On 2023-11-06 14:02, Alan Browne wrote:
> On 2023-11-06 00:26, Frankie wrote:
>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>
>>>> It's a cherry picked statistic that completely ignored lifetime costs.
>>>
>>> Not at all.
>>
>> When you average the huge waste of owning Apple products where you
>> have to
>> overcome the loss of ports and missing slots and proprietary cabling and
>> repair costs so far off the charts everyone pays high ransoms to
>> AppleCare,
>> it's always 2X to 3X the overall cost of owning similar Android devices.
>
> You can't come up with proof of that, of course.  Since my devices in
> the past came with all the cables I've ever needed, there is no cost to
> add more.

I remember a kid that got an Apple tablet (I don't know the proper name)
as a present from an uncle, who also came to configure it all for the
first time. Then the father bought him a foldable case, and had to pay
for it a hefty price. He commented on it to me, saying how expensive was
to own that Apple tablet, the housefold being otherwise on Android.

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

On 2023-11-06 08:18, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2023-11-06 14:02, Alan Browne wrote:
>> On 2023-11-06 00:26, Frankie wrote:
>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>
>>>>> It's a cherry picked statistic that completely ignored lifetime costs.
>>>>
>>>> Not at all.
>>>
>>> When you average the huge waste of owning Apple products where you
>>> have to
>>> overcome the loss of ports and missing slots and proprietary cabling and
>>> repair costs so far off the charts everyone pays high ransoms to
>>> AppleCare,
>>> it's always 2X to 3X the overall cost of owning similar Android devices.
>>
>> You can't come up with proof of that, of course.  Since my devices in
>> the past came with all the cables I've ever needed, there is no cost
>> to add more.
>
> I remember a kid that got an Apple tablet (I don't know the proper name)
> as a present from an uncle, who also came to configure it all for the
> first time. Then the father bought him a foldable case, and had to pay
> for it a hefty price. He commented on it to me, saying how expensive was
> to own that Apple tablet, the housefold being otherwise on Android.

So buying an over priced case in a marketplace of thousands of lower
priced options plays into this? Sheesh.

Anyway, samples of one, picked for the comments, as always don't
represent the whole - not even close.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 2023-11-06 14:32, Alan Browne wrote:
> On 2023-11-06 08:18, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2023-11-06 14:02, Alan Browne wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-06 00:26, Frankie wrote:
>>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> It's a cherry picked statistic that completely ignored lifetime
>>>>>> costs.
>>>>>
>>>>> Not at all.
>>>>
>>>> When you average the huge waste of owning Apple products where you
>>>> have to
>>>> overcome the loss of ports and missing slots and proprietary cabling
>>>> and
>>>> repair costs so far off the charts everyone pays high ransoms to
>>>> AppleCare,
>>>> it's always 2X to 3X the overall cost of owning similar Android
>>>> devices.
>>>
>>> You can't come up with proof of that, of course.  Since my devices in
>>> the past came with all the cables I've ever needed, there is no cost
>>> to add more.
>>
>> I remember a kid that got an Apple tablet (I don't know the proper
>> name) as a present from an uncle, who also came to configure it all
>> for the first time. Then the father bought him a foldable case, and
>> had to pay for it a hefty price. He commented on it to me, saying how
>> expensive was to own that Apple tablet, the housefold being otherwise
>> on Android.
>
> So buying an over priced case in a marketplace of thousands of lower
> priced options plays into this?  Sheesh.

Apple stuff.

Wen we have to buy Apple stuff we have to pay by the nose. Android Stuff
is cheaper.

It just is.

So when we have to decide what brand to buy a tablet or phone, that
enters our consideration, not being fans.

> Anyway, samples of one, picked for the comments, as always don't
> represent the whole - not even close.

Oh, but I had dozens of similar experiences in the last forty years or
so. Everybody I talked with along the years commented that owning an
Apple thing was expensive.

