In message <87il1ipdfr.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
13:18:48, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:
[]
>> I remember in the '70s our school chaplain saying plaintively that he
>> wished more "creatures great and small" would come to his evensong
>> (which was voluntary).
>
>The rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate...

If you mean I (or my folks) was rich, it was a boarding school - and you
wouldn't think that if you saw the dormitories, especially in Winter!
>
>> Same here - fry-up too. Wetherspoons do a couple of good value sizes
>> of those!
>
>If you ever had one of my fry-ups you'd never want a 'Spoons one
>again. Cumberland sausage, Ayrshire bacon, Stornoway black pudding, duck
>egg, kidneys, oyster mushrooms, fried bread and NO BEANS. Stokes's brown
>sauce on the side.
[]
I have a very unsophisticated palate, so there's no point in giving me
expensive things, such as wine, or the qualified things you mention. I
used to not like kidneys at all - even the remaining taste if someone
removed them from "steak and kidney" put me off - but lost that, though
I still don't think I'd like them other than as that sort of added
ingredient. I _love_ fried bread! And I agree with you, I'd rather not
have the beans - if something else came in their place of course! I
don't dislike them - I think I like them - there just often seem to be
too much (many) of them.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"There are a great many people in the country today who, through no fault of
their own, are sane." - Monty Python's Flying Circus

In message <l5tkeaF5r3U2@mid.individual.net> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
14:06:02, BrritSki <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> writes
[]
>The local pubs in Coventry on Friday nights had a man come round with a
>large wicker basket from where he would sell shelled prawns, cockles
>and mussels. Yum...
[]
Alive, alive oh? Or was that just Dublin?

With all the fish stories - I'll just add to my unsophisticated palate
by saying I think the only fish I regularly buy is/are what we used to
call crabsticks, though they're now called seafood sticks, presumably
because there's absolutely no crab in them. (Though they still colour
them the same!)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"There are a great many people in the country today who, through no fault of
their own, are sane." - Monty Python's Flying Circus

Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes:

> On 19/03/2024 13:01, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
>> Kate B <elvira@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes:
>>
>>> On 18/03/2024 15:51, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
>>>> Steve Hague <stevehague82@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>
>>>>> On 17/03/2024 21:50, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
>>>>>> 'They' change things and it's the end of the world.
>>>>>> I was listening to Fed Up earlier, with the folk complaining
>>>>>> bitterly
>>>>>> about TA Omnibus being moved to an hour later on a Sunday morning,
>>>>>> swapping with Desert Island Discs.
>>>>>> So who are these people who can't lie in bed for another hour on a
>>>>>> Sunday to catch the omnibus? I mean, what are Sunday mornings for?
>>>>>> (Lying in bed, I mean, not listening to the omnibus, which I don't do,
>>>>>> They can't be morning churchgoers because
>>>>>> Rosie
>>>>> I'm a Sunday morning churchgoer, but even if I wasn't I wouldn't be
>>>>> listening to the omnibuscrash. I lost interest shortly after Nigel
>>>>> fell off the roof, and haven't listened since. I remain here because I
>>>>> enjoy the company.
>>>>> Steve
>>>> I didn't finish did I? I grow old.
>>>> I was going to say that Sunday morning churchgoers would miss it
>>>> anyway. Are there many evening services these day? Long ago there were
>>>> complaints that evening services had to be disrupted because of Dr
>>>> Finlay's Casebook, or the Forsyte Saga, or whatever, but I think you'd
>>>> be hard-pressed these days to find an evening service outside a
>>>> cathedral evensong.
>>>
>>> It depends what variety of church you favour. There are no less than
>>> two evening masses at the Catholic cathedral here (one is in Polish).
>> You remind me of the time (gosh, nearly 30 years ago now!) I found
>> myself in a place called Castlegregory in Co Kerry on a Saturday
>> evening, There were loads of people wandering around the streets, older
>> on the whole than an Italian /passaggiata/ but very much the same sort of
>> thing. I went to a pub and it was deserted, but I knew it was a good pub
>> because the barman ('curate' is the correct term I understand but I
>> don't want to confuse matters) was an expert at Guinness-pouring and
>> having the next one half-prepared long before I was done with the
>> first. I asked him where everybody was and he said they were going to
>> mass. Of course, the pub was rammed a couple of hours (and several
>> Guinnesses) later. I suppose that was a very early morning mass.
>> I know St Giles in Reading, heavy on the bells smells and fiery
>> handbags
>> the way I like it, used to do an evening service because some of the
>> Quakers from along the alley used to sing in the choir in the
>> evening. The Episcopalian ("English Kirk") St Brides in Glasgow does
>> that sort of thing but only in the morning. I haven't been to St
>> Michaels in Edinburgh, up beyong the Meadows, but I don't think that
>> does mornings either. The respective High Kirks of St Mungo and St Giles
>> do evenings do evenings but the presbyterians are no fun.
>
> Piskies, however many smells and bells they wave about, are not
> actually Catholic (even if they claim to be - I sang at a Maundy
> Thursday mass at St Michael's (Spiky Mike's) and could have been
> thirteen again and pre-Vatican II). There are rarely evening masses at
> Pisky churches because the congregations are too small, and alas these
> days smaller Catholic churches don't do Sunday evenings either, though
> they'll all do Saturday 'vigil' ones.

