> $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in
> >>>>>>> Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
> >>>>>>> “significant threat
> >>>>>>> to national security.â€
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
> >>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas,
> >>>>>>> that state responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure
> >>>>>>> deals with individuals tied to hostile governments,
> >>>>>>> including China."
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>>
> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >>>>>> infrastructure?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I
> >>>>> posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying
> >>>>> critical USA infrastructures.
> >>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
> >>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese
> >>>> army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near
> >>>> an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by
> >>>> banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
> >>>> hostile governments, including China."
> >>>> ---------------------------------------
> >>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
> >>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't
> >>>> even know what critical infrastructure is:
> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> >>>>
> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
> >>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so
> >>>> vital to the United States that their incapacitation or
> >>>> destruction would have a debilitating effect on security,
> >>>> national economic security, national public health or safety,
> >>>> or any combination thereof.
> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> >>>>
> and what
> >>>>> is your opinion about that?
> >>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory don't
> >>>> mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>
> >>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might
> >>> have bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical
> >>> infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your
> >>> opinion about this.
> >>>
> >>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in
> >>> opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of
> >>> getting a straight answer about my opinions, you will need to
> >>> start by stating your opinion.
> >> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not contain
> >> facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese national? That he
> >> did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind farm is Not critical
> >> infrastructure? What?
> >>
> >> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably
> >> reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely possible
> >> metric of hope that I may have on the table of literally getting
> >> a straight answer from you at any point in the passage of time?
> >> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >
> > The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered "critical
> > infrastructure."
> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and wind power
> is part of the energy structure.
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated segments:
> electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S. electricity segment
> contains more than 6,413 power plants (this includes 3,273 traditional
> electric utilities and 1,738 nonutility power producers) with
> approximately 1,075 gigawatts of installed generation. Approximately
> 48 percent of electricity is produced by combusting coal (primarily
> transported by rail), 20 percent in nuclear power plants, and 22
> percent by combusting natural gas. The remaining generation is
> provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent), oil (1 percent), and
> renewable sources (solar, wind, and geothermal) (3 percent).
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
> critical infrastructure?
> > The objection to that purchase is based on the
> > fact that it is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is
> > about buying property near "critical infrastructure." I don't think
> > anyone is worried about Chinese nationals buying our military bases
> > out from under us.
> >
> > If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read the
> > written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational
> > discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state your
> > opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking about. In
> > this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if
> > we are talking about the same subject, I have a black and white
> > answer and I think it's a good one.
> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He couldn't
> follow through. Can you?
> > BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this bullshabble
> that you post? Or is it just another case of you amazing and amusing
> yourself, and trying to confirm yourself as the king - or queen, or
> whatever - of RORT controversialism?
> --
> bill
> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

On 5/23/2023 4:51 PM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 1:55:40 PM UTC-7, George Anthony wrote:
>> On 5/23/2023 3:06 PM, Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)  A group of Chinese
>>>>>>>>> citizens living and working in Florida sued the state
>>>>>>>>> Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from
>>>>>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
>>>>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
>>>>>>>>> “critical infrastructure†and also
>>>>>>>>> affects citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
>>>>>>>>> and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling
>>>>>>>>> property to them face the harshest penalties. The
>>>>>>>>> prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will have
>>>>>>>>> a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese and
>>>>>>>>> Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit says
>>>>>>>>> the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the actions of
>>>>>>>>> their government and there is no evidence of national
>>>>>>>>> security risk from Chinese citizens buying Florida
>>>>>>>>> property.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The law “will codify and expand housing
>>>>>>>>> discrimination against people of Asian descent in violation
>>>>>>>>> of the Constitution and the Fair Housing Act,â€
>>>>>>>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the suit.
>>>>>>>>> “It will also cast an undue burden of
>>>>>>>>> suspicion on anyone seeking to buy property whose name
>>>>>>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan,
>>>>>>>>> or Syrian.†"
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
>>>>>>>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting foreign
>>>>>>>>> ownership or investments in private agricultural land. So
>>>>>>>>> far this year, restrictive laws also have been enacted in
>>>>>>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become “a
>>>>>>>>> political flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a staff
>>>>>>>>> attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center at the
>>>>>>>>> University of Arkansas.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting land
>>>>>>>>> ownership by foreign entities stems from some highly
>>>>>>>>> publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies purchasing
>>>>>>>>> land near military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
>>>>>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng Group’s planned
>>>>>>>>> $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in Grand
>>>>>>>>> Forks, North Dakota, poses a “significant
>>>>>>>>> threat to national security.â€
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought
>>>>>>>>> a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
>>>>>>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with
>>>>>>>>> individuals tied to hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I
>>>>>>> posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying
>>>>>>> critical USA infrastructures.
>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese army
>>>>>> veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air
>>>>>> Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
>>>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to hostile
>>>>>> governments, including China."
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't even
>>>>>> know what critical infrastructure is:
>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so
>>>>>> vital to the United States that their incapacitation or
>>>>>> destruction would have a debilitating effect on security,
>>>>>> national economic security, national public health or safety, or
>>>>>> any combination thereof.
>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> and what
>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory don't mean
>>>>>> squat if it don't work.
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might have
>>>>> bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical infrastructure
>>>>> Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your opinion about
>>>>> this.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in
>>>>> opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of getting a
>>>>> straight answer about my opinions, you will need to start by
>>>>> stating your opinion.
>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not contain facts?
>>>> That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese national? That he did Not BUY a
>>>> wind farm? That a wind farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?
>>>>
>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably reorient
>>>> and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely possible metric of hope
>>>> that I may have on the table of literally getting a straight answer
>>>> from you at any point in the passage of time?
>>>> --
>>>> bill
>>>> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>
>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered "critical infrastructure."
>> Oh yeah. Try telling that to your liberal, tree hugging, woke friends.
>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it is NEAR
>> "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about buying property near
>> "critical infrastructure." I don't think anyone is worried about Chinese
>> nationals buying our military bases out from under us.
>>>
>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read the written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state your opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking about. In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if we are talking about the same subject, I have a black and white answer and I think it's a good one.
>>>
>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
>>>
>>> TB
>> --
>> (Space holder for future brilliant signature line)
>
> ROFLMAO and kicking up my heels. YEEEEEE HAWwwww They say there is one born every minute. How about you sucker? You claim black and responses are easy. What's your opinion about this law?
>
> I feel like I fired a gun full of blanks at the jive ass idiot's feet. I expect him to start dancing. The best I can hope for is a non-answer.
>
> TB
>

On 5/23/2023 7:14 PM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 7:43:52 PM UTC-7,
>>>>>>> bfh wrote:
>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)
>>>>>>>>>  A group of Chinese
>>>>>>>>> citizens living and working in Florida sued the state
>>>>>>>>> Monday over a new law that bans Chinese nationals from
>>>>>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of the state.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
>>>>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
>>>>>>>>> “critical
>>>>>>>>> infrastructure†and also affects
>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and
>>>>>>>>> North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those selling
>>>>>>>>> property to them face the harshest penalties. The
>>>>>>>>> prohibition also applies to agricultural land.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law will
>>>>>>>>> have a substantial chilling effect on sales to Chinese
>>>>>>>>> and Asian people who can legally buy property. The suit
>>>>>>>>> says the law unfairly equates Chinese people with the
>>>>>>>>> actions of their government and there is no evidence of
>>>>>>>>> national security risk from Chinese citizens buying
>>>>>>>>> Florida property.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The law “will codify
>>>>>>>>> and expand housing discrimination against people of
>>>>>>>>> Asian descent in violation of the Constitution and the
>>>>>>>>> Fair Housing Act,†the ACLU said
>>>>>>>>> in a news release announcing the suit.
>>>>>>>>> “It will also cast an
>>>>>>>>> undue burden of suspicion on anyone seeking to buy
>>>>>>>>> property whose name sounds remotely Asian, Russian,
>>>>>>>>> Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or
>>>>>>>>> Syrian.†"
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership of
>>>>>>>>> agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting
>>>>>>>>> foreign ownership or investments in private
>>>>>>>>> agricultural land. So far this year, restrictive laws
>>>>>>>>> also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho, Montana,
>>>>>>>>> Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become
>>>>>>>>> “a political
>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,†said Micah Brown, a
>>>>>>>>> staff attorney for the National Agricultural Law Center
>>>>>>>>> at the University of Arkansas.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws targeting
>>>>>>>>> land ownership by foreign entities stems from some
>>>>>>>>> highly publicized cases of Chinese-connected companies
>>>>>>>>> purchasing land near military bases. Earlier this year,
>>>>>>>>> the U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
>>>>>>>>> Group’s planned
>>>>>>>>> $700 million wet corn milling plant near a base in
>>>>>>>>> Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
>>>>>>>>> “significant threat
>>>>>>>>> to national security.â€
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas,
>>>>>>>>> that state responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure
>>>>>>>>> deals with individuals tied to hostile governments,
>>>>>>>>> including China."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the article I
>>>>>>> posted doesn't say anything about Chinese nationals buying
>>>>>>> critical USA infrastructures.
>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese
>>>>>> army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm near
>>>>>> an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by
>>>>>> banning infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
>>>>>> hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably don't
>>>>>> even know what critical infrastructure is:
>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered so
>>>>>> vital to the United States that their incapacitation or
>>>>>> destruction would have a debilitating effect on security,
>>>>>> national economic security, national public health or safety,
>>>>>> or any combination thereof.
>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>> and what
>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory don't
>>>>>> mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They might
>>>>> have bought land near that. Can you tell me what critical
>>>>> infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your
>>>>> opinion about this.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested in
>>>>> opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope of
>>>>> getting a straight answer about my opinions, you will need to
>>>>> start by stating your opinion.
>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not contain
>>>> facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese national? That he
>>>> did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind farm is Not critical
>>>> infrastructure? What?
>>>>
>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably
>>>> reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely possible
>>>> metric of hope that I may have on the table of literally getting
>>>> a straight answer from you at any point in the passage of time?
>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>
>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered "critical
>>> infrastructure."
>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and wind power
>> is part of the energy structure.
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>> The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated segments:
>> electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S. electricity segment
>> contains more than 6,413 power plants (this includes 3,273 traditional
>> electric utilities and 1,738 nonutility power producers) with
>> approximately 1,075 gigawatts of installed generation. Approximately
>> 48 percent of electricity is produced by combusting coal (primarily
>> transported by rail), 20 percent in nuclear power plants, and 22
>> percent by combusting natural gas. The remaining generation is
>> provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent), oil (1 percent), and
>> renewable sources (solar, wind, and geothermal) (3 percent).
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
>> critical infrastructure?
>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the
>>> fact that it is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is
>>> about buying property near "critical infrastructure." I don't think
>>> anyone is worried about Chinese nationals buying our military bases
>>> out from under us.
>>>
>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read the
>>> written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational
>>> discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state your
>>> opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking about. In
>>> this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if
>>> we are talking about the same subject, I have a black and white
>>> answer and I think it's a good one.
>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He couldn't
>> follow through. Can you?
>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this bullshabble
>> that you post? Or is it just another case of you amazing and amusing
>> yourself, and trying to confirm yourself as the king - or queen, or
>> whatever - of RORT controversialism?
>> --
>> bill
>> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>
> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law I posted about is about property near critical infrastructure.
>
> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying farmland or any property within 10 miles of a military installation or “critical infrastructure,” such as a seaport or airport."
>
> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the actual ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that law, but so far I haven't seen it, and you are the only one talking about it.
>
> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing. If you want an opinion you have to start with one. I have a clear opinion about YOUR subject. Your subject is so ridiculous i don't think I need one, but oh well. If you want to play you need to put something in the pot.
>
> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own definition of "critical infrastructure" you will need to define what YOU are talking about. Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm. What's he going to do? Turn up the power and fry everything within a 100 mile radius? Where do we draw the line? Should Chinese nationals be prohibited from buying a single wind generator? What about solar panels? How many can they own?
>
> I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label. You guys are dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
>
> TB

Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh
>>> wrote:
>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7,
>>>>> bfh wrote:
>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
>>>>>>> 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)
>>>>>>>>> â€â€
>>>>>>>>> A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
>>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new law that
>>>>>>>>> bans Chinese nationals from purchasing property in
>>>>>>>>> large swaths of the state.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
>>>>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
>>>>>>>>> “critical
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
infrastructure†and
also affects
>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
>>>>>>>>> and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those
>>>>>>>>> selling property to them face the harshest
>>>>>>>>> penalties. The prohibition also applies to
>>>>>>>>> agricultural land.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law
>>>>>>>>> will have a substantial chilling effect on sales to
>>>>>>>>> Chinese and Asian people who can legally buy
>>>>>>>>> property. The suit says the law unfairly equates
>>>>>>>>> Chinese people with the actions of their government
>>>>>>>>> and there is no evidence of national security risk
>>>>>>>>> from Chinese citizens buying Florida property.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The law
>>>>>>>>> “will
>>>>>>>>> codify and expand housing discrimination against
>>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of the
>>>>>>>>> Constitution and the Fair Housing
>>>>>>>>> Act,â€
>>>>>>>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
>>>>>>>>> suit.
>>>>>>>>> “It
>>>>>>>>> will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
>>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose name sounds
>>>>>>>>> remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban,
>>>>>>>>> Venezuelan, or
>>>>>>>>> Syrian.â€
>>>>>>>>> "
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership
>>>>>>>>> of agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting
>>>>>>>>> foreign ownership or investments in private
>>>>>>>>> agricultural land. So far this year, restrictive
>>>>>>>>> laws also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho,
>>>>>>>>> Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become
>>>>>>>>> “a
>>>>>>>>> political
>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,â€
>>>>>>>>> said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
>>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University of
>>>>>>>>> Arkansas.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws
>>>>>>>>> targeting land ownership by foreign entities stems
>>>>>>>>> from some highly publicized cases of
>>>>>>>>> Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near
>>>>>>>>> military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
>>>>>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng
>>>>>>>>> Group’s
>>>>>>>>> planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
>>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
>>>>>>>>> “significant
>>>>>>>>> threat to national
>>>>>>>>> security.â€
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in
>>>>>>>>> Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
>>>>>>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
>>>>>>>>> hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>
What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the
>>>>>>> article I posted doesn't say anything about Chinese
>>>>>>> nationals buying critical USA infrastructures.
>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese
>>>>>> army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm
>>>>>> near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in
>>>>>> 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with individuals
>>>>>> tied to hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably
>>>>>> don't even know what critical infrastructure is:
>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>
There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered
>>>>>> so vital to the United States that their incapacitation
>>>>>> or destruction would have a debilitating effect on
>>>>>> security, national economic security, national public
>>>>>> health or safety, or any combination thereof.
>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>
and what
>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory
>>>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They
>>>>> might have bought land near that. Can you tell me what
>>>>> critical infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will
>>>>> also need your opinion about this.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested
>>>>> in opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope
>>>>> of getting a straight answer about my opinions, you will
>>>>> need to start by stating your opinion.
>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not
>>>> contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese
>>>> national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind farm
>>>> is Not critical infrastructure? What?
>>>>
>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably
>>>> reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely
>>>> possible metric of hope that I may have on the table of
>>>> literally getting a straight answer from you at any point in
>>>> the passage of time? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it
>>>> don't work.
>>>
>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered
>>> "critical infrastructure."
>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and wind
>> power is part of the energy structure.
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>> The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
>> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S. electricity
>> segment contains more than 6,413 power plants (this includes
>> 3,273 traditional electric utilities and 1,738 nonutility power
>> producers) with approximately 1,075 gigawatts of installed
>> generation. Approximately 48 percent of electricity is produced
>> by combusting coal (primarily transported by rail), 20 percent in
>> nuclear power plants, and 22 percent by combusting natural gas.
>> The remaining generation is provided by hydroelectric plants (6
>> percent), oil (1 percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind,
>> and geothermal) (3 percent).
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
>> critical infrastructure?
>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it is
>>> NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about buying
>>> property near "critical infrastructure." I don't think anyone
>>> is worried about Chinese nationals buying our military bases
>>> out from under us.
>>>
>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read
>>> the written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational
>>> discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state
>>> your opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking
>>> about. In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously
>>> huge 'if', if we are talking about the same subject, I have a
>>> black and white answer and I think it's a good one.
>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He
>> couldn't follow through. Can you?
>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this
>> bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another case of you
>> amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to confirm yourself as
>> the king - or queen, or whatever - of RORT controversialism? --
>> bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>
> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law I posted
> about is about property near critical infrastructure.
>
> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying farmland
> or any property within 10 miles of a military installation or
> “critical infrastructure,” such as a seaport or airport."
>
> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the actual
> ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that law, but so far I
> haven't seen it, and you are the only one talking about it.
>
> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing. If you
> want an opinion you have to start with one. I have a clear opinion
> about YOUR subject. Your subject is so ridiculous i don't think I
> need one, but oh well. If you want to play you need to put
> something in the pot.
>
> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own definition of
> "critical infrastructure" you will need to define what YOU are
> talking about.

On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 6:47:09 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh
> >>> wrote:
> >>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7,
> >>>>> bfh wrote:
> >>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
> >>>>>>> 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)
> >>>>>>>>> â€â€
> >>>>>>>>> A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
> >>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new law that
> >>>>>>>>> bans Chinese nationals from purchasing property in
> >>>>>>>>> large swaths of the state.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
> >>>>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
> >>>>>>>>> “critical
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> infrastructure†and
> also affects
> >>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
> >>>>>>>>> and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those
> >>>>>>>>> selling property to them face the harshest
> >>>>>>>>> penalties. The prohibition also applies to
> >>>>>>>>> agricultural land.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law
> >>>>>>>>> will have a substantial chilling effect on sales to
> >>>>>>>>> Chinese and Asian people who can legally buy
> >>>>>>>>> property. The suit says the law unfairly equates
> >>>>>>>>> Chinese people with the actions of their government
> >>>>>>>>> and there is no evidence of national security risk
> >>>>>>>>> from Chinese citizens buying Florida property.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> The law
> >>>>>>>>> “will
> >>>>>>>>> codify and expand housing discrimination against
> >>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of the
> >>>>>>>>> Constitution and the Fair Housing
> >>>>>>>>> Act,â€
> >>>>>>>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
> >>>>>>>>> suit.
> >>>>>>>>> “It
> >>>>>>>>> will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
> >>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose name sounds
> >>>>>>>>> remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban,
> >>>>>>>>> Venezuelan, or
> >>>>>>>>> Syrian.â€
> >>>>>>>>> "
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership
> >>>>>>>>> of agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting
> >>>>>>>>> foreign ownership or investments in private
> >>>>>>>>> agricultural land. So far this year, restrictive
> >>>>>>>>> laws also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho,
> >>>>>>>>> Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become
> >>>>>>>>> “a
> >>>>>>>>> political
> >>>>>>>>> flashpoint,â€
> >>>>>>>>> said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
> >>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University of
> >>>>>>>>> Arkansas.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws
> >>>>>>>>> targeting land ownership by foreign entities stems
> >>>>>>>>> from some highly publicized cases of
> >>>>>>>>> Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near
> >>>>>>>>> military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
> >>>>>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng
> >>>>>>>>> Group’s
> >>>>>>>>> planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
> >>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
> >>>>>>>>> “significant
> >>>>>>>>> threat to national
> >>>>>>>>> security.â€
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
> >>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in
> >>>>>>>>> Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
> >>>>>>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
> >>>>>>>>> hostile governments, including China."
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>
> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >>>>>>>> infrastructure?
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the
> >>>>>>> article I posted doesn't say anything about Chinese
> >>>>>>> nationals buying critical USA infrastructures.
> >>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
> >>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese
> >>>>>> army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm
> >>>>>> near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in
> >>>>>> 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with individuals
> >>>>>> tied to hostile governments, including China."
> >>>>>> ---------------------------------------
> >>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
> >>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably
> >>>>>> don't even know what critical infrastructure is:
> >>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>
> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
> >>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered
> >>>>>> so vital to the United States that their incapacitation
> >>>>>> or destruction would have a debilitating effect on
> >>>>>> security, national economic security, national public
> >>>>>> health or safety, or any combination thereof.
> >>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>
> and what
> >>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
> >>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory
> >>>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They
> >>>>> might have bought land near that. Can you tell me what
> >>>>> critical infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will
> >>>>> also need your opinion about this.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested
> >>>>> in opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope
> >>>>> of getting a straight answer about my opinions, you will
> >>>>> need to start by stating your opinion.
> >>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not
> >>>> contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese
> >>>> national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind farm
> >>>> is Not critical infrastructure? What?
> >>>>
> >>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably
> >>>> reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely
> >>>> possible metric of hope that I may have on the table of
> >>>> literally getting a straight answer from you at any point in
> >>>> the passage of time? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it
> >>>> don't work.
> >>>
> >>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered
> >>> "critical infrastructure."
> >> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and wind
> >> power is part of the energy structure.
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> >> The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
> >> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S. electricity
> >> segment contains more than 6,413 power plants (this includes
> >> 3,273 traditional electric utilities and 1,738 nonutility power
> >> producers) with approximately 1,075 gigawatts of installed
> >> generation. Approximately 48 percent of electricity is produced
> >> by combusting coal (primarily transported by rail), 20 percent in
> >> nuclear power plants, and 22 percent by combusting natural gas.
> >> The remaining generation is provided by hydroelectric plants (6
> >> percent), oil (1 percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind,
> >> and geothermal) (3 percent).
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
> >> critical infrastructure?
> >>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it is
> >>> NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about buying
> >>> property near "critical infrastructure." I don't think anyone
> >>> is worried about Chinese nationals buying our military bases
> >>> out from under us.
> >>>
> >>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read
> >>> the written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational
> >>> discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state
> >>> your opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking
> >>> about. In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously
> >>> huge 'if', if we are talking about the same subject, I have a
> >>> black and white answer and I think it's a good one.
> >> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He
> >> couldn't follow through. Can you?
> >>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
> >> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this
> >> bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another case of you
> >> amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to confirm yourself as
> >> the king - or queen, or whatever - of RORT controversialism? --
> >> bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >
> > I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law I posted
> > about is about property near critical infrastructure.
> >
> > "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying farmland
> > or any property within 10 miles of a military installation or
> > “critical infrastructure,†such as a seaport or airport."
> >
> > Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the actual
> > ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that law, but so far I
> > haven't seen it, and you are the only one talking about it.
> >
> > So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing. If you
> > want an opinion you have to start with one. I have a clear opinion
> > about YOUR subject. Your subject is so ridiculous i don't think I
> > need one, but oh well. If you want to play you need to put
> > something in the pot.
> >
> > Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own definition of
> > "critical infrastructure" you will need to define what YOU are
> > talking about.
> You just think - erroneously - that I've gone freelance. It's not 'my'
> definition.
> https://www.cisa.gov/topics/critical-infrastructure-security-and-resilience/critical-infrastructure-sectors
> > Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think
> > I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm. What's he going
> > to do? Turn up the power and fry everything within a 100 mile
> > radius? Where do we draw the line? Should Chinese nationals be
> > prohibited from buying a single wind generator? What about solar
> > panels? How many can they own?
> From my POV, they can't own any of those things if they're part of
> our "critical infrastructure".
> > I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label. You guys are
> > dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
> Do you really think that any foreign national of a country that's
> hostile to our interests should be able to own any part of of our
> "critical infrastructure"?
> --
> bill
> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

