Who had that on their Las Vegas race betting card?

https://apnews.com/article/andretti-global-f1-fia-expansion-11th-team-c65c0160167925d2aedb09ae9f779654

On Monday, October 2, 2023 at 1:02:24 PM UTC-4, News wrote:
> Who had that on their Las Vegas race betting card?
>
> https://apnews.com/article/andretti-global-f1-fia-expansion-11th-team-c65c0160167925d2aedb09ae9f779654

Big thumbs up! I hope they make it all the way.

Now, who would drive? Will they pick from their Indycar team? The European formulas? Poach someone? Who would you all hire?

John

On Mon, 2 Oct 2023 17:46:06 -0700 (PDT), JP <jpayne543@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Monday, October 2, 2023 at 1:02:24?PM UTC-4, News wrote:
>> Who had that on their Las Vegas race betting card?
>>
>> https://apnews.com/article/andretti-global-f1-fia-expansion-11th-team-c65c0160167925d2aedb09ae9f779654
>
>
>Big thumbs up! I hope they make it all the way.
>
>Now, who would drive? Will they pick from their Indycar team? The European formulas? Poach someone? Who would you all hire?
>
>John

Indycar drivers are not appropriate for F1. The better pools for
drivers are F2 and F3 competitions, since the whole car concepts
similar to F1 and they mostly drive at the same tracks.
So, Andretti will probably choose young drivers from there and
possible one veteran to guide them.

On Tuesday, October 3, 2023 at 6:19:34 AM UTC-4, Yazoo wrote:
> On Mon, 2 Oct 2023 17:46:06 -0700 (PDT), JP <jpay...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >On Monday, October 2, 2023 at 1:02:24?PM UTC-4, News wrote:
> >> Who had that on their Las Vegas race betting card?
> >>
> >> https://apnews.com/article/andretti-global-f1-fia-expansion-11th-team-c65c0160167925d2aedb09ae9f779654
> >
> >
> >Big thumbs up! I hope they make it all the way.
> >
> >Now, who would drive? Will they pick from their Indycar team? The European formulas? Poach someone? Who would you all hire?
> >
> >John
> Indycar drivers are not appropriate for F1. The better pools for
> drivers are F2 and F3 competitions, since the whole car concepts
> similar to F1 and they mostly drive at the same tracks.
> So, Andretti will probably choose young drivers from there and
> possible one veteran to guide them.

Yazoo,

That’s a good point about lower formula drivers having some familiarity with F1 circuits. The US press has been talking about Alex Palou having a possible path to F1. Colton Herta also, however from what I’ve observed of him I don’t think he has what it takes. Palou is a different story. I think he might be no worse than the bottom half of the current grid.

On Tue, 3 Oct 2023 12:24:19 -0700 (PDT), JP <jpayne543@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Yazoo,
>
>That’s a good point about lower formula drivers having some familiarity with F1 circuits. The US press has been talking about Alex Palou having a possible path to F1. Colton Herta also, however from what I’ve observed of him I don’t think he has what it takes. Palou is a different story. I think he might be no worse than the
bottom half of the current grid.

JP,
I don't know those drivers, but F1 is so different to Indy in so many
ways.
Not only that cars are different, but tracks, rules, speed, power...
all are different. So, it is not easy to adapt and many who tried to
switch to F1 strugled.
It would be beneficial for the F1 sport if more American drivers
participate, but the right way for them would be to start very young
in junior competitions in Europe, in teams' academies so to grow
themselves as drivers and prepare for the F1.

Good place to read about differences:

https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences

On Wednesday, October 4, 2023 at 3:19:50 AM UTC-4, Yazoo wrote:
> Good place to read about differences:
>
> https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences

Yazoo,

You’re absolutely correct and that has been Alex Palou’s exact path which is why he might have a chance where others haven’t.

Please see:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Álex_Palou
(Sorry, not sure how to post a live link in usenet)

On Wed, 4 Oct 2023 05:20:29 -0700 (PDT), JP <jpayne543@gmail.com>
wrote:

....

