In article <20231006120636.33ca6f6d7a28ff7a5f76fe32@novabbs.com>,
Retro Guy <retroguy@novabbs.com> wrote:
>On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 17:11:27 -0000 (UTC)
>Spiros Bousbouras <spibou@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I was thinking that a whitelist would be faster and simpler. As for filters ,
>> a human familiar with the group would certainly be more reliable than an
>> automatic filter.
>
>The quantity of spam precludes manual filtering. Thousands upon thousands of
>spam messages, where you would need an entire team to handle that by hand.
>

Exactly the case.

>--
>Retro Guy

--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@nk.ca Ici doctor@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism https://www.empire.kred/ROOTNK?t=94a1f39b
There is something wrong with the mind that punishes dissent and not murder. -unknown Beware https://mindspring.com

On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 00:55:43 -0000 (UTC)
doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) wrote:

> In article <2f5fff571adf1caea9290b4ad916ef8d$1@sybershock.com>,
> Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
> >On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 15:16:29 +0100
> >Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> >> We need a whitelisting solution, at the federation level.
> >>
> >> If a GG user manages to find a technical group that hasn't been
> >> flooded with spam, then they'd wonder why an otherwise active group
> >> is completely ignoring them. I don't think whitelisting would be
> >> fair.
> >
> >It is not our job to worry about Google's users.
> >
> >It is Google's job to worry about their users.
> >
> >The mother hen mentality fixes nothing.
> >
>
> But their abusers are making groups unreadable.

There are efforts by some admins to resolve this. Many groups are now quite
usable as admins are tackling and conquering the spam.

It should need to be this way, but it is what it is. Nobody tells Google what
to do.

--
Retro Guy

In article <20231006175944.2258f79eef470c06cf49c5b3@novabbs.org>,
Retro Guy <retroguy@novabbs.org> wrote:
>On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 00:55:43 -0000 (UTC)
>doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) wrote:
>
>> In article <2f5fff571adf1caea9290b4ad916ef8d$1@sybershock.com>,
>> Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
>> >On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 15:16:29 +0100
>> >Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> >> We need a whitelisting solution, at the federation level.
>> >>
>> >> If a GG user manages to find a technical group that hasn't been
>> >> flooded with spam, then they'd wonder why an otherwise active group
>> >> is completely ignoring them. I don't think whitelisting would be
>> >> fair.
>> >
>> >It is not our job to worry about Google's users.
>> >
>> >It is Google's job to worry about their users.
>> >
>> >The mother hen mentality fixes nothing.
>> >
>>
>> But their abusers are making groups unreadable.
>
>There are efforts by some admins to resolve this. Many groups are now quite
>usable as admins are tackling and conquering the spam.
>
>It should need to be this way, but it is what it is. Nobody tells Google what
>to do.
>

Too big for their own head.

>--
>Retro Guy

--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@nk.ca Ici doctor@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism https://www.empire.kred/ROOTNK?t=94a1f39b
There is something wrong with the mind that punishes dissent and not murder. -unknown Beware https://mindspring.com

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On Friday, 06 October 2023 14:37 -0000, Eric M wrote:

> [FU2]
> Le 06/10/2023 à 16:28, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) a écrit :

>> It appears that if enough people using the google groups interface
>> complain about spam in comp.lang.c, they'll fix it. That worked
>> for comp.arch, it appears.

> Yes, it worked, Google just deleted the newsgroup :
> http://al.howardknight.net/?STYPE=msgid&MSGI=%3Cfc5652a3-1c35-4b43-8f8d-1527e4257ac2n%40googlegroups.com%3E

Please follow and use the static "View for Bookmarking" URLs, when
posting, as it does not use the full query software.

http://al.howardknight.net/?ID=169664075300

It seems that whoever is pointing out comp.arch as being disabled, has
not actually checked. comp.arch is fully accessible using the lame
Google Groups http2nntp gateway.