On 5/23/2023 9:31 PM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 6:47:09 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 11:46:19 PM UTC-7,
>>>>>>> bfh wrote:
>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
>>>>>>>>> 7:43:52 PM UTC-7, bfh
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP)
>>>>>>>>>>> â€â€
>>>>>>>>>>> A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
>>>>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new law that
>>>>>>>>>>> bans Chinese nationals from purchasing property in
>>>>>>>>>>> large swaths of the state.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles (16
>>>>>>>>>>> kilometers) of military installations and other
>>>>>>>>>>> “critical
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>> infrastructure†and
>> also affects
>>>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
>>>>>>>>>>> and North Korea. But Chinese citizens and those
>>>>>>>>>>> selling property to them face the harshest
>>>>>>>>>>> penalties. The prohibition also applies to
>>>>>>>>>>> agricultural land.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the law
>>>>>>>>>>> will have a substantial chilling effect on sales to
>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese and Asian people who can legally buy
>>>>>>>>>>> property. The suit says the law unfairly equates
>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese people with the actions of their government
>>>>>>>>>>> and there is no evidence of national security risk
>>>>>>>>>>> from Chinese citizens buying Florida property.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The law
>>>>>>>>>>> “will
>>>>>>>>>>> codify and expand housing discrimination against
>>>>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of the
>>>>>>>>>>> Constitution and the Fair Housing
>>>>>>>>>>> Act,â€
>>>>>>>>>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
>>>>>>>>>>> suit.
>>>>>>>>>>> “It
>>>>>>>>>>> will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
>>>>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose name sounds
>>>>>>>>>>> remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian, Cuban,
>>>>>>>>>>> Venezuelan, or
>>>>>>>>>>> Syrian.â€
>>>>>>>>>>> "
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign ownership
>>>>>>>>>>> of agricultural land has risen by 50% this year.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws restricting
>>>>>>>>>>> foreign ownership or investments in private
>>>>>>>>>>> agricultural land. So far this year, restrictive
>>>>>>>>>>> laws also have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho,
>>>>>>>>>>> Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become
>>>>>>>>>>> “a
>>>>>>>>>>> political
>>>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,â€
>>>>>>>>>>> said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
>>>>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University of
>>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws
>>>>>>>>>>> targeting land ownership by foreign entities stems
>>>>>>>>>>> from some highly publicized cases of
>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese-connected companies purchasing land near
>>>>>>>>>>> military bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
>>>>>>>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng
>>>>>>>>>>> Group’s
>>>>>>>>>>> planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
>>>>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
>>>>>>>>>>> “significant
>>>>>>>>>>> threat to national
>>>>>>>>>>> security.â€
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
>>>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in
>>>>>>>>>>> Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
>>>>>>>>>>> hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the
>>>>>>>>> article I posted doesn't say anything about Chinese
>>>>>>>>> nationals buying critical USA infrastructures.
>>>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a Chinese
>>>>>>>> army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a wind farm
>>>>>>>> near an Air Force base in Texas, that state responded in
>>>>>>>> 2021 by banning infrastructure deals with individuals
>>>>>>>> tied to hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you probably
>>>>>>>> don't even know what critical infrastructure is:
>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are considered
>>>>>>>> so vital to the United States that their incapacitation
>>>>>>>> or destruction would have a debilitating effect on
>>>>>>>> security, national economic security, national public
>>>>>>>> health or safety, or any combination thereof.
>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>> and what
>>>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory
>>>>>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that. They
>>>>>>> might have bought land near that. Can you tell me what
>>>>>>> critical infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT. I will
>>>>>>> also need your opinion about this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly interested
>>>>>>> in opinions. Going forward, if you want to have any hope
>>>>>>> of getting a straight answer about my opinions, you will
>>>>>>> need to start by stating your opinion.
>>>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not
>>>>>> contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese
>>>>>> national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind farm
>>>>>> is Not critical infrastructure? What?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should probably
>>>>>> reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any uniquely
>>>>>> possible metric of hope that I may have on the table of
>>>>>> literally getting a straight answer from you at any point in
>>>>>> the passage of time? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it
>>>>>> don't work.
>>>>>
>>>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered
>>>>> "critical infrastructure."
>>>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and wind
>>>> power is part of the energy structure.
>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
>>>> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S. electricity
>>>> segment contains more than 6,413 power plants (this includes
>>>> 3,273 traditional electric utilities and 1,738 nonutility power
>>>> producers) with approximately 1,075 gigawatts of installed
>>>> generation. Approximately 48 percent of electricity is produced
>>>> by combusting coal (primarily transported by rail), 20 percent in
>>>> nuclear power plants, and 22 percent by combusting natural gas.
>>>> The remaining generation is provided by hydroelectric plants (6
>>>> percent), oil (1 percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind,
>>>> and geothermal) (3 percent).
>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>
>> How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
>>>> critical infrastructure?
>>>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it is
>>>>> NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about buying
>>>>> property near "critical infrastructure." I don't think anyone
>>>>> is worried about Chinese nationals buying our military bases
>>>>> out from under us.
>>>>>
>>>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually read
>>>>> the written words we might have the basis of a, lol, rational
>>>>> discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing around and state
>>>>> your opinion about whatever it is you think you are talking
>>>>> about. In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is obviously
>>>>> huge 'if', if we are talking about the same subject, I have a
>>>>> black and white answer and I think it's a good one.
>>>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He
>>>> couldn't follow through. Can you?
>>>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
>>>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this
>>>> bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another case of you
>>>> amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to confirm yourself as
>>>> the king - or queen, or whatever - of RORT controversialism? --
>>>> bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>
>>> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law I posted
>>> about is about property near critical infrastructure.
>>>
>>> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying farmland
>>> or any property within 10 miles of a military installation or
>>> “critical infrastructure,†such as a seaport or airport."
>>>
>>> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the actual
>>> ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that law, but so far I
>>> haven't seen it, and you are the only one talking about it.
>>>
>>> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing. If you
>>> want an opinion you have to start with one. I have a clear opinion
>>> about YOUR subject. Your subject is so ridiculous i don't think I
>>> need one, but oh well. If you want to play you need to put
>>> something in the pot.
>>>
>>> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own definition of
>>> "critical infrastructure" you will need to define what YOU are
>>> talking about.
>> You just think - erroneously - that I've gone freelance. It's not 'my'
>> definition.
>> https://www.cisa.gov/topics/critical-infrastructure-security-and-resilience/critical-infrastructure-sectors
>>> Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think
>>> I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm. What's he going
>>> to do? Turn up the power and fry everything within a 100 mile
>>> radius? Where do we draw the line? Should Chinese nationals be
>>> prohibited from buying a single wind generator? What about solar
>>> panels? How many can they own?
>> From my POV, they can't own any of those things if they're part of
>> our "critical infrastructure".
>>> I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label. You guys are
>>> dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
>> Do you really think that any foreign national of a country that's
>> hostile to our interests should be able to own any part of of our
>> "critical infrastructure"?
>> --
>> bill
>> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>
> So, we're at war with China, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia, and North Korea? Anyone who was born in those countries is automatically our enemy?

Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 6:47:09 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM
>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
>>>>>>> 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
>>>>>>>>> 7:43:52 PM
>>>>>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬â€
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
>>>>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new law
>>>>>>>>>>> that bans Chinese nationals from purchasing
>>>>>>>>>>> property in large swaths of the state.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles
>>>>>>>>>>> (16 kilometers) of military installations and
>>>>>>>>>>> other ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“critical
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
infrastructureÃÃâ€
’¢â‚¬
and
>> also affects
>>>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran,
>>>>>>>>>>> Russia, and North Korea. But Chinese citizens
>>>>>>>>>>> and those selling property to them face the
>>>>>>>>>>> harshest penalties. The prohibition also
>>>>>>>>>>> applies to agricultural land.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the
>>>>>>>>>>> law will have a substantial chilling effect on
>>>>>>>>>>> sales to Chinese and Asian people who can
>>>>>>>>>>> legally buy property. The suit says the law
>>>>>>>>>>> unfairly equates Chinese people with the
>>>>>>>>>>> actions of their government and there is no
>>>>>>>>>>> evidence of national security risk from Chinese
>>>>>>>>>>> citizens buying Florida property.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> The law ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“will
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
codify and expand housing discrimination against
>>>>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of the
>>>>>>>>>>> Constitution and the Fair Housing
>>>>>>>>>>> Act,ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
>>>>>>>>>>> suit. ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“It
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
>>>>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose name
>>>>>>>>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian,
>>>>>>>>>>> Cuban, Venezuelan, or Syrian.ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
"
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign
>>>>>>>>>>> ownership of agricultural land has risen by 50%
>>>>>>>>>>> this year.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws
>>>>>>>>>>> restricting foreign ownership or investments in
>>>>>>>>>>> private agricultural land. So far this year,
>>>>>>>>>>> restrictive laws also have been enacted in
>>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and
>>>>>>>>>>> Virginia.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“a
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
political
>>>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
>>>>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University of
>>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws
>>>>>>>>>>> targeting land ownership by foreign entities
>>>>>>>>>>> stems from some highly publicized cases of
>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese-connected companies purchasing land
>>>>>>>>>>> near military bases. Earlier this year, the
>>>>>>>>>>> U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
>>>>>>>>>>> GroupÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬â„¢s
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
>>>>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
>>>>>>>>>>> ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“significant
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
threat to national
>>>>>>>>>>> security.ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
>>>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in
>>>>>>>>>>> Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
>>>>>>>>>>> hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
>>>>>>>>>> work.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the
>>>>>>>>> article I posted doesn't say anything about
>>>>>>>>> Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>>> infrastructures.
>>>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a
>>>>>>>> Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a
>>>>>>>> wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
>>>>>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals
>>>>>>>> with individuals tied to hostile governments,
>>>>>>>> including China."
>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you
>>>>>>>> probably don't even know what critical infrastructure
>>>>>>>> is:
>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>>>
There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are
>>>>>>>> considered so vital to the United States that their
>>>>>>>> incapacitation or destruction would have a
>>>>>>>> debilitating effect on security, national economic
>>>>>>>> security, national public health or safety, or any
>>>>>>>> combination thereof.
>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>>>
and what
>>>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory
>>>>>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that.
>>>>>>> They might have bought land near that. Can you tell me
>>>>>>> what critical infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT.
>>>>>>> I will also need your opinion about this.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly
>>>>>>> interested in opinions. Going forward, if you want to
>>>>>>> have any hope of getting a straight answer about my
>>>>>>> opinions, you will need to start by stating your
>>>>>>> opinion.
>>>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not
>>>>>> contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese
>>>>>> national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind
>>>>>> farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should
>>>>>> probably reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any
>>>>>> uniquely possible metric of hope that I may have on the
>>>>>> table of literally getting a straight answer from you at
>>>>>> any point in the passage of time? -- bill Theory don't
>>>>>> mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>
>>>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered
>>>>> "critical infrastructure."
>>>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and
>>>> wind power is part of the energy structure.
>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>
The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
>>>> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S.
>>>> electricity segment contains more than 6,413 power plants
>>>> (this includes 3,273 traditional electric utilities and 1,738
>>>> nonutility power producers) with approximately 1,075
>>>> gigawatts of installed generation. Approximately 48 percent
>>>> of electricity is produced by combusting coal (primarily
>>>> transported by rail), 20 percent in nuclear power plants, and
>>>> 22 percent by combusting natural gas. The remaining
>>>> generation is provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent),
>>>> oil (1 percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind, and
>>>> geothermal) (3 percent).
>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>>>
How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
>>>> critical infrastructure?
>>>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it
>>>>> is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about
>>>>> buying property near "critical infrastructure." I don't
>>>>> think anyone is worried about Chinese nationals buying our
>>>>> military bases out from under us.
>>>>>
>>>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually
>>>>> read the written words we might have the basis of a, lol,
>>>>> rational discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing
>>>>> around and state your opinion about whatever it is you
>>>>> think you are talking about. In this instance, I promise,
>>>>> IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if we are talking
>>>>> about the same subject, I have a black and white answer and
>>>>> I think it's a good one.
>>>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He
>>>> couldn't follow through. Can you?
>>>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
>>>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this
>>>> bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another case of you
>>>> amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to confirm yourself
>>>> as the king - or queen, or whatever - of RORT
>>>> controversialism? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
>>>> work.
>>>
>>> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law I
>>> posted about is about property near critical infrastructure.
>>>
>>> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying
>>> farmland or any property within 10 miles of a military
>>> installation or “critical infrastructure,†such as a
>>> seaport or airport."
>>>
>>> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the actual
>>> ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that law, but so far
>>> I haven't seen it, and you are the only one talking about it.
>>>
>>> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing. If
>>> you want an opinion you have to start with one. I have a clear
>>> opinion about YOUR subject. Your subject is so ridiculous i
>>> don't think I need one, but oh well. If you want to play you
>>> need to put something in the pot.
>>>
>>> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own definition
>>> of "critical infrastructure" you will need to define what YOU
>>> are talking about.
>> You just think - erroneously - that I've gone freelance. It's not
>> 'my' definition.
>> https://www.cisa.gov/topics/critical-infrastructure-security-and-resilience/critical-infrastructure-sectors
>>>
>>
Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think
>>> I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm. What's he
>>> going to do? Turn up the power and fry everything within a 100
>>> mile radius? Where do we draw the line? Should Chinese
>>> nationals be prohibited from buying a single wind generator?
>>> What about solar panels? How many can they own?
>> From my POV, they can't own any of those things if they're part
>> of our "critical infrastructure".
>>> I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label. You guys
>>> are dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
>> Do you really think that any foreign national of a country
>> that's hostile to our interests should be able to own any part of
>> of our "critical infrastructure"? -- bill Theory don't mean squat
>> if it don't work.
>
> So, we're at war with China, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
> and North Korea?

