It's almost 10yrs since I last read this newsgroup, so apologise if this
is a FAQ:

I'm having my ADSL++ upgraded to Full Fibre next week, and the
associated POTs line is toast. Nobody but scammers call me on it
anyway.

However, as an exercise as much as anything else, I'd like to retain
my retro dial phone with bells, and connect it to a 'box' which will,
like the Openreach gubbins, be powered from a UPS, and service a
geographic VoIP number that's currently with Gradwell (but they are
too expensive).

If I need to make any outgoing calls, I've got a DECT cordless.

Recommendations for the 'box' and the VoIP provider please.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:

[snip]

>
> If I need to make any outgoing calls, I've got a DECT cordless.
>
> Recommendations for the 'box' and the VoIP provider please.

Sign up with Voipfone - https://www.voipfone.co.uk/

Buy an ATA (Analog Telephone Adapter) with two POTs sockets from them
and plug it into your router. Plug your retro dial phone into one POTS
socket, and the base station for your DECT phone into the other.

Using their web portal, or by speaking to them, port in your geographic
VoIP number.

Ask here again if you need further guidance.

Cost - ATA about £56
Ported-in number £3 per month

Minimum call plan is "Flex" - make sure you set Users=0 otherwise they
charge you a further £1.5 per month because they treat users as extensions.

--
Graham J

On 02/04/2024 18:40, Roland Perry wrote:
> However, as an exercise as much as anything else, I'd like to retain
> my retro dial phone with bells, and connect it to a 'box' which will,
> like the Openreach gubbins, be powered from a UPS, and service a
> geographic VoIP number that's currently with Gradwell (but they are
> too expensive).

Before I retired I was often on 24/7 call, I found pagers just did not
always wake me and sometimes I was convinced the pager had gone when it
had not.

I so I used to plug in a proper phone with a bell overnight - that woke
me immediately!

In message <uuhsdu$3efaj$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:13:32 on Tue, 2 Apr
2024, Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> remarked:
>Roland Perry wrote:
>
>[snip]
>
>> If I need to make any outgoing calls, I've got a DECT cordless.
>> Recommendations for the 'box' and the VoIP provider please.
>
>
>Sign up with Voipfone - https://www.voipfone.co.uk/
>
>Buy an ATA (Analog Telephone Adapter) with two POTs sockets from them
>and plug it into your router. Plug your retro dial phone into one POTS
>socket, and the base station for your DECT phone into the other.
>
>Using their web portal, or by speaking to them, port in your geographic
>VoIP number.
>
>Ask here again if you need further guidance.
>
>Cost - ATA about £56

Any particular models?

>Ported-in number £3 per month

That appears to have gone up to £6 (£5 + VAT).

>Minimum call plan is "Flex" - make sure you set Users=0 otherwise they
>charge you a further £1.5 per month because they treat users as
>extensions.

--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:

[snip]

>>
>> Cost - ATA about £56
>
> Any particular models?

https://www.voipfone.co.uk/shop.php?method=view&pid=142

--
Graham J

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <uuhsdu$3efaj$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:13:32 on Tue, 2 Apr
> 2024, Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> remarked:
>> Roland Perry wrote:
>>
>> [snip]
>>
>>> If I need to make any outgoing calls, I've got a DECT cordless.
>>> Recommendations for the 'box' and the VoIP provider please.
>>
>>
>> Sign up with Voipfone - https://www.voipfone.co.uk/
>>
>> Buy an ATA (Analog Telephone Adapter) with two POTs sockets from them
>> and plug it into your router. Plug your retro dial phone into one POTS
>> socket, and the base station for your DECT phone into the other.
>>
>> Using their web portal, or by speaking to them, port in your geographic
>> VoIP number.
>>
>> Ask here again if you need further guidance.
>>
>> Cost - ATA about £56
>
> Any particular models?
>
>> Ported-in number £3 per month
>
> That appears to have gone up to £6 (£5 + VAT).
>
>> Minimum call plan is "Flex" - make sure you set Users=0 otherwise they
>> charge you a further £1.5 per month because they treat users as
>> extensions.
>

I use Andrews and Arnold

https://www.aa.net.uk/voice-and-mobile/voip-information/

I purchased their Yealink DECT base station and handset. It works well.

