Le 2024-03-19 à 05:43, Whisper a écrit :
> On 19/03/2024 7:30 am, Scout wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>> news:65f44162$1@news.ausics.net...
>>> On 15/03/2024 7:13 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, but what created natural selection?
>>
>> Reality. Something you apparently know very little about.
>>
>>
>
>
> Who's reality?
What a nonsensical question. That's like asking «How much blue weight ?»
>
> Natural selection obviously exists, but how did it get a foothold? 'it's
> natural' type answers are not very helpful.
It got it's «foothold» when life started and the local condition
changed. That change can be local or due to those organism being
transported somewhere else.
This have been explained to you before. More than once in this thread.

Le 2024-03-19 à 01:45, Siri Cruise a écrit :
> Whisper wrote:
>> On 17/03/2024 1:19 pm, Siri Cruise wrote:
>>> Kualinar wrote:
>>>> Adding a god does nothing but add complexity to the problem and
>>>> don't solve anything.
>>>
>>> Truth doesn't depend on what you deem necessary. Truth is.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Who gets to decide what the truth is?
>
> No human. A god perhaps can.
>
> When we need a truth we have methods to collectively decide what we call
> the truth. Smart ones acknowledge that has sent innocents to the gallows.
>
There is no need to introduce any god or other agency to decide what
truth is.
Truth is what concord with reality.

Mitchell Holman wrote:
> 2) Baptists are the single biggest
> denomination in the country, of course
> their beliefs are relevant to the issue.

The minority of christians. Most christians are catholics.

>> Why not a catholic church?
>> https://www.catholic.com/qa/should-we-read-the-bible-literally-or-symbo
>> lically
>>
> You denied any Christians held the
> Bible as inerrant, I showed where

Quote me. If you read catholic sources, they will point out you
use 'inerrant' despite most christians not accepting your
definitions. Your continued insistence identifies this as your
strawman. You do not want an honest engagement you want an
irrational cudgel to beat your way to victolly!

> If all of the Bible cannot be trusted
> as accurate then why trust any of it?

If you consulted people or other baptists, you would have an
answer you couldn't use as a cudgel.

--
Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. @
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' /|\
The Church of the Holey Apple .signature 3.2 / \
of Discordian Mysteries. This post insults Islam. Mohamed

On 3/19/2024 2:43 AM, Whisper wrote:
> On 19/03/2024 7:30 am, Scout wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>> news:65f44162$1@news.ausics.net...
>>> On 15/03/2024 7:13 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, but what created natural selection?
>>
>> Reality. Something you apparently know very little about.
>>
>>
>
>
> Who's reality?

Everyone's. There is only one reality.

On 3/19/2024 12:32 PM, Siri Cruise wrote:
> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>     2) Baptists are the single biggest
>> denomination in the country, of course
>> their beliefs are relevant to the issue.
>
> The minority of christians. Most christians are catholics.

In the U.S., Catholics are 20.8% of all Christians; Christians altogether are
70.6% of the U.S. population. So-called "evangelical" Protestants, who in fact
are mostly fundamentalists, comprise 25.4% Christians; mainline Protestants
comprise 14.7%

https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/religious-landscape-study/

Phil Omdahl wrote:
> On 3/19/2024 2:43 AM, Whisper wrote:
>> On 19/03/2024 7:30 am, Scout wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>>> news:65f44162$1@news.ausics.net...
>>>> On 15/03/2024 7:13 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, but what created natural selection?
>>>
>>> Reality. Something you apparently know very little about.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Who's reality?
>
> Everyone's. There is only one reality.
>

So I assume.

--
Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. @
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' /|\
The Church of the Holey Apple .signature 3.2 / \
of Discordian Mysteries. This post insults Islam. Mohamed

On 3/19/24 00:39, the late Mark Wieber wrote:
> On 3/18/2024 10:34 PM, Siri Cruise wrote:
>> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>> https://www.namb.net/apologetics/resource/the-three-i-s-of-scripture-
>>> inspired-interrant-infallible/
>>>
>>
>> Now you claim all christians are Baptists.
>
> No, he didn't.

He did cite a Southern Baptist source.