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

On 2023-11-06 12:22, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2023-11-06 14:32, Alan Browne wrote:
>> On 2023-11-06 08:18, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-06 14:02, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>> On 2023-11-06 00:26, Frankie wrote:
>>>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's a cherry picked statistic that completely ignored lifetime
>>>>>>> costs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not at all.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you average the huge waste of owning Apple products where you
>>>>> have to
>>>>> overcome the loss of ports and missing slots and proprietary
>>>>> cabling and
>>>>> repair costs so far off the charts everyone pays high ransoms to
>>>>> AppleCare,
>>>>> it's always 2X to 3X the overall cost of owning similar Android
>>>>> devices.
>>>>
>>>> You can't come up with proof of that, of course.  Since my devices
>>>> in the past came with all the cables I've ever needed, there is no
>>>> cost to add more.
>>>
>>> I remember a kid that got an Apple tablet (I don't know the proper
>>> name) as a present from an uncle, who also came to configure it all
>>> for the first time. Then the father bought him a foldable case, and
>>> had to pay for it a hefty price. He commented on it to me, saying how
>>> expensive was to own that Apple tablet, the housefold being otherwise
>>> on Android.
>>
>> So buying an over priced case in a marketplace of thousands of lower
>> priced options plays into this?  Sheesh.
>
> Apple stuff.
>
> Wen we have to buy Apple stuff we have to pay by the nose. Android Stuff
> is cheaper.
>
> It just is.

In your head.

>
> So when we have to decide what brand to buy a tablet or phone, that
> enters our consideration, not being fans.
>
>> Anyway, samples of one, picked for the comments, as always don't
>> represent the whole - not even close.
>
> Oh, but I had dozens of similar experiences in the last forty years or
> so. Everybody I talked with along the years commented that owning an
> Apple thing was expensive.

Sure.

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

On 11/4/2023 5:20 AM, badgolferman wrote:
> Alan Browne <bitbucket@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>
>> "The iPhone is obviously superior at one thing. Ask your wallet."
>> -WaPo
>> https://wapo.st/45Ya1CH
>>
>
> Do you actually resale your phone or does it go in the drawer as a spare?
> I’m leery of buying used phones unless they’re coming from someone I know.
> And the times I do buy a phone it’s because the one I have is broken or too
> old. They end up in the drawer or given to recycle programs. I guess some
> people buy a new phone every year just to boast about it.

The TCO of a flagship Android versus a flagship iPhone is very close.
The Android device will have a slightly lower initial cost but will also
have lower trade-in value or resale value.

For non-flagship devices it is probably also the case.

--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards

On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:

>> Oh, but I had dozens of similar experiences in the last forty years or
>> so. Everybody I talked with along the years commented that owning an
>> Apple thing was expensive.
>
> Sure.

Why do you think Apple's profits are so high anyway?

The average cost to own Apple iPhones is more than two or three times the
average cost of owning Android phones for a lot of reasons related to this.

For one, as you mentioned, Apple accessories are far more expensive.
Especially since they're almost always special Apple proprietary parts.

For another, people are afraid of Apple fleecing them on repairs.
So they spend enormous sums every year on something they call Apple Care.
Apple is very happy to take their money from them because they're scared.

Nobody on Android needs Android Care.
It's only something Apple owners pay for.
Because repairs on Apple iPhones earned a flunking grade by iFixit.

Then when they do buy genuine Apple parts, if they don't also have Apple
replace those parts and reset the security lock, it doesn't work right.

All this is well known because iFixit gave the latest two years' worth of
iPhones a flunking grade in repairability. iFixit even retroactively
flunked older Apple phones when they found out Apple was doing that.

Apple made repairs impossible to do without resetting Apple locks on
purpose of course which is why people are so afraid they get Apple Care.

What's the worst part isn't even that many apps which are free on Android
cost money on iOS and those that cost money on Android cost more on iOS.

But it is even worse than that because Apple removes standard things like
the sdcard slot which almost every Android phone has for portable memory.

And APple removed the aux port which means that you can't use your wired
headphones anymore. Instead you have to buy expensive wireless products.

In the end, you're paying two to three times more for Apple products.
People who own Apple products actually brag how much they cost them.

On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:

>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because they're not
>> fleecing you every time you have to buy something that is free on Android?
>
> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep my Apple
> things going. Once case (above) was for "neatness".

How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on purpose?

On 5/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:

> Just tested on various browsers and different machines where I'm not
> logged into my WaPo account.

Everything on the iPhone costs more, from apps to cables to repairs.

It really doesn't matter how much you get "back" when you ditch your
expensive iPhone because overall Apple products will always cost you two to
three times what Android costs when you consider Apple designed it that
way.

Why do you think Apple removed the aux port and battery charger?
It's to make you buy a new one since you have to buy something to replace
what Apple took away (and no, "any old brick" will not work correctly).

The extremely high cost of Apple ownership is why they resell their phones.

Almost nobody on Android "resells" their phone.
Most people just buy a new phone.