<https://groups.google.com/g/comp.arch/c/q_F83lC2ARU/m/yxpag8nWBAAJ>
<quote>
MitchAlsup
unread,
7:32 PM (1 hour ago)
to
You may know more about it than I right now !!!
</quote>

- --
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.
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On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 01:00:00 +0100, ? Good Guy ? <Hello.World@example.onion> wrote:
snip
> talk about how to

udp google

On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 01:01:56 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) wrote:
>In article <20231006175944.2258f79eef470c06cf49c5b3@novabbs.org>,
>Retro Guy <retroguy@novabbs.org> wrote:
>>On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 00:55:43 -0000 (UTC)
>>doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) wrote:
>>> In article <2f5fff571adf1caea9290b4ad916ef8d$1@sybershock.com>,
>>> Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
>>> >On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 15:16:29 +0100
>>> >Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >> >> We need a whitelisting solution, at the federation level.
>>> >> If a GG user manages to find a technical group that hasn't been
>>> >> flooded with spam, then they'd wonder why an otherwise active group
>>> >> is completely ignoring them. I don't think whitelisting would be
>>> >> fair.
>>> >It is not our job to worry about Google's users.
>>> >It is Google's job to worry about their users.
>>> >The mother hen mentality fixes nothing.
>>> But their abusers are making groups unreadable.
>>There are efforts by some admins to resolve this. Many groups are now quite
>>usable as admins are tackling and conquering the spam.
>>It should need to be this way, but it is what it is. Nobody tells Google what
>>to do.
>
>Too big for their own head.

the bigger they are . . .

On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 17:59:44 -0700
Retro Guy <retroguy@novabbs.org> wrote:

> Nobody tells Google what to do.

Be careful not to poke the bear. The purple-haired Google vegan
skinny-jeans mafia might come after you.

They might shell your house with yogurt and tofu and lettuce greens and
other weapons of rabbit destruction.

--
__|__|__|__ 3883@sugar.bug
__|__|__|__ https://sybershock.com | https://syfershock.com
__|__|__|__ news://alt.sources.crypto
| | | #CipherTag #WaffleTag #Cryptologer

On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 12:06:36 -0700
Retro Guy <retroguy@novabbs.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 17:11:27 -0000 (UTC)
> Spiros Bousbouras <spibou@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I was thinking that a whitelist would be faster and simpler. As for filters ,
> > a human familiar with the group would certainly be more reliable than an
> > automatic filter.
>
> The quantity of spam precludes manual filtering. Thousands upon thousands of
> spam messages, where you would need an entire team to handle that by hand.

The central idea given in <20231005094102.846@kylheku.com> was

That is to say, servers like Eternal September should reject all
articles from Google Groups, except from users who are whitelisted.

..I was trying to improve on the specifics given in that message and the
objections in later messages to those specifics. Noone suggested going
manually through all the spam.

On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 18:26:19 -0000 (UTC)
Ray Banana <rayban@raybanana.net> wrote:
> * Spiros Bousbouras wrote:
> >> <ufjr39$ak71$1@dont-email.me>
> >>
> >> and some kind soul translated the posting to Thai and posted it to the same
> >> group:
> >>
> >> <18a75249-032f-4f06-9c5f-0b5f6025e3b7n@googlegroups.com>
> >
> > I don't read Thai but the googlegroups post is not a translation of
> ><ufjr39$ak71$1@dont-email.me> .The latter has
> >
> > group=*
> > case=0
> > score=kill
> > msgid_last=*<*@googlegroups.com>*
>
> The Thai message reads:

[...]

> which Google Translator (how ironic) translates as

Nothing ironic about it. Many of Google services are good. Their email
service in particular is very good at filtering spam. Hence it's a
mystery to me why they don't do the same with googlegroups.

> "I saw Kenny McCormack post what to do about spam.
> Here for trn this is what I do when using tin.
>
> You can add these 4 lines to the file "~/.tin/filter" I found that
> This is the only solution that worked for me. The other items I
> Found in web search failure"
>
> Not perfect, but you get the meaning.

Ok , so the Thai message did not translate the whole of
<ufjr39$ak71$1@dont-email.me> .

> And at the same time, you have refuted your claim that
> human moderators are more reliable ;-)

In what way have I refuted it ?

> not to mention availability. And I have ~15.000 spam mails
> from Google Groups on my server accumulated over the last
> 3 days. Care to check them manually?

By "mails" do you mean usenet posts ? If yes then noone suggested going
manually through the spam , see <xcM1CDmY5isYRGNHp@bongo-ra.co> .