Well no, the piskies are Anglicans although they do "one holy catholic
and apostolic church" in their creed. When they're minded to they do do
bells and smells much better than the post Vatican II Catholics. St
Mary's Piskie Cathedral in Glasgow is LGBT Central and the congregation
often goes clubbing after Sunday evensong.

Rosie

BrritSki <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 19/03/2024 13:29, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
>> BrritSki <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> I have very fond memories of roasts my Grandma made, almost always
>>> roast beef (overcooked by today's standards) and with a heavy
>>> Yorkshire Pudding served first with the gravy. Billy Cotton's Bandshow
>>> or 2-way Family Favourites on the wireless.
>>
>> I always liked lamb best. Especially in summer with new potatoes and
>> freshly-podded peas (podding peas was my favourite Sunday dinner ritual
>> as a child).
>
> Yes, that brings back happy memories too. Freshly picked young runner beans
> are a massive favourite with me still.
>
>
> <snip>
>> You can't get decent mutton (for hotpot) these days for love nor
>> money. Unless somerat knows different?
>>
> https://www.farmison.com/mutton/other-cuts
>
> Never tried them, so no idea if it really is mutton.
>
> The cut I miss is breast of lamb, boned, a thin layer of stuffing spread
> on and then rolled and tied. Roasted so most of the fat runs out and it
> is crunchy, but still very rich and fatty so I don't think waife would
> eat it.
>

My mother made the day for a butcher when asking for breast of lamb ‘and
would you chine it please?’ The butcher (a true experienced butcher) smiled
and commented that he would chine it with please as he hadn’t had anyone
ask for this for years! I love BoL too, has to be stuffed of course and
cooked to lose most of the fat of course. Getting hold of unprepared raw
lamb shanks is very difficult these days - and if they are available
anywhere, one needs a mortar gauge to afford them!

--
Toodle Pip, Mike McMillan

On 19/03/2024 14:47, Mike McMillan wrote:
> BrritSki <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>> The cut I miss is breast of lamb, boned, a thin layer of stuffing spread
>> on and then rolled and tied. Roasted so most of the fat runs out and it
>> is crunchy, but still very rich and fatty so I don't think waife would
>> eat it.
>>
>
> My mother made the day for a butcher when asking for breast of lamb ‘and
> would you chine it please?’ The butcher (a true experienced butcher) smiled
> and commented that he would chine it with please as he hadn’t had anyone
> ask for this for years!

I regularly buy a rack of pork loin chops and always ask for them to be
chined but not scored as I don;t like the random slashes you usually
get. I prefer the skin to be cut with regular 1cm spaced parallel cuts
right through the fat and for the full width of the joint. The butcher
knows to give me the fattiest joint that he has for maximum flavour.

