3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
Are such aliens autistic?

bt

On 25/03/24 10:56, bertitaylor wrote:

> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
> Are such aliens autistic?

Is this from the novel by Liu Cixin? After reading the first few
chapters, I decided not to read anything else by that author.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

bertitaylor wrote:

> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
> Are such aliens autistic?

The question makes no sense. Aliens would presumably be more different
from us than autistic people are from neurotypical people.

--
Jerry Friedman

Peter Moylan wrote:

> On 25/03/24 10:56, bertitaylor wrote:

>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
>> Are such aliens autistic?

> Is this from the novel by Liu Cixin? After reading the first few
> chapters, I decided not to read anything else by that author.

I liked the first few chapters and thought it went steadily downhill from
there.

--
Jerry Friedman

Le 25/03/2024 à 03:48, jerryfriedman a écrit :
> bertitaylor wrote:
>>
>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
>> Are such aliens autistic?
>
> The question makes no sense.  Aliens would presumably be more different
> from us than autistic people are from neurotypical people.

Autism is a highly variable condition, so they are variably different
from non-autistic people. "If you've met one person with autism, you've
met one person with autism" - Stephen Shore.

In a society where everyone was trustworthy, it would be natural for
some to find an advantage in exploiting this, an advantage in being
untrustworthy. At the same time, society wouldn't work if no-one could
be trusted, so I'd expect the stable condition to be a mix, among both
aliens and us.

Le 25/03/2024 à 06:34, Hibou a écrit :
> Le 25/03/2024 à 03:48, jerryfriedman a écrit :
>> bertitaylor wrote:
>>>
>>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
>>> Are such aliens autistic?
>>
>> The question makes no sense.  Aliens would presumably be more different
>> from us than autistic people are from neurotypical people.
>
> Autism is a highly variable condition, so they are variably different

they -> autistic people

> from non-autistic people. "If you've met one person with autism, you've
> met one person with autism" - Stephen Shore.
>
> In a society where everyone was trustworthy, it would be natural for
> some to find an advantage in exploiting this, an advantage in being
> untrustworthy. At the same time, society wouldn't work if no-one could
> be trusted, so I'd expect the stable condition to be a mix, among both
> aliens and us.

On 25/03/2024 04:48, jerryfriedman wrote:
> bertitaylor wrote:
>
>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
>> Are such aliens autistic?
>
> The question makes no sense.  Aliens would presumably be more different
> from us than autistic people are from neurotypical people.
>

The Netflix series in question has been on my 'recommended' list for
viewing, presumably because I tend to watch SF themed stuff.

I agree the that the OP question is a non-sequitur. A better question
would have been "What do these aliens rely on for politics and
politicians?"

Perhaps we do all deserve to die for not having figured out the
alternative for so long.

occam wrote:

>The Netflix series in question has been on my 'recommended' list for
>viewing, presumably because I tend to watch SF themed stuff.

After having watched the first two episodes I would definitely recommend
it, though this here appears to be the wrong newsgroup to discuss tv
series. But I tried alt.tv, which is full of SPAM, so where to go?

-jw-

--

And now for something completely different...

On 25/03/2024 10:43, Joerg Walther wrote:
> occam wrote:
>
>> The Netflix series in question has been on my 'recommended' list for
>> viewing, presumably because I tend to watch SF themed stuff.
>
> After having watched the first two episodes I would definitely recommend
> it, though this here appears to be the wrong newsgroup to discuss tv
> series. But I tried alt.tv, which is full of SPAM, so where to go?
>

Thanks. I will watch it.

Do not worry too much about raising the discussion about a TV series in
AUE. AUE is a broad church. Also included in its list of acceptable
themes: foodstuff, physics, physical ailments, personal peeves, the
language of perversion, and more.

On 2024-03-25, occam wrote:

> On 25/03/2024 10:43, Joerg Walther wrote:
>> occam wrote:
>>
>>> The Netflix series in question has been on my 'recommended' list for
>>> viewing, presumably because I tend to watch SF themed stuff.
>>
>> After having watched the first two episodes I would definitely recommend
>> it, though this here appears to be the wrong newsgroup to discuss tv
>> series. But I tried alt.tv, which is full of SPAM, so where to go?
>>
>
> Thanks. I will watch it.
>
> Do not worry too much about raising the discussion about a TV series in
> AUE. AUE is a broad church. Also included in its list of acceptable
> themes: foodstuff, physics, physical ailments, personal peeves, the
> language of perversion, and more.