On 10/6/23 19:55, The Doctor wrote:
> In article <d78a803bb42cae27c3cad8f3e7b993d4$1@sybershock.com>,
> Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
>> On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 15:16:29 +0100
>> Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> If a GG user manages to find a technical group that hasn't been
>>> flooded with spam, then they'd wonder why an otherwise active group
>>> is completely ignoring them. I don't think whitelisting would be
>>> fair.
>>
>> Google groups users are the modern version of the September AOL users.
>>
>
> Exactly!
>
>> --
>> __|__|__|__ 3883@sugar.bug
>> __|__|__|__ https://sybershock.com
>> __|__|__|__ news://alt.sources.crypto
>> | | | #CipherTag #WaffleTag #Cryptologer
>>
>
>

Ironic the server called "eternal september" didn't emulate the
september user base
--
user <candycane> is generated from /dev/urandom

On 10/6/2023 8:44 PM, Syber Shock wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 17:59:44 -0700
> Retro Guy <retroguy@novabbs.org> wrote:
>
>> Nobody tells Google what to do.
>
> Be careful not to poke the bear. The purple-haired Google vegan
> skinny-jeans mafia might come after you.
>
> They might shell your house with yogurt and tofu and lettuce greens and
> other weapons of rabbit destruction.
>

Little shits! Humm...

On Fri, 06 Oct 2023 17:59:44 -0700, Retro Guy wrote:

> On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 00:55:43 -0000 (UTC)
> doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) wrote:
>
>> In article <2f5fff571adf1caea9290b4ad916ef8d$1@sybershock.com>,
>> Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
>> >On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 15:16:29 +0100 Richard Harnden
>> ><richard.nospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> >> We need a whitelisting solution, at the federation level.
>> >>
>> >> If a GG user manages to find a technical group that hasn't been
>> >> flooded with spam, then they'd wonder why an otherwise active group
>> >> is completely ignoring them. I don't think whitelisting would be
>> >> fair.
>> >
>> >It is not our job to worry about Google's users.
>> >
>> >It is Google's job to worry about their users.
>> >
>> >The mother hen mentality fixes nothing.
>> >
>> >
>> But their abusers are making groups unreadable.
>
> There are efforts by some admins to resolve this. Many groups are now
> quite usable as admins are tackling and conquering the spam.
>
> It should need to be this way, but it is what it is. Nobody tells Google
> what to do.

pfft google thought they were too big not be dnsbl listed, nor that any
network would dare block all gmail for periods of time to send them a
message, google were wrong, both counts.

doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) writes:
> In article <87y1gfvf7i.fsf@nosuchdomain.example.com>,
> Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> wrote:
>>doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) writes:
>>> In article <1bwmvzg50w.fsf@pfeifferfamily.net>,
>>> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> wrote:
>>>>Eric M <conanospamic@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> Yes, it worked, Google just deleted the newsgroup :
>>>>>
>>>>http://al.howardknight.net/?STYPE=msgid&MSGI=%3Cfc5652a3-1c35-4b43-8f8d-1527e4257ac2n%40googlegroups.com%3E
>>>>
>>>>No, that was a comment from a user during the Thaidal wave referring to
>>>>the s/n ratio having gotten so bad the group had become
>>>>useless. Checking... the group is still there.
>>>>
>>>>https://groups.google.com/g/comp.arch
>>>>
>>>
>>> Depeer Google groups now! Enough with the anaccountability!
>>
>>What exactly woold that do? Would articles posted elsewhere (say, via
>>eternal-september) no longer appear on the Google Groups web interface?
>>
>>I'm not pleased with GG as a Usenet interface, but it's still a decent
>>archive. I wouldn't want to lose that.
>
> The archive is already lost due to high spamtrollers!

I presume you know the answer to my question and that the answer is yes:
depeering Google Groups would prevent all newly posted articles from
being added to the GG archive.

I oppose doing that. I suspect the recent wave of Thai spam will be
temporary, and it's still possible that Google may deal with it.

Furthermore, since it's something only Usenet server administrators can
do, and has nothing to do with C, I request that this discussion be
taken out of comp.lang.c, where it is off topic. (We've already had a
necessary discussion of how individual users can filter out the recent
spam.)

I'm redirecting followups to news.admin.net-abuse.usenet; feel free to
cross-post to news.software.nntp if it's really topical there.

I mean, the whole point is that we don't want off-topic posts, right?

--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com
Will write code for food.
void Void(void) { Void(); } /* The recursive call of the void */

The Doctor to Keith Thompson:

> > I'm not pleased with GG as a Usenet interface, but it's
> > still a decent archive. I wouldn't want to lose that.
>
> The archive is already lost due to high spamtrollers!

usenetarcives.com is another emerging option. If they get
enough funding, they may have a chance of replacing Google's
archive. Does anybody know how full their coverage is going
to be?