It's only the Apple owners who are madly trying to recoup high losses.
An example is the rip off of Apple Care which is just crazy to pay for.

Just as nobody on Android "insures" their phone (ala "Apple Care"),
only Apple owners are so afraid of their phone that they insure it.

At an extremely high yearly cost, which over time costs more than a brand
new phone would cost - but they need Apple Care because it's so expensive.

In the end, the iPhone costs so much more than Android that the Apple
owners are desperate to sell it to someone else who will defray costs.

I say let them.
Apple is laughing at iPhone owners all the way to the bank.

sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote

> The TCO of a flagship Android versus a flagship iPhone is very close.
> The Android device will have a slightly lower initial cost but will also
> have lower trade-in value or resale value.
>
> For non-flagship devices it is probably also the case.

Steve is wrong (he lies); and he's cherry picking only flagship Androids.
The only way an iPhone costs what Android costs is if you ignore costs.

But that's pure bullshit.
Ask Steve to lay out the true lifetime costs.

He won't.
That's how I know Steve is lying and not just confused.

Steve will _never_ lay out the lifetime costs he says he's calculated.
Because he didn't calculate them.

He made them all up.
Out of nothing.

There isn't an iPhone alive that has the app power that even my _free_
Samsung Galaxy A32-5G has, and all I had to pay for it was the sales tax.

All my apps are free - so there's no cost in apps.
And T-Mobile replaced mine twice under warranty - so no repair costs.

If you purchase an iPhone, the initial sales tax alone is _more_ than I
spent on the lifetime of this phone (as all it ever needed was a case).

Yes - the free Android phone came with a high-speed charger, like most
Android phones still do - and it came with the standard aux port too.

So I can use my wired headphones without having to run out and purchase an
expensive set of headphones whose batteries constantly die on you.

And, um, no, I don't pay for a replacement-policy either, which is money
wasted that many Apple owners pay for which Steve doesn't account for.

All of Steve's numbers are completely bogus because he cherry picks the
phones and he ignores 99% of the Android phones that people actually buy.

On 2023-11-09 21:31, Wally J wrote:
> sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com> wrote
>
>> The TCO of a flagship Android versus a flagship iPhone is very close.
>> The Android device will have a slightly lower initial cost but will also
>> have lower trade-in value or resale value.
>>
>> For non-flagship devices it is probably also the case.
>
> Steve is wrong (he lies); and he's cherry picking only flagship Androids.
> The only way an iPhone costs what Android costs is if you ignore costs.

Do you ever proofread what you've written.

The only way A costs what B costs is if you ignore costs?

>
> But that's pure bullshit.
> Ask Steve to lay out the true lifetime costs.

This was where you were supposed to lay them out...

>
> He won't.
> That's how I know Steve is lying and not just confused.
>
> Steve will _never_ lay out the lifetime costs he says he's calculated.
> Because he didn't calculate them.
>
> He made them all up.
> Out of nothing.
>
> There isn't an iPhone alive that has the app power that even my _free_
> Samsung Galaxy A32-5G has, and all I had to pay for it was the sales tax.

Well either you're a liar or you are really, really stupid.

>
> All my apps are free - so there's no cost in apps.
> And T-Mobile replaced mine twice under warranty - so no repair costs.
>
> If you purchase an iPhone, the initial sales tax alone is _more_ than I
> spent on the lifetime of this phone (as all it ever needed was a case).
>
> Yes - the free Android phone came with a high-speed charger, like most
> Android phones still do - and it came with the standard aux port too.

It wasn't free. And the "standard aux port" (why'd you change your
naming convention for it, BTW?) is no better than the Lightning port.

>
> So I can use my wired headphones without having to run out and purchase an
> expensive set of headphones whose batteries constantly die on you.

And you can do exactly the same for Lightning headphones.

>
> And, um, no, I don't pay for a replacement-policy either, which is money
> wasted that many Apple owners pay for which Steve doesn't account for.
>
> All of Steve's numbers are completely bogus because he cherry picks the
> phones and he ignores 99% of the Android phones that people actually buy.

And yet, you don't produce any numbers at all in rebuttal.

Strange for someone who supposedly only states facts.

On 2023-11-10 06:04, Frankie wrote:
> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>
>>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because they're not
>>> fleecing you every time you have to buy something that is free on Android?
>>
>> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep my Apple
>> things going. Once case (above) was for "neatness".
>
> How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
> something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on purpose?

Or the FM radio.