On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 8:29:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 6:47:09 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM
> >>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
> >>>>>>> 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
> >>>>>>>>> 7:43:52 PM
> >>>>>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬â€
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
> >>>>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new law
> >>>>>>>>>>> that bans Chinese nationals from purchasing
> >>>>>>>>>>> property in large swaths of the state.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles
> >>>>>>>>>>> (16 kilometers) of military installations and
> >>>>>>>>>>> other ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“critical
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> infrastructureÃÃâ€
> ’¢â‚¬
> and
> >> also affects
> >>>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran,
> >>>>>>>>>>> Russia, and North Korea. But Chinese citizens
> >>>>>>>>>>> and those selling property to them face the
> >>>>>>>>>>> harshest penalties. The prohibition also
> >>>>>>>>>>> applies to agricultural land.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the
> >>>>>>>>>>> law will have a substantial chilling effect on
> >>>>>>>>>>> sales to Chinese and Asian people who can
> >>>>>>>>>>> legally buy property. The suit says the law
> >>>>>>>>>>> unfairly equates Chinese people with the
> >>>>>>>>>>> actions of their government and there is no
> >>>>>>>>>>> evidence of national security risk from Chinese
> >>>>>>>>>>> citizens buying Florida property.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> The law ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“will
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> codify and expand housing discrimination against
> >>>>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of the
> >>>>>>>>>>> Constitution and the Fair Housing
> >>>>>>>>>>> Act,ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
> >>>>>>>>>>> suit. ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“It
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
> >>>>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose name
> >>>>>>>>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian,
> >>>>>>>>>>> Cuban, Venezuelan, or Syrian.ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> "
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign
> >>>>>>>>>>> ownership of agricultural land has risen by 50%
> >>>>>>>>>>> this year.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws
> >>>>>>>>>>> restricting foreign ownership or investments in
> >>>>>>>>>>> private agricultural land. So far this year,
> >>>>>>>>>>> restrictive laws also have been enacted in
> >>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and
> >>>>>>>>>>> Virginia.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“a
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> political
> >>>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
> >>>>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University of
> >>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws
> >>>>>>>>>>> targeting land ownership by foreign entities
> >>>>>>>>>>> stems from some highly publicized cases of
> >>>>>>>>>>> Chinese-connected companies purchasing land
> >>>>>>>>>>> near military bases. Earlier this year, the
> >>>>>>>>>>> U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
> >>>>>>>>>>> GroupÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬â„¢s
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
> >>>>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
> >>>>>>>>>>> ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“significant
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> threat to national
> >>>>>>>>>>> security.ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
> >>>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in
> >>>>>>>>>>> Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
> >>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
> >>>>>>>>>>> hostile governments, including China."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >>>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
> >>>>>>>>>> work.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the
> >>>>>>>>> article I posted doesn't say anything about
> >>>>>>>>> Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >>>>>>>>> infrastructures.
> >>>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
> >>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a
> >>>>>>>> Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a
> >>>>>>>> wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
> >>>>>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals
> >>>>>>>> with individuals tied to hostile governments,
> >>>>>>>> including China."
> >>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
> >>>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you
> >>>>>>>> probably don't even know what critical infrastructure
> >>>>>>>> is:
> >>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>
> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
> >>>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are
> >>>>>>>> considered so vital to the United States that their
> >>>>>>>> incapacitation or destruction would have a
> >>>>>>>> debilitating effect on security, national economic
> >>>>>>>> security, national public health or safety, or any
> >>>>>>>> combination thereof.
> >>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>
> and what
> >>>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
> >>>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory
> >>>>>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that.
> >>>>>>> They might have bought land near that. Can you tell me
> >>>>>>> what critical infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT.
> >>>>>>> I will also need your opinion about this.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly
> >>>>>>> interested in opinions. Going forward, if you want to
> >>>>>>> have any hope of getting a straight answer about my
> >>>>>>> opinions, you will need to start by stating your
> >>>>>>> opinion.
> >>>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not
> >>>>>> contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese
> >>>>>> national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind
> >>>>>> farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should
> >>>>>> probably reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any
> >>>>>> uniquely possible metric of hope that I may have on the
> >>>>>> table of literally getting a straight answer from you at
> >>>>>> any point in the passage of time? -- bill Theory don't
> >>>>>> mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered
> >>>>> "critical infrastructure."
> >>>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and
> >>>> wind power is part of the energy structure.
> >>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>
> >>>>
> The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
> >>>> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S.
> >>>> electricity segment contains more than 6,413 power plants
> >>>> (this includes 3,273 traditional electric utilities and 1,738
> >>>> nonutility power producers) with approximately 1,075
> >>>> gigawatts of installed generation. Approximately 48 percent
> >>>> of electricity is produced by combusting coal (primarily
> >>>> transported by rail), 20 percent in nuclear power plants, and
> >>>> 22 percent by combusting natural gas. The remaining
> >>>> generation is provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent),
> >>>> oil (1 percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind, and
> >>>> geothermal) (3 percent).
> >>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> >>>>
> How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
> >>>> critical infrastructure?
> >>>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it
> >>>>> is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about
> >>>>> buying property near "critical infrastructure." I don't
> >>>>> think anyone is worried about Chinese nationals buying our
> >>>>> military bases out from under us.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually
> >>>>> read the written words we might have the basis of a, lol,
> >>>>> rational discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing
> >>>>> around and state your opinion about whatever it is you
> >>>>> think you are talking about. In this instance, I promise,
> >>>>> IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if we are talking
> >>>>> about the same subject, I have a black and white answer and
> >>>>> I think it's a good one.
> >>>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He
> >>>> couldn't follow through. Can you?
> >>>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
> >>>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this
> >>>> bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another case of you
> >>>> amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to confirm yourself
> >>>> as the king - or queen, or whatever - of RORT
> >>>> controversialism? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
> >>>> work.
> >>>
> >>> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law I
> >>> posted about is about property near critical infrastructure.
> >>>
> >>> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying
> >>> farmland or any property within 10 miles of a military
> >>> installation or “critical infrastructure,†such as a
> >>> seaport or airport."
> >>>
> >>> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the actual
> >>> ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that law, but so far
> >>> I haven't seen it, and you are the only one talking about it.
> >>>
> >>> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing. If
> >>> you want an opinion you have to start with one. I have a clear
> >>> opinion about YOUR subject. Your subject is so ridiculous i
> >>> don't think I need one, but oh well. If you want to play you
> >>> need to put something in the pot.
> >>>
> >>> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own definition
> >>> of "critical infrastructure" you will need to define what YOU
> >>> are talking about.
> >> You just think - erroneously - that I've gone freelance. It's not
> >> 'my' definition.
> >> https://www.cisa.gov/topics/critical-infrastructure-security-and-resilience/critical-infrastructure-sectors
> >>>
> >>
> Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think
> >>> I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm. What's he
> >>> going to do? Turn up the power and fry everything within a 100
> >>> mile radius? Where do we draw the line? Should Chinese
> >>> nationals be prohibited from buying a single wind generator?
> >>> What about solar panels? How many can they own?
> >> From my POV, they can't own any of those things if they're part
> >> of our "critical infrastructure".
> >>> I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label. You guys
> >>> are dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
> >> Do you really think that any foreign national of a country
> >> that's hostile to our interests should be able to own any part of
> >> of our "critical infrastructure"? -- bill Theory don't mean squat
> >> if it don't work.
> >
> > So, we're at war with China, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
> > and North Korea?
> You just can't help it, can you? I didn't say anything about war.
> > Anyone who was born in those countries is
> > automatically our enemy? It's important that those people can't own
> > agricultural land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? That is listed
> > as critical infrastructure and this bill is very concerned with
> > agricultural land. Hey this is important stuff. What happens if the
> > Cubans jam up the toilets in Florida?
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErBK4KEMiko&t=29s
> > I probably should mention that Portland is a port city. Around here
> > China is an important trading partner.
> Try to hang onto control of those ports.
> ------------------------------------------------------
> In a recent opinion piece published by the Daily Mail, former British
> Defense and International Trade Secretary Dr Liam Fox and former U.S.
> National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane noted that China now owns
> 96 ports around the world. Some of these are at key locations for
> maritime trade, "giving Beijing strategic dominance without having to
> deploy a single soldier, ship or weapon."
> ...
> Holmes, a former U.S. Navy officer, noted prosperity is the top
> priority for any government. And Beijing’s port investments mean it
> can hold a large portion of a country's prosperity hostage, compelling
> its leadership to take political stances agreeable to the Chinese
> Communist Party. "So, seaports are a critical enabler for China's bid
> for commercial, diplomatic, and military influence."
> -----------------------------------------------------
> https://www.voanews.com/a/6224958.html#:~:text=China%E2%80%99s%20global%20port%20expansion%20means%20Beijing%20now%20has,China%20now%20owns%2096%20ports%20around%20the%20world.
>
> Much the same can be said about energy and agricultural
> infrastructure. And we are in a "war" with China - although it's not a
> shooting war. Yet.
>
> One more thing - the Chinese are capable of playing a much longer game
> than we seem to be.
> --
> bill
> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