CLC removed from FollowUp-To: at Keith's request.

--
() ascii ribbon campaign -- against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org -- against proprietary attachments

I wrote:

> usenetarcives.com is another emerging option.

I beg everybody's pardon for a typo in the URL. I had better
copy it from the browser:

<https://www.usenetarchives.com/>
--
() ascii ribbon campaign -- against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org -- against proprietary attachments

Am 07.10.2023 um 13:47:21 Uhr schrieb Anton Shepelev:

> The Doctor to Keith Thompson:
>
> > > I'm not pleased with GG as a Usenet interface, but it's
> > > still a decent archive. I wouldn't want to lose that.
> >
> > The archive is already lost due to high spamtrollers!
>
> usenetarcives.com is another emerging option. If they get
> enough funding, they may have a chance of replacing Google's
> archive. Does anybody know how full their coverage is going
> to be?

Not really good, at least not for recent stuff.
If I search my name, I can't find any post.

Marco Moock to Anton Shepelev:

> > usenetarchives.com [Ant: typo fixed] is another emerging
> > option. If they get enough funding, they may have a
> > chance of replacing Google's archive. Does anybody know
> > how full their coverage is going to be?
>
> Not really good, at least not for recent stuff. If I
> search my name, I can't find any post.

They have not finished pupolating the archive yet, and
according the their Stats page, migration to another
database is underway. Let us recheck later.

--
() ascii ribbon campaign -- against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org -- against proprietary attachments

Le 07/10/2023 à 12:55, Anton Shepelev a écrit :

>> usenetarcives.com is another emerging option.

> I beg everybody's pardon for a typo in the URL. I had better
> copy it from the browser:
>
> <https://www.usenetarchives.com/>

They don't have all the hierarchies. Only the Big 8 and a few alt.*
groups.

Anton Shepelev <anton.txt@gmail.moc> wrote:

> I wrote:
>
> > usenetarcives.com is another emerging option.
>
> I beg everybody's pardon for a typo in the URL. I had better
> copy it from the browser:
>
> <https://www.usenetarchives.com/>

That's useful, thank you.

--
^Ï^. Sn!pe <https://youtu.be/_kqytf31a8E>

My pet rock Gordon just is.

On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 13:47:21 +0300, Anton Shepelev
<anton.txt@gmail.moc> wrote:

>usenetarcHives.com is another emerging option.

Not really. They use Google scripts.
What could go wrong? <irony>
[]'s
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012
Google Fuchsia - 2021

On 7 Oct 2023 19:32:59 +1000, noel <deletethis@invalid.lan> wrote:
>On Fri, 06 Oct 2023 17:59:44 -0700, Retro Guy wrote:
>> On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 00:55:43 -0000 (UTC)
>> doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) wrote:
>>> In article <2f5fff571adf1caea9290b4ad916ef8d$1@sybershock.com>,
>>> Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
>>> >It is not our job to worry about Google's users.
>>> >It is Google's job to worry about their users.
>>> >The mother hen mentality fixes nothing.
>>> But their abusers are making groups unreadable.
>> There are efforts by some admins to resolve this. Many groups are now
>> quite usable as admins are tackling and conquering the spam.
>> It should need to be this way, but it is what it is. Nobody tells Google
>> what to do.
>
>pfft google thought they were too big not be dnsbl listed, nor that any
>network would dare block all gmail for periods of time to send them a
>message, google were wrong, both counts.

the pandemic googlespam flood continues unabated . . .
"googlegroups.com" is a ghost ship running on autopilot

In article <f35182db5b4c06bbc8350051fc621a50$1@sybershock.com>,
Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
>On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 17:59:44 -0700
>Retro Guy <retroguy@novabbs.org> wrote:
>
>> Nobody tells Google what to do.
>
>Be careful not to poke the bear. The purple-haired Google vegan
>skinny-jeans mafia might come after you.
>
>They might shell your house with yogurt and tofu and lettuce greens and
>other weapons of rabbit destruction.