>Please see:
>https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Álex_Palou
>(Sorry, not sure how to post a live link in usenet)

Thank you. You've posted OK. Link is working.
Alex Palou obviously has natural development path, so he might be good
in F1 one day.
I'll watch him more closely in the future. :)

On 4/10/2023 8:19 pm, Yazoo wrote:
>
> Good place to read about differences:
>
> https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences

One of the biggest differences, according to some of the ex-F2 drivers in Indycar currently is the
tyres. They say in Indy you can spin up the rears, keep your boot in and they'll get hotter and
hotter and give more grip. Whereas they say that if you were to do that with the F1 / F2 Pirelli
rubber you'll lose the tyres - for good. They get slipperier as the wheelie goes on, chunks fly off
and they never come back to you.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy little classification
in the DSM"
David Melville

This is not an email and hasn't been checked for viruses by any half-arsed self-promoting software.

On Thu, 5 Oct 2023 17:53:28 +1300, ~misfit~
<shaun.at.pukekohe@gmail.com> wrote:

>On 4/10/2023 8:19 pm, Yazoo wrote:
>>
>> Good place to read about differences:
>>
>> https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences
>
>One of the biggest differences, according to some of the ex-F2 drivers in Indycar currently is the
>tyres. They say in Indy you can spin up the rears, keep your boot in and they'll get hotter and
>hotter and give more grip. Whereas they say that if you were to do that with the F1 / F2 Pirelli
>rubber you'll lose the tyres - for good. They get slipperier as the wheelie goes on, chunks fly off
>and they never come back to you.

Thanks. I didn't know about Indycar tyres, but I do know that F1 tyres
have to be managed well. If driver pushes them too much they will
degrade very quick. Based on what I learned about the differences, I
believe that F1 car is much more complicated and harder to drive.

Yazoo <yazoo@myself.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 5 Oct 2023 17:53:28 +1300, ~misfit~
> <shaun.at.pukekohe@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 4/10/2023 8:19 pm, Yazoo wrote:
>>>
>>> Good place to read about differences:
>>>
>>> https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences
>>
>> One of the biggest differences, according to some of the ex-F2 drivers
>> in Indycar currently is the
>> tyres. They say in Indy you can spin up the rears, keep your boot in and
>> they'll get hotter and
>> hotter and give more grip. Whereas they say that if you were to do that
>> with the F1 / F2 Pirelli
>> rubber you'll lose the tyres - for good. They get slipperier as the
>> wheelie goes on, chunks fly off
>> and they never come back to you.
>
> Thanks. I didn't know about Indycar tyres, but I do know that F1 tyres
> have to be managed well. If driver pushes them too much they will
> degrade very quick. Based on what I learned about the differences, I
> believe that F1 car is much more complicated and harder to drive.

A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very different
techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g. drafting is much more
important). It is my impression that Indycar requires less skill but more
bottle.

--
Sir Tim

On 5 Oct 2023 20:03:42 GMT, Sir Tim <no_email@invalid.invalid> wrote:

....

>
>A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very different
>techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g. drafting is much more
>important). It is my impression that Indycar requires less skill but more
>bottle.

Yes, exactly thats my opinion as well. :)

AFAIK, some drivers did well transfering from F1 to Indycar, but some
strugled a lot. I don't know any opposite direction (from Indycar to
F1) with any success.

On 10/6/2023 3:34 AM, Yazoo wrote:
> On 5 Oct 2023 20:03:42 GMT, Sir Tim <no_email@invalid.invalid>
> wrote:

>> A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very
>> different techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g.
>> drafting is much more important). It is my impression that Indycar
>> requires less skill but more bottle.
>
> Yes, exactly thats my opinion as well. :)
>
> AFAIK, some drivers did well transfering from F1 to Indycar, but
> some strugled a lot. I don't know any opposite direction (from
> Indycar to F1) with any success.

Mario.

--
Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge.
Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; knowledge
without compassion is inhuman. - Victor Weisskopf

On Friday, October 6, 2023 at 1:34:22 AM UTC-6, Yazoo wrote:

> AFAIK, some drivers did well transfering from F1 to Indycar, but some
> strugled a lot. I don't know any opposite direction (from Indycar to
> F1) with any success.

