JMB99 <mb@nospam.net> wrote:
> On 06/03/2024 14:01, John Williamson wrote:
>> If, like many people, you use only cell based comms, (Now cheaper than
>> landline and which are not locked to any particular location) you will
>> wonder what all the fuss is about.
>
>
> Any listener to radio phone-ins and radio news programmes will know just
> reliable VOIP is!
>
>
That’s more a function of a poor quality communication link rather than
VOIP as a technology.

On 07/03/2024 08:45, Tweed wrote:
> That’s more a function of a poor quality communication link rather than
> VOIP as a technology.

Does not matter what the cause is if you cannot communicate with people
because of it.

Occasionally the person in the studio will give up and connect by
landline and straight away get a perfect connection.

On 07/03/2024 08:32, JMB99 wrote:
> On 06/03/2024 14:01, John Williamson wrote:
>> If, like many people, you use only cell based comms, (Now cheaper than
>> landline and which are not locked to any particular location) you will
>> wonder what all the fuss is about.
>
>
> Any listener to radio phone-ins and radio news programmes will know just
> reliable VOIP is!
>
>
>
The problem isn't the VOIP element, it is the cellular system it is
using. A lot of reporters seem to be calling in using Zoom or a similar
technology over a poor quality connection. If they made a standard voice
call instead, they need less bandwidth and the error correction seems to
be better.

Back in the day, there used to be a technician on all BBC phone in
programmes who would call you back after you called in and check the
line quality before you went on air. Nowadays, it sounds as if they just
put you on hold until it's your turn and hope for the best.

Tciao for Now!

John.

On Wed, 6 Mar 2024 15:12:13 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk>
wrote:

>I think plugging the master plug from your extension wiring into the
>router (via a converter if necessary) should make all your old kit work
>via the new system, though it may be inconvenient if your router is not
>currently near your master socket.

It will work, and even if the router is not conveniently near where
you would really like your phone to be, just move the base station of
the phone next to the router anyway and buy another extension handset.

Or you might be able to obtain just another charging stand (from
Ebay?) for the handset you already have in the base station, so that
you can continue to use it somewhere else. You'll then have a base
station with no handset next to the router, and the same number of
handsets around the house that you had previously, at very little
extra expense.

Rod.

That sounds daft. You might as well call via whatsapp then.

Yes on Rabbit, they would have gone on working but I got fed up with
eternally replacing the rechargeable batteries as one always lost capacity
before the other one did. Nickel-Metal Hydrides were in mine but I don't
think double A sized ones were as high capacity as the more modern ones and
had a habit of self discharging. Eventually the legends wore off the keys
and some keys needed to be wobbled to make contact, they were heavy too.
Brian

--

--:
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...
briang1@blueyonder.co.uk
Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote in message
news:CNAX4dHUQI6lFw+R@255soft.uk...
> In message <us9fms$asjm$1@dont-email.me> at Wed, 6 Mar 2024 10:14:50,
> Brian Gaff <brian1gaff@gmail.com> writes
>>No I men the old analogue walk about phones. They simply used 49Mhz and
>>just
>>at the high frequency end ofmedium wave. They had no protection against
>>eavesdroppers as they used narrow band FM.
>
> Ah yes. I think I still have one (though I usually use a corded 'phone).
>
>> I do also admit in its day, owning a Rabbit system With my base station
>> up
>>high in the building I found in places I could get a mile out of them. The
>>idea was also that you had rbbit phone points around the place and you
>>could
>>also communicate via those. For what it was, it worked for many years as a
>>cordless digital mobile. I don't know what protocols it used but the
>>frequencies were high. After a while phone got shut down of course as
>>nobody
>>wanted to pay a connection rate to the company which ran them.
>
> I remember seeing the base stations at motorway services and the like. I
> think they continued to work as a home cordless after they turned off the
> network.
>>
>>T
>>Are there any mobiles around now which can be used the house on a landline
>>and as a mobile?
>>Brian
>
> Good question! I'm not aware of any. Though when we switch to VoIP, I
> think it'll become moot, in that you'll be able to use your VoIPphone
> wherever you can get internet (at call costs of whatever your VoIPphone
> provider - who doesn't have to be your broadband provider, and in the case
> of PlusNet certainly won't be). The one I looked at (VoIPfone) was IIRR
> 1p/minute (or 7p/minute to UK mobiles!), though had packages similar to
> mobile ones of so many minutes a month (to both land and mobiles) for a
> monthly fee (e. g. IIRR 100 minutes for the fiver-a-month one). (2p/min to
> USA, including USA mobiles, i. e. yes, outside monthly package minutes, UK
> mobiles cost more to call than US ones.)
> --
> J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
>
> The first draft was "flick me all over with ..." (RT Chtr 2020)