In the past A&A have railed against NAT and the problems it potentially
introduces for VOIP. The various protocols involved are supposed to work
around this, so I don’t know how much of an issue this really is today. My
ISP (IDnet) gives me a fully routed IPv6 subnet so NAT isn’t an issue.

I can’t offer any current advice about Analogue Telephone Adapters (ATA).
They used to be common and cheap but no longer. I guess the demand has gone
away. Cisco and Grandstream seem to be the two main vendors these days. A
lot of the Cisco kit seems designed for a corporate rollout so check the
manual in advance to see that it can be configured at a single user
domestic level.

If you want to retain your landline number make sure it gets ported before
your POTs service vanishes. It can take a week to ten days for the porting
process to complete.

One advantage of Andrew’s and Arnold is that you can always (during
working hours) get to speak to someone who knows what they are talking
about. They might even be able to point you I the direction of an ATA.

I suppose an alternative is to purchase a router with an integrated
analogue phone socket. I guess the other potential issue with an ATA is
does it have enough oomph to power a mechanical bell.

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <uuhsdu$3efaj$1@dont-email.me>, at 22:13:32 on Tue, 2 Apr
>> 2024, Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> remarked:
>>> Roland Perry wrote:
>>>
>>> [snip]
>>>
>>>> If I need to make any outgoing calls, I've got a DECT cordless.
>>>> Recommendations for the 'box' and the VoIP provider please.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sign up with Voipfone - https://www.voipfone.co.uk/
>>>
>>> Buy an ATA (Analog Telephone Adapter) with two POTs sockets from them
>>> and plug it into your router. Plug your retro dial phone into one POTS
>>> socket, and the base station for your DECT phone into the other.
>>>
>>> Using their web portal, or by speaking to them, port in your geographic
>>> VoIP number.
>>>
>>> Ask here again if you need further guidance.
>>>
>>> Cost - ATA about £56
>>
>> Any particular models?
>>
>>> Ported-in number £3 per month
>>
>> That appears to have gone up to £6 (£5 + VAT).
>>
>>> Minimum call plan is "Flex" - make sure you set Users=0 otherwise they
>>> charge you a further £1.5 per month because they treat users as
>>> extensions.
>>
>
> I use Andrews and Arnold
>
> https://www.aa.net.uk/voice-and-mobile/voip-information/
>
> I purchased their Yealink DECT base station and handset. It works well.
>
> In the past A&A have railed against NAT and the problems it potentially
> introduces for VOIP. The various protocols involved are supposed to work
> around this, so I don’t know how much of an issue this really is today. My
> ISP (IDnet) gives me a fully routed IPv6 subnet so NAT isn’t an issue.
>
> I can’t offer any current advice about Analogue Telephone Adapters (ATA).
> They used to be common and cheap but no longer. I guess the demand has gone
> away. Cisco and Grandstream seem to be the two main vendors these days. A
> lot of the Cisco kit seems designed for a corporate rollout so check the
> manual in advance to see that it can be configured at a single user
> domestic level.
>
> If you want to retain your landline number make sure it gets ported before
> your POTs service vanishes. It can take a week to ten days for the porting
> process to complete.
>
> One advantage of Andrew’s and Arnold is that you can always (during
> working hours) get to speak to someone who knows what they are talking
> about. They might even be able to point you I the direction of an ATA.
>
> I suppose an alternative is to purchase a router with an integrated
> analogue phone socket. I guess the other potential issue with an ATA is
> does it have enough oomph to power a mechanical bell.
>

PS: you’d also need to check that the ATA supports loop disconnect
dialling.

Roland Perry wrote:

[snip]

>
>> Ported-in number £3 per month
>
> That appears to have gone up to £6 (£5 + VAT).