Jacques Villeneuve
Juan Pablo Montoya
Mario Andretti

On 10/6/2023 9:39 AM, texas gate wrote:
> On Friday, October 6, 2023 at 1:34:22 AM UTC-6, Yazoo wrote:
>
>> AFAIK, some drivers did well transfering from F1 to Indycar, but some
>> strugled a lot. I don't know any opposite direction (from Indycar to
>> F1) with any success.
>
> Jacques Villeneuve
> Juan Pablo Montoya

Prior to entering F1 each had raced competitively on road courses for
several years before two years in CART (which featured road and street
courses as well as ovals).

> Mario Andretti

No disagreement there.

--
Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge.
Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; knowledge
without compassion is inhuman. - Victor Weisskopf

On Fri, 06 Oct 2023 09:34:19 +0200, Yazoo <yazoo@myself.com> wrote:

>On 5 Oct 2023 20:03:42 GMT, Sir Tim <no_email@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>...
>
>>
>>A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very different
>>techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g. drafting is much more
>>important). It is my impression that Indycar requires less skill but more
>>bottle.
>
>Yes, exactly thats my opinion as well. :)
>
>AFAIK, some drivers did well transfering from F1 to Indycar, but some
>strugled a lot. I don't know any opposite direction (from Indycar to
>F1) with any success.
Jaques Villeneuve

On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 6:25:32 PM UTC-4, RichS wrote:
> On Fri, 06 Oct 2023 09:34:19 +0200, Yazoo <ya...@myself.com> wrote:
>
> >On 5 Oct 2023 20:03:42 GMT, Sir Tim <no_e...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> >
> >...
> >
> >>
> >>A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very different
> >>techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g. drafting is much more
> >>important). It is my impression that Indycar requires less skill but more
> >>bottle.
> >
> >Yes, exactly thats my opinion as well. :)
> >
> >AFAIK, some drivers did well transfering from F1 to Indycar, but some
> >strugled a lot. I don't know any opposite direction (from Indycar to
> >F1) with any success.
> Jaques Villeneuve

How about Michael Andretti himself? (13 starts, 1 podium, 7 career points (best race finish 3rd) [courtesy Sports Illustrated]

On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 6:41:31 PM UTC-6, JP wrote:

> How about Michael Andretti himself?

what do mean himself?

On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 4:25:32 PM UTC-6, RichS wrote:

> Jaques Villeneuve

sp Jacques Villeneuve

On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 8:25:53 PM UTC-6, texas gate wrote:
> On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 6:41:31 PM UTC-6, JP wrote:
>
> > How about Michael Andretti himself?
> what do mean himself?

oops got it

On 2023-10-05 13:03, Sir Tim wrote:
> Yazoo <yazoo@myself.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 5 Oct 2023 17:53:28 +1300, ~misfit~
>> <shaun.at.pukekohe@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 4/10/2023 8:19 pm, Yazoo wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Good place to read about differences:
>>>>
>>>> https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences
>>>
>>> One of the biggest differences, according to some of the ex-F2 drivers
>>> in Indycar currently is the
>>> tyres. They say in Indy you can spin up the rears, keep your boot in and
>>> they'll get hotter and
>>> hotter and give more grip. Whereas they say that if you were to do that
>>> with the F1 / F2 Pirelli
>>> rubber you'll lose the tyres - for good. They get slipperier as the
>>> wheelie goes on, chunks fly off
>>> and they never come back to you.
>>
>> Thanks. I didn't know about Indycar tyres, but I do know that F1 tyres
>> have to be managed well. If driver pushes them too much they will
>> degrade very quick. Based on what I learned about the differences, I
>> believe that F1 car is much more complicated and harder to drive.
>
> A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very different
> techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g. drafting is much more
> important). It is my impression that Indycar requires less skill but more
> bottle.
>

I think your impression is wrong.

Racing on an oval is different from a road course, obviously, but it
requires just as much skill. Ask Nigel Mansell what he thought about the
challenges of oval racing.

Furthermore, the feeder serieses (?) for IndyCar are road racing series.

I think by far the biggest factor is the lack of familiarity with the
tracks that F1 uses. This is what caught Michael Andretti out when he
tried to move from IndyCars to F1. He had plenty of success on IndyCar
road courses, but moving straight over to F1 and having to learn every
circuit from scratch at every race just wasn't workable.

On Monday, October 9, 2023 at 1:52:16 AM UTC-4, Alan wrote:
> On 2023-10-05 13:03, Sir Tim wrote:
> > Yazoo <ya...@myself.com> wrote:
> >> On Thu, 5 Oct 2023 17:53:28 +1300, ~misfit~
> >> <shaun.at...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 4/10/2023 8:19 pm, Yazoo wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Good place to read about differences:
> >>>>
> >>>> https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences
> >>>
> >>> One of the biggest differences, according to some of the ex-F2 drivers
> >>> in Indycar currently is the
> >>> tyres. They say in Indy you can spin up the rears, keep your boot in and
> >>> they'll get hotter and
> >>> hotter and give more grip. Whereas they say that if you were to do that
> >>> with the F1 / F2 Pirelli
> >>> rubber you'll lose the tyres - for good. They get slipperier as the
> >>> wheelie goes on, chunks fly off
> >>> and they never come back to you.
> >>
> >> Thanks. I didn't know about Indycar tyres, but I do know that F1 tyres
> >> have to be managed well. If driver pushes them too much they will
> >> degrade very quick. Based on what I learned about the differences, I
> >> believe that F1 car is much more complicated and harder to drive.
> >
> > A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very different
> > techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g. drafting is much more
> > important). It is my impression that Indycar requires less skill but more
> > bottle.
> >
> I think your impression is wrong.
>
> Racing on an oval is different from a road course, obviously, but it
> requires just as much skill. Ask Nigel Mansell what he thought about the
> challenges of oval racing.
>
> Furthermore, the feeder serieses (?) for IndyCar are road racing series.
>
> I think by far the biggest factor is the lack of familiarity with the
> tracks that F1 uses. This is what caught Michael Andretti out when he
> tried to move from IndyCars to F1. He had plenty of success on IndyCar
> road courses, but moving straight over to F1 and having to learn every
> circuit from scratch at every race just wasn't workable.

Yes, you’re right Alan, I understand oval racing is quite difficult, more so than one would expect. For his first year or so Grosjean didn’t drive any of the oval races but has now become pretty good.

Actually, Indy NXT (formerly Indy Lights), the next level down from Indycar runs on a couple of ovals, e.g. Iowa and Milwaukee.

On 2023-10-09 05:28, JP wrote:
> On Monday, October 9, 2023 at 1:52:16 AM UTC-4, Alan wrote:
>> On 2023-10-05 13:03, Sir Tim wrote:
>>> Yazoo <ya...@myself.com> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 5 Oct 2023 17:53:28 +1300, ~misfit~
>>>> <shaun.at...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 4/10/2023 8:19 pm, Yazoo wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Good place to read about differences:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences
>>>>>
>>>>> One of the biggest differences, according to some of the
>>>>> ex-F2 drivers in Indycar currently is the tyres. They say in
>>>>> Indy you can spin up the rears, keep your boot in and they'll
>>>>> get hotter and hotter and give more grip. Whereas they say
>>>>> that if you were to do that with the F1 / F2 Pirelli rubber
>>>>> you'll lose the tyres - for good. They get slipperier as the
>>>>> wheelie goes on, chunks fly off and they never come back to
>>>>> you.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks. I didn't know about Indycar tyres, but I do know that
>>>> F1 tyres have to be managed well. If driver pushes them too
>>>> much they will degrade very quick. Based on what I learned
>>>> about the differences, I believe that F1 car is much more
>>>> complicated and harder to drive.
>>>
>>> A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very
>>> different techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g.
>>> drafting is much more important). It is my impression that
>>> Indycar requires less skill but more bottle.
>>>
>> I think your impression is wrong.
>>
>> Racing on an oval is different from a road course, obviously, but
>> it requires just as much skill. Ask Nigel Mansell what he thought
>> about the challenges of oval racing.
>>
>> Furthermore, the feeder serieses (?) for IndyCar are road racing
>> series.
>>
>> I think by far the biggest factor is the lack of familiarity with
>> the tracks that F1 uses. This is what caught Michael Andretti out
>> when he tried to move from IndyCars to F1. He had plenty of success
>> on IndyCar road courses, but moving straight over to F1 and having
>> to learn every circuit from scratch at every race just wasn't
>> workable.
>
> Yes, you’re right Alan, I understand oval racing is quite difficult,
> more so than one would expect. For his first year or so Grosjean
> didn’t drive any of the oval races but has now become pretty good.
>
> Actually, Indy NXT (formerly Indy Lights), the next level down from
> Indycar runs on a couple of ovals, e.g. Iowa and Milwaukee.

True. I thought about that when I replied (and checking there's also
"World Wide Technology Raceway" in Madison Illinois), but that's still
only 3 out of 14 races, and on short ovals at that.

On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 11:52:16 PM UTC-6, Alan wrote:

> I think your impression is wrong.

I think you are a fucking cock sucker.

On Monday, October 9, 2023 at 7:00:19 PM UTC-4, Alan wrote:
> On 2023-10-09 05:28, JP wrote:
> > On Monday, October 9, 2023 at 1:52:16 AM UTC-4, Alan wrote:
> >> On 2023-10-05 13:03, Sir Tim wrote:
> >>> Yazoo <ya...@myself.com> wrote:
> >>>> On Thu, 5 Oct 2023 17:53:28 +1300, ~misfit~
> >>>> <shaun.at...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> On 4/10/2023 8:19 pm, Yazoo wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Good place to read about differences:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> https://www.redbull.com/us-en/indycar-vs-f1-differences
> >>>>>
> >>>>> One of the biggest differences, according to some of the
> >>>>> ex-F2 drivers in Indycar currently is the tyres. They say in
> >>>>> Indy you can spin up the rears, keep your boot in and they'll
> >>>>> get hotter and hotter and give more grip. Whereas they say
> >>>>> that if you were to do that with the F1 / F2 Pirelli rubber
> >>>>> you'll lose the tyres - for good. They get slipperier as the
> >>>>> wheelie goes on, chunks fly off and they never come back to
> >>>>> you.
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks. I didn't know about Indycar tyres, but I do know that
> >>>> F1 tyres have to be managed well. If driver pushes them too
> >>>> much they will degrade very quick. Based on what I learned
> >>>> about the differences, I believe that F1 car is much more
> >>>> complicated and harder to drive.
> >>>
> >>> A lot of Indycar racing takes place on ovals, which require very
> >>> different techniques from the road circuits that F1 uses (e.g.
> >>> drafting is much more important). It is my impression that
> >>> Indycar requires less skill but more bottle.
> >>>
> >> I think your impression is wrong.
> >>
> >> Racing on an oval is different from a road course, obviously, but
> >> it requires just as much skill. Ask Nigel Mansell what he thought
> >> about the challenges of oval racing.
> >>
> >> Furthermore, the feeder serieses (?) for IndyCar are road racing
> >> series.
> >>
> >> I think by far the biggest factor is the lack of familiarity with
> >> the tracks that F1 uses. This is what caught Michael Andretti out
> >> when he tried to move from IndyCars to F1. He had plenty of success
> >> on IndyCar road courses, but moving straight over to F1 and having
> >> to learn every circuit from scratch at every race just wasn't
> >> workable.
> >
> > Yes, you’re right Alan, I understand oval racing is quite difficult,
> > more so than one would expect. For his first year or so Grosjean
> > didn’t drive any of the oval races but has now become pretty good.
> >
> > Actually, Indy NXT (formerly Indy Lights), the next level down from
> > Indycar runs on a couple of ovals, e.g. Iowa and Milwaukee.
> True. I thought about that when I replied (and checking there's also
> "World Wide Technology Raceway" in Madison Illinois), but that's still
> only 3 out of 14 races, and on short ovals at that.

Yeah I saw that too when I looked it up. The World Wide Blah Blah is a NASCAR track.

I guess maybe they use the shorter ovals to “ease them in.” But the short ones can be challenging too because even though they don’t have the outright speed you’re always turning. I don’t like to watch them because they make me dizzy. But I guess my wife would say that’s a natural state for me. ;-)