On 3/19/24 13:15, Mitchell Holman wrote:
> Siri Cruise <chine.bleu@www.yahoo.com> wrote in
> news:utchvl$uqbb$1@dont-email.me:
>
>> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>> Siri Cruise <chine.bleu@www.yahoo.com> wrote in
>>> news:utb84g$ltdf$1@dont- email.me:
>>>
>>>> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>>>> https://www.namb.net/apologetics/resource/the-three-i-s-of-scripture
>>>>> - inspired-interrant-infallible/
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Now you claim all christians are Baptists.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Why do you keep deleting posts?
>>>
>>> The claim was that some Christians
>>> hold the Bible as infallible, I posted
>>> multiple cites showing that, you delete
>>> them all and build a strawman about
>>> Baptists?
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Then why cite from a Baptist church?
>
>
> 1) I cited three sources, why did
> you delete two of them?
>
> 2) Baptists are the single biggest
> denomination in the country, of course
> their beliefs are relevant to the issue.
>
>
>>
>> Why not a catholic church?v
>> https://www.catholic.com/qa/should-we-read-the-bible-literally-or-symbo
>> lically
>>
>
> You denied any Christians held the
> Bible as inerrant, I showed where
> SOME do. No one said that all do.
>
> But that raises a related question.
>
> If all of the Bible cannot be trusted
> as accurate then why trust any of it?

This is actually a very good question, and this very question has caused
much division within the Church.

On 3/19/24 07:48, Mitchell Holman wrote:
> Siri Cruise <chine.bleu@www.yahoo.com> wrote in news:utb84g$ltdf$1@dont-
> email.me:
>
>> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>> https://www.namb.net/apologetics/resource/the-three-i-s-of-scripture-
>>> inspired-interrant-infallible/
>>>
>>
>> Now you claim all christians are Baptists.
>>
>
>
> Why do you keep deleting posts?
>
> The claim was that some Christians
> hold the Bible as infallible, I posted
> multiple cites showing that, you delete
> them all and build a strawman about
> Baptists?

You cited an SBC source.

On 3/19/2024 2:53 PM, David Hartung wrote:
> On 3/19/24 00:39, the late Mark Wieber wrote:
>> On 3/18/2024 10:34 PM, Siri Cruise wrote:
>>> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>>> https://www.namb.net/apologetics/resource/the-three-i-s-of-scripture-
>>>> inspired-interrant-infallible/
>>>>
>>>
>>> Now you claim all christians are Baptists.
>>
>> No, he didn't.
>
> He did cite a Southern Baptist source.

Because they're emblematic of stupid fundamentalists.

"Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
news:65f95e3a$1@news.ausics.net...
> On 19/03/2024 7:30 am, Scout wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>> news:65f44162$1@news.ausics.net...
>>> On 15/03/2024 7:13 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, but what created natural selection?
>>
>> Reality. Something you apparently know very little about.
>>
>>
>
>
> Who's reality?

You think there are different realities?

What is your basis for such a conclusion?

>
> Natural selection obviously exists, but how did it get a foothold?

Those that died early... didn't reproduce.

Those that did... did.

Thus those best at surviving tend to produce more offspring than those that
didn't.

> 'it's natural' type answers are not very helpful.

True, as it does sort of assume some level of intelligence at both ends of
the conversation... something that seems to be weak at your end.

Scout wrote:
>>
>> Who's reality?
>
> You think there are different realities?
>
> What is your basis for such a conclusion?

Who is reality?

I am. Grovel before me.

--
Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. @
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' /|\
The Church of the Holey Apple .signature 3.2 / \
of Discordian Mysteries. This post insults Islam. Mohamed

On 3/19/2024 4:39 PM, Siri Cruise wrote:
> Scout wrote:
>>>
>>> Who's reality?
>>
>> You think there are different realities?
>>
>> What is your basis for such a conclusion?
>
> Who is reality?

She is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reality_Winner

David Hartung wrote:
> On 3/19/24 13:15, Mitchell Holman wrote:
>> Siri Cruise <chine.bleu@www.yahoo.com> wrote in
>> news:utchvl$uqbb$1@dont-email.me:
>>
>>> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>>> Siri Cruise <chine.bleu@www.yahoo.com> wrote in
>>>> news:utb84g$ltdf$1@dont- email.me:
>>>>
>>>>> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>>>>> https://www.namb.net/apologetics/resource/the-three-i-s-of-scripture
>>>>>> - inspired-interrant-infallible/
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Now you claim all christians are Baptists.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        Why do you keep deleting posts?
>>>>
>>>>        The claim was that some Christians
>>>> hold the Bible as infallible, I posted
>>>> multiple cites showing that, you delete
>>>> them all and build a strawman about
>>>> Baptists?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Then why cite from a Baptist church?
>>
>>
>>     1) I cited three sources, why did
>> you delete two of them?
>>
>>     2) Baptists are the single biggest
>> denomination in the country, of course
>> their beliefs are relevant to the issue.
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Why not a catholic church?v
>>> https://www.catholic.com/qa/should-we-read-the-bible-literally-or-symbo
>>> lically
>>>
>>
>>   You denied any Christians held the
>> Bible as inerrant, I showed where
>> SOME do. No one said that all do.
>>
>>   But that raises a related question.
>>
>>   If all of the Bible cannot be trusted
>> as accurate then why trust any of it?
>
> This is actually a very good question, and this very question has
> caused much division within the Church.
>
>

the bible is a collection of texts. there's no good reason to believe it
'speaks' with a unity