> ... Getting hold of unprepared raw
> lamb shanks is very difficult these days - and if they are available
> anywhere, one needs a mortar gauge to afford them!

The pair I got from Waitrose were about £13. Not cheap, but not a vast
outlay for 4 servings either. Decent beef for stewing is similarly
priced (shin or feather/blade).

On 19/03/2024 13:51, Chris J Dixon wrote:

> Once my sister and I had been left to prepare our own meal, as my
> parents were out. We were to have salad with a tin of ox tongue.
>
> What we should have done was pop the tin in the fridge first, to
> solidify the jelly, so that, on removal from the tin, anonymous
> slices could be taken. We did not do this, so the contents
> plopped out onto the plate, their recognisably bovine origin
> being something of a shock, and we somewhat lost our appetites.
>

(vegans and anyone slightly queasy about meat origins should look away now)

When I was about fifteen and on a (perfectly horrible in many ways)
French exchange visit to Auch near Toulouse, Madame asked me if I liked
to eat tongue. Thinking of those neat round mauve slices I said yes, and
followed her into the kitchen where she plunged a giant fork into a
seething cauldron and drew out a grey, dripping, all-too-identifiable,
whole tongue with all the gristle. Appetite did not return for about a
day...

--
Kate B

On 19/03/2024 14:24, BrritSki wrote:
> On 19/03/2024 14:14, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
>> BrritSki <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> On 19/03/2024 13:18, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
>>>> If you ever had one of my fry-ups you'd never want a 'Spoons one
>>>> again. Cumberland sausage, Ayrshire bacon, Stornoway black pudding,
>>>> duck
>>>> egg, kidneys, oyster mushrooms, fried bread and NO BEANS. Stokes's
>>>> brown
>>>> sauce on the side.
>>>>
>>> I'm with you on all of that, including the beans. No brown sauce for
>>> me - a nice meaty mushroom fried separately supplies a bit of liquid
>>> to the feast.
>>
>> I'm sure beans with cooked breakfast is a recent innovation, and one
>> very much to be regretted. For one thing the dreadfully sweet tomato
>> sauce pollutes the egg yolk and spoils the experience of mopping up said
>> yolk with the fried bread. The other regrettable thing is tinned
>> tomatoes, although half a grilled beefsteak tomato has its place.
>>
> <LW> to all that.
>

GARYT (who'd have ever thought there'd be an opportunity to say that?)

john

On 19/03/2024 14:19, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <87il1ipdfr.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
> 13:18:48, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>> "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:
> []
>>> I remember in the '70s our school chaplain saying plaintively that he
>>> wished more "creatures great and small" would come to his evensong
>>> (which was voluntary).
>>
>> The rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate...
>
> If you mean I (or my folks) was rich, it was a boarding school - and you
> wouldn't think that if you saw the dormitories, especially in Winter!
>

I believe the allusion was to the line in the aforereferenced hymn and
its use a justification for the divinely ordained and therefore
immutable social order, rather than to your particular circumstances.

john

On 19/03/2024 13:21, BrritSki wrote:

>
> A large free-range chicken will give us at least 6 servings and most
> likely 8. Roast on the day, some reheated the next day with left over
> roasties and skin crisped up. The remaining half will be either curried
> and/or made into polpette.  Not to mention lots of lovely stock for
> soups and risotto.

A Public Service Announcement.

Those amongst us who are given to eating chicken in the form of joints
rather than whole birds might like to be reminded that the bones can be
frozen in a ziplock bag which is added to until a sufficient quantity
has been reached to make stock.