In message <l4t8ehF4l60U1@mid.individual.net> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
07:25:05, John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> writes
>On 06/03/2024 22:52, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>
>>> I have unlimited calls, text and broadband on my pay monthly cell
>>> connection, and it costs me about half the price that an equivalent
>>> landline package would.
>>
>> Interesting! Who are you with? Do you find broadband-via-mobile is
>> adequate technically (speed, reliability, other)? How much _do_ you pay?
>> (Obviously feel free not to answer that - or any of this of course!)
>
>I have SIM my accounts with EE and Vodafone at about thirty quid a
>month each. Netter deals are probably available, but ICBA looking. The
>phine cost me £160, and the router cost me £30. If I were willing to
>put up with losing the internet on one account while talking on the
>other, it takes two SIMs. It happily carries on working if I use the BB
>account on the SIM I'm talking via.

I've not noticed any degradation of my landline-based broadband when I'm
using the 'phone.
>
>Last time I asked the question, a landline was about £55.

For monthly cost, see Andy's post and my reply.
>
>For the majority of the time I can stream 2K definition video on either
>accounts. Occasionally, one of them drops out.

So to get _reliable_ BB, you're paying about 2 × 30 = 60 quid a month.
>>>
>>> If your cell is costing you more per month than a landline, then as
>>> most pay as you use it packages require a minimum top up every month
>>> anyway, you may as well go for the unlimited contract option.
>>>
>> Indeed; it hearkens back to the old dial-up days, when the knowledge
>> that every minute was costing you inhibited use. You say "than a
>> landline" - I don't consider that I pay separately for my landline, just
>> all as part of my broadband;
>
>I remember maxing out my 20GB landline data allowance on the dim and
>distant past. I also remember uploading and downloading stuff via 2G
>cellphone at 9600 baud, and paying by the minute.
>
I don't think most landline-based broadband has an allowance these days
- well, I'm sure they do (hidden under "fair usage", a weasel term I
don't think the industry should be allowed), but high enough most people
never hit it. Do mobile-based BB contracts have a limit?
>
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

I'd rather trust the guys in the lab coats who aren't demanding that I get up
early on Sundays to apologize for being human.
-- Captain Splendid (quoted by "The Real Bev" in mozilla.general, 2014-11-16)

In message <l4tbfiF4fn8U1@mid.individual.net> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
08:16:50, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> writes
>John Williamson wrote:
>
>> Last time I asked the question, a landline was about £55.
>
>Plusnet currently costs me £26.20/m for line rental, off-peak calls and
>80/20Mb broadband (from next month, the CPI+3.9% will see it rise to
>£28.37)
>
I too am paying PlusNet twentysomething - "line rental" (I'll certainly
be glad to see _that_ term consigned to history!), anytime calls, and (I
think) 30/10 broadband; as you say, the CPI+3.9 cuts in at the end of
this month.

(Where did the 3.9% come from? It seems to be used by most providers.
[And one - fortunately not PlusNet - provider uses RPI not CPI.])

