From a newsletter:

<quote>
The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
those that died for the first time.
</quote>

The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
more carefully.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

Peter Moylan wrote:

> From a newsletter:

> <quote>
> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
> those that died for the first time.
> </quote>

> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence more carefully.

The 1st S is hard to parse. i think it's parsed as:


The driver (at the centre of the horror (NSW Hunter Valley bus crash)) has broken his silence.


------------ so the [horror] here is an adj. --- in the USA more commonly [horrific]

On Wednesday, Peter Moylan yelped out that:
> From a newsletter:
>
> <quote>
> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
> those that died for the first time.
> </quote>
>
> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
> more carefully.

Reported speech? Is he matching the word order of the driver?

/dps

--
Rule #0: Don't be on fire.
In case of fire, exit the building before tweeting about it.
(Sighting reported by Adam F)

On 14/03/24 12:13, Snidely wrote:
> On Wednesday, Peter Moylan yelped out that:
>> From a newsletter:
>>
>> <quote> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley
>> bus crash has broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett
>> Andrew Button said he thought about the night the tragedy unfolded
>> on June 11 last year every hour of every day, after coming
>> face-to-face with family members of those that died for the first
>> time. </quote>
>>
>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last
>> sentence more carefully.
>
> Reported speech? Is he matching the word order of the driver?

It's hard to tell. (So the sentence is ambiguous in another way that
hadn't occurred to me.) I suspect, though, that he hadn't met the family
members until the court hearing.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

Peter Moylan wrote:

> From a newsletter:

> <quote>
> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
> those that died for the first time.
> </quote>

> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
> more carefully.

Maybe even more than one time.

--
Jerry Friedman

On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:

> From a newsletter:
>
> <quote>
> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
> those that died for the first time.
> </quote>
>
> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
> more carefully.

I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?

--
Athel -- French and British, living in Marseilles for 37 years; mainly
in England until 1987.

On 2024-03-14, Snidely wrote:

> On Wednesday, Peter Moylan yelped out that:
>> From a newsletter:
>>
>> <quote>
>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>> those that died for the first time.
>> </quote>
>>
>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>> more carefully.
>
> Reported speech? Is he matching the word order of the driver?

Good point --- it might not have sounded as weird spoken.

--
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?
A: Top-posting.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on usenet?

On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:

> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>
>> From a newsletter:
>>
>> <quote>
>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>> those that died for the first time.
>> </quote>
>>
>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>> more carefully.
>
> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?

It's weird, I agree.

--
By those who see with their eyes closed
You know me by my black telescope

On 2024-03-14 10:47:53 +0000, Adam Funk said:

> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>
>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>>
>>> From a newsletter:
>>>
>>> <quote>
>>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>>> those that died for the first time.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>>> more carefully.
>>
>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?
>
> It's weird, I agree.

Incidentally, if this is a local newsletter cannot its readers be
expected to know that the Hunter Valley is in New South Wales? Even I,
on the other side of the world, know that, though perhaps I'm cheating
because my sister lived in Muswellbrook for several years.

--
Athel -- French and British, living in Marseilles for 37 years; mainly
in England until 1987.

On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:

> On 2024-03-14 10:47:53 +0000, Adam Funk said:
>
>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>
>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>>>
>>>> From a newsletter:
>>>>
>>>> <quote>
>>>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>>>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>>>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>>>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>>>> those that died for the first time.
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>>>> more carefully.
>>>
>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?
>>
>> It's weird, I agree.
>
> Incidentally, if this is a local newsletter cannot its readers be
> expected to know that the Hunter Valley is in New South Wales? Even I,
> on the other side of the world, know that, though perhaps I'm cheating
> because my sister lived in Muswellbrook for several years.

I guess it depends on how local the newsletter is. I'd be surprised if
there weren't other "Hunter Valley"s in the world, though.

--
By filing this bug report, you have challenged my
my honor. Prepare to die!
---Klingon Programmer's Guide

Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:

> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:

>> From a newsletter:
>>
>> <quote>
>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>> those that died for the first time.
>> </quote>
>>
>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>> more carefully.

> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?

I think it's supposed to be somewhat like "horror story" and "horror movie".

Google finds the same thing in British media, especially in headlines:

"Man and child killed in Surrey horror crash"

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/red-road-lightwater-crash-surrey-b2494692.html

Sudden gust led to horror crash

A HORROR helicopter crash at Delph last July in which the pilot was
seriously injured and the helicopter written off has been blamed in an
official report on wind conditions at the time.

https://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/24193/sudden-gust-led-to-horror-crash

(The poor guy guy broke both his legs, but no one else was involved in
any way, so as helicopter crashes go, it doesn't seem very horror, I mean
horrible.)