See also: Ginger freezes well and can be grated direct from frozen into
the pan of either curry or rhubarb (other dishes are available).

john

On 19/03/2024 13:23, BrritSki wrote:
> On 19/03/2024 13:10, Nick Odell wrote:
>> On Tue, 19 Mar 2024 08:34:20 +0000, BrritSki
>> <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 19/03/2024 01:23, Steveski wrote:
>>>> On 18/03/2024 18:32, Vicky wrote:
>>>>
>>>> [snip]
>>>>
>>>>> And a roast in a carvery
>>>>> doesn't taste the same at all. Home-cooked is much better.
>>>>
>>>> <LW>
>>>>
>>> I've had some good roasts in restaurants, but as Kate said, the gravy
>>> almost always lets them down.
>>>
>>> But I much prefer home cooked, either by myself or waife with whoever
>>> doesn't cook doing the washing up. I am not a stereotypical man-cook
>>> though and don't use every pan and mostly clear up as I go along so it's
>>> only the last minute pots and pans that are left dirty.
>>>
>>> I have very fond memories of roasts my Grandma made, almost always roast
>>> beef (overcooked by today's standards) and with a heavy Yorkshire
>>> Pudding served first with the gravy. Billy Cotton's Bandshow or 2-way
>>> Family Favourites on the wireless.
>>>
>>> And then my Mum's delicious cooking usually lamb or beef, occasionally
>>> chicken, but that was a rare treat in the early days.
>>>
>>> And finally my svigermor and the epic feasts she cooked for family
>>> gatherings that were invariably roast pork with amazing crackling, and
>>> always red cabbage in addition to the normal veggies.
>>>
>>> Happy Days
>>
>> It's interesting (FSVO) how the popularity and availability of meats
>> has changed over the years. Like you, I remember chicken being
>> something we only had on special occasions but I think lamb was the
>> most common Sunday roast when I was very little. And although I was
>> familiar, first hand, with the concept of roast beef and Yorkshire
>> pudding, it wasn't until just a few years ago that I had the
>> experience of Yorkshire pudding and gravy as the starter to the roast
>> beef meal. In Yorkshire, of course.
>>
> Grandad was a Yorkshireman which is why Grandma served it that way 70
> years ago. I think she served it with lamb too which was indeed very
> common.
>
> When chicken started to become cheap it had a distinctly fishy flavour
> from the cheap feeds that were used...
>
WIWAL there was a rotation of lamb (shoulder), pork (belly) and beef
(brisket) for our roasts. Note the cheapest cuts for roasting at the
time - not necessarily still the case. Chicken was rare (not cooked
rare, just eaten seldom) because my father grew up on a snmallholding
where they kept their own chickens for the pot and the flavour of shop
ones could never compare.

john

On 19/03/2024 14:14, Rosie Mitchell wrote:

>
> I'm sure beans with cooked breakfast is a recent innovation, and one
> very much to be regretted. For one thing the dreadfully sweet tomato
> sauce pollutes the egg yolk and spoils the experience of mopping up said
> yolk with the fried bread. The other regrettable thing is tinned
> tomatoes, although half a grilled beefsteak tomato has its place.

My mum occasionally put beans with bacon, and that's going back at least
sixty years. She did fry them, though, and butter beans the same.
Still love either. Nothing quite as tasty as a tin of beans, fried, so
that they bubble away all the juice and start to brown. I really
recommend it.

--
Jane
The Amethyst Artist
BTME

http://www.clothandclay.co.uk/umra/cookbook.htm - Umrats' recipes

On Tue, 19 Mar 2024 14:17:10 +0000, Rosie Mitchell wrote:

> BrritSki <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> writes:
>
> G> On 19/03/2024 13:29, Rosie Mitchell wrote:

>>> You can't get decent mutton (for hotpot) these days for love nor
>>> money. Unless somerat knows different?
>>>
>> https://www.farmison.com/mutton/other-cuts
>
> Thank you, I'll look them up.

I've used Farmison once, but not for mutton. I get my mutton from Pipers
Farm (actually a group of farms).
https://pipersfarm.com/collections/grass-fed-lamb-mutton-slow-cooking

Farmison's pork belly didn't crackle nearly as well as that from Pipers
Farm. Their merguez sausages are good though - that's what I was looking
for when I found Farmison.