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2023-11-10 06:04, Frankie wrote:
>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>
>>>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because they're not
>>>> fleecing you every time you have to buy something that is free on
>>>> Android?
>>>
>>> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep my Apple
>>> things going.  Once case (above) was for "neatness".
>>
>> How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
>> something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on
>> purpose?
>
> Or the FM radio.
>

Again:

How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?

Again, let me help you out:

<https://www.statista.com/statistics/215515/consumers-in-selected-countries-using-their-mobile-for-fm-radio/>

On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2023-11-10 06:04, Frankie wrote:
>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because they're not
>>>>> fleecing you every time you have to buy something that is free on
>>>>> Android?
>>>>
>>>> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep my
>>>> Apple
>>>> things going.  Once case (above) was for "neatness".
>>>
>>> How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
>>> something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on
>>> purpose?
>>
>> Or the FM radio.
>>
>
> Again:
>
> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?

I am using it right now :-)

>
> Again, let me help you out:
>
> <https://www.statista.com/statistics/215515/consumers-in-selected-countries-using-their-mobile-for-fm-radio/>

Did you look at the column for Spain? ;-)

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

On 2023-11-10 10:03, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
>> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-10 06:04, Frankie wrote:
>>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because they're
>>>>>> not
>>>>>> fleecing you every time you have to buy something that is free on
>>>>>> Android?
>>>>>
>>>>> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep my
>>>>> Apple
>>>>> things going.  Once case (above) was for "neatness".
>>>>
>>>> How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
>>>> something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on
>>>> purpose?
>>>
>>> Or the FM radio.
>>>
>>
>> Again:
>>
>> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?
>
> I am using it right now :-)
>
>>
>> Again, let me help you out:
>>
>> <https://www.statista.com/statistics/215515/consumers-in-selected-countries-using-their-mobile-for-fm-radio/>
>
> Did you look at the column for Spain? ;-)
>

Yes. So what?

I'll turn it around.

I live in Canada and I have never ONCE seen anyone listening to FM radio
on a phone.

On 2023-11-10 19:08, Alan wrote:
> On 2023-11-10 10:03, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>> On 2023-11-10 06:04, Frankie wrote:
>>>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because
>>>>>>> they're not
>>>>>>> fleecing you every time you have to buy something that is free on
>>>>>>> Android?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep my
>>>>>> Apple
>>>>>> things going.  Once case (above) was for "neatness".
>>>>>
>>>>> How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
>>>>> something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on
>>>>> purpose?
>>>>
>>>> Or the FM radio.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Again:
>>>
>>> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?
>>
>> I am using it right now :-)
>>
>>>
>>> Again, let me help you out:
>>>
>>> <https://www.statista.com/statistics/215515/consumers-in-selected-countries-using-their-mobile-for-fm-radio/>
>>
>> Did you look at the column for Spain? ;-)
>>
>
> Yes. So what?
>
> I'll turn it around.
>
> I live in Canada and I have never ONCE seen anyone listening to FM radio
> on a phone.

But I have seen many, in my country.

Maybe you do not have a radio culture. We do.

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
> On 2023-11-10 19:08, Alan wrote:
> > On 2023-11-10 10:03, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> >> On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
> >>> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> >>>> On 2023-11-10 06:04, Frankie wrote:
> >>>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because
> >>>>>>> they're not fleecing you every time you have to buy something
> >>>>>>> that is free on Android?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep
> >>>>>> my Apple things going.  Once case (above) was for "neatness".
> >>>>>
> >>>>> How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
> >>>>> something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on
> >>>>> purpose?
> >>>>
> >>>> Or the FM radio.
> >>>
> >>> Again:
> >>>
> >>> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?
> >>
> >> I am using it right now :-)
> >>
> >>>
> >>> Again, let me help you out:
> >>>
> >>> <https://www.statista.com/statistics/215515/consumers-in-selected-countries-using-their-mobile-for-fm-radio/>
> >>
> >> Did you look at the column for Spain? ;-)
> >
> > Yes. So what?
> >
> > I'll turn it around.
> >
> > I live in Canada and I have never ONCE seen anyone listening to FM radio
> > on a phone.

That's what you get for buying iPhones!

BTW, we've never ONCE seen anyone using iMessage! Your point being?

> But I have seen many, in my country.
>
> Maybe you do not have a radio culture. We do.

<firmly sitting on hands>

What's next? USB-C charging ports? (Non) Supplied chargers? iMessage
on Android? Just use a news server with short retention and start all
over.

Can someone please pass the popcorn?