From https://www.voipfone.co.uk/services/porting whcih includes the text:

"... Voipfone Flex where it's just £3 ex VAT per month and you pay
separately for any calls you make."

--
Graham J

On Wed, 03 Apr 2024 08:00:45 +0000, Tweed wrote:

> One advantage of Andrew’s and Arnold is that you can always (during
> working hours) get to speak to someone who knows what they are talking
> about. They might even be able to point you I the direction of an ATA.

Once you've paid the porting fee (£15 last time I looked) AAISP charge
£1.20 + VAT per month for each number. Calls are cheap too.

On 02.04.2024 um 22:13 Uhr Graham J wrote:

> Buy an ATA (Analog Telephone Adapter) with two POTs sockets from them
> and plug it into your router.

Make sure it supports pulse dialing. If it doesn't, you can dial with
your rotary phone.

Make sure it supports IPv6, so you can use it even when you don't get a
public IPv4.

--
kind regards
Marco

Send spam to 1712088812muell@cartoonies.org

On Wed, 03 Apr 2024 11:16:29 +0200, Marco Moock wrote:

> Make sure it supports pulse dialing. If it doesn't, you can dial with
> your rotary phone.

ITYM "can't" ...

Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> I use Andrews and Arnold
>
> https://www.aa.net.uk/voice-and-mobile/voip-information/
>
> I purchased their Yealink DECT base station and handset. It works well.
>
> In the past A&A have railed against NAT and the problems it potentially
> introduces for VOIP. The various protocols involved are supposed to work
> around this, so I don’t know how much of an issue this really is today. My
> ISP (IDnet) gives me a fully routed IPv6 subnet so NAT isn’t an issue.

I've used A&A over a number of ISPs that don't offer IPv6 and not had
problems. It's basically plug and play these days - it probably helps if
you make sure you set the STUN server address when configuring the ATA but a
number of ISP and router swaps and it's just worked.

> I can’t offer any current advice about Analogue Telephone Adapters (ATA).
> They used to be common and cheap but no longer. I guess the demand has gone
> away. Cisco and Grandstream seem to be the two main vendors these days. A
> lot of the Cisco kit seems designed for a corporate rollout so check the
> manual in advance to see that it can be configured at a single user
> domestic level.

It's worth checking that it supports pulse dialling.
https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/showthread.php?t=138482
suggests you could use a pulse to tone dialling converter plus a regular
ATA, but also some ATAs that do support pulse.

Theo

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I use Andrews and Arnold
>>
>> https://www.aa.net.uk/voice-and-mobile/voip-information/
>>
>> I purchased their Yealink DECT base station and handset. It works well.
>>
>> In the past A&A have railed against NAT and the problems it potentially
>> introduces for VOIP. The various protocols involved are supposed to work
>> around this, so I don’t know how much of an issue this really is today. My
>> ISP (IDnet) gives me a fully routed IPv6 subnet so NAT isn’t an issue.
>
> I've used A&A over a number of ISPs that don't offer IPv6 and not had
> problems. It's basically plug and play these days - it probably helps if
> you make sure you set the STUN server address when configuring the ATA but a
> number of ISP and router swaps and it's just worked.
>
>> I can’t offer any current advice about Analogue Telephone Adapters (ATA).
>> They used to be common and cheap but no longer. I guess the demand has gone
>> away. Cisco and Grandstream seem to be the two main vendors these days. A
>> lot of the Cisco kit seems designed for a corporate rollout so check the
>> manual in advance to see that it can be configured at a single user
>> domestic level.
>
> It's worth checking that it supports pulse dialling.
> https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/showthread.php?t=138482
> suggests you could use a pulse to tone dialling converter plus a regular
> ATA, but also some ATAs that do support pulse.
>
> Theo
>

https://www.grandstream.com/hubfs/Product_Documentation/datasheet_ht812_english.pdf

Seems to support both loop disconnect dialling and has a REN of 3, so
likely to operate the mechanical bell.

On 03.04.2024 um 12:05 Uhr Theo wrote:

> but also some ATAs that do support pulse.
https://www.grandstream.com/products/gateways-and-atas/analog-telephone-adaptors

Supports IPv6 and pulse dialing.
Although, I haven't tested that yet.