Click here to read the complete article

On Wednesday, May 24, 2023 at 6:37:38 AM UTC-7, Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 8:29:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> > Technobarbarian wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 6:47:09 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> > >> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > >>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> > >>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > >>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM
> > >>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> > >>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > >>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
> > >>>>>>> 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh
> > >>>>>>> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
> > >>>>>>>>> 7:43:52 PM
> > >>>>>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬â€
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new law
> > >>>>>>>>>>> that bans Chinese nationals from purchasing
> > >>>>>>>>>>> property in large swaths of the state.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles
> > >>>>>>>>>>> (16 kilometers) of military installations and
> > >>>>>>>>>>> other ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“critical
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > infrastructureÃÃâ€
> > ’¢â‚¬
> > and
> > >> also affects
> > >>>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran,
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Russia, and North Korea. But Chinese citizens
> > >>>>>>>>>>> and those selling property to them face the
> > >>>>>>>>>>> harshest penalties. The prohibition also
> > >>>>>>>>>>> applies to agricultural land.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the
> > >>>>>>>>>>> law will have a substantial chilling effect on
> > >>>>>>>>>>> sales to Chinese and Asian people who can
> > >>>>>>>>>>> legally buy property. The suit says the law
> > >>>>>>>>>>> unfairly equates Chinese people with the
> > >>>>>>>>>>> actions of their government and there is no
> > >>>>>>>>>>> evidence of national security risk from Chinese
> > >>>>>>>>>>> citizens buying Florida property.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> The law ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“will
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > codify and expand housing discrimination against
> > >>>>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of the
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Constitution and the Fair Housing
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Act,ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
> > >>>>>>>>>>> suit. ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“It
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
> > >>>>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose name
> > >>>>>>>>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian,
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Cuban, Venezuelan, or Syrian.ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > "
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ownership of agricultural land has risen by 50%
> > >>>>>>>>>>> this year.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws
> > >>>>>>>>>>> restricting foreign ownership or investments in
> > >>>>>>>>>>> private agricultural land. So far this year,
> > >>>>>>>>>>> restrictive laws also have been enacted in
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Virginia.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“a
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > political
> > >>>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University of
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws
> > >>>>>>>>>>> targeting land ownership by foreign entities
> > >>>>>>>>>>> stems from some highly publicized cases of
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Chinese-connected companies purchasing land
> > >>>>>>>>>>> near military bases. Earlier this year, the
> > >>>>>>>>>>> U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
> > >>>>>>>>>>> GroupÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬â„¢s
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
> > >>>>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“significant
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > threat to national
> > >>>>>>>>>>> security.ÃÃâ€
> > >>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
> > >>>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
> > >>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
> > >>>>>>>>>>> hostile governments, including China."
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> > >>>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
> > >>>>>>>>>> work.
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the
> > >>>>>>>>> article I posted doesn't say anything about
> > >>>>>>>>> Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> > >>>>>>>>> infrastructures.
> > >>>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
> > >>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a
> > >>>>>>>> Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a
> > >>>>>>>> wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
> > >>>>>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals
> > >>>>>>>> with individuals tied to hostile governments,
> > >>>>>>>> including China."
> > >>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
> > >>>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
> > >>>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you
> > >>>>>>>> probably don't even know what critical infrastructure
> > >>>>>>>> is:
> > >>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
> > >>>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are
> > >>>>>>>> considered so vital to the United States that their
> > >>>>>>>> incapacitation or destruction would have a
> > >>>>>>>> debilitating effect on security, national economic
> > >>>>>>>> security, national public health or safety, or any
> > >>>>>>>> combination thereof.
> > >>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > and what
> > >>>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
> > >>>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory
> > >>>>>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that.
> > >>>>>>> They might have bought land near that. Can you tell me
> > >>>>>>> what critical infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT.
> > >>>>>>> I will also need your opinion about this.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly
> > >>>>>>> interested in opinions. Going forward, if you want to
> > >>>>>>> have any hope of getting a straight answer about my
> > >>>>>>> opinions, you will need to start by stating your
> > >>>>>>> opinion.
> > >>>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not
> > >>>>>> contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese
> > >>>>>> national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind
> > >>>>>> farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should
> > >>>>>> probably reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any
> > >>>>>> uniquely possible metric of hope that I may have on the
> > >>>>>> table of literally getting a straight answer from you at
> > >>>>>> any point in the passage of time? -- bill Theory don't
> > >>>>>> mean squat if it don't work.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered
> > >>>>> "critical infrastructure."
> > >>>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and
> > >>>> wind power is part of the energy structure.
> > >>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
> > >>>> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S.
> > >>>> electricity segment contains more than 6,413 power plants
> > >>>> (this includes 3,273 traditional electric utilities and 1,738
> > >>>> nonutility power producers) with approximately 1,075
> > >>>> gigawatts of installed generation. Approximately 48 percent
> > >>>> of electricity is produced by combusting coal (primarily
> > >>>> transported by rail), 20 percent in nuclear power plants, and
> > >>>> 22 percent by combusting natural gas. The remaining
> > >>>> generation is provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent),
> > >>>> oil (1 percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind, and
> > >>>> geothermal) (3 percent).
> > >>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>
> > >>>>
> > How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
> > >>>> critical infrastructure?
> > >>>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it
> > >>>>> is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about
> > >>>>> buying property near "critical infrastructure." I don't
> > >>>>> think anyone is worried about Chinese nationals buying our
> > >>>>> military bases out from under us.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually
> > >>>>> read the written words we might have the basis of a, lol,
> > >>>>> rational discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing
> > >>>>> around and state your opinion about whatever it is you
> > >>>>> think you are talking about. In this instance, I promise,
> > >>>>> IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if we are talking
> > >>>>> about the same subject, I have a black and white answer and
> > >>>>> I think it's a good one.
> > >>>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He
> > >>>> couldn't follow through. Can you?
> > >>>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
> > >>>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this
> > >>>> bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another case of you
> > >>>> amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to confirm yourself
> > >>>> as the king - or queen, or whatever - of RORT
> > >>>> controversialism? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
> > >>>> work.
> > >>>
> > >>> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law I
> > >>> posted about is about property near critical infrastructure.
> > >>>
> > >>> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying
> > >>> farmland or any property within 10 miles of a military
> > >>> installation or “critical infrastructure,†such as a
> > >>> seaport or airport."
> > >>>
> > >>> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the actual
> > >>> ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that law, but so far
> > >>> I haven't seen it, and you are the only one talking about it.
> > >>>
> > >>> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing. If
> > >>> you want an opinion you have to start with one. I have a clear
> > >>> opinion about YOUR subject. Your subject is so ridiculous i
> > >>> don't think I need one, but oh well. If you want to play you
> > >>> need to put something in the pot.
> > >>>
> > >>> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own definition
> > >>> of "critical infrastructure" you will need to define what YOU
> > >>> are talking about.
> > >> You just think - erroneously - that I've gone freelance. It's not
> > >> 'my' definition.
> > >> https://www.cisa.gov/topics/critical-infrastructure-security-and-resilience/critical-infrastructure-sectors
> > >>>
> > >>
> > Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think
> > >>> I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm. What's he
> > >>> going to do? Turn up the power and fry everything within a 100
> > >>> mile radius? Where do we draw the line? Should Chinese
> > >>> nationals be prohibited from buying a single wind generator?
> > >>> What about solar panels? How many can they own?
> > >> From my POV, they can't own any of those things if they're part
> > >> of our "critical infrastructure".
> > >>> I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label. You guys
> > >>> are dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
> > >> Do you really think that any foreign national of a country
> > >> that's hostile to our interests should be able to own any part of
> > >> of our "critical infrastructure"? -- bill Theory don't mean squat
> > >> if it don't work.
> > >
> > > So, we're at war with China, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
> > > and North Korea?
> > You just can't help it, can you? I didn't say anything about war.
> > > Anyone who was born in those countries is
> > > automatically our enemy? It's important that those people can't own
> > > agricultural land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? That is listed
> > > as critical infrastructure and this bill is very concerned with
> > > agricultural land. Hey this is important stuff. What happens if the
> > > Cubans jam up the toilets in Florida?
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErBK4KEMiko&t=29s
> > > I probably should mention that Portland is a port city. Around here
> > > China is an important trading partner.
> > Try to hang onto control of those ports.
> > ------------------------------------------------------
> > In a recent opinion piece published by the Daily Mail, former British
> > Defense and International Trade Secretary Dr Liam Fox and former U.S.
> > National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane noted that China now owns
> > 96 ports around the world. Some of these are at key locations for
> > maritime trade, "giving Beijing strategic dominance without having to
> > deploy a single soldier, ship or weapon."
> > ...
> > Holmes, a former U.S. Navy officer, noted prosperity is the top
> > priority for any government. And Beijing’s port investments mean it
> > can hold a large portion of a country's prosperity hostage, compelling
> > its leadership to take political stances agreeable to the Chinese
> > Communist Party. "So, seaports are a critical enabler for China's bid
> > for commercial, diplomatic, and military influence."
> > -----------------------------------------------------
> > https://www.voanews.com/a/6224958.html#:~:text=China%E2%80%99s%20global%20port%20expansion%20means%20Beijing%20now%20has,China%20now%20owns%2096%20ports%20around%20the%20world.
> >
> > Much the same can be said about energy and agricultural
> > infrastructure. And we are in a "war" with China - although it's not a
> > shooting war. Yet.
> >
> > One more thing - the Chinese are capable of playing a much longer game
> > than we seem to be.
> > --
> > bill
> > Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> Was that so difficult? All you needed to say was that you are in favor of this law. So, we have 2 in favor and one, as usual, dancing around.
>
> This law is bigoted bullshit straight out of the traditional fascist playbook. Use ignorance to demonize minority groups and create fear. The sheep need big brother to protect them. The next thing you know communists will be cutting off your balls.
>
> Talk about prejudice, this law judges people by their country of origin.
>
> This law isn't necessary because we have Federal programs to address this problem, without creating insane restrictions. Right wing influencers are leading you airheads around like balloons with strings tied to your nose.
>
> "The Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States (CFIUS)
> CFIUS is an interagency committee authorized to review certain transactions involving foreign investment in the United States and certain real estate transactions by foreign persons, in order to determine the effect of such transactions on the national security of the United States."
>
> https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/international/the-committee-on-foreign-investment-in-the-united-states-cfius
>
> It's seriously important that we prevent people who were born in other places from owning farm land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? LOL, give me a break. This is just more manufactured outrage.
>
> TB