The cost of a _new_ landline, if you don't have one, I _think_ is in
three figures, but that's one-off. After end of POTS, I don't know what
will happen there: presumably there'll still be an installation cost for
new users, though presumably fibre. (As, presumably, is happening for
new builds, such as estates.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Worst programme ever made? I was in hospital once having a knee operation and I
watched a whole episode of "EastEnders". Ugh! I suppose it's true to life. But
so is diarrhoea - and I don't want to see that on television. - Patrick Moore,
in Radio Times 12-18 May 2007.

In message <usc43n$10731$1@dont-email.me> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024 10:15:16,
Brian Gaff <brian1gaff@gmail.com> writes
>That sounds daft. You might as well call via whatsapp then.
>
>Yes on Rabbit, they would have gone on working but I got fed up with
>eternally replacing the rechargeable batteries as one always lost capacity
>before the other one did. Nickel-Metal Hydrides were in mine but I don't
>think double A sized ones were as high capacity as the more modern ones and
>had a habit of self discharging. Eventually the legends wore off the keys
>and some keys needed to be wobbled to make contact, they were heavy too.
>Brian
>
There are now two sorts of nickel metal hydride cells. In AA size, the
ordinary sort are pushing 3 amp hours (I refuse to continue to use
milliamp-hours now we're so far past 1 - you can get 1 in triple A cells
now!), though seem not to quite reach it - 2.95 seems common. The other
sort are low self-discharge - retain 80-90% capacity even after a year -
and those seem to be about 2.5 Ah capacity; the practical difference
therefore favours the latter sort, for nearly all purposes (maybe people
using high-discharge _regularly_ might go for the other sort just for
the high capacity - professional photographers, modellers). The low
self-discharge sort are distinguishable by usually being sold charged -
"ready to use"; there are several known makes (or rather models, from
known makes), the one I can think of being eneloop though I can't
remember who from, but Lidl also sell them occasionally (they also
occasionally sell the ordinary sort, so look for the "ready to use" or
similar wording).
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Worst programme ever made? I was in hospital once having a knee operation and I
watched a whole episode of "EastEnders". Ugh! I suppose it's true to life. But
so is diarrhoea - and I don't want to see that on television. - Patrick Moore,
in Radio Times 12-18 May 2007.

J. P. Gilliver <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
> In message <l4tbfiF4fn8U1@mid.individual.net> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
> 08:16:50, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> writes
>> John Williamson wrote:
>>
>>> Last time I asked the question, a landline was about £55.
>>
>> Plusnet currently costs me £26.20/m for line rental, off-peak calls and
>> 80/20Mb broadband (from next month, the CPI+3.9% will see it rise to
>> £28.37)
>>
> I too am paying PlusNet twentysomething - "line rental" (I'll certainly
> be glad to see _that_ term consigned to history!), anytime calls, and (I
> think) 30/10 broadband; as you say, the CPI+3.9 cuts in at the end of
> this month.
>
> (Where did the 3.9% come from? It seems to be used by most providers.
> [And one - fortunately not PlusNet - provider uses RPI not CPI.])
>
> The cost of a _new_ landline, if you don't have one, I _think_ is in
> three figures, but that's one-off. After end of POTS, I don't know what
> will happen there: presumably there'll still be an installation cost for
> new users, though presumably fibre. (As, presumably, is happening for
> new builds, such as estates.)

As to installation costs, that will depend on local competition. My
recently installed CityFibre based optical fibre had a zero installation
fee.

J. P. Gilliver wrote:

> Where did the 3.9% come from?

I started-off assuming +3.9% was the max allowed by OFCOM, but it
appears OFCOM also wondered where it comes from ... their conclusion
just seems to be that a pounds+pence increase must be quoted rather than
a formula ...

On 07/03/2024 10:49, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <l4tbfiF4fn8U1@mid.individual.net> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
> 08:16:50, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> writes
>> John Williamson wrote:
>>
>>> Last time I asked the question, a landline was about £55.
>>
>> Plusnet currently costs me £26.20/m for line rental, off-peak calls
>> and 80/20Mb broadband (from next month, the CPI+3.9% will see it rise
>> to £28.37)
>>
It seems I am out of date, then, but as I am not able to make use of a
fixed connection point, it's not that important to me. Plusnet isn't all
that far off what I am paying, it seems.