Back to the real world, comp.mail.sendmail is getting hammered
like comp.lang.c

>
>--
> __|__|__|__ 3883@sugar.bug
> __|__|__|__ https://sybershock.com | https://syfershock.com
> __|__|__|__ news://alt.sources.crypto
> | | | #CipherTag #WaffleTag #Cryptologer
>
>
>

--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@nk.ca Ici doctor@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism https://www.empire.kred/ROOTNK?t=94a1f39b
An oil stain on the carpet is not removed by picking up the litter. -unknown Beware https://mindspring.com

In article <ufqmqd$1vve7$9@dont-email.me>,
candycanearter07 <no@thanks.net> wrote:
>On 10/6/23 19:55, The Doctor wrote:
>> In article <d78a803bb42cae27c3cad8f3e7b993d4$1@sybershock.com>,
>> Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 15:16:29 +0100
>>> Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> If a GG user manages to find a technical group that hasn't been
>>>> flooded with spam, then they'd wonder why an otherwise active group
>>>> is completely ignoring them. I don't think whitelisting would be
>>>> fair.
>>>
>>> Google groups users are the modern version of the September AOL users.
>>>
>>
>> Exactly!
>>
>>> --
>>> __|__|__|__ 3883@sugar.bug
>>> __|__|__|__ https://sybershock.com
>>> __|__|__|__ news://alt.sources.crypto
>>> | | | #CipherTag #WaffleTag #Cryptologer
>>>
>>
>>
>
>Ironic the server called "eternal september" didn't emulate the
>september user base

Ray Banana is a good man unlike Google!

>--
>user <candycane> is generated from /dev/urandom
>

--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@nk.ca Ici doctor@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism https://www.empire.kred/ROOTNK?t=94a1f39b
An oil stain on the carpet is not removed by picking up the litter. -unknown Beware https://mindspring.com

In article <ufqnc5$26alr$1@dont-email.me>,
Chris M. Thomasson <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> wrote:
>On 10/6/2023 8:44 PM, Syber Shock wrote:
>> On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 17:59:44 -0700
>> Retro Guy <retroguy@novabbs.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Nobody tells Google what to do.
>>
>> Be careful not to poke the bear. The purple-haired Google vegan
>> skinny-jeans mafia might come after you.
>>
>> They might shell your house with yogurt and tofu and lettuce greens and
>> other weapons of rabbit destruction.
>>
>
>Little s*ts! Humm...

Treat Google Groups like you do Google+ .
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@nk.ca Ici doctor@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism https://www.empire.kred/ROOTNK?t=94a1f39b
An oil stain on the carpet is not removed by picking up the litter. -unknown Beware https://mindspring.com

In article <652125cb$1@news.ausics.net>, noel <deletethis@invalid.lan> wrote:
>On Fri, 06 Oct 2023 17:59:44 -0700, Retro Guy wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 7 Oct 2023 00:55:43 -0000 (UTC)
>> doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The Doctor) wrote:
>>
>>> In article <2f5fff571adf1caea9290b4ad916ef8d$1@sybershock.com>,
>>> Syber Shock <admin@sybershock.com> wrote:
>>> >On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 15:16:29 +0100 Richard Harnden
>>> ><richard.nospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> >> We need a whitelisting solution, at the federation level.
>>> >>
>>> >> If a GG user manages to find a technical group that hasn't been
>>> >> flooded with spam, then they'd wonder why an otherwise active group
>>> >> is completely ignoring them. I don't think whitelisting would be
>>> >> fair.
>>> >
>>> >It is not our job to worry about Google's users.
>>> >
>>> >It is Google's job to worry about their users.
>>> >
>>> >The mother hen mentality fixes nothing.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> But their abusers are making groups unreadable.
>>
>> There are efforts by some admins to resolve this. Many groups are now
>> quite usable as admins are tackling and conquering the spam.
>>
>> It should need to be this way, but it is what it is. Nobody tells Google
>> what to do.
>
>
>pfft google thought they were too big not be dnsbl listed, nor that any
>network would dare block all gmail for periods of time to send them a
>message, google were wrong, both counts.
>

Gmail and Google Groups are high abuse

!!

1)

https://groups.google.com/search/conversations?q=Depeer%20Google%20Groups

2)

https://www.nk.ca/blog/index.php?/categories/14-Google-Spam

And do not get me started about M$ .
--
Member - Liberal International This is doctor@nk.ca Ici doctor@nk.ca
Yahweh, King & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism https://www.empire.kred/ROOTNK?t=94a1f39b
An oil stain on the carpet is not removed by picking up the litter. -unknown Beware https://mindspring.com