--
Jim <http://www.jim-easterbrook.me.uk/>
1959/1985? M B+ G+ A L- I- S- P-- CH0(p) Ar++ T+ H0 Q--- Sh0

In message <utc9ur$skf1$2@dont-email.me> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024 15:11:23,
john ashby <johnashby20@yahoo.com> writes
>On 19/03/2024 14:19, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> In message <87il1ipdfr.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
>>13:18:48, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>>> "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:
>> []
>>>> I remember in the '70s our school chaplain saying plaintively that he
>>>> wished more "creatures great and small" would come to his evensong
>>>> (which was voluntary).
>>>
>>> The rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate...
>> If you mean I (or my folks) was rich, it was a boarding school - and
>>you wouldn't think that if you saw the dormitories, especially in
>>Winter!
>>
>
>I believe the allusion was to the line in the aforereferenced hymn and
>its use a justification for the divinely ordained and therefore
>immutable social order, rather than to your particular circumstances.
>
>john

Ah! Our chaplain's plaint was not a reference to that hymn (other than
that's where Alf White got the name), but the TV series, which was on at
the same time as his evensong, which came a poor second to most of us!
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Practicall every British actor with a bus pass is in there ...
Barry Norman (on "The Best Exotic Marigold Hotel" [2011]), RT 2015/12/12-18

In message <87le6ee16n.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
14:38:56, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
[]
>Well no, the piskies are Anglicans although they do "one holy catholic
>and apostolic church" in their creed. When they're minded to they do do

Our school chapel were plain Anglican (CoE I think), but still had that
phrase in one of the chants, at least in the 1970s. I think "catholic"
just means something like open to all, rather than anything to do with
the church of Rome.

>bells and smells much better than the post Vatican II Catholics. St

The CoE is very broad; brother and partner and I used to, on a nice
weekend day, go look round the odd old church, and I remember being most
surprised to find in one - somewhere in Oxfordshire, I think - a small
confessional booth; I'd always thought that was something only the
Catholics had/did.

>Mary's Piskie Cathedral in Glasgow is LGBT Central and the congregation
>often goes clubbing after Sunday evensong.

(Who do they club? [Sorry.])
>
>Rosie
John
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Practicall every British actor with a bus pass is in there ...
Barry Norman (on "The Best Exotic Marigold Hotel" [2011]), RT 2015/12/12-18

On Tue, 19 Mar 2024 14:24:01 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver"
<G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:

>In message <l5tkeaF5r3U2@mid.individual.net> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
>14:06:02, BrritSki <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> writes
>[]
>>The local pubs in Coventry on Friday nights had a man come round with a
>>large wicker basket from where he would sell shelled prawns, cockles
>>and mussels. Yum...
>[]
>Alive, alive oh? Or was that just Dublin?
>
>With all the fish stories - I'll just add to my unsophisticated palate
>by saying I think the only fish I regularly buy is/are what we used to
>call crabsticks, though they're now called seafood sticks, presumably
>because there's absolutely no crab in them. (Though they still colour
>them the same!)

Capt Ex, then second mate, sailed with a second engineer on lightening
ships and I joined him and we made friends. He and his wife stayed
with us in London and then we all drove up to their home, Peterhead,
in Scotland. Mrs Eng's dad had been a fisherman and still got fish if
he wanted it when the boats came in. They did while we were there and
we got fish fresh to have. I can't actually remember what fish though.
I think Ex and Eng were invited to go out with the fleet but declined.

"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:

> In message <87il1ipdfr.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
> 13:18:48, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>>"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:
> []
>>> I remember in the '70s our school chaplain saying plaintively that he
>>> wished more "creatures great and small" would come to his evensong
>>> (which was voluntary).
>>
>>The rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate...
>
> If you mean I (or my folks) was rich, it was a boarding school - and
> you wouldn't think that if you saw the dormitories, especially in
> Winter!

No, I mean that the sentiment is appalling. We had to sing it at my
non-boarding primary school and I winced even then. Years later when I
got to know somebody else who had lived in the lodge of a big house and
had to sing it her school – the sentiment was not lost on her peers.