> I too am paying PlusNet twentysomething - "line rental" (I'll certainly
> be glad to see _that_ term consigned to history!), anytime calls, and (I
> think) 30/10 broadband; as you say, the CPI+3.9 cuts in at the end of
> this month.
>
There will still be a monthly fee for the service, no matter what they
call it. There has to be a connection to your premises as well as other
stuff going on, all of which which costs money to maintain. Switching to
VOIP will make it easier for them to alter the cost of use as well as
connection quality on a packet by packet basis if needed as a load
balancing measure.

All that going over to VOIP will change is that there will be one less
conversion from digital to analogue and vice versa in the exchange. That
conversion will, instead, be done at your end of the "last mile". What
happens now is that your analogue signals get converted to digital in
the exchange and squirted along their internal VOIP networks, then
reconverted to squirt the analogue down your POTS wires, which currently
also carry the broadband signal as modulated HF signals. It has been a
long time since exchanges were full of clattering rotary switches and
relays. In most villages, the exchange is under a manhole cover outside
the old exchange which is now someone's home, and the operator is as
likely as not to be working from home in Dundee or somewhere.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 07/03/2024 10:57, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <usc43n$10731$1@dont-email.me> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024 10:15:16,
> Brian Gaff <brian1gaff@gmail.com> writes
>> That sounds daft. You might as well call via whatsapp then.
>>
>> Yes on Rabbit, they would have gone on working but I got fed up with
>> eternally replacing the rechargeable batteries as one always lost
>> capacity
>> before the other one did. Nickel-Metal Hydrides were in mine but I don't
>> think double A sized ones were as high capacity as the more modern
>> ones and
>> had a habit of self discharging. Eventually the legends wore off the keys
>> and some keys needed to be wobbled to make contact, they were heavy too.
>> Brian
>>
> There are now two sorts of nickel metal hydride cells. In AA size, the
> ordinary sort are pushing 3 amp hours (I refuse to continue to use
> milliamp-hours now we're so far past 1 - you can get 1 in triple A cells
> now!), though seem not to quite reach it - 2.95 seems common. The other
> sort are low self-discharge - retain 80-90% capacity even after a year -
> and those seem to be about 2.5 Ah capacity; the practical difference
> therefore favours the latter sort, for nearly all purposes (maybe people
> using high-discharge _regularly_ might go for the other sort just for
> the high capacity - professional photographers, modellers). The low
> self-discharge sort are distinguishable by usually being sold charged -
> "ready to use"; there are several known makes (or rather models, from
> known makes), the one I can think of being eneloop though I can't
> remember who from, but Lidl also sell them occasionally (they also
> occasionally sell the ordinary sort, so look for the "ready to use" or
> similar wording).

Replacing time expired NiMH or NiCd cells is normally easy. Open the
cover, replace the useless cells and you're good for another year or
two. My cordless landline phone was on its third or fourth set when I
moved on to the boat, so couldn't make use of it any longer. They can
even be replaced by primary cells in an emergency. They are also easily
recyclable.

The lithium batteries are usually permanently built in, with the cells
custom designed to fit and welded in place. This means that when they do
eventually fail, the device is scrap. For consumer devices, they are
usually sized to give the minimum acceptable run time between charges,
so for extended use, you need either a spare device or an external power
pack. They are also currently not easy to recycle, though there are a
few places which now do it.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