On 11/10/2023 12:03 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
>> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:

<snip>

>> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?
>
> I am using it right now :-)

At the health club I go to they have three televisions viewable from
many of the exercise machines. They broadcast the audio on LPFM radio.
So it's useful to have a phone with an FM receiver if you want audio.
Alas, without a headphone jack, since the headphone wire acts as an
antenna, a built-in FM radio is not possible.

Bluetooth Auracast <https://www.bluetooth.com/auracast/>, when it is
deployed, will be a better option for this sort of application.

There are some RTL receivers that can connect to USB-OTG, via a USB-A to
USB-C, or a Micro-USB to USB-C adapter, so you can receive broadcast FM,
but these are unwieldy.

There was a Lightning FM radio for iPhones but it is no longer available
<https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07G1LGS62>.

--
“If you are not an expert on a subject, then your opinions about it
really do matter less than the opinions of experts. It's not
indoctrination nor elitism. It's just that you don't know as much as
they do about the subject.”—Tin Foil Awards

On 2023-11-10 11:34, sms wrote:
> On 11/10/2023 12:03 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>>> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?
>>
>> I am using it right now :-)
>
> At the health club I go to they have three televisions viewable from
> many of the exercise machines. They broadcast the audio on LPFM radio.
> So it's useful to have a phone with an FM receiver if you want audio.
> Alas, without a headphone jack, since the headphone wire acts as an
> antenna, a built-in FM radio is not possible.
>
> Bluetooth Auracast <https://www.bluetooth.com/auracast/>, when it is
> deployed, will be a better option for this sort of application.
>
> There are some RTL receivers that can connect to USB-OTG, via a USB-A to
> USB-C, or a Micro-USB to USB-C adapter, so you can receive broadcast FM,
> but these are unwieldy.
>
> There was a Lightning FM radio for iPhones but it is no longer available
> <https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07G1LGS62>.
>

That would strongly suggest it didn't sell very well...

....which strongly suggests it wasn't really something that many people
wanted to do.

Thank you for making my point.

On 2023-11-10 20:32, Frank Slootweg wrote:
> Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>> On 2023-11-10 19:08, Alan wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-10 10:03, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>> On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
>>>>> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>>>> On 2023-11-10 06:04, Frankie wrote:
>>>>>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because
>>>>>>>>> they're not fleecing you every time you have to buy something
>>>>>>>>> that is free on Android?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep
>>>>>>>> my Apple things going.  Once case (above) was for "neatness".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
>>>>>>> something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on
>>>>>>> purpose?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Or the FM radio.
>>>>>
>>>>> Again:
>>>>>
>>>>> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?
>>>>
>>>> I am using it right now :-)
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Again, let me help you out:
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www.statista.com/statistics/215515/consumers-in-selected-countries-using-their-mobile-for-fm-radio/>
>>>>
>>>> Did you look at the column for Spain? ;-)
>>>
>>> Yes. So what?
>>>
>>> I'll turn it around.
>>>
>>> I live in Canada and I have never ONCE seen anyone listening to FM radio
>>> on a phone.
>
> That's what you get for buying iPhones!
>
> BTW, we've never ONCE seen anyone using iMessage! Your point being?
>
>> But I have seen many, in my country.
>>
>> Maybe you do not have a radio culture. We do.
>
> <firmly sitting on hands>
>
> What's next? USB-C charging ports? (Non) Supplied chargers? iMessage
> on Android? Just use a news server with short retention and start all
> over.
>
> Can someone please pass the popcorn?

Nah, RCS doesn't support matter transfers yet. :-)

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

On 2023-11-10 20:34, sms wrote:
> On 11/10/2023 12:03 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>>> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?
>>
>> I am using it right now :-)
>
> At the health club I go to they have three televisions viewable from
> many of the exercise machines. They broadcast the audio on LPFM radio.
> So it's useful to have a phone with an FM receiver if you want audio.
> Alas, without a headphone jack, since the headphone wire acts as an
> antenna, a built-in FM radio is not possible.
>
> Bluetooth Auracast <https://www.bluetooth.com/auracast/>, when it is
> deployed, will be a better option for this sort of application.
>
> There are some RTL receivers that can connect to USB-OTG, via a USB-A to
> USB-C, or a Micro-USB to USB-C adapter, so you can receive broadcast FM,
> but these are unwieldy.
>
> There was a Lightning FM radio for iPhones but it is no longer available
> <https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07G1LGS62>.