+1

--
We seem to understand the value of oil, timber, minerals, and
housing, but not the value of unspoiled beauty, wildlife,
solitude, and spiritual renewal. ---Calvin

On 25/03/24 21:32, occam wrote:
> On 25/03/2024 10:43, Joerg Walther wrote:
>> occam wrote:
>>
>>> The Netflix series in question has been on my 'recommended' list for
>>> viewing, presumably because I tend to watch SF themed stuff.
>>
>> After having watched the first two episodes I would definitely recommend
>> it, though this here appears to be the wrong newsgroup to discuss tv
>> series. But I tried alt.tv, which is full of SPAM, so where to go?
>
> Thanks. I will watch it.
>
> Do not worry too much about raising the discussion about a TV series in
> AUE. AUE is a broad church. Also included in its list of acceptable
> themes: foodstuff, physics, physical ailments, personal peeves, the
> language of perversion, and more.

You forgot sheep.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

On 25/03/2024 13:05, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 25/03/24 21:32, occam wrote:
>> On 25/03/2024 10:43, Joerg Walther wrote:
>>> occam wrote:
>>>
>>>> The Netflix series in question has been on my 'recommended' list for
>>>> viewing, presumably because I tend to watch SF themed stuff.
>>>
>>> After having watched the first two episodes I would definitely recommend
>>> it, though this here appears to be the wrong newsgroup to discuss tv
>>> series. But I tried alt.tv, which is full of SPAM, so where to go?
>>
>> Thanks. I will watch it.
>>
>> Do not worry too much about raising the discussion about a TV series in
>> AUE. AUE is a broad church. Also included in its list of acceptable
>> themes:  foodstuff, physics, physical ailments, personal peeves, the
>> language of perversion, and more.
>
> You forgot sheep.
>

My ba.ad!

Hibou wrote:

> Le 25/03/2024 à 03:48, jerryfriedman a écrit :
>> bertitaylor wrote:
>>>
>>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
>>> Are such aliens autistic?
>>
>> The question makes no sense.  Aliens would presumably be more different
>> from us than autistic people are from neurotypical people.

> Autism is a highly variable condition, so they are variably different
> from non-autistic people. "If you've met one person with autism, you've
> met one person with autism" - Stephen Shore.

True, but well-conceived aliens can be more different from us than that.

> In a society where everyone was trustworthy, it would be natural for
> some to find an advantage in exploiting this, an advantage in being
> untrustworthy. At the same time, society wouldn't work if no-one could
> be trusted, so I'd expect the stable condition to be a mix, among both
> aliens and us.

That's assuming the aliens are capable of lying and getting away with
it, which they don't have to be. One could also imagine aliens that have
an effectively enforced death penalty for lying.

--
Jerry Friedman

jerryfriedman wrote:

> That's assuming the aliens are capable of lying and getting away with
> it, which they don't have to be. One could also imagine aliens that have
> an effectively enforced death penalty for lying.

There are animals who can lie in order to protect their stash or their
knowledge of a favourable spot. Isn't it realistic to suppose that the
ability to lie is an inherent part of intelligence?

Death penalties do not prevent people from any action.

--
Bertel, Denmark

On 25-Mar-24 14:39, jerryfriedman wrote:
> Hibou wrote:
>
>> Le 25/03/2024 à 03:48, jerryfriedman a écrit :
>>> bertitaylor wrote:
>>>>
>>>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>>>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>>>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
>>>> Are such aliens autistic?
>>>
>>> The question makes no sense.  Aliens would presumably be more different
>>> from us than autistic people are from neurotypical people.
>
>> Autism is a highly variable condition, so they are variably different
>> from non-autistic people. "If you've met one person with autism,
>> you've met one person with autism" - Stephen Shore.
>
> True, but well-conceived aliens can be more different from us than that.

Well conception gets you a well frog. It that what you had in mind?

--
Sam Plusnet

On 25-Mar-24 11:09, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2024-03-25, occam wrote:
>
>> On 25/03/2024 10:43, Joerg Walther wrote:
>>> occam wrote:
>>>
>>>> The Netflix series in question has been on my 'recommended' list for
>>>> viewing, presumably because I tend to watch SF themed stuff.
>>>
>>> After having watched the first two episodes I would definitely recommend
>>> it, though this here appears to be the wrong newsgroup to discuss tv
>>> series. But I tried alt.tv, which is full of SPAM, so where to go?
>>>
>>
>> Thanks. I will watch it.
>>
>> Do not worry too much about raising the discussion about a TV series in
>> AUE. AUE is a broad church. Also included in its list of acceptable
>> themes: foodstuff, physics, physical ailments, personal peeves, the
>> language of perversion, and more.
>
> +1

I would go beyond simple addition, and include a wide swathe of mathematics.