--
Jerry Friedman

Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:

> From a newsletter:
>
> <quote>
> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
> those that died for the first time.
> </quote>
>
> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
> more carefully.
>

How many times can ones family member die?

--
^Ï^. Sn!pe, PA, FIBS - Professional Crastinator

My pet rock Gordon just is.

On 2024-03-14 08:29, jerryfriedman wrote:
> Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>
>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>
>>>  From a newsletter:
>>>
>>> <quote>
>>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>>> those that died for the first time.
>>> </quote>
>>>
>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>>> more carefully.
>
>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?
>
> I think it's supposed to be somewhat like "horror story" and "horror
> movie".

I would have expected 'horrific' or 'horrible'.

> Google finds the same thing in British media, especially in headlines:
>
> "Man and child killed in Surrey horror crash"
>
> https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/red-road-lightwater-crash-surrey-b2494692.html
>
>
> Sudden gust led to horror crash
>
> A HORROR helicopter crash at Delph last July in which the pilot was
> seriously injured and the helicopter written off has been blamed in an
> official report on wind conditions at the time.
> https://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/24193/sudden-gust-led-to-horror-crash
>
> (The poor guy guy broke both his legs, but no one else was involved in
> any way, so as helicopter crashes go, it doesn't seem very horror, I mean
> horrible.)
>

--
Dear optimists, pessimists, and realists,
while you were arguing about the glass of water, I drank it.
Sincerely,
The Opportunist.
%

On 14-Mar-24 13:53, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>
>> On 2024-03-14 10:47:53 +0000, Adam Funk said:
>>
>>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>>>>
>>>>> From a newsletter:
>>>>>
>>>>> <quote>
>>>>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>>>>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>>>>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>>>>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>>>>> those that died for the first time.
>>>>> </quote>
>>>>>
>>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>>>>> more carefully.
>>>>
>>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?
>>>
>>> It's weird, I agree.
>>
>> Incidentally, if this is a local newsletter cannot its readers be
>> expected to know that the Hunter Valley is in New South Wales? Even I,
>> on the other side of the world, know that, though perhaps I'm cheating
>> because my sister lived in Muswellbrook for several years.
>
> I guess it depends on how local the newsletter is. I'd be surprised if
> there weren't other "Hunter Valley"s in the world, though.

The author didn't feel the need to specify in which "Newcastle" the case
was being heard. There may be more Newcastles than Hunter Valleys
(though I feel disinclined to do the research).

I wonder of the author actively chose to use "horror" in place of the
more obvious "horrific", and if so, what purpose it might have served?

--
Sam Plusnet

On 14-Mar-24 15:18, Sn!pe wrote:
> Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:
>
>> From a newsletter:
>>
>> <quote>
>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>> those that died for the first time.
>> </quote>
>>
>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>> more carefully.
>>
>
> How many times can ones family member die?
>
Dunno. Are they cowardly?

--
Sam Plusnet

lar3ryca wrote:

> On 2024-03-14 08:29, jerryfriedman wrote:
>> Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>
>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>>
>>>>  From a newsletter:
>>>>
>>>> <quote>
>>>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>>>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>>>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>>>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>>>> those that died for the first time.
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>>>> more carefully.
>>
>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?
>>
>> I think it's supposed to be somewhat like "horror story" and "horror
>> movie".

> I would have expected 'horrific' or 'horrible'.

So would I. Someone in the British or Australian press must have decided
that using "horror" that way is, as little Alex put it, real horrorshow.

A lot of British journalists like attributive nouns in headlines. Examples
from LanguageLog:

"Ben Douglas Bafta race row hairdresser James Brown 'sorry'"

(James Brown, a hairdresser, apologized for racially insulting Ben
Douglas, a white actor, at the BAFTA awards ceremony.)

https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=3173

"Corpse sex kill threat prisoner gets 45 year sentence"

(The prisoner had threatened to kill people and have sex with their
corpses.)

https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=29803

"Horror" seems to have spread from headlines to articles.

>> Google finds the same thing in British media, especially in headlines:
>>
>> "Man and child killed in Surrey horror crash"
>>
>> https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/red-road-lightwater-crash-surrey-b2494692.html
>>
>>
>> Sudden gust led to horror crash
>>
>> A HORROR helicopter crash at Delph last July in which the pilot was
>> seriously injured and the helicopter written off has been blamed in an
>> official report on wind conditions at the time.
>> https://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/24193/sudden-gust-led-to-horror-crash
...