--
kind regards
Marco

Send spam to 1712138747muell@cartoonies.org

On 03.04.2024 um 09:31 Uhr Bob Eager wrote:

> On Wed, 03 Apr 2024 11:16:29 +0200, Marco Moock wrote:
>
> > Make sure it supports pulse dialing. If it doesn't, you can dial
> > with your rotary phone.
>
> ITYM "can't" ...

Yes, my fault.

--
kind regards
Marco

Send spam to 1712129508muell@cartoonies.org

In article <Vxv*c40Gz@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>,
Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

> I've used A&A over a number of ISPs that don't offer IPv6 and not
> had problems. It's basically plug and play these days - it
> probably helps if you make sure you set the STUN server address
> when configuring the ATA but a number of ISP and router swaps and
> it's just worked.

Currently with very expensive Virgin Media but we're supposed to be
getting BRSK if they *ever* put the poles up.

Anyone know if these things work with Virgin and CGNAT used by BRSK?

Thanks.

Bob.

Bob Latham <bob@sick-of-spam.invalid> wrote:
> In article <Vxv*c40Gz@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>,
> Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> I've used A&A over a number of ISPs that don't offer IPv6 and not
>> had problems. It's basically plug and play these days - it
>> probably helps if you make sure you set the STUN server address
>> when configuring the ATA but a number of ISP and router swaps and
>> it's just worked.
>
> Currently with very expensive Virgin Media but we're supposed to be
> getting BRSK if they *ever* put the poles up.
>
> Anyone know if these things work with Virgin and CGNAT used by BRSK?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Bob.
>
>

BRSK claim to support ipv6, so hopefully no NAT on that.

In message <uuj12i$3po90$1@dont-email.me>, at 08:38:56 on Wed, 3 Apr
2024, Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> remarked:
>Roland Perry wrote:
>
>[snip]
>
>>> Cost - ATA about £56
>> Any particular models?
>
>https://www.voipfone.co.uk/shop.php?method=view&pid=142

Which appears to claim that to use the two sockets you need two VoIP
accounts (or one and an extension). That doubles the cost :(

They also don't recommend plugging two phones into to one socket, and
I'd need my vintage phone plus a Dect base.
--
Roland Perry

In message <uuj2m6$3q6sk$1@dont-email.me>, at 08:06:30 on Wed, 3 Apr
2024, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:

>>I guess the other potential issue with an ATA is
>> does it have enough oomph to power a mechanical bell.
>
>PS: you’d also need to check that the ATA supports loop disconnect
>dialling.

I'm a happy to buy a "vintage ATA", if that helps. There's absolutely no
need to get a brand new one.
--
Roland Perry

In message <uuj2bd$3q4mt$1@dont-email.me>, at 08:00:45 on Wed, 3 Apr
2024, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:

>If you want to retain your landline number

"the associated POTs line is toast. Nobody but scammers call me on
it anyway."
--
Roland Perry

In message <l74kk5F9b0kU7@mid.individual.net>, at 09:08:21 on Wed, 3 Apr
2024, Bob Eager <news0009@eager.cx> remarked:
>On Wed, 03 Apr 2024 08:00:45 +0000, Tweed wrote:
>
>> One advantage of Andrew’s and Arnold is that you can always (during
>> working hours) get to speak to someone who knows what they are talking
>> about. They might even be able to point you I the direction of an ATA.
>
>Once you've paid the porting fee (£15 last time I looked) AAISP charge
>£1.20 + VAT per month for each number. Calls are cheap too.