--
Sam Plusnet

Sam Plusnet wrote:

>>> Do not worry too much about raising the discussion about a TV series in
>>> AUE. AUE is a broad church. Also included in its list of acceptable
>>> themes: foodstuff, physics, physical ailments, personal peeves, the
>>> language of perversion, and more.
>>
>> +1
>
> I would go beyond simple addition, and include a wide swathe of mathematics.

There's also small bits of French now and then.

--
Bertel, Denmark

On 2024-03-25 19:46:12 +0000, Bertel Lund Hansen said:

> Sam Plusnet wrote:
>
>>>> Do not worry too much about raising the discussion about a TV series in
>>>> AUE. AUE is a broad church. Also included in its list of acceptable
>>>> themes: foodstuff, physics, physical ailments, personal peeves, the
>>>> language of perversion, and more.
>>>
>>> +1
>>
>> I would go beyond simple addition, and include a wide swathe of mathematics.
>
> There's also small bits of French now and then.

Not to mention Danish.

--
Athel -- French and British, living in Marseilles for 37 years; mainly
in England until 1987.

On 2024-03-25, Sam Plusnet wrote:

> On 25-Mar-24 11:09, Adam Funk wrote:
>> On 2024-03-25, occam wrote:
>>
>>> On 25/03/2024 10:43, Joerg Walther wrote:
>>>> occam wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The Netflix series in question has been on my 'recommended' list for
>>>>> viewing, presumably because I tend to watch SF themed stuff.
>>>>
>>>> After having watched the first two episodes I would definitely recommend
>>>> it, though this here appears to be the wrong newsgroup to discuss tv
>>>> series. But I tried alt.tv, which is full of SPAM, so where to go?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks. I will watch it.
>>>
>>> Do not worry too much about raising the discussion about a TV series in
>>> AUE. AUE is a broad church. Also included in its list of acceptable
>>> themes: foodstuff, physics, physical ailments, personal peeves, the
>>> language of perversion, and more.
>>
>> +1
>
> I would go beyond simple addition, and include a wide swathe of mathematics.

Ha, yes!

--
I have never killed any one, but I have read some obituary notices
with great satisfaction. (Clarence Darrow)

Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:

> jerryfriedman wrote:

>> That's assuming the aliens are capable of lying and getting away with
>> it, which they don't have to be. One could also imagine aliens that have
>> an effectively enforced death penalty for lying.

> There are animals who can lie in order to protect their stash or their
> knowledge of a favourable spot. Isn't it realistic to suppose that the
> ability to lie is an inherent part of intelligence?

It might depend on how they communicate. I have a dim memory from the
book (/The Three-Body Problem/) that the aliens communicate mind-to-
mind with quantum entanglement. (Could be totally wrong.). In general
something like telepathy might preclude lying. It might also depend on
how the aliens evolved. If they cooperate more closely than primates,
more like social insects, there might be no reason for lying to evolve.
And SF aliens might have engineered themselves or been engineered to
be the way they are.

My point is that SF aliens are supposed to be different from humans. If
some quality that's different from most humans is presented, it doesn't
make sense to guess that they're like the minority of humans who have
that quality. (Apparently some autistic people have a lot of trouble with
lying and maybe a few who can communicate really can't lie.). There's
a strong possibility that the author deliberately made them different
from humans and may have a good explanation.

> Death penalties do not prevent people from any action.

True, for humans.

But the possibility of a death penalty for lying wasn't a good response
on my part to the statement in the OP that the aliens in the Netflix
/Three-Body Problem/ can't lie.

--
Jerry Friedman

Den 25-03-2024 kl. 20:41 skrev Sam Plusnet:
>
> I would go beyond simple addition, and include a wide swathe of
> mathematics.

I would have written "swath", but a quick look seems to indicate
that that is the American spelling.

I can't recall seeing your spelling before - is it more rarely
used on this side of the pond?