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs cannot withstand reason, fact, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"Religion is an evil who's goal is mind control"

Maximus <gladiator@colosseum.rome> wrote in
news:l5urqdF92qdU1@mid.individual.net:

> � oAtheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!� -
> hhyapster 7.4.23
>
> "Christian beliefs cannot withstand reason, fact, and knowledge"
>
> "Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"
>
> "God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
> The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."
>
> "Religion is an evil who's goal is mind control"

"The Bible, properly read, is the most potent
force for atheism ever devised"
- Isaac Asimov -

David Hartung <junk@nogood.com> wrote in news:VZCcnQ9OC-
0elGf4nZ2dnZeNn_cAAAAA@giganews.com:

> On 3/19/24 07:48, Mitchell Holman wrote:
>> Siri Cruise <chine.bleu@www.yahoo.com> wrote in news:utb84g$ltdf$1@dont-
>> email.me:
>>
>>> Mitchell Holman wrote:
>>>> https://www.namb.net/apologetics/resource/the-three-i-s-of-scripture-
>>>> inspired-interrant-infallible/
>>>>
>>>
>>> Now you claim all christians are Baptists.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Why do you keep deleting posts?
>>
>> The claim was that some Christians
>> hold the Bible as infallible, I posted
>> multiple cites showing that, you delete
>> them all and build a strawman about
>> Baptists?
>
> You cited an SBC source.
>
>

I cited multiple sources.

Maximus wrote:
> the bible is a collection of texts. there's no good reason to
> believe it 'speaks' with a unity

Which is a different consideration than whether christians think
it is inerrant.

--
Siri Seal of Disavowal #000-001. Disavowed. Denied. @
'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' /|\
The Church of the Holey Apple .signature 3.2 / \
of Discordian Mysteries. This post insults Islam. Mohamed

On 3/19/2024 8:32 PM, Siri Cruise wrote:
> Maximus wrote:
>> the bible is a collection of texts. there's no good reason to believe it
>> 'speaks' with a unity
>
> Which is a different consideration than whether christians think it is inerrant.

That's true, but we know there are *many* christians who believe the bible to be
not only inerrant but infallible.

They are idiots.

Kualinar wrote on 20/03/2024 3:40 am:

<Snip>

> How an all loving god who forgive can sent peoples to eternal torture
> JUST for not believing in it ? That quality make that «original sin» an
> absurdity. An all loving, forgiving, god would have forgiven that error
> by Adam & Eve who had NO WAY to know was «bad» until AFTER committing
> that error. It was eating the fruit of the tree of KNOWLEDGE. Including
> the knowledge of good and bad/evil. Before, they DID NOT KNOW that
> eating that fruit was a bad thing.

But didn't God tell them they could have the fruits of ALL the other
trees, just not touch that ONE tree??

AH! Yes .... https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Genesis-Chapter-2/

Genesis Chapt 2

Verse 9 .... And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree
that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also
in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Verse 15 .... And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the garden
of Eden to dress it and to keep it.

Verse 16 .... And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree
of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

Verse 17 .... But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou
shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt
surely die.

So Adam couldn't know the difference between Good and Evil, just that he
was doing what God had said NOT to do!!
--
Daniel

Daniel65 wrote:
> Kualinar wrote on 20/03/2024 3:40 am:
>
> <Snip>
>
>> How an all loving god who forgive can sent peoples to eternal torture
>> JUST for not believing in it ? That quality make that «original sin»
>> an absurdity. An all loving, forgiving, god would have forgiven that
>> error by Adam & Eve who had NO WAY to know was «bad» until AFTER
>> committing that error. It was eating the fruit of the tree of
>> KNOWLEDGE. Including the knowledge of good and bad/evil. Before, they
>> DID NOT KNOW that eating that fruit was a bad thing.
>
> But didn't God tell them they could have the fruits of ALL the other
> trees, just not touch that ONE tree??
>
> AH! Yes .... https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Genesis-Chapter-2/
>
> Genesis Chapt 2
>
> Verse 9 .... And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every
> tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of
> life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of
> good and evil.
>
> Verse 15 .... And the LORD God took the man, and put him into the
> garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.
>
> Verse 16 .... And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every
> tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
>
> Verse 17 .... But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou
> shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou
> shalt surely die.
>
> So Adam couldn't know the difference between Good and Evil, just that
> he was doing what God had said NOT to do!!