--
Jerry Friedman

On 14/03/24 22:35, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> On 2024-03-14 10:47:53 +0000, Adam Funk said:
>
>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>
>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>>>
>>>> From a newsletter:
>>>>
>>>> <quote> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter
>>>> Valley bus crash has broken his silence. Outside Newcastle
>>>> court, Brett Andrew Button said he thought about the night the
>>>> tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every hour of every day,
>>>> after coming face-to-face with family members of those that
>>>> died for the first time. </quote>
>>>>
>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last
>>>> sentence more carefully.
>>>
>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where
>>> it is?
>>
>> It's weird, I agree.

As Jerry pointed out, it's not unusual to have attributive nouns that
work this way. I've seen "horror" examples before, especially in headlines.

> Incidentally, if this is a local newsletter cannot its readers be
> expected to know that the Hunter Valley is in New South Wales? Even
> I, on the other side of the world, know that, though perhaps I'm
> cheating because my sister lived in Muswellbrook for several years.

The phrasing is typical for a Sydney-based reporter. Newcastle people
know where Muswellbrook is, but Sydney people probably don't. Most of
the time they act as if Sydney is the entire state. They've heard of
Hunter Valley wines, but that's about it.

Drifting a little: a have some sympathy for the bus driver in the story.
The bus overturned in a roundabout, in a place where one is leaving the
local wine country roads and approaching the entry to the Hunter
Expressway. I know that roundabout, and it's confusing. It looks as if
one should take the first exit from the roundabout to get onto the entry
ramp. At the very last minute, a sign tells you that you need to stay in
the roundabout and proceed to the next exit, forcing you to make an
unexpected sharp turn. I don't know whether that point came up in the
trial, but it should have. Furthermore, the newspapers don't seem to
have pointed out that the road authorities still haven't fixed the
misleading signage.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

On 2024-03-14, Sam Plusnet wrote:

> On 14-Mar-24 13:53, Adam Funk wrote:
>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>
>>> On 2024-03-14 10:47:53 +0000, Adam Funk said:
>>>
>>>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> From a newsletter:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <quote>
>>>>>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>>>>>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>>>>>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>>>>>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>>>>>> those that died for the first time.
>>>>>> </quote>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>>>>>> more carefully.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?
>>>>
>>>> It's weird, I agree.
>>>
>>> Incidentally, if this is a local newsletter cannot its readers be
>>> expected to know that the Hunter Valley is in New South Wales? Even I,
>>> on the other side of the world, know that, though perhaps I'm cheating
>>> because my sister lived in Muswellbrook for several years.
>>
>> I guess it depends on how local the newsletter is. I'd be surprised if
>> there weren't other "Hunter Valley"s in the world, though.
>
> The author didn't feel the need to specify in which "Newcastle" the case
> was being heard. There may be more Newcastles than Hunter Valleys
> (though I feel disinclined to do the research).

Without looking it up, I can think of 3 Newcastles (NSW, on Tyne,
under Lyme). This is the first Hunter Valley I've heard of but it
sounds like a likely place name.

> I wonder of the author actively chose to use "horror" in place of the
> more obvious "horrific", and if so, what purpose it might have served?

Headline writers just seem to like it, I guess.

--
It was far easier for you as civilised men to behave
like barbarians, than it was for them as barbarians to
behave like civilised men. ---Spock

On 2024-03-14, jerryfriedman wrote:

> lar3ryca wrote:
>
>> On 2024-03-14 08:29, jerryfriedman wrote:
>>> Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>>>
>>>>>  From a newsletter:
>>>>>
>>>>> <quote>
>>>>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>>>>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>>>>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>>>>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>>>>> those that died for the first time.
>>>>> </quote>
>>>>>
>>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>>>>> more carefully.
>>>
>>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?
>>>
>>> I think it's supposed to be somewhat like "horror story" and "horror
>>> movie".
>
>> I would have expected 'horrific' or 'horrible'.
>
> So would I. Someone in the British or Australian press must have decided
> that using "horror" that way is, as little Alex put it, real horrorshow.
>
> A lot of British journalists like attributive nouns in headlines. Examples
> from LanguageLog:
>
> "Ben Douglas Bafta race row hairdresser James Brown 'sorry'"
>
> (James Brown, a hairdresser, apologized for racially insulting Ben
> Douglas, a white actor, at the BAFTA awards ceremony.)
>
> https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=3173
>
>
> "Corpse sex kill threat prisoner gets 45 year sentence"
>
> (The prisoner had threatened to kill people and have sex with their
> corpses.)
>
> https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=29803

Thanks for clearing that barely parseable headline up.