That sounds much more affordable.
--
Roland Perry

In message <uujfbe$3t8fg$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:42:38 on Wed, 3 Apr
2024, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>> I've used A&A over a number of ISPs that don't offer IPv6 and not had
>> problems. It's basically plug and play these days - it probably helps if
>> you make sure you set the STUN server address when configuring the ATA but a
>> number of ISP and router swaps and it's just worked.
>>
>>> I can’t offer any current advice about Analogue Telephone Adapters (ATA).
>>> They used to be common and cheap but no longer. I guess the demand has gone
>>> away. Cisco and Grandstream seem to be the two main vendors these days. A
>>> lot of the Cisco kit seems designed for a corporate rollout so check the
>>> manual in advance to see that it can be configured at a single user
>>> domestic level.
>>
>> It's worth checking that it supports pulse dialling.
>> https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/showthread.php?t=138482
>> suggests you could use a pulse to tone dialling converter plus a regular
>> ATA, but also some ATAs that do support pulse.
>
>https://www.grandstream.com/hubfs/Product_Documentation/datasheet_ht812_english.pdf
>
>Seems to support both loop disconnect dialling and has a REN of 3, so
>likely to operate the mechanical bell.

Looks very promising, but need to check if it's "supported" by A&A I
suppose.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <uujfbe$3t8fg$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:42:38 on Wed, 3 Apr
> 2024, Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> I've used A&A over a number of ISPs that don't offer IPv6 and not had
>>> problems. It's basically plug and play these days - it probably helps if
>>> you make sure you set the STUN server address when configuring the ATA but a
>>> number of ISP and router swaps and it's just worked.
>>>
>>>> I can’t offer any current advice about Analogue Telephone Adapters (ATA).
>>>> They used to be common and cheap but no longer. I guess the demand has gone
>>>> away. Cisco and Grandstream seem to be the two main vendors these days. A
>>>> lot of the Cisco kit seems designed for a corporate rollout so check the
>>>> manual in advance to see that it can be configured at a single user
>>>> domestic level.
>>>
>>> It's worth checking that it supports pulse dialling.
>>> https://www.vintage-radio.net/forum/showthread.php?t=138482
>>> suggests you could use a pulse to tone dialling converter plus a regular
>>> ATA, but also some ATAs that do support pulse.
>>
>> https://www.grandstream.com/hubfs/Product_Documentation/datasheet_ht812_english.pdf
>>
>> Seems to support both loop disconnect dialling and has a REN of 3, so
>> likely to operate the mechanical bell.
>
> Looks very promising, but need to check if it's "supported" by A&A I
> suppose.

Give their tech support line a call. Their VOIP service is standards
compliant, so I’d be surprised if the Grandstream device didn’t work.

In article <uuk7so$3blg$1@dont-email.me>,
Tweed <usenet.tweed@gmail.com> wrote:
> Bob Latham <bob@sick-of-spam.invalid> wrote:
> > In article <Vxv*c40Gz@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>,
> > Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> >
> >> I've used A&A over a number of ISPs that don't offer IPv6 and not
> >> had problems. It's basically plug and play these days - it
> >> probably helps if you make sure you set the STUN server address
> >> when configuring the ATA but a number of ISP and router swaps and
> >> it's just worked.
> >
> > Currently with very expensive Virgin Media but we're supposed to be
> > getting BRSK if they *ever* put the poles up.
> >
> > Anyone know if these things work with Virgin and CGNAT used by BRSK?
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Bob.
> >
> >

> BRSK claim to support ipv6, so hopefully no NAT on that.

I can't grasp IPv6 at all. I've read quite a bit but the more I read,
the more confused I get. I don't know anyone who has it or knows
anything of it, for me it's a bogey man and a disaster waiting to
happen.

Bob.

In message <uuj3bd$3qadn$1@dont-email.me>, at 09:17:46 on Wed, 3 Apr
2024, Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> remarked:
>Roland Perry wrote:
>
>[snip]
>
>>> Ported-in number £3 per month
>> That appears to have gone up to £6 (£5 + VAT).
>
>From https://www.voipfone.co.uk/services/porting whcih includes the text:
>
>"... Voipfone Flex where it's just £3 ex VAT

So £3.60 inc VAT?

>per month and you pay separately for any calls you make."

Slightly off-putting that elsewhere on their site they appear to price
it at £6 (inc VAT, not ex-VAT).
--
Roland Perry