In message <l4tmmdF6j4oU2@mid.individual.net> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
11:28:14, Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> writes
>J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>
>> Where did the 3.9% come from?
>
>I started-off assuming +3.9% was the max allowed by OFCOM, but it
>appears OFCOM also wondered where it comes from ... their conclusion
>just seems to be that a pounds+pence increase must be quoted rather
>than a formula ...
>
I think PlusNet _have_ always told me in pounds and pence, but cited the
CPI+3.9% as the _reason_ - and they added _that_ to the contract terms,
I think about three or four years ago. I'm glad to hear OFCom are also
puzzled by where it comes from - but not surprised they haven't pursued
the matter: OFCom, like most of the OFs, mostly do _not_ operate in the
_customer's_ interests, but the industry's.
>
>
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove
that the other party is unfit to rule - and both commonly succeed, and are
right. -H.L. Mencken, writer, editor, and critic (1880-1956)

In message <l4tmpbF6o7aU1@mid.individual.net> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
11:29:47, John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> writes
>On 07/03/2024 10:49, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
[]
>> I too am paying PlusNet twentysomething - "line rental" (I'll certainly
>> be glad to see _that_ term consigned to history!), anytime calls, and (I
[]
>There will still be a monthly fee for the service, no matter what they
>call it. There has to be a connection to your premises as well as other

Yes, but I pay a monthly fee for my broadband. Now that that's fixed
(and has been for some years) rather than usage-based, any reference to
"line rental" is just plain irritating.

>stuff going on, all of which which costs money to maintain. Switching
>to VOIP will make it easier for them to alter the cost of use as well
>as connection quality on a packet by packet basis if needed as a load
>balancing measure.

Though - unless they invoke traffic shaping, which I would hope even
OFCom would take a dim view of if used against third party companies -
they (the broadband provider) won't be able to affect those using a
third party VoIP provider (which PlusNet customers at present it appears
will have to).
>
>All that going over to VOIP will change is that there will be one less
>conversion from digital to analogue and vice versa in the exchange.
>That conversion will, instead, be done at your end of the "last mile".
>What happens now is that your analogue signals get converted to digital
>in the exchange and squirted along their internal VOIP networks, then
>reconverted to squirt the analogue down your POTS wires, which
>currently also carry the broadband signal as modulated HF signals. It

Which (the modulated HF) will of course continue for many customers,
just the AF (and DC signalling) will cease.

>has been a long time since exchanges were full of clattering rotary
>switches and relays. In most villages, the exchange is under a manhole
>cover outside the old exchange which is now someone's home, and the
>operator is as likely as not to be working from home in Dundee or
>somewhere.
>
I was surprised to find that in my village (small town? 2,766 in 2011,
so probably still a village), it's actually a substantial building; I'd
been expecting a cabinet. Operator! Now there's a quaint concept; I
don't think I've dialled - 100 is it? - for decades!
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove
that the other party is unfit to rule - and both commonly succeed, and are
right. -H.L. Mencken, writer, editor, and critic (1880-1956)

On 06/03/2024 15:12, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <l4rb8tFq7htU1@mid.individual.net> at Wed, 6 Mar 2024
> 14:01:01, John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> writes
>> On 06/03/2024 12:08, charles wrote:
>>> With landlines about to vanish this is not a concern. I am told that
>>> when I
>>> move to VOIP, an app will allow me to pick up VOIP calls on my mobile.
>>> Problem solved.
>>>
>> The app can already be installed on your mobile if you set up a VOIP
>> account on your broadband and have a router with a Wifi connection.
>
> The VoIP account doesn't have to be with the same provider as your
> broadband. (In the case of PlusNet, they're still saying they're not
> offering it - they'll move you to BT, though [part of the same company,
> though most of the time they operate separately] if you want.)

I currently have my landline from BT and Internet (ADSL2+) from PlusNet.
Does anyone know how they will deal with the change to digital phone?
Like, who will provide the new router and will it have a socket for an
analogue phone? Will I be "encouraged" to switch to fibre of some
flavour, and will this be FTTC, FTTN or what? ATM the (copper) phone
connections are embedded in the walls of the block of flats I live in,
so FTTP would not be very nice, as in wires laid on the ground and holes
drilled in walls. (A neighbour in the same block has a CityFibre
connection done in this way.)

I know that BT own PlusNet but I still want to keep PlusNet as my ISP.