--
Hear my laughter in your head
It's a pity, it's a shame, nothing's been said

On 2024-03-15 10:12:24 +0000, Adam Funk said:

> On 2024-03-14, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>
>> On 14-Mar-24 13:53, Adam Funk wrote:
>>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2024-03-14 10:47:53 +0000, Adam Funk said:
>>>>
>>>>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> From a newsletter:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <quote>
>>>>>>> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley bus crash has
>>>>>>> broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett Andrew Button said he
>>>>>>> thought about the night the tragedy unfolded on June 11 last year every
>>>>>>> hour of every day, after coming face-to-face with family members of
>>>>>>> those that died for the first time.
>>>>>>> </quote>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last sentence
>>>>>>> more carefully.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where it is?
>>>>>
>>>>> It's weird, I agree.
>>>>
>>>> Incidentally, if this is a local newsletter cannot its readers be
>>>> expected to know that the Hunter Valley is in New South Wales? Even I,
>>>> on the other side of the world, know that, though perhaps I'm cheating
>>>> because my sister lived in Muswellbrook for several years.
>>>
>>> I guess it depends on how local the newsletter is. I'd be surprised if
>>> there weren't other "Hunter Valley"s in the world, though.
>>
>> The author didn't feel the need to specify in which "Newcastle" the case
>> was being heard. There may be more Newcastles than Hunter Valleys
>> (though I feel disinclined to do the research).
>
> Without looking it up, I can think of 3 Newcastles (NSW, on Tyne,
> under Lyme). This is the first Hunter Valley I've heard of but it
> sounds like a likely place name.

I have read that postal sorters complain that Newcastle-under-Lyme
people just write "Newcastle" on enveopes, whereas people from the much
larger and better known Newcastle-upon-Tyne usually write
“Newcastle-upon-Tyne".
>
>
>> I wonder of the author actively chose to use "horror" in place of the
>> more obvious "horrific", and if so, what purpose it might have served?
>
> Headline writers just seem to like it, I guess.

--
Athel -- French and British, living in Marseilles for 37 years; mainly
in England until 1987.

In article <l5ioetFdln7U1@mid.individual.net>, Athel Cornish-Bowden
<me@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On 2024-03-15 10:12:24 +0000, Adam Funk said:

> > On 2024-03-14, Sam Plusnet wrote:
> >
> >> On 14-Mar-24 13:53, Adam Funk wrote:
> >>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 2024-03-14 10:47:53 +0000, Adam Funk said:
> >>>>
> >>>>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> From a newsletter:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> <quote> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley
> >>>>>>> bus crash has broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett
> >>>>>>> Andrew Button said he thought about the night the tragedy
> >>>>>>> unfolded on June 11 last year every hour of every day, after
> >>>>>>> coming face-to-face with family members of those that died for
> >>>>>>> the first time. </quote>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last
> >>>>>>> sentence more carefully.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where
> >>>>>> it is?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> It's weird, I agree.
> >>>>
> >>>> Incidentally, if this is a local newsletter cannot its readers be
> >>>> expected to know that the Hunter Valley is in New South Wales? Even
> >>>> I, on the other side of the world, know that, though perhaps I'm
> >>>> cheating because my sister lived in Muswellbrook for several years.
> >>>
> >>> I guess it depends on how local the newsletter is. I'd be surprised
> >>> if there weren't other "Hunter Valley"s in the world, though.
> >>
> >> The author didn't feel the need to specify in which "Newcastle" the
> >> case was being heard. There may be more Newcastles than Hunter
> >> Valleys (though I feel disinclined to do the research).
> >
> > Without looking it up, I can think of 3 Newcastles (NSW, on Tyne, under
> > Lyme). This is the first Hunter Valley I've heard of but it sounds like
> > a likely place name.

> I have read that postal sorters complain that Newcastle-under-Lyme
> people just write "Newcastle" on enveopes, whereas people from the much
> larger and better known Newcastle-upon-Tyne usually write
> ”Newcastle-upon-Tyne".

In Wales, there's Newcastle Emlyn - just to confuse the issue.

> --

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té²
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 15/03/24 21:12, Adam Funk wrote:

> Without looking it up, I can think of 3 Newcastles (NSW, on Tyne,
> under Lyme). This is the first Hunter Valley I've heard of but it
> sounds like a likely place name.

I've just asked Google Maps for the Hunter Valley, and then done a
Google search for Hunter Valley. In both cases, all the results I got
were for places upriver from Newcastle. (Newcastle Harbour is the place
where the Hunter River reaches the ocean. Inverhunter, as the Scots
would say.)