Mrs Alexander wrote lots of those improving hymns for children. I was also
aware that "And through all his wondrous childhood /[about which we know
absolutely nothing of course]/ he would honour and obey". Cringe. Comes
up every Christmas Eve too, long after it should have been consigned to
the compost heap.

Mrs Cecil Alexander lived at 37 Eccles Street, Dublin, and I like to
imagine her writing with a critical and disapproving eye the Blooms and
their children at number 7. I could wish they could have exchanged
fictionality.

Rosie

john ashby <johnashby20@yahoo.com> writes:

> On 19/03/2024 14:19, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
>> In message <87il1ipdfr.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
>> 13:18:48, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>>> "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:
>> []
>>>> I remember in the '70s our school chaplain saying plaintively that he
>>>> wished more "creatures great and small" would come to his evensong
>>>> (which was voluntary).
>>>
>>> The rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate...
>> If you mean I (or my folks) was rich, it was a boarding school - and
>> you wouldn't think that if you saw the dormitories, especially in
>> Winter!
>>
>
> I believe the allusion was to the line in the aforereferenced hymn and
> its use a justification for the divinely ordained and therefore
> immutable social order, rather than to your particular circumstances.
>
> john

Fazakerley.

Rosie

On Tue, 19 Mar 2024 15:28:22 +0000, john ashby <johnashby20@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>WIWAL there was a rotation of lamb (shoulder), pork (belly) and beef
>(brisket) for our roasts. Note the cheapest cuts for roasting at the
>time - not necessarily still the case. Chicken was rare (not cooked
>rare, just eaten seldom) because my father grew up on a snmallholding
>where they kept their own chickens for the pot and the flavour of shop
>ones could never compare.
>
>john

I remember as a child a family from Lancashire visiting us and we had
chicken and the father carved it. Slices all round. We'd always just
cut it into chunks. Leg, thigh, wings, breast etc. Chickens were
different then, expensive and tasty. Even organic, free range ones are
not as good now, but I suppose memory tastes better and food does too
when you are younger.

john ashby <johnashby20@yahoo.com> writes:

> On 19/03/2024 13:21, BrritSki wrote:
>
>> A large free-range chicken will give us at least 6 servings and most
>> likely 8. Roast on the day, some reheated the next day with left
>> over roasties and skin crisped up. The remaining half will be either
>> curried and/or made into polpette.  Not to mention lots of lovely
>> stock for soups and risotto.
>
> A Public Service Announcement.
>
> Those amongst us who are given to eating chicken in the form of joints
> rather than whole birds might like to be reminded that the bones can
> be frozen in a ziplock bag which is added to until a sufficient
> quantity has been reached to make stock.

What I learned from my foray into making Friday Night Dinner for my
young Jewish friend (the one who ate with relish bacon and Cumberland
sausage, though not black pudding, on Christmas morning) was to
slow-cook a chicken, skin it and deep fry the skin later, remove the
meat, use a little of the liquid to make gravy, then use the bones and
the rest of the liquid, and the giblets if provided although getting
giblets with your chicken is getting tricky these days. I have no idea
why because you can't make proper gravy without them.

> See also: Ginger freezes well and can be grated direct from frozen
> into the pan of either curry or rhubarb (other dishes are available).

You do have to take care about sourcing your ginger though. Most
supermarket ginger has had the heat bred out of it. Another thing I
don't understand because if you can't stand the heat stay out of the
ginger. Or something.

Rosie

Jane Vernon <spam@nopotteratthisaddress.co.uk> writes:

> On 19/03/2024 14:14, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
>
>> I'm sure beans with cooked breakfast is a recent innovation, and one
>> very much to be regretted. For one thing the dreadfully sweet tomato
>> sauce pollutes the egg yolk and spoils the experience of mopping up said
>> yolk with the fried bread. The other regrettable thing is tinned
>> tomatoes, although half a grilled beefsteak tomato has its place.
>
> My mum occasionally put beans with bacon, and that's going back at
> least sixty years. She did fry them, though, and butter beans the
> same. Still love either. Nothing quite as tasty as a tin of beans,
> fried, so that they bubble away all the juice and start to brown. I
> really recommend it.