--
Max Demian

In message <l4tnfkF6r3tU1@mid.individual.net> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
11:41:40, John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> writes
>On 07/03/2024 10:57, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
[]
>> There are now two sorts of nickel metal hydride cells. In AA size, the
>> ordinary sort are pushing 3 amp hours (I refuse to continue to use
[]
>> sort are low self-discharge - retain 80-90% capacity even after a year -
>> and those seem to be about 2.5 Ah capacity; the practical difference
[]
>Replacing time expired NiMH or NiCd cells is normally easy. Open the
>cover, replace the useless cells and you're good for another year or
>two. My cordless landline phone was on its third or fourth set when I
>moved on to the boat, so couldn't make use of it any longer. They can
>even be replaced by primary cells in an emergency. They are also easily
>recyclable.

I probably shouldn't have brought up the two sorts of NiMH in this
context, as for cordless home handsets self-discharge isn't really a
problem, as they're mostly placed back on a charger when the call is
finished (though I guess some people don't). As you say, it's more a
matter of replacing cells when they no longer hold much charge.
>
>The lithium batteries are usually permanently built in, with the cells
>custom designed to fit and welded in place. This means that when they

Though I think the EC at least have legislated against that - isn't the
latest iPhone different to previous ones in that respect?

>do eventually fail, the device is scrap. For consumer devices, they are
>usually sized to give the minimum acceptable run time between charges,
>so for extended use, you need either a spare device or an external
>power pack. They are also currently not easy to recycle, though there
>are a few places which now do it.
>
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Under democracy one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove
that the other party is unfit to rule - and both commonly succeed, and are
right. -H.L. Mencken, writer, editor, and critic (1880-1956)

On Thu, 7 Mar 2024 12:31:02 +0000, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com>
wrote:

>I currently have my landline from BT and Internet (ADSL2+) from PlusNet.
>Does anyone know how they will deal with the change to digital phone?
>Like, who will provide the new router and will it have a socket for an
>analogue phone?

I don't think they will. Currently Plusnet don't seem to offer a VOIP
service of their own, so if you stay with Plusnet and upgrade to fibre
you would have to subscribe to a VOIP service from somebody else, and
probably have to obtain extra equipment to use it.

If your landline phone is vital to you, the simplest way would seem to
be to change both internet and landline to another service provider
that *does* offer a VOIP service, then upgrade to fibre. It's not the
only way, but it seems simplest to get all your communication services
from the same company.

BT and Zen are just two companies I happen to know about that offer
both internet and VOIP phone. There are probably others, but don't
assume that they all do.

Rod.

On 07/03/2024 12:22, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <l4tnfkF6r3tU1@mid.individual.net> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
> 11:41:40, John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> writes

>> The lithium batteries are usually permanently built in, with the cells
>> custom designed to fit and welded in place. This means that when they
>
> Though I think the EC at least have legislated against that - isn't the
> latest iPhone different to previous ones in that respect?
>
The EU repair rules mean that Apple now have to sell you the tools
needed to replace the battery, rather than only letting their approved
workshops have them. The battery itself is still glued inside the case
using glue which can only be melted by a suitable heat source.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

In article <uscc26$11oo2$1@dont-email.me>,
Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> wrote:
> On 06/03/2024 15:12, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> > In message <l4rb8tFq7htU1@mid.individual.net> at Wed, 6 Mar 2024
> > 14:01:01, John Williamson <johnwilliamson@btinternet.com> writes
> >> On 06/03/2024 12:08, charles wrote:
> >>> With landlines about to vanish this is not a concern. I am told that
> >>> when I
> >>> move to VOIP, an app will allow me to pick up VOIP calls on my mobile.
> >>> Problem solved.
> >>>
> >> The app can already be installed on your mobile if you set up a VOIP
> >> account on your broadband and have a router with a Wifi connection.
> >
> > The VoIP account doesn't have to be with the same provider as your
> > broadband. (In the case of PlusNet, they're still saying they're not
> > offering it - they'll move you to BT, though [part of the same company,
> > though most of the time they operate separately] if you want.)