Still, we all know that these results are influenced by the location of
the searcher, and that "less relevant" results are omitted. I might have
had a different result if I had searched for "Hunter Valley Kazakhstan".

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

On 2024-03-15, Peter Moylan wrote:

> On 15/03/24 21:12, Adam Funk wrote:
>
>> Without looking it up, I can think of 3 Newcastles (NSW, on Tyne,
>> under Lyme). This is the first Hunter Valley I've heard of but it
>> sounds like a likely place name.
>
> I've just asked Google Maps for the Hunter Valley, and then done a
> Google search for Hunter Valley. In both cases, all the results I got
> were for places upriver from Newcastle. (Newcastle Harbour is the place
> where the Hunter River reaches the ocean. Inverhunter, as the Scots
> would say.)
>
> Still, we all know that these results are influenced by the location of
> the searcher, and that "less relevant" results are omitted. I might have
> had a different result if I had searched for "Hunter Valley Kazakhstan".

I suspect it would work better with English-speaking countries, but I
haven't been able to find one in N America --- just several towns
called Hunter in the USA and two Hunter Islands in Canada.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter_(disambiguation)#Places>

--
Morality is doing what's right regardless of what you're
told. Obedience is doing what you're told regardless of what is
right. (attributed to H.L. Mencken)

On 2024-03-15, charles wrote:

> In article <l5ioetFdln7U1@mid.individual.net>, Athel Cornish-Bowden
><me@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> On 2024-03-15 10:12:24 +0000, Adam Funk said:
>
>> > On 2024-03-14, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 14-Mar-24 13:53, Adam Funk wrote:
>> >>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> On 2024-03-14 10:47:53 +0000, Adam Funk said:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> On 2024-03-14, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> On 2024-03-14 00:30:16 +0000, Peter Moylan said:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> From a newsletter:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> <quote> The driver at the centre of the horror NSW Hunter Valley
>> >>>>>>> bus crash has broken his silence. Outside Newcastle court, Brett
>> >>>>>>> Andrew Button said he thought about the night the tragedy
>> >>>>>>> unfolded on June 11 last year every hour of every day, after
>> >>>>>>> coming face-to-face with family members of those that died for
>> >>>>>>> the first time. </quote>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> The author is probably now wishing he had proof-read that last
>> >>>>>>> sentence more carefully.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> I'm more thrown by the first sentence. Does "horror" belong where
>> >>>>>> it is?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> It's weird, I agree.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Incidentally, if this is a local newsletter cannot its readers be
>> >>>> expected to know that the Hunter Valley is in New South Wales? Even
>> >>>> I, on the other side of the world, know that, though perhaps I'm
>> >>>> cheating because my sister lived in Muswellbrook for several years.
>> >>>
>> >>> I guess it depends on how local the newsletter is. I'd be surprised
>> >>> if there weren't other "Hunter Valley"s in the world, though.
>> >>
>> >> The author didn't feel the need to specify in which "Newcastle" the
>> >> case was being heard. There may be more Newcastles than Hunter
>> >> Valleys (though I feel disinclined to do the research).
>> >
>> > Without looking it up, I can think of 3 Newcastles (NSW, on Tyne, under
>> > Lyme). This is the first Hunter Valley I've heard of but it sounds like
>> > a likely place name.
>
>> I have read that postal sorters complain that Newcastle-under-Lyme
>> people just write "Newcastle" on enveopes, whereas people from the much
>> larger and better known Newcastle-upon-Tyne usually write
>> ”Newcastle-upon-Tyne".

The postcode would fix that: NE(various numbers) vs ST5.

> In Wales, there's Newcastle Emlyn - just to confuse the issue.

SA38

--
One could hardly get rich if one bothered all the time about whether
what one was doing was wrong or right.

On Fri, 15 Mar 2024 10:12:24 +0000
Adam Funk <a24061@ducksburg.com> wrote:

> On 2024-03-14, Sam Plusnet wrote:
>
> > On 14-Mar-24 13:53, Adam Funk wrote:
[]

> > The author didn't feel the need to specify in which "Newcastle" the case
> > was being heard. There may be more Newcastles than Hunter Valleys
> > (though I feel disinclined to do the research).
>
> Without looking it up, I can think of 3 Newcastles (NSW, on Tyne,
> under Lyme). This is the first Hunter Valley I've heard of but it
> sounds like a likely place name.
>

I know of another 3 (admittedly not very big) in Wales (*)
on Clun (* not in Wales these days)
(suburb of Bridgend)
Emlyn

and 1 in Norn Oilan.

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.