I have been listening to the radio in this room for the last two months,
using Open Radio app on a tablet (ie, via internet) and a BT speaker.

One station says "Madrid" but is is fact based in Mallorca, where they
have their own language and sometimes they speak it (and I don't
understand them).

Sometimes the server gets on a loop of some sort and sends the same
commercial a dozen times. I have to change station to another radio network.

Sometimes there are too many tiny interruptions for confort.

So today I use instead one of my phones with radio. I have yet to try to
see if it will send to the BT speaker while the headphones are connected.

Or I can use an old fully analogical radio receiver. It works, just has
a bit of a "hum" noise.

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.

Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
> On 2023-11-10 10:03, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2023-11-10 17:21, Alan wrote:
>>> On 2023-11-10 06:42, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>> On 2023-11-10 06:04, Frankie wrote:
>>>>> On 6/11/2023, Alan Browne wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Or do you think Apple's profits are off the charts because they're
>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>> fleecing you every time you have to buy something that is free on
>>>>>>> Android?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've never been forced to buy anything extra from Apple to keep my
>>>>>> Apple
>>>>>> things going.  Once case (above) was for "neatness".
>>>>>
>>>>> How are you going to get your wired headphones to work without buying
>>>>> something else to replace the headphone jack that Apple removed on
>>>>> purpose?
>>>>
>>>> Or the FM radio.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Again:
>>>
>>> How many people are even AWARE that their phone has an FM radio?
>>
>> I am using it right now :-)
>>
>>>
>>> Again, let me help you out:
>>>
>>> <https://www.statista.com/statistics/215515/consumers-in-selected-countries-using-their-mobile-for-fm-radio/>
>>
>> Did you look at the column for Spain? ;-)
>>
>
> Yes. So what?
>
> I'll turn it around.
>
> I live in Canada and I have never ONCE seen anyone listening to FM radio
> on a phone.

How do you even "see" someone listening to FM radio?

When I had an android phone I certainly used to and it was something I
missed when changing to iphone. There are times and places where there's
poor mobile data signal yet radio would still work.

It's moot now with the growing lack of headphone jack and ubiquity of
wireless headphones there's no wire for the aerial.

Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> wrote

> How do you even "see" someone listening to FM radio?

You're trying to have an adult conversation with Alan Baker?
> When I had an android phone I certainly used to and it was something I
> missed when changing to iphone. There are times and places where there's
> poor mobile data signal yet radio would still work.

Having FM radio on a phone is much better than not having it on the phone.

> It's moot now with the growing lack of headphone jack and ubiquity of
> wireless headphones there's no wire for the aerial.

Most Android phones have the industry standard headphone jack; it's only
most iPhones that don't (as Apple slowly removes hardware and software
functionality from the iPhone to force users to find a way to buy it back).
--
You can't make those ungodly profits off of an informed consumer base.

"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote

>> There was a Lightning FM radio for iPhones but it is no longer available
>> <https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07G1LGS62>.
>
> I have been listening to the radio in this room for the last two months,
> using Open Radio app on a tablet (ie, via internet) and a BT speaker.

Bear in mind it's only iPhones which completely lack modern functionality
(such as portable memory slots and the industry standard 3.5mm aux jack).

FACT:
Most Android phones have them; yet no new iPhones do.

*0% of iPhones have key modern hardware capabilities - while from 66%*
*to 78% of Android phone have that key modern hardware functionality*
<https://groups.google.com/g/comp.mobile.android/c/vLB-bIF-P5Q/>

Certainly mine does.

The lack of modern hardware is yet another reason why you can't seriously
compare any iPhone to even the least expensive Android phone out there.
*There is no comparison possible between what an iPhone & Android phone does*
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/eziBe9NRI04>
--
Apple makes those ungodly profits off of an incredibly gullible consumer.

Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
> On 2023-11-10 20:32, Frank Slootweg wrote:
[...]

> > What's next? USB-C charging ports? (Non) Supplied chargers? iMessage
> > on Android? Just use a news server with short retention and start all
> > over.
> >
> > Can someone please pass the popcorn?
>
> Nah, RCS doesn't support matter transfers yet. :-)

Bummer! See, Joerg is right after all: RCS sucks!

On 2023-11-10 13:08, Alan wrote:

> I live in Canada and I have never ONCE seen anyone listening to FM radio
> on a phone.

If you see someone using an iPhone listening to their buds, they may
indeed be listening to a radio station feed via itunes or Web interface.

Not sure how you would see that, of course.