> I currently have my landline from BT and Internet (ADSL2+) from PlusNet.
> Does anyone know how they will deal with the change to digital phone?
> Like, who will provide the new router and will it have a socket for an
> analogue phone? Will I be "encouraged" to switch to fibre of some
> flavour, and will this be FTTC, FTTN or what? ATM the (copper) phone
> connections are embedded in the walls of the block of flats I live in,
> so FTTP would not be very nice, as in wires laid on the ground and holes
> drilled in walls. (A neighbour in the same block has a CityFibre
> connection done in this way.)

As I understand it, you simply need a "phone adaptor" plugged into a
network output of your router. Yes, you might get a new router with the
adaptor incorporated, but that's not essential.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té²
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

In article <78djuil9jq0mcgssfgfspafo7lcbh6ctc2@4ax.com>,
Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> wrote:
> On Thu, 7 Mar 2024 12:31:02 +0000, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com>
> wrote:

> >I currently have my landline from BT and Internet (ADSL2+) from PlusNet.
> >Does anyone know how they will deal with the change to digital phone?
> >Like, who will provide the new router and will it have a socket for an
> >analogue phone?

> I don't think they will. Currently Plusnet don't seem to offer a VOIP
> service of their own, so if you stay with Plusnet and upgrade to fibre
> you would have to subscribe to a VOIP service from somebody else, and
> probably have to obtain extra equipment to use it.

> If your landline phone is vital to you, the simplest way would seem to
> be to change both internet and landline to another service provider
> that *does* offer a VOIP service, then upgrade to fibre. It's not the
> only way, but it seems simplest to get all your communication services
> from the same company.

> BT and Zen are just two companies I happen to know about that offer
> both internet and VOIP phone. There are probably others, but don't
> assume that they all do.

I use Orpheus Internet for Fibre (used to be ADSL2) and will be moving to
VOIP from them shortly.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England - sent from my RISC OS 4té²
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

In message <78djuil9jq0mcgssfgfspafo7lcbh6ctc2@4ax.com> at Thu, 7 Mar
2024 12:52:17, Roderick Stewart <rjfs@escapetime.myzen.co.uk> writes
>On Thu, 7 Mar 2024 12:31:02 +0000, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com>
>wrote:
>
>>I currently have my landline from BT and Internet (ADSL2+) from PlusNet.
>>Does anyone know how they will deal with the change to digital phone?
>>Like, who will provide the new router and will it have a socket for an
>>analogue phone?
>
>I don't think they will. Currently Plusnet don't seem to offer a VOIP
>service of their own, so if you stay with Plusnet and upgrade to fibre
>you would have to subscribe to a VOIP service from somebody else, and
>probably have to obtain extra equipment to use it.

PlusNet's "hub 2" router has a (BT style!) socket, under a sticker
labelled Digital Phone Customers Only. The latest knowledge anyone has,
however, is that PlusNet - as such - _aren't_ going to be offering VoIP,
though I'm hoping they're going to change their mind. If they don't, I
don't know if the electronics behind that socket (if any!) can be
enabled.

When I mentioned the subject in passing when talking to them about
something else, they said they'd put me onto their "partner company" or
some such phrase, BT. Whether that means transfer of whole thing -
broadband and VoIP - or just the VoIP part, I didn't pursue at that
point.
>
>If your landline phone is vital to you, the simplest way would seem to
>be to change both internet and landline to another service provider
>that *does* offer a VOIP service, then upgrade to fibre. It's not the
>only way, but it seems simplest to get all your communication services
>from the same company.

Has advantages and disadvantages. Probably little or no _technical_
advantage to going separate, as if broadband fails, VoIP will anyway;
there may or may not be financial advantage. If separate, the VoIP
company will almost certainly have a monthly charge - but I suspect the
broadband company will add one for providing VoIP as well; it's then
down to how much those monthly charges are, how many free minutes (or
can you have anytime), how much minutes beyond the free cost (and to
where - do you call a particular country a lot or not), and so on.
>
>BT and Zen are just two companies I happen to know about that offer
>both internet and VOIP phone. There are probably others, but don't
>assume that they all do.