Click here to read the complete article

On 5/25/2023 4:24 PM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Wednesday, May 24, 2023 at 6:37:38 AM UTC-7, Technobarbarian wrote:
>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 8:29:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 6:47:09 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 10:44:31 AM
>>>>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
>>>>>>>>>> 11:46:19 PM UTC-7, bfh
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
>>>>>>>>>>>> 7:43:52 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬â€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new law
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that bans Chinese nationals from purchasing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> property in large swaths of the state.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10 miles
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (16 kilometers) of military installations and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> other ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“critical
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> infrastructureÃÃâ€
>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>> and
>>>>> also affects
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Russia, and North Korea. But Chinese citizens
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and those selling property to them face the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> harshest penalties. The prohibition also
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> applies to agricultural land.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> law will have a substantial chilling effect on
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sales to Chinese and Asian people who can
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> legally buy property. The suit says the law
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> unfairly equates Chinese people with the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> actions of their government and there is no
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> evidence of national security risk from Chinese
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> citizens buying Florida property.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The law ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> codify and expand housing discrimination against
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Constitution and the Fair Housing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Act,ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suit. ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“It
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose name
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sounds remotely Asian, Russian, Iranian,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cuban, Venezuelan, or Syrian.ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> "
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting foreign
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ownership of agricultural land has risen by 50%
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this year.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> restricting foreign ownership or investments in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> private agricultural land. So far this year,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> restrictive laws also have been enacted in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Utah and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Virginia.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> political
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arkansas.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state laws
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> targeting land ownership by foreign entities
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stems from some highly publicized cases of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese-connected companies purchasing land
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> near military bases. Earlier this year, the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> U.S. Air Force said that the Fufeng
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GroupÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬â„¢s
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Å“significant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> threat to national
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> security.ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Texas, that state responded in 2021 by banning
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure deals with individuals tied to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
>>>>>>>>>>>>> work.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and the
>>>>>>>>>>>> article I posted doesn't say anything about
>>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructures.
>>>>>>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own stuff?
>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------- After a
>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon bought a
>>>>>>>>>>> wind farm near an Air Force base in Texas, that state
>>>>>>>>>>> responded in 2021 by banning infrastructure deals
>>>>>>>>>>> with individuals tied to hostile governments,
>>>>>>>>>>> including China."
>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>>>>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you
>>>>>>>>>>> probably don't even know what critical infrastructure
>>>>>>>>>>> is:
>>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>>>>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are
>>>>>>>>>>> considered so vital to the United States that their
>>>>>>>>>>> incapacitation or destruction would have a
>>>>>>>>>>> debilitating effect on security, national economic
>>>>>>>>>>> security, national public health or safety, or any
>>>>>>>>>>> combination thereof.
>>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>> and what
>>>>>>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>>>>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill Theory
>>>>>>>>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of that.
>>>>>>>>>> They might have bought land near that. Can you tell me
>>>>>>>>>> what critical infrastructure Chinese nationals BOUGHT.
>>>>>>>>>> I will also need your opinion about this.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly
>>>>>>>>>> interested in opinions. Going forward, if you want to
>>>>>>>>>> have any hope of getting a straight answer about my
>>>>>>>>>> opinions, you will need to start by stating your
>>>>>>>>>> opinion.
>>>>>>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does Not
>>>>>>>>> contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a Chinese
>>>>>>>>> national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm? That a wind
>>>>>>>>> farm is Not critical infrastructure? What?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should
>>>>>>>>> probably reorient and reevaluate the calculus of any
>>>>>>>>> uniquely possible metric of hope that I may have on the
>>>>>>>>> table of literally getting a straight answer from you at
>>>>>>>>> any point in the passage of time? -- bill Theory don't
>>>>>>>>> mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT considered
>>>>>>>> "critical infrastructure."
>>>>>>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure, and
>>>>>>> wind power is part of the energy structure.
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
>>>>>>> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S.
>>>>>>> electricity segment contains more than 6,413 power plants
>>>>>>> (this includes 3,273 traditional electric utilities and 1,738
>>>>>>> nonutility power producers) with approximately 1,075
>>>>>>> gigawatts of installed generation. Approximately 48 percent
>>>>>>> of electricity is produced by combusting coal (primarily
>>>>>>> transported by rail), 20 percent in nuclear power plants, and
>>>>>>> 22 percent by combusting natural gas. The remaining
>>>>>>> generation is provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent),
>>>>>>> oil (1 percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind, and
>>>>>>> geothermal) (3 percent).
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
>>>>>>> critical infrastructure?
>>>>>>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact that it
>>>>>>>> is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole law is about
>>>>>>>> buying property near "critical infrastructure." I don't
>>>>>>>> think anyone is worried about Chinese nationals buying our
>>>>>>>> military bases out from under us.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and actually
>>>>>>>> read the written words we might have the basis of a, lol,
>>>>>>>> rational discussion. If you are ready to stop dancing
>>>>>>>> around and state your opinion about whatever it is you
>>>>>>>> think you are talking about. In this instance, I promise,
>>>>>>>> IF, and this is obviously huge 'if', if we are talking
>>>>>>>> about the same subject, I have a black and white answer and
>>>>>>>> I think it's a good one.
>>>>>>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff clone. He
>>>>>>> couldn't follow through. Can you?
>>>>>>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
>>>>>>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of this
>>>>>>> bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another case of you
>>>>>>> amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to confirm yourself
>>>>>>> as the king - or queen, or whatever - of RORT
>>>>>>> controversialism? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
>>>>>>> work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law I
>>>>>> posted about is about property near critical infrastructure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying
>>>>>> farmland or any property within 10 miles of a military
>>>>>> installation or “critical infrastructure,†such as a
>>>>>> seaport or airport."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the actual
>>>>>> ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that law, but so far
>>>>>> I haven't seen it, and you are the only one talking about it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing. If
>>>>>> you want an opinion you have to start with one. I have a clear
>>>>>> opinion about YOUR subject. Your subject is so ridiculous i
>>>>>> don't think I need one, but oh well. If you want to play you
>>>>>> need to put something in the pot.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own definition
>>>>>> of "critical infrastructure" you will need to define what YOU
>>>>>> are talking about.
>>>>> You just think - erroneously - that I've gone freelance. It's not
>>>>> 'my' definition.
>>>>> https://www.cisa.gov/topics/critical-infrastructure-security-and-resilience/critical-infrastructure-sectors
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>> Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think
>>>>>> I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm. What's he
>>>>>> going to do? Turn up the power and fry everything within a 100
>>>>>> mile radius? Where do we draw the line? Should Chinese
>>>>>> nationals be prohibited from buying a single wind generator?
>>>>>> What about solar panels? How many can they own?
>>>>> From my POV, they can't own any of those things if they're part
>>>>> of our "critical infrastructure".
>>>>>> I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label. You guys
>>>>>> are dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
>>>>> Do you really think that any foreign national of a country
>>>>> that's hostile to our interests should be able to own any part of
>>>>> of our "critical infrastructure"? -- bill Theory don't mean squat
>>>>> if it don't work.
>>>>
>>>> So, we're at war with China, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran, Russia,
>>>> and North Korea?
>>> You just can't help it, can you? I didn't say anything about war.
>>>> Anyone who was born in those countries is
>>>> automatically our enemy? It's important that those people can't own
>>>> agricultural land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? That is listed
>>>> as critical infrastructure and this bill is very concerned with
>>>> agricultural land. Hey this is important stuff. What happens if the
>>>> Cubans jam up the toilets in Florida?
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErBK4KEMiko&t=29s
>>>> I probably should mention that Portland is a port city. Around here
>>>> China is an important trading partner.
>>> Try to hang onto control of those ports.
>>> ------------------------------------------------------
>>> In a recent opinion piece published by the Daily Mail, former British
>>> Defense and International Trade Secretary Dr Liam Fox and former U.S.
>>> National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane noted that China now owns
>>> 96 ports around the world. Some of these are at key locations for
>>> maritime trade, "giving Beijing strategic dominance without having to
>>> deploy a single soldier, ship or weapon."
>>> ...
>>> Holmes, a former U.S. Navy officer, noted prosperity is the top
>>> priority for any government. And Beijing’s port investments mean it
>>> can hold a large portion of a country's prosperity hostage, compelling
>>> its leadership to take political stances agreeable to the Chinese
>>> Communist Party. "So, seaports are a critical enabler for China's bid
>>> for commercial, diplomatic, and military influence."
>>> -----------------------------------------------------
>>> https://www.voanews.com/a/6224958.html#:~:text=China%E2%80%99s%20global%20port%20expansion%20means%20Beijing%20now%20has,China%20now%20owns%2096%20ports%20around%20the%20world.
>>>
>>> Much the same can be said about energy and agricultural
>>> infrastructure. And we are in a "war" with China - although it's not a
>>> shooting war. Yet.
>>>
>>> One more thing - the Chinese are capable of playing a much longer game
>>> than we seem to be.
>>> --
>>> bill
>>> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>> Was that so difficult? All you needed to say was that you are in favor of this law. So, we have 2 in favor and one, as usual, dancing around.
>>
>> This law is bigoted bullshit straight out of the traditional fascist playbook. Use ignorance to demonize minority groups and create fear. The sheep need big brother to protect them. The next thing you know communists will be cutting off your balls.
>>
>> Talk about prejudice, this law judges people by their country of origin.
>>
>> This law isn't necessary because we have Federal programs to address this problem, without creating insane restrictions. Right wing influencers are leading you airheads around like balloons with strings tied to your nose.
>>
>> "The Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States (CFIUS)
>> CFIUS is an interagency committee authorized to review certain transactions involving foreign investment in the United States and certain real estate transactions by foreign persons, in order to determine the effect of such transactions on the national security of the United States."
>>
>> https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/international/the-committee-on-foreign-investment-in-the-united-states-cfius
>>
>> It's seriously important that we prevent people who were born in other places from owning farm land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? LOL, give me a break. This is just more manufactured outrage.
>>
>> TB
>
> Knock,knock, knock, is this thing on? <crickets> I'm pretty disappointed. I thought we were going to have a lively exchange of opinions. Instead, our Three Clumsy Dodgers all danced away from this thread. Our jive ass dodger was all over this thread, with 4 posts, until things got real. He never stops dancing, so that was no surprise. I had figured that sticks would at least explain why people who were born in Cuba shouldn't own farm land within 10 miles of a sewage plant. Nothin'. I figured bfh would tell me all the ways I was wrong and he was right. <crickets>
>
> I thought that was one of my all time best flames. This being Usenet all of my victims will deny feeling even the slightest bit of warmth. LOL So it goes.
>
> TB

Technobarbarian wrote:
> On Wednesday, May 24, 2023 at 6:37:38 AM UTC-7, Technobarbarian
> wrote:
>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 8:29:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 6:47:09 PM UTC-7, bfh
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM
>>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at
>>>>>>>> 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
>>>>>>>>>> 11:46:19 PM
>>>>>>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
>>>>>>>>>>>> 7:43:52ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Â¯PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
UTC-7, bfh wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’Ãâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> law that bans Chinese nationals from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the state.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> miles (16 kilometers) of military
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> installations and other ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’Ãâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“critical
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
infrastructureÃÃâ€
>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
>>>
>>>
and
>>>>> also affects
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Iran, Russia, and North Korea. But
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese citizens and those selling
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> property to them face the harshest
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> penalties. The prohibition also applies
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to agricultural land.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the law will have a substantial chilling
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> effect on sales to Chinese and Asian
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people who can legally buy property. The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suit says the law unfairly equates
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese people with the actions of their
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> government and there is no evidence of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> national security risk from Chinese
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> citizens buying Florida property.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The law ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
codify and expand housing discrimination against
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the Constitution and the Fair Housing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Act,ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> suit. ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“It
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> name sounds remotely Asian, Russian,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Syrian.ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> foreign ownership of agricultural land
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has risen by 50% this year.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> restricting foreign ownership or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> investments in private agricultural land.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So far this year, restrictive laws also
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
political
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’Ãâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Arkansas.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> laws targeting land ownership by foreign
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> entities stems from some highly
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> publicized cases of Chinese-connected
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> companies purchasing land near military
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GroupÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€žÂ¢s
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“significant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
threat to national
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> security.ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> banning infrastructure deals with
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> individuals tied to hostile governments,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> including China."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it
>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't work.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and
>>>>>>>>>>>> the article I posted doesn't say anything
>>>>>>>>>>>> about Chinese nationals buying critical USA
>>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructures.
>>>>>>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own
>>>>>>>>>>> stuff? ----------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate
>>>>>>>>>>> tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air Force
>>>>>>>>>>> base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by
>>>>>>>>>>> banning infrastructure deals with individuals
>>>>>>>>>>> tied to hostile governments, including China."
>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
>>>>>>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you
>>>>>>>>>>> probably don't even know what critical
>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure is:
>>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
>>>>>>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are
>>>>>>>>>>> considered so vital to the United States that
>>>>>>>>>>> their incapacitation or destruction would have
>>>>>>>>>>> a debilitating effect on security, national
>>>>>>>>>>> economic security, national public health or
>>>>>>>>>>> safety, or any combination thereof.
>>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
and what
>>>>>>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
>>>>>>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill
>>>>>>>>>>> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of
>>>>>>>>>> that. They might have bought land near that. Can
>>>>>>>>>> you tell me what critical infrastructure Chinese
>>>>>>>>>> nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your opinion
>>>>>>>>>> about this.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly
>>>>>>>>>> interested in opinions. Going forward, if you
>>>>>>>>>> want to have any hope of getting a straight
>>>>>>>>>> answer about my opinions, you will need to start
>>>>>>>>>> by stating your opinion.
>>>>>>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does
>>>>>>>>> Not contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a
>>>>>>>>> Chinese national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm?
>>>>>>>>> That a wind farm is Not critical infrastructure?
>>>>>>>>> What?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should
>>>>>>>>> probably reorient and reevaluate the calculus of
>>>>>>>>> any uniquely possible metric of hope that I may
>>>>>>>>> have on the table of literally getting a straight
>>>>>>>>> answer from you at any point in the passage of
>>>>>>>>> time? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
>>>>>>>>> work.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT
>>>>>>>> considered "critical infrastructure."
>>>>>>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure,
>>>>>>> and wind power is part of the energy structure.
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>
The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
>>>>>>> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S.
>>>>>>> electricity segment contains more than 6,413 power
>>>>>>> plants (this includes 3,273 traditional electric
>>>>>>> utilities and 1,738 nonutility power producers) with
>>>>>>> approximately 1,075 gigawatts of installed generation.
>>>>>>> Approximately 48 percent of electricity is produced by
>>>>>>> combusting coal (primarily transported by rail), 20
>>>>>>> percent in nuclear power plants, and 22 percent by
>>>>>>> combusting natural gas. The remaining generation is
>>>>>>> provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent), oil (1
>>>>>>> percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind, and
>>>>>>> geothermal) (3 percent).
>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>
How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
>>>>>>> critical infrastructure?
>>>>>>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact
>>>>>>>> that it is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole
>>>>>>>> law is about buying property near "critical
>>>>>>>> infrastructure." I don't think anyone is worried
>>>>>>>> about Chinese nationals buying our military bases out
>>>>>>>> from under us.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and
>>>>>>>> actually read the written words we might have the
>>>>>>>> basis of a, lol, rational discussion. If you are
>>>>>>>> ready to stop dancing around and state your opinion
>>>>>>>> about whatever it is you think you are talking about.
>>>>>>>> In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is
>>>>>>>> obviously huge 'if', if we are talking about the same
>>>>>>>> subject, I have a black and white answer and I think
>>>>>>>> it's a good one.
>>>>>>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff
>>>>>>> clone. He couldn't follow through. Can you?
>>>>>>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
>>>>>>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of
>>>>>>> this bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another
>>>>>>> case of you amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to
>>>>>>> confirm yourself as the king - or queen, or whatever -
>>>>>>> of RORT controversialism? -- bill Theory don't mean
>>>>>>> squat if it don't work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law
>>>>>> I posted about is about property near critical
>>>>>> infrastructure.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying
>>>>>> farmland or any property within 10 miles of a military
>>>>>> installation or “critical
>>>>>> infrastructure,†such as a seaport or
>>>>>> airport."
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the
>>>>>> actual ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that
>>>>>> law, but so far I haven't seen it, and you are the only
>>>>>> one talking about it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing.
>>>>>> If you want an opinion you have to start with one. I have
>>>>>> a clear opinion about YOUR subject. Your subject is so
>>>>>> ridiculous i don't think I need one, but oh well. If you
>>>>>> want to play you need to put something in the pot.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own
>>>>>> definition of "critical infrastructure" you will need to
>>>>>> define what YOU are talking about.
>>>>> You just think - erroneously - that I've gone freelance.
>>>>> It's not 'my' definition.
>>>>> https://www.cisa.gov/topics/critical-infrastructure-security-and-resilience/critical-infrastructure-sectors
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>>>>
Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think
>>>>>> I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm.
>>>>>> What's he going to do? Turn up the power and fry
>>>>>> everything within a 100 mile radius? Where do we draw the
>>>>>> line? Should Chinese nationals be prohibited from buying
>>>>>> a single wind generator? What about solar panels? How
>>>>>> many can they own?
>>>>> From my POV, they can't own any of those things if they're
>>>>> part of our "critical infrastructure".
>>>>>> I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label.
>>>>>> You guys are dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
>>>>> Do you really think that any foreign national of a country
>>>>> that's hostile to our interests should be able to own any
>>>>> part of of our "critical infrastructure"? -- bill Theory
>>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
>>>>
>>>> So, we're at war with China, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran,
>>>> Russia, and North Korea?
>>> You just can't help it, can you? I didn't say anything about
>>> war.
>>>> Anyone who was born in those countries is automatically our
>>>> enemy? It's important that those people can't own
>>>> agricultural land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? That is
>>>> listed as critical infrastructure and this bill is very
>>>> concerned with agricultural land. Hey this is important
>>>> stuff. What happens if the Cubans jam up the toilets in
>>>> Florida?
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErBK4KEMiko&t=29s
>>>> I probably should mention that Portland is a port city.
>>>> Around here China is an important trading partner.
>>> Try to hang onto control of those ports.
>>> ------------------------------------------------------ In a
>>> recent opinion piece published by the Daily Mail, former
>>> British Defense and International Trade Secretary Dr Liam Fox
>>> and former U.S. National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane
>>> noted that China now owns 96 ports around the world. Some of
>>> these are at key locations for maritime trade, "giving Beijing
>>> strategic dominance without having to deploy a single soldier,
>>> ship or weapon." ... Holmes, a former U.S. Navy officer, noted
>>> prosperity is the top priority for any government. And
>>> Beijing’s port investments mean it can hold a large portion
>>> of a country's prosperity hostage, compelling its leadership to
>>> take political stances agreeable to the Chinese Communist
>>> Party. "So, seaports are a critical enabler for China's bid for
>>> commercial, diplomatic, and military influence."
>>> -----------------------------------------------------
>>> https://www.voanews.com/a/6224958.html#:~:text=China%E2%80%99s%20global%20port%20expansion%20means%20Beijing%20now%20has,China%20now%20owns%2096%20ports%20around%20the%20world.
>>>
>>>
>>>
Much the same can be said about energy and agricultural
>>> infrastructure. And we are in a "war" with China - although
>>> it's not a shooting war. Yet.
>>>
>>> One more thing - the Chinese are capable of playing a much
>>> longer game than we seem to be. -- bill Theory don't mean squat
>>> if it don't work.
>> Was that so difficult? All you needed to say was that you are in
>> favor of this law. So, we have 2 in favor and one, as usual,
>> dancing around.
>>
>> This law is bigoted bullshit straight out of the traditional
>> fascist playbook. Use ignorance to demonize minority groups and
>> create fear. The sheep need big brother to protect them. The next
>> thing you know communists will be cutting off your balls.
>>
>> Talk about prejudice, this law judges people by their country of
>> origin.
>>
>> This law isn't necessary because we have Federal programs to
>> address this problem, without creating insane restrictions. Right
>> wing influencers are leading you airheads around like balloons
>> with strings tied to your nose.
>>
>> "The Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States
>> (CFIUS) CFIUS is an interagency committee authorized to review
>> certain transactions involving foreign investment in the United
>> States and certain real estate transactions by foreign persons,
>> in order to determine the effect of such transactions on the
>> national security of the United States."
>>
>> https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/international/the-committee-on-foreign-investment-in-the-united-states-cfius
>>
>>
>>
It's seriously important that we prevent people who were born in other
places from owning farm land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? LOL,
give me a break. This is just more manufactured outrage.
>>
>> TB
>
> Knock,knock, knock, is this thing on? <crickets> I'm pretty
> disappointed. I thought we were going to have a lively exchange of
> opinions. Instead, our Three Clumsy Dodgers all danced away from
> this thread. Our jive ass dodger was all over this thread, with 4
> posts, until things got real. He never stops dancing, so that was
> no surprise. I had figured that sticks would at least explain why
> people who were born in Cuba shouldn't own farm land within 10
> miles of a sewage plant. Nothin'. I figured bfh would tell me all
> the ways I was wrong and he was right. <crickets>
>
> I thought that was one of my all time best flames. This being
> Usenet all of my victims will deny feeling even the slightest bit
> of warmth. LOL So it goes.