There's a place for bacon and beans but it's not on the breakfast
plate. It was a favourite of mime but I have't made it for years. Using
pork belly usually, with haricot or borlotti beans, onions, mustard and
black treacle, slowly casseroled for hours. (I believe this is in the
Umra Cookbook).

Rosie

On 19/03/2024 17:35, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
> "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:
>
>> In message <87il1ipdfr.fsf@golgonooza.co.uk> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
>> 13:18:48, Rosie Mitchell <rcmitchell@golgonooza.co.uk> writes
>>> "J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> writes:
>> []
>>>> I remember in the '70s our school chaplain saying plaintively that he
>>>> wished more "creatures great and small" would come to his evensong
>>>> (which was voluntary).
>>>
>>> The rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate...
>>
>> If you mean I (or my folks) was rich, it was a boarding school - and
>> you wouldn't think that if you saw the dormitories, especially in
>> Winter!
>
> No, I mean that the sentiment is appalling. We had to sing it at my
> non-boarding primary school and I winced even then. Years later when I
> got to know somebody else who had lived in the lodge of a big house and
> had to sing it her school – the sentiment was not lost on her peers.
>
> Mrs Alexander wrote lots of those improving hymns for children. I was also
> aware that "And through all his wondrous childhood /[about which we know
> absolutely nothing of course]/ he would honour and obey"

Where was the honouring and obeying when he did a Cameron daughter
impersonation in the synagogue?
>
> Mrs Cecil Alexander lived at 37 Eccles Street, Dublin, and I like to
> imagine her writing with a critical and disapproving eye the Blooms and
> their children at number 7. I could wish they could have exchanged
> fictionality.
>

Possible, she died two years after Rudy.

john

On 19/03/2024 17:49, Rosie Mitchell wrote:
> john ashby <johnashby20@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> On 19/03/2024 13:21, BrritSki wrote:
>>
>>> A large free-range chicken will give us at least 6 servings and most
>>> likely 8. Roast on the day, some reheated the next day with left
>>> over roasties and skin crisped up. The remaining half will be either
>>> curried and/or made into polpette.  Not to mention lots of lovely
>>> stock for soups and risotto.
>>
>> A Public Service Announcement.
>>
>> Those amongst us who are given to eating chicken in the form of joints
>> rather than whole birds might like to be reminded that the bones can
>> be frozen in a ziplock bag which is added to until a sufficient
>> quantity has been reached to make stock.
>
> What I learned from my foray into making Friday Night Dinner for my
> young Jewish friend (the one who ate with relish bacon and Cumberland
> sausage, though not black pudding, on Christmas morning) was to
> slow-cook a chicken, skin it and deep fry the skin later, remove the
> meat, use a little of the liquid to make gravy, then use the bones and
> the rest of the liquid, and the giblets if provided although getting
> giblets with your chicken is getting tricky these days. I have no idea
> why because you can't make proper gravy without them.
>
>> See also: Ginger freezes well and can be grated direct from frozen
>> into the pan of either curry or rhubarb (other dishes are available).
>
> You do have to take care about sourcing your ginger though. Most
> supermarket ginger has had the heat bred out of it. Another thing I
> don't understand because if you can't stand the heat stay out of the
> ginger. Or something.
>
> Rosie

Most supermarket anything has had the flavour bred out of it. Previous
Person of Interest and I used to complain that it was only possible to
buy orange water, green water, red water, yellow water usw.