And voipfone at least - probably others - offer VoIP only. (1.50 a month
including 0 minutes, 5.00 including IIRR 100, and other packages.)
>
>Rod.
John
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"Bother," said Pooh, as Windows crashed into piglet.

In message <5b3de7e8a3charles@candehope.me.uk> at Thu, 7 Mar 2024
13:30:03, charles <charles@candehope.me.uk> writes
[]
>As I understand it, you simply need a "phone adaptor" plugged into a
>network output of your router. Yes, you might get a new router with the
>adaptor incorporated, but that's not essential.
>
For the _technical_ requirement, yes. You also need a VoIP _service_,
which your broadband provider may or may not provide (PlusNet at present
are not planning to).

For another premises I know of where BT provide both anyway, I've seen a
letter suggesting the transition will be fairly seamless - it's just a
"something will happen, we'll tell you more nearer the time" letter at
the moment, but I presume a new router (or adapter) will be required, as
the existing router there doesn't have any unusual sockets on it.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Everybody's throwing dinner parties, cooking this, baking that... Food has
eaten television here. - Sam Neill (RT 2014/10/11-17)

In article <usbu2d$uv9g$1@dont-email.me>, JMB99 <mb@nospam.net>
scribeth thus
>On 06/03/2024 14:01, John Williamson wrote:
>> If, like many people, you use only cell based comms, (Now cheaper than
>> landline and which are not locked to any particular location) you will
>> wonder what all the fuss is about.
>
>
>Any listener to radio phone-ins and radio news programmes will know just
>reliable VOIP is!
>
>
>

Been using to for years and can't fault it!....

--
Tony Sayer

Man is least himself when he talks in his own person.

Give him a keyboard, and he will reveal himself.

In article <usbvjp$uv9g$7@dont-email.me>, JMB99 <mb@nospam.net>
scribeth thus
>On 07/03/2024 08:45, Tweed wrote:
>> That’s more a function of a poor quality communication link rather than
>> VOIP as a technology.
>
>Does not matter what the cause is if you cannot communicate with people
>because of it.
>
>Occasionally the person in the studio will give up and connect by
>landline and straight away get a perfect connection.
>
>

Most likely the mobile fone signal in the studio is very weak some even
have metal plates around them and foil coated fibreboard and the like...

--
Tony Sayer

Man is least himself when he talks in his own person.

Give him a keyboard, and he will reveal himself.

On 07/03/2024 12:52, Roderick Stewart wrote:
> On Thu, 7 Mar 2024 12:31:02 +0000, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I currently have my landline from BT and Internet (ADSL2+) from PlusNet.
>> Does anyone know how they will deal with the change to digital phone?
>> Like, who will provide the new router and will it have a socket for an
>> analogue phone?
>
> I don't think they will. Currently Plusnet don't seem to offer a VOIP
> service of their own, so if you stay with Plusnet and upgrade to fibre
> you would have to subscribe to a VOIP service from somebody else, and
> probably have to obtain extra equipment to use it.
>
> If your landline phone is vital to you, the simplest way would seem to
> be to change both internet and landline to another service provider
> that *does* offer a VOIP service, then upgrade to fibre. It's not the
> only way, but it seems simplest to get all your communication services
> from the same company.
>
> BT and Zen are just two companies I happen to know about that offer
> both internet and VOIP phone. There are probably others, but don't
> assume that they all do.

I can manage without a landline phone but someone has to maintain the
physical landline. Perhaps PlusNet will do it (indirectly) as they do
currently offer landlines on a "local loop" basis.

I do want to keep PlusNet as my ISP for the email address and webspace
they provide (FOC), plus Usenet, though others provide the latter (such
as ES that I mostly use currently).

--
Max Demian