On Thursday, May 25, 2023 at 4:35:01 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> Technobarbarian wrote:
> > On Wednesday, May 24, 2023 at 6:37:38 AM UTC-7, Technobarbarian
> > wrote:
> >> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 8:29:52 PM UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 6:47:09 PM UTC-7, bfh
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at 4:53:17 PM
> >>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>>> On Tuesday, May 23, 2023 at
> >>>>>>>> 10:44:31 AM UTC-7, bfh
> >>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
> >>>>>>>>>> 11:46:19 PM
> >>>>>>>>>> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Monday, May 22, 2023 at
> >>>>>>>>>>>> 7:43:52ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬Â¯PM
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> UTC-7, bfh wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Technobarbarian wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’Ãâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â‚¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> A group of Chinese citizens living and working in
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Florida sued the state Monday over a new
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> law that bans Chinese nationals from
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> purchasing property in large swaths of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the state.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The law applies to properties within 10
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> miles (16 kilometers) of military
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> installations and other ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’Ãâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“critical
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> infrastructureÃÃâ€
> >>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
> >>>
> >>>
> and
> >>>>> also affects
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> citizens of Cuba, Venezuela, Syria,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Iran, Russia, and North Korea. But
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese citizens and those selling
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> property to them face the harshest
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> penalties. The prohibition also applies
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to agricultural land.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The American Civil Liberties Union says
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the law will have a substantial chilling
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> effect on sales to Chinese and Asian
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> people who can legally buy property. The
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> suit says the law unfairly equates
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chinese people with the actions of their
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> government and there is no evidence of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> national security risk from Chinese
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> citizens buying Florida property.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The law ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“will
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> codify and expand housing discrimination against
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> people of Asian descent in violation of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the Constitution and the Fair Housing
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Act,ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> the ACLU said in a news release announcing the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> suit. ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“It
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> will also cast an undue burden of suspicion on
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone seeking to buy property whose
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> name sounds remotely Asian, Russian,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Iranian, Cuban, Venezuelan, or
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Syrian.ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> "
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> "The number of states restricting
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> foreign ownership of agricultural land
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> has risen by 50% this year.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heading into 2023, 14 states had laws
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> restricting foreign ownership or
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> investments in private agricultural land.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> So far this year, restrictive laws also
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> have been enacted in Arkansas, Idaho,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Montana, Tennessee, Utah and Virginia.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Foreign land ownership has become
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“a
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> political
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> flashpoint,ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’Ãâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> said Micah Brown, a staff attorney for the National
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Agricultural Law Center at the University
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> of Arkansas.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brown said the recent surge in state
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> laws targeting land ownership by foreign
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> entities stems from some highly
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> publicized cases of Chinese-connected
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> companies purchasing land near military
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> bases. Earlier this year, the U.S. Air
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Force said that the Fufeng
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> GroupÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€žÂ¢s
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> planned $700 million wet corn milling plant near a
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> base in Grand Forks, North Dakota, poses
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> a ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’…“significant
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> threat to national
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> security.ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢ÃÃâ€
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ’¢â€šÂ¬
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate tycoon
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> bought a wind farm near an Air Force base
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> banning infrastructure deals with
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> individuals tied to hostile governments,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> including China."
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://apnews.com/article/florida-chinese-citizens-property-law-4aeecc7a9470d03726658f1ef7b1d1f1
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
> What's your personal position on Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure?
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> don't work.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> I don't know anything about that subject and
> >>>>>>>>>>>> the article I posted doesn't say anything
> >>>>>>>>>>>> about Chinese nationals buying critical USA
> >>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructures.
> >>>>>>>>>>> Of course it did. Don't you read your own
> >>>>>>>>>>> stuff? ----------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>>> After a Chinese army veteran and real estate
> >>>>>>>>>>> tycoon bought a wind farm near an Air Force
> >>>>>>>>>>> base in Texas, that state responded in 2021 by
> >>>>>>>>>>> banning infrastructure deals with individuals
> >>>>>>>>>>> tied to hostile governments, including China."
> >>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>>>> What critical infrastructure did they buy
> >>>>>>>>>>> Don't you read your own stuff? And since you
> >>>>>>>>>>> probably don't even know what critical
> >>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure is:
> >>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> There are 16 critical infrastructure sectors whose assets, systems,
> >>>>>>>>>>> and networks, whether physical or virtual, are
> >>>>>>>>>>> considered so vital to the United States that
> >>>>>>>>>>> their incapacitation or destruction would have
> >>>>>>>>>>> a debilitating effect on security, national
> >>>>>>>>>>> economic security, national public health or
> >>>>>>>>>>> safety, or any combination thereof.
> >>>>>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> and what
> >>>>>>>>>>>> is your opinion about that?
> >>>>>>>>>>> Now can you provide your own opinion? -- bill
> >>>>>>>>>>> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> I don't think Chinese nationals BOUGHT any of
> >>>>>>>>>> that. They might have bought land near that. Can
> >>>>>>>>>> you tell me what critical infrastructure Chinese
> >>>>>>>>>> nationals BOUGHT. I will also need your opinion
> >>>>>>>>>> about this.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> I'm mostly interested in facts. You are mostly
> >>>>>>>>>> interested in opinions. Going forward, if you
> >>>>>>>>>> want to have any hope of getting a straight
> >>>>>>>>>> answer about my opinions, you will need to start
> >>>>>>>>>> by stating your opinion.
> >>>>>>>>> Are you claiming that the article you posted does
> >>>>>>>>> Not contain facts? That the Chinese guy was Not a
> >>>>>>>>> Chinese national? That he did Not BUY a wind farm?
> >>>>>>>>> That a wind farm is Not critical infrastructure?
> >>>>>>>>> What?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> And at the end of the day going forward, I should
> >>>>>>>>> probably reorient and reevaluate the calculus of
> >>>>>>>>> any uniquely possible metric of hope that I may
> >>>>>>>>> have on the table of literally getting a straight
> >>>>>>>>> answer from you at any point in the passage of
> >>>>>>>>> time? -- bill Theory don't mean squat if it don't
> >>>>>>>>> work.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> The wind farm you are talking about is NOT
> >>>>>>>> considered "critical infrastructure."
> >>>>>>> Bullshit. The energy sector is critical infrastructure,
> >>>>>>> and wind power is part of the energy structure.
> >>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>
> The energy infrastructure is divided into three interrelated
> >>>>>>> segments: electricity, oil, and natural gas. The U.S.
> >>>>>>> electricity segment contains more than 6,413 power
> >>>>>>> plants (this includes 3,273 traditional electric
> >>>>>>> utilities and 1,738 nonutility power producers) with
> >>>>>>> approximately 1,075 gigawatts of installed generation.
> >>>>>>> Approximately 48 percent of electricity is produced by
> >>>>>>> combusting coal (primarily transported by rail), 20
> >>>>>>> percent in nuclear power plants, and 22 percent by
> >>>>>>> combusting natural gas. The remaining generation is
> >>>>>>> provided by hydroelectric plants (6 percent), oil (1
> >>>>>>> percent), and renewable sources (solar, wind, and
> >>>>>>> geothermal) (3 percent).
> >>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>
> How can you even consider that electricity generated by wind is not
> >>>>>>> critical infrastructure?
> >>>>>>>> The objection to that purchase is based on the fact
> >>>>>>>> that it is NEAR "critical infrastructure". The whole
> >>>>>>>> law is about buying property near "critical
> >>>>>>>> infrastructure." I don't think anyone is worried
> >>>>>>>> about Chinese nationals buying our military bases out
> >>>>>>>> from under us.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> If you ever get your head out of your ass and
> >>>>>>>> actually read the written words we might have the
> >>>>>>>> basis of a, lol, rational discussion. If you are
> >>>>>>>> ready to stop dancing around and state your opinion
> >>>>>>>> about whatever it is you think you are talking about.
> >>>>>>>> In this instance, I promise, IF, and this is
> >>>>>>>> obviously huge 'if', if we are talking about the same
> >>>>>>>> subject, I have a black and white answer and I think
> >>>>>>>> it's a good one.
> >>>>>>> You sound like an "Evidence in plain sight" Schiff
> >>>>>>> clone. He couldn't follow through. Can you?
> >>>>>>>> BTW, #45 signed off on that purchase years ago.
> >>>>>>> Do you actually honestly literally Believe most of
> >>>>>>> this bullshabble that you post? Or is it just another
> >>>>>>> case of you amazing and amusing yourself, and trying to
> >>>>>>> confirm yourself as the king - or queen, or whatever -
> >>>>>>> of RORT controversialism? -- bill Theory don't mean
> >>>>>>> squat if it don't work.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I seriously think you must be losing your mind. The law
> >>>>>> I posted about is about property near critical
> >>>>>> infrastructure.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> "The law (SB 264) prohibits Chinese citizens from buying
> >>>>>> farmland or any property within 10 miles of a military
> >>>>>> installation or “critical
> >>>>>> infrastructure,†such as a seaport or
> >>>>>> airport."
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Maybe, if I dug deeper I might find something about the
> >>>>>> actual ownership of "critical infrastructure" in that
> >>>>>> law, but so far I haven't seen it, and you are the only
> >>>>>> one talking about it.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> So ok, lets consider YOUR subject, You are still dancing.
> >>>>>> If you want an opinion you have to start with one. I have
> >>>>>> a clear opinion about YOUR subject. Your subject is so
> >>>>>> ridiculous i don't think I need one, but oh well. If you
> >>>>>> want to play you need to put something in the pot.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Since you have gone freelance and insist on your own
> >>>>>> definition of "critical infrastructure" you will need to
> >>>>>> define what YOU are talking about.
> >>>>> You just think - erroneously - that I've gone freelance.
> >>>>> It's not 'my' definition.
> >>>>> https://www.cisa.gov/topics/critical-infrastructure-security-and-resilience/critical-infrastructure-sectors
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>
> Even if I lived next door to that guy I don't think
> >>>>>> I would be bothered if he turned off his wind farm.
> >>>>>> What's he going to do? Turn up the power and fry
> >>>>>> everything within a 100 mile radius? Where do we draw the
> >>>>>> line? Should Chinese nationals be prohibited from buying
> >>>>>> a single wind generator? What about solar panels? How
> >>>>>> many can they own?
> >>>>> From my POV, they can't own any of those things if they're
> >>>>> part of our "critical infrastructure".
> >>>>>> I'm feeling complimented by the "artful dodger" label.
> >>>>>> You guys are dodgers, but you sure ain't artful.
> >>>>> Do you really think that any foreign national of a country
> >>>>> that's hostile to our interests should be able to own any
> >>>>> part of of our "critical infrastructure"? -- bill Theory
> >>>>> don't mean squat if it don't work.
> >>>>
> >>>> So, we're at war with China, Cuba, Venezuela, Syria, Iran,
> >>>> Russia, and North Korea?
> >>> You just can't help it, can you? I didn't say anything about
> >>> war.
> >>>> Anyone who was born in those countries is automatically our
> >>>> enemy? It's important that those people can't own
> >>>> agricultural land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? That is
> >>>> listed as critical infrastructure and this bill is very
> >>>> concerned with agricultural land. Hey this is important
> >>>> stuff. What happens if the Cubans jam up the toilets in
> >>>> Florida?
> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErBK4KEMiko&t=29s
> >>>> I probably should mention that Portland is a port city.
> >>>> Around here China is an important trading partner.
> >>> Try to hang onto control of those ports.
> >>> ------------------------------------------------------ In a
> >>> recent opinion piece published by the Daily Mail, former
> >>> British Defense and International Trade Secretary Dr Liam Fox
> >>> and former U.S. National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane
> >>> noted that China now owns 96 ports around the world. Some of
> >>> these are at key locations for maritime trade, "giving Beijing
> >>> strategic dominance without having to deploy a single soldier,
> >>> ship or weapon." ... Holmes, a former U.S. Navy officer, noted
> >>> prosperity is the top priority for any government. And
> >>> Beijing’s port investments mean it can hold a large portion
> >>> of a country's prosperity hostage, compelling its leadership to
> >>> take political stances agreeable to the Chinese Communist
> >>> Party. "So, seaports are a critical enabler for China's bid for
> >>> commercial, diplomatic, and military influence."
> >>> -----------------------------------------------------
> >>> https://www.voanews.com/a/6224958.html#:~:text=China%E2%80%99s%20global%20port%20expansion%20means%20Beijing%20now%20has,China%20now%20owns%2096%20ports%20around%20the%20world.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> Much the same can be said about energy and agricultural
> >>> infrastructure. And we are in a "war" with China - although
> >>> it's not a shooting war. Yet.
> >>>
> >>> One more thing - the Chinese are capable of playing a much
> >>> longer game than we seem to be. -- bill Theory don't mean squat
> >>> if it don't work.
> >> Was that so difficult? All you needed to say was that you are in
> >> favor of this law. So, we have 2 in favor and one, as usual,
> >> dancing around.
> >>
> >> This law is bigoted bullshit straight out of the traditional
> >> fascist playbook. Use ignorance to demonize minority groups and
> >> create fear. The sheep need big brother to protect them. The next
> >> thing you know communists will be cutting off your balls.
> >>
> >> Talk about prejudice, this law judges people by their country of
> >> origin.
> >>
> >> This law isn't necessary because we have Federal programs to
> >> address this problem, without creating insane restrictions. Right
> >> wing influencers are leading you airheads around like balloons
> >> with strings tied to your nose.
> >>
> >> "The Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States
> >> (CFIUS) CFIUS is an interagency committee authorized to review
> >> certain transactions involving foreign investment in the United
> >> States and certain real estate transactions by foreign persons,
> >> in order to determine the effect of such transactions on the
> >> national security of the United States."
> >>
> >> https://home.treasury.gov/policy-issues/international/the-committee-on-foreign-investment-in-the-united-states-cfius
> >>
> >>
> >>
> It's seriously important that we prevent people who were born in other
> places from owning farm land within 10 miles of a sewage plant? LOL,
> give me a break. This is just more manufactured outrage.
> >>
> >> TB
> >
> > Knock,knock, knock, is this thing on? <crickets> I'm pretty
> > disappointed. I thought we were going to have a lively exchange of
> > opinions. Instead, our Three Clumsy Dodgers all danced away from
> > this thread. Our jive ass dodger was all over this thread, with 4
> > posts, until things got real. He never stops dancing, so that was
> > no surprise. I had figured that sticks would at least explain why
> > people who were born in Cuba shouldn't own farm land within 10
> > miles of a sewage plant. Nothin'. I figured bfh would tell me all
> > the ways I was wrong and he was right. <crickets>
> >
> > I thought that was one of my all time best flames. This being
> > Usenet all of my victims will deny feeling even the slightest bit
> > of warmth. LOL So it goes.
> Since you're obviously in favor of selling critical infrastructure to
> Chinese nationals, I don't know why you're disappointed. You've
> self-admitted that you've exceeded your self-expections for your
> self-amusement and self-amazement.
> --
> bill
> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.