john

On 19-Mar-24 15:28, john ashby wrote:
> On 19/03/2024 13:23, BrritSki wrote:
>> On 19/03/2024 13:10, Nick Odell wrote:
>>> On Tue, 19 Mar 2024 08:34:20 +0000, BrritSki
>>> <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 19/03/2024 01:23, Steveski wrote:
>>>>> On 18/03/2024 18:32, Vicky wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> [snip]
>>>>>
>>>>>> And a roast in a carvery
>>>>>> doesn't taste the same at all. Home-cooked is much better.
>>>>>
>>>>> <LW>
>>>>>
>>>> I've had some good roasts in restaurants, but as Kate said, the gravy
>>>> almost always lets them down.
>>>>
>>>> But I much prefer home cooked, either by myself or waife with whoever
>>>> doesn't cook doing the washing up. I am not a stereotypical man-cook
>>>> though and don't use every pan and mostly clear up as I go along so
>>>> it's
>>>> only the last minute pots and pans that are left dirty.
>>>>
>>>> I have very fond memories of roasts my Grandma made, almost always
>>>> roast
>>>> beef (overcooked by today's standards) and with a heavy Yorkshire
>>>> Pudding served first with the gravy. Billy Cotton's Bandshow or 2-way
>>>> Family Favourites on the wireless.
>>>>
>>>> And then my Mum's delicious cooking usually lamb or beef, occasionally
>>>> chicken, but that was a rare treat in the early days.
>>>>
>>>> And finally my svigermor and the epic feasts she cooked for family
>>>> gatherings that were invariably roast pork with amazing crackling, and
>>>> always red cabbage in addition to the normal veggies.
>>>>
>>>> Happy Days
>>>
>>> It's interesting (FSVO) how the popularity and availability of meats
>>> has changed over the years. Like you, I remember chicken being
>>> something we only had on special occasions but I think lamb was the
>>> most common Sunday roast when I was very little. And although I was
>>> familiar, first hand, with the concept of roast beef and Yorkshire
>>> pudding, it wasn't until just a few years ago that I had the
>>> experience of Yorkshire pudding and gravy as the starter to the roast
>>> beef meal. In Yorkshire, of course.
>>>
>> Grandad was a Yorkshireman which is why Grandma served it that way 70
>> years ago. I think she served it with lamb too which was indeed very
>> common.
>>
>> When chicken started to become cheap it had a distinctly fishy flavour
>> from the cheap feeds that were used...
>>
> WIWAL there was a rotation of lamb (shoulder), pork (belly) and beef
> (brisket) for our roasts. Note the cheapest cuts for roasting at the
> time - not necessarily still the case. Chicken was rare (not cooked
> rare, just eaten seldom) because my father grew up on a snmallholding
> where they kept their own chickens for the pot and the flavour of shop
> ones could never compare.

WIWAL the rotation of lamb/mutton, pork & beef was established with the
butcher and he delivered that steady rotation for decades. If we ever
had chicken in those days it was a 'boiler chicken' i.e. one that too
old to lay eggs.

--
Sam Plusnet

On 19-Mar-24 14:24, J. P. Gilliver wrote:
> In message <l5tkeaF5r3U2@mid.individual.net> at Tue, 19 Mar 2024
> 14:06:02, BrritSki <rtilburyTAKEOUT@gmail.com> writes
> []
>> The local pubs in Coventry on Friday nights had a man come round with a
>> large wicker basket from where he would sell shelled prawns, cockles
>> and mussels. Yum...
> []
> Alive, alive oh? Or was that just Dublin?

The man selling shellfish from a wicker basket, doing a round of the
local pubs, seemed to be a common feature up until the 1970s(?) I have
no idea when this died out (assuming it has). Maybe pubs objected to
having to clean up?

--
Sam Plusnet

J. P. Gilliver wrote:

>With all the fish stories - I'll just add to my unsophisticated palate
>by saying I think the only fish I regularly buy is/are what we used to
>call crabsticks, though they're now called seafood sticks, presumably
>because there's absolutely no crab in them. (Though they still colour
>them the same!)

<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjH8y1baxVI>

Enjoy! ;-)

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham
'48/33 M B+ G++ A L(-) I S-- CH0(--)(p) Ar- T+ H0 ?Q
chris@cdixon.me.uk @ChrisJDixon1
Plant amazing Acers.