/Anders, Denmark

jerry.friedman99@gmail.com (jerryfriedman) writes:
> Hibou wrote:
>> Le 25/03/2024 à 03:48, jerryfriedman a écrit :
>>> bertitaylor wrote:
>>>>
>>>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>>>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>>>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
>>>> Are such aliens autistic?
>>>
>>> The question makes no sense.  Aliens would presumably be more different
>>> from us than autistic people are from neurotypical people.
>
>> Autism is a highly variable condition, so they are variably
>> different from non-autistic people. "If you've met one person with
>> autism, you've met one person with autism" - Stephen Shore.
>
> True, but well-conceived aliens can be more different from us than that.
>
>> In a society where everyone was trustworthy, it would be natural for
>> some to find an advantage in exploiting this, an advantage in being
>> untrustworthy. At the same time, society wouldn't work if no-one
>> could be trusted, so I'd expect the stable condition to be a mix,
>> among both aliens and us.
>
> That's assuming the aliens are capable of lying and getting away with
> it, which they don't have to be. One could also imagine aliens that have
> an effectively enforced death penalty for lying.

However, lying could still be beneficial to r-strategists - you're
thinking with an K-strategist's outlook. As long as you can have enough
offspring that get away with it, you don't mind losing the ones that
don't get away with it. (C.f. Klingons for contrast, who were written as
K-strategists with a high culling rate - that's ecologically unworkable.)

Phil
--
We are no longer hunters and nomads. No longer awed and frightened, as we have
gained some understanding of the world in which we live. As such, we can cast
aside childish remnants from the dawn of our civilization.
-- NotSanguine on SoylentNews, after Eugen Weber in /The Western Tradition/

Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> writes:
> On 25/03/24 10:56, bertitaylor wrote:
>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we
>> lie.
>> Are such aliens autistic?
>
> Is this from the novel by Liu Cixin? After reading the first few
> chapters, I decided not to read anything else by that author.

I've concluded recently that I abhor almost everyone's writing style, so
I'm not sure extraplation from book to screen is always fair.
I noticed that an actual space scientist "Dr. Becky" Smethurst (with a
DPhil Oxon. in black holes) has done a "reaction" vid to the screening
of the netflix thing - it might change your mind, or it might not.
"An astrophysicist reacts to 3 Body Problem #shorts"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INSIf61C9KE
As it's by the people who screwed the game of pooch, I'm not holding up
much hope.

Phil
--
We are no longer hunters and nomads. No longer awed and frightened, as we have
gained some understanding of the world in which we live. As such, we can cast
aside childish remnants from the dawn of our civilization.
-- NotSanguine on SoylentNews, after Eugen Weber in /The Western Tradition/

Anders D. Nygaard wrote:

>> I would go beyond simple addition, and include a wide swathe of
>> mathematics.
>
> I would have written "swath", but a quick look seems to indicate
> that that is the American spelling.
>
> I can't recall seeing your spelling before - is it more rarely
> used on this side of the pond?

Maybe an Ngram with this string will give you the answer?

swathe:eng_us_2019,swathe:eng_gb_2019,swath:eng_us_2019,swath:eng_gb_2019

--
Bertel, Denmark

Phil Carmody wrote:

> jerry.friedman99@gmail.com (jerryfriedman) writes:
>> Hibou wrote:
>>> Le 25/03/2024 à 03:48, jerryfriedman a écrit :
>>>> bertitaylor wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 3 body problem is a Netflix serial.
>>>>> It is about the possible extinction of our species by aliens.
>>>>> Apparently we deserve to be extinct as we cannot be trusted, as we lie.
>>>>> Are such aliens autistic?
>>>>
>>>> The question makes no sense.  Aliens would presumably be more different
>>>> from us than autistic people are from neurotypical people.
>>
>>> Autism is a highly variable condition, so they are variably
>>> different from non-autistic people. "If you've met one person with
>>> autism, you've met one person with autism" - Stephen Shore.
>>
>> True, but well-conceived aliens can be more different from us than that.
>>
>>> In a society where everyone was trustworthy, it would be natural for
>>> some to find an advantage in exploiting this, an advantage in being
>>> untrustworthy. At the same time, society wouldn't work if no-one
>>> could be trusted, so I'd expect the stable condition to be a mix,
>>> among both aliens and us.
>>
>> That's assuming the aliens are capable of lying and getting away with
>> it, which they don't have to be. One could also imagine aliens that have
>> an effectively enforced death penalty for lying.

> However, lying could still be beneficial to r-strategists - you're
> thinking with an K-strategist's outlook. As long as you can have enough
> offspring that get away with it, you don't mind losing the ones that
> don't get away with it. (C.f. Klingons for contrast, who were written as
> K-strategists with a high culling rate - that's ecologically unworkable.)

By "effectively enforced" I meant that for all practical purposes,
no one gets away with it.

--
Jerry Friedman