Click here to read the complete article

On 5/26/2023 10:43 AM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> Yep. There isn't anything to suggest that they are more likely to cause problems than people who were born here, unless you want to count your xenophobia.

Hard to see how even a leftist can say something this dumb.

> "Since 1991, American families have adopted more than 60,000 Chinese babies, almost all of them girls"
>
> Those are obviously dangerous people. They shouldn't allowed to own anything.
>
> "Thousands of Chinese parents-to-be make the trip to give birth in the U.S. every year so that their kids are born American citizens, according to experts in the industry."

I don't know why you deceptively talk about commoners instead of the
government associated foreign national the bill targets. Oh yeah,
lefties lie.

> Hey, they were born here. They obviously will not cause problems, no matter how long they lived in China.
>
> If they become American citizens the dangerous people become safe. If they get permanent resident status the dangerous people automatically become safe. I don't think it would be difficult for anyone to find a safe dummy buyer.

Here are the targeted groups. Seems logical to me.

1. The People’s Republic of China, the Chinese Communist Party or
any official or member of either group.
2. Any other political party or member of a political party or a
subdivision of a political party in the People’s Republic of China.
3. A partnership, association, corporation, organization or any
other combination of persons organized under the laws of or having its
principal place of business in the People’s Republic of China or a
subsidiary of such entity.
4. Any person who is domiciled in the People’s Republic of China and
is not a citizen or lawful permanent resident of the United States.
5. Any person, entity or collection of persons or entities described
in subparagraphs 1 through 4 as having a controlling interest in a
partnership, association, corporation, organization, trust or any other
legal entity or subsidiary formed for the purpose of owning real
property in Florida.

Maybe you should read the actual bill.

<https://flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/264/BillText/er/PDF>

On Friday, May 26, 2023 at 9:21:38 AM UTC-7, sticks wrote:
> On 5/26/2023 10:43 AM, Technobarbarian wrote:
> > Yep. There isn't anything to suggest that they are more likely to cause problems than people who were born here, unless you want to count your xenophobia.
> Hard to see how even a leftist can say something this dumb.
> > "Since 1991, American families have adopted more than 60,000 Chinese babies, almost all of them girls"
> >
> > Those are obviously dangerous people. They shouldn't allowed to own anything.
> >
> > "Thousands of Chinese parents-to-be make the trip to give birth in the U.S. every year so that their kids are born American citizens, according to experts in the industry."
> I don't know why you deceptively talk about commoners instead of the
> government associated foreign national the bill targets. Oh yeah,
> lefties lie.
> > Hey, they were born here. They obviously will not cause problems, no matter how long they lived in China.
> >
> > If they become American citizens the dangerous people become safe. If they get permanent resident status the dangerous people automatically become safe. I don't think it would be difficult for anyone to find a safe dummy buyer.
> Here are the targeted groups. Seems logical to me.
>
> 1. The People’s Republic of China, the Chinese Communist Party or
> any official or member of either group.
> 2. Any other political party or member of a political party or a
> subdivision of a political party in the People’s Republic of China.
> 3. A partnership, association, corporation, organization or any
> other combination of persons organized under the laws of or having its
> principal place of business in the People’s Republic of China or a
> subsidiary of such entity.
> 4. Any person who is domiciled in the People’s Republic of China and
> is not a citizen or lawful permanent resident of the United States.
> 5. Any person, entity or collection of persons or entities described
> in subparagraphs 1 through 4 as having a controlling interest in a
> partnership, association, corporation, organization, trust or any other
> legal entity or subsidiary formed for the purpose of owning real
> property in Florida.
>
>
> Maybe you should read the actual bill.
>
> <https://flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2023/264/BillText/er/PDF>

Yawn, I'm really not all that interested. I'm mostly humoring bft. He likes to argue and he's having problems finding playmates. This all comes down to why I prefer facts to opinions. I figure that, once they know the facts everyone will figure out their own opinion regardless of what I might say here. Here opinions are just a game. Which reminds me. I don't know who you are posting for, but, if it's me you could save yourself a lot of work if you cut down on the number of words you use. Yes fans, I do get the irony in this. All of my fans know I like to use a lot of words, but I'm mostly posting for myself, so I don't care how much of it anyone reads. I'm just a compulsive writer.

But, here's the thing. There have been many people just like you here in the past. Back in the day we would have at least half a dozen people who didn't sound all that different from you posting all day, every day. In effect, I have already read your posts many times. I tired of that a long time ago. This group is still an excellent place to find out what's bouncing around in the far right echo chamber. But, for you I mostly look for the subject and filter out the opinions. On that Durham investigation post I stopped reading once I figured out that this was the subject. I wasn't interested in your opinion on this subject and only read enough to see which side you were on.

This is a particularly silly thing to argue about because it wouldn't do anything to make us safer and isn't likely to survive a court test. Desantis doesn't really care. He's just trolling.

You dweebs are really missing the big picture. There are real reasons to be concerned with foreign ownership of critical infrastructure, particularly in smaller countries. If someone who doesn't like you owns seriously critical infrastructure, they can hold your whole country hostage and charge exorbitant fees. You know, pretty much the same way Republicans are holding our whole country hostage.

TB