I will never understand how grown intelligent educated persons living
today can honestly believe such nonsense.

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs cannot withstand reason, fact, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"Religion is an evil who's goal is mind control"

Siri Cruise wrote:
> Maximus wrote:
>> the bible is a collection of texts. there's no good reason to believe
>> it 'speaks' with unity
>
> Which is a different consideration than whether christians think it is
> inerrant.
>

it's related

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs cannot withstand reason, fact, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"Religion is an evil who's goal is mind control"

On 20/03/2024 6:29 am, Kualinar wrote:
> Le 2024-03-19 à 05:43, Whisper a écrit :
>> On 19/03/2024 7:30 am, Scout wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>>> news:65f44162$1@news.ausics.net...
>>>> On 15/03/2024 7:13 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, but what created natural selection?
>>>
>>> Reality. Something you apparently know very little about.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Who's reality?
> What a nonsensical question. That's like asking «How much blue weight ?»
>>

Compare the reality of a blind and deaf person (from birth) to your
reality.

>> Natural selection obviously exists, but how did it get a foothold?
>> 'it's natural' type answers are not very helpful.
> It got it's «foothold» when life started and the local condition
> changed.

Explain this 'foothold'. How did it come to be.

>That change can be local or due to those organism being
> transported somewhere else.
> This have been explained to you before. More than once in this thread.

I understand what you're saying, but it's fucking useless as far as
actually answering my questions.

On 20/03/2024 6:37 am, Phil Omdahl wrote:
> On 3/19/2024 2:43 AM, Whisper wrote:
>> On 19/03/2024 7:30 am, Scout wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>>> news:65f44162$1@news.ausics.net...
>>>> On 15/03/2024 7:13 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, but what created natural selection?
>>>
>>> Reality. Something you apparently know very little about.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Who's reality?
>
> Everyone's. There is only one reality.
>

Nope. A color blind person can't even see the colors you see - which
reality is real? A blind and/or deaf person's reality is very real to
them, but very different to yours and mine. There are forces and
concepts we are blind to, but our reality is still real to us even
though we are missing a lot of reality out there. Many of us accept
complete BS concepts like big bangs, dark matter/energy etc even though
they don't exist.

The problem is none of us know the true reality, and never will as we
are humans and incapable of ever understanding the true nature of the
universe. I accept it as it's perfectly reasonable, many don't and just
crap on about 'it's natural' or 'it's god'. Weak.

On 20/03/2024 8:25 am, Siri Cruise wrote:
> Phil Omdahl wrote:
>> On 3/19/2024 2:43 AM, Whisper wrote:
>>> On 19/03/2024 7:30 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>>>> news:65f44162$1@news.ausics.net...
>>>>> On 15/03/2024 7:13 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, but what created natural selection?
>>>>
>>>> Reality. Something you apparently know very little about.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Who's reality?
>>
>> Everyone's. There is only one reality.
>>
>
> So I assume.
>

Yes there is 1 reality, but humans will never perceive it in totality.
We have a very blinkered and fragmented view of the universe. That's
the best we'll ever do.

On 20/03/2024 9:20 am, Scout wrote:
>
>
> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
> news:65f95e3a$1@news.ausics.net...
>> On 19/03/2024 7:30 am, Scout wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> "Whisper" <whisper@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>>> news:65f44162$1@news.ausics.net...
>>>> On 15/03/2024 7:13 am, Scout wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, but what created natural selection?
>>>
>>> Reality. Something you apparently know very little about.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Who's reality?
>
> You think there are different realities?
>

I think, know, there are many different perceptions of reality, all
incomplete.

> What is your basis for such a conclusion?
>
>

Pretty fucking obvious.

>>
>> Natural selection obviously exists, but how did it get a foothold?
>
> Those that died early... didn't reproduce.

That's not an answer. You're looking at effect without cause.

>
> Those that did... did.
>
> Thus those best at surviving tend to produce more offspring than those
> that didn't.
>
>> 'it's natural' type answers are not very helpful.
>
> True, as it does sort of assume some level of intelligence at both ends
> of the conversation... something that seems to be weak at your end.
>
>
>

lol doesn't take much brain power to understand what you guys are